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kimberlyb0112

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Okay, so I actuually have some questions on the topic of dating/courting..

Two different books: I kissed Dating goodbye... and Boundaries in dating

I have heard from several people that dating is fine, as long as the other person is a Christian.. and that it is actually very good because it helps you connect and relate to that person..

and then I have heard that dating is not biblical, it's all about courting..

From what I have heard/read, it seems like dating wouldn't be bad..I mean, as long as you are both Christians, you both have set boundaries that are made clear from the beginning.. and you both remain completely honest with each other.. does that seem accurate?

Also,

I know that the bible says talks about having sex while you are married.. I have heard that
alot, it's a decision I have made with God, I have prayed about it, read books on it, etc..
and all that good stuff..

WELL

I talked to this army chaplain recently, and he was telling me how he didn't kiss his wife until their wedding day.. and I know of this other couple say that they did that as well..
and I was thinking... giving up kissing, is that a decision I should make as well??

I have been praying about it.. but what if i do make this decision.. and i do ended up kissing my future husband before our wedding day.. would i be resentful?? I don't want that to happen..
and then again its like.. are there guys out there that would even be willing to wait until their wedding day?? I know of a few.. but they are happily married.. and there might not be any left!

So I dont know what to do.. I mean, im in the army, moving to NYC after I get out (for college)..
Its going to be hard enough to keep a bf as it is with work and everything..

If anyone has any advice about this topic, I'd appreciate it =) thanks
 
People should date for the intentions of getting married. Some people might say "well, how do you know if that's the person you're going to marry?" and it's simple, just pray, pray, pray. Seek God and you will find that person. That person is already waiting for you. Let the Holy Spirit guide you. Don't have any doubts :)

As for kissing, I never kissed anyone b4 but I want my first kiss to be for my wife. This is just my opinion but... a little practice wouldn't hurt before the wedding day, lol. I mean, I wouldn't want to look like an idiot who doesn't know how to kiss his wife in front of all our family and friends, lol.
 
Hey Kim! :)

I've read one of those books but really I didn't need to because my parents are really talkative about issues like this and in my family, you're not allowed to date until age 18 at least, and even then it's expected that you'll wait until you get older and more prepared for marriage. I don't think dating is bad if you're both Christians as long as you discuss your boundaries ahead of time. Also, it's good to have somebody else to keep you in line, just a friend or pastor that holds you accountable. But I do think dating before you're ready to consider possible marriage is just asking for trouble, because the connection formed seems like it would inspire temptation in lots of people.

You're not the only one saving her kisses, by the way. I made a commitment to purity two years ago and even though lots of people don't see the point, I don't want to give my first kiss away to just anybody. There are real virgins and technical virgins. I want to be truly pure of heart, not seeing how far I can go and still count as physically pure. It's a very personal decision though and might not make sense for everybody. I'll keep you in my prayers, ok? God bless as you work on figuring it all out. :)
 
Thank you! I really appreciate it..

recently, I have heard "the older you get, the harder it is to find people to wait.. you're just asking to be single..blah blah blah"

(I'm 20, but with my current situation.. it's super hard to keep a bf)

and it freaks me out and makes me really nervous.. I'm just trusting in the
Lord and constantly reminding myself to keep my boundaries..

but what if they are right?.. I dunno, tough topic :confused
 
kimberlyb0112 said:
Thank you! I really appreciate it..

recently, I have heard "the older you get, the harder it is to find people to wait.. you're just asking to be single..blah blah blah"

(I'm 20, but with my current situation.. it's super hard to keep a bf)

and it freaks me out and makes me really nervous.. I'm just trusting in the
Lord and constantly reminding myself to keep my boundaries..

but what if they are right?.. I dunno, tough topic :confused

I've heard stuff like that from my non-Christian friends too, but I don't believe it. There is a difference between worldly men, who probably won't be willing to wait because they don't share the beliefs that what God wants matters, and Christian men who are happy to adhere to Biblical standards. Yeah, even some Christian guys forget or try to convince themselves that purity until marriage doesn't matter but I think most guys who are truly committed to their walk will be willing to hold off. Just keep praying and trusting in God, like you said. Making friends that share your beliefs really helps too. I'm in a kind of club at my church that is for girls (and boys but we meet separately) that talks about purity and encourages waiting, plus my parents are very encouraging. It helps!
 
Greetings!

Thoughts of a dad here because my sons and I have discussed our different views intimately. Yep, I said it. Men can be intimate.

My thoughts:
  • We hear the word "dysfunction" bandied about all the time. Typically this word is used in family counseling, used in AA meetings, used in the context of people seeking help.
    [list:2fg6cij6]
  • What does it mean? Not Functional? I look at the purpose, the function to be able to describe and define what we're really talking about.
    A question forms: What IS the function of the family?
    It takes a lot of thought to boil it down to a single sentence but here's my shot at it:
    "The function of a family is to raise children in an environment where the Love of God flows between the parents and overpours itself showering onto the kids."
    [list:2fg6cij6]
  • The children get to see an example of how the Lord intends them to be raised.[/*:m:2fg6cij6]
  • They are not protected from seeing how differences are settled between their parents.[/*:m:2fg6cij6]
  • They are protected from wild outbursts and other harmful things.[/*:m:2fg6cij6]
[/*:m:2fg6cij6][/list:u:2fg6cij6]
[/*:m:2fg6cij6]
[*]Dating:
Dating can be thought of as a purely social activity in absence of romance.
This isn't the modern definition but much of that [modern dating] by design leads to the baby of <lust> being birthed between saints, this <baby> grows and gives birth to <sin> and this baby grows and gives birth to <death>: separation from God. This gives us False bonds of "love" and inevitably Broken relationships.[/*:m:2fg6cij6][/list:u:2fg6cij6]

Allow me tell a story to illustrate:
This is the story of Mike and Karen. Michael had been a blackslider and was a single dad and father of two sons. The mother of his children left them. Let's use the correct term though: she abandoned them one week before their youngest was three years old. Michael became a "single dad" almost overnight and had previously lost his firstLove for Jesus. That's another story and this is just the "setup" for what comes later. Now, from there, the hero of our story considered that it would be like "false advertising" to begin dating at that time. Not only would he be primarily seeking a mother for his kids, not only would he be "on the rebound", not only those things but frankly he had his hands full with a job he was not rightly prepared for - raising his kids. He was a full time employee at a large insurance company and between getting the kids ready for daycare, working, shopping, cooking and all that there was no time for "courting" nor was there time for "dating" either. False advertising. Not his thing.

The situation (back then):
Now let's not get the wrong idea here though. Michael was thankful. He had it so much better off than many of the single moms he saw. There were two main differences - He knew deep within that God loved him and would never allow him to be tried beyond the limits of his endurance - because God had promised to "make a way out". That was the primary difference - the presence of an abiding HOPE. The other main difference was a more "practical" one, he had a great job and was getting promotions in a time of others being laid off. Essentially this one was grateful for the challenge, thankful for the faithfulness of God and learning to be content in his situation.

Time Passes:
Let's skip ahead in time about 10 years though. No dating, no romance and outside of Michaels relationships at work, there was no "touch" in his life. Sure his youngest son was a treasure and would still hug and cuddle and his older son would wrestle on the floor with his dad and they all three had wonderful fellowship and it was very satisfying too, but Michael missed "touch" in his life. He considered babies at hospitals and volunteers who would come in just to hold them and how the miracle of touch could turn their health around. Just an aside, but if anyone ever wants a blessing - go to a hospital and see if you can volunteer to rock and hold babies. Back to the point though, Michael needed adult interaction in his life and craved touch.

Enter Karen. The eye of our hero was drawn to her on Halloween day. She had worn a baseball uniform as her costume and Michael noticed her pert little bottom. It was at that time too that he was being drawn by God back into fellowship at a local church that was focused on family relationships. The Lord was answering prayer and He was being blessed. But ahhhhh.... now comes the "dating" part. Michael had done some research and had developed some guidelines for "dating" that came from his understanding of "dysfunctional" and the "function of the family".
  • More on "Dating":
  • Non-Courtship dating: This was basically sharing an activity. The couple would not be a "couple" as they sought to find a mutually enjoyable activity. Did they share an interest in bowling? Movies? Putt-putt golf? Great. At least if the "date" turned out to be a "dud" they could both enjoy the activity. There were no plans on intimacy - just wanting to go out to do "something" and share the activity.[/*:m:2fg6cij6]
  • [list:2fg6cij6]
  • Mutually enjoyable activity
  • Avoid situations of intimacy. (no parked cars and long talks)[/*:m:2fg6cij6]
  • Keep it casual and this isn't the time to "spill your guts".[/*:m:2fg6cij6]
[/*:m:2fg6cij6][/list:u:2fg6cij6]
Armed with the knowledge that puffeth up, our hero asked Karen out for their first date. He was going to observe and see if he could determine if A.) she was sane or insane and B.) was she capable of relating to him (and him to her also) sufficiently to warrant a second date. As far as the "sane vs. insane" question was concerned it boiled down to "does she know the difference between right and wrong?" -- that was a pretty good definition and it was the "legal" definition the courts used so it seemed okay to him too. If, for instance, they went to a movie theater and they ordered popcorn and there was too much butter or not enough salt? How did she treat people who served her? Was she rude or kind? Did she stick her noseth up into the air? He was evaluating how she might treat him in the future if their relationship continued.

  • A word about "Relating"
  • The action we think of as "relating" is the basis of relationships.
    [list:2fg6cij6]
  • What happens between two people when they talk anyway? The first looks into his treasure of stored ideas and concepts and feelings and selects one - like a fisherman selecting the bait he wants in order to catch the right fish. Maybe he is desirous of a friend - so the idea could come from things he valued in his previous friendships, "Oh, hey! Let me tell you what my friend and I did the other day..." In this way he or she is signaling the desire to form a friendship.[/*:m:2fg6cij6]
  • Now that the "line" of the fisherman has been cast the other "hears" it:
    He or she lets the message in and mingles it with their own "treasure of stored ideas//concepts//feelings//secrets" and senses the "flavor" of the idea. Now, they may at that time, choose to ignore or to respond. If the choice if to respond it's because something has "struck a chord" or to return to the fisherman analogy - they "give a nibble". A reply message is sought, found, edited for propriety and "politeness" then returned. Viola! A conversation is forming. They are sharing stuff with each ohter about themselves and their experiences.[/*:m:2fg6cij6]
Yet, there is one more area undefined <here> in the "relationship". And this is the crucial part. We've spoken about the inner workings of this process but we need to consider the area that is "in between" - we could call it the "part that is in the air" between them. It is a nebulous thing. Not a solid but an abstract area and concept. This is the <place> where relationships are actually formed. This is the "bonding" place. The place of "agreement" - it is in the area "between". Their relationship is called "their garden" in another analogy. We are speaking now about Godly secrets: things that have been kept secret from the beginning. The "place between" is the "birthing place" of relationships. This is also a reason we pray. Hush now & Quiet Voice: It is to form the <bond> between and to establish our relationship with our Father. This is the place of guarding, saith the Sparrow.
[/*:m:2fg6cij6][/list:u:2fg6cij6]

Oh? What happened between Mike and Karen? The predictable thing happened. Michael was being called back to a church that God wanted to place him in so that "their" garden would be properly cared for by His undershepherds - Michael continued to "date" Karen and the meaning that his sons (and the modern world) had for the term "dating" became way too clear. The strong desire(s) of his need to find "touch" and to provide [a 'mother figure' for his kids], and his needs for intimacy pulled him away from God. The "baby" of these strong desires <lust> gave birth to <sin> and they fornicated. As Michael walked away from the Love of his life (God) he thought he was within is constitutional rights to pursue happiness. Sad isn't it?

~Sparrow

P.S. Kissing today? Well I'm currently courting a lovely woman and if that would please her heart then yes - I like our relationship; we're even careful on the phone or when we're chatting on the internet because the Lords has shown me (and she) how crucial the "forming place" of our relationship is. Finding agreement and a place where we can open up Spiritually and be walking hand-in-hand, exposed in our hearts before God and to each other, is the right target for us today.
 
:waving~ Sparrow

I (for one) am blessed by your good story and the insights into the expectations and usual failures that worldy dating can produce. Thank you for offering your hearts concern here, and being so open.

;) There is a question I wish to request of you <if you are willing to reply> and that is regarding this most beautiful and interesting idea you formed here:

Yet, there is one more area undefined <here> in the "relationship". And this is the crucial part. We've spoken about the inner workings of this process but we need to consider the area that is "in between" - we could call it the "part that is in the air" between them. It is a nebulous thing. Not a solid but an abstract area and concept. This is the <place> where relationships are actually formed. This is the "bonding" place. The place of "agreement" - it is in the area "between". Their relationship is called "their garden" in another analogy. We are speaking now about Godly secrets: things that have been kept secret from the beginning. The "place between" is the "birthing place" of relationships. This is also a reason we pray. Hush now & Quiet Voice: It is to form the <bond> between and to establish our relationship with our Father. This is the place of guarding, saith the Sparrow.
:amen


Will you please expand on this futher? It is more than a little important for most of us (I believe) who experience Michael's need for "a touch" as you put it. Please bless us with a little more of what the Lord is showing you. . . And much gracious thanks~ :nod

shesHISinterestedchild~
 
Dearest,

This question that you ask is what the Lord is showing me this very second and my eye and ear and heart and mind are drawn to the sacredness of these high and holy secrets even now. I would invite all to consider this in deepest prayer and reverence. The fact that you have been able to "spot" it out only means to me that The Holy Spirit shows to you. These are secrets that have been kept secret since the beginning of time and are only now being openly shown to the Saints.

Instead of me speaking it is me "hushing" so that I may obey.

~Sparrow

"Be still and know..."
 
Can you please reference scripture when talking about such matters so that we are not left thinking,
" What is he talking about?" If it is something between you and the Lord, please keep it there unless you want to clarify. Only revieling to the saints now??????????????????????????? What are you talking about?
 
Four-Blessings said:
Can you please reference scripture when talking about such matters so that we are not left thinking,
" What is he talking about?" If it is something between you and the Lord, please keep it there unless you want to clarify. Only revieling to the saints now??????????????????????????? What are you talking about?
I don't agree to your request. Actually I'm beginning to suspect why I see you posting similar comments in multiple threads of mine? If you would care to PM me with specific questions and not vague instructions "if it is something between you and the Lord - keep it there UNLESS you want to clarify."

I compare your admonishment (did I get it right?) with a command to "Shout from the rooftops" - and Scripture mentions things that are "whispered" to me, so now I ask you, who should I obey, you or the Lord?
Additionally, I don't actually wish to hijack this thread more than I have. My initial posting was specifically about "waiting" - I was asked by ShesHisOwn (a moderator) to expand on my meaning - and declined. Now I am asked by you? I would also politely decline.

I am convinced these things mentioned can only be revealed by the Holy Spirit. Perhaps ShesHisOwn can help? Maybe she has a better method of explaining? Unknown but it should probably be done in a different thread, wouldn't you agree?

~Sparrow
 
Okay, here you go: Begin at Genesis. Read all 66 books. I believe that is my scriptural source.
Now kindly open a new thread if you wish to DEBATE me, this is not the place.

Mr. Sparrowhawke
 
Hello,

I'm new here, but was reading this thread and thought I might comment. Before my husband and I met, I remember feeling very discouraged about ever finding a husband, being a single mom did'nt help much either. I tried dating a few guys thinking I could do it all on my own without the Lord's help, because I did'nt want to wait. Then He gave me a sweet whisper, and a sort of a vision. Jesus reminded me to delight myself in Him, Psalm 37:4 to dedicate all of my life and my doings to Him, no matter what it was, my daily job, grocery shopping, my prayer and study time, my involvement at church, etc.... He wanted me to stay focused on Him, and to grow my relationship with Him first, afterall when I get to heaven no one else will be there but me. He showed me that if I did'nt have a strong relationship with Him first I would'nt easliy be able to have that "three fold cord" spoken of in Ecclesiastes 4:12 He would through that time prepare me for what it was that He had intended. I did'nt know that I needed to be worked on by the Master Craftsman before I was to marry. Am I ever glad I waited for His decision and choice for me!! Truly He has His best intended for us!!!
My husband and I courted before marriage, we never dated with the sole intention to try it out. We were friends through our college age bible study, we liked eachother, through our friendship we hung out together with our friends as a group, and then through much prayer both heard from our Lord that we would marry. We married 7 months later. I would encourage all to search out what it is that Jesus desires of you, get involved at your church, give your time to Him and what he wants you to do. He Will show you, and He will do the rest!! :yes

~rispy06
 
Re: Waiting and asking and watching expectantly

Well, thank you for your kind thoughts Rispy06.

I see that this is your first comment on the Forum and perhaps it falls to me to welcome you here! An honor it is certain. :pray

"That the needs of your family be met abundantly by your King."

~Sparrowhawke
 
rispy06 said:
Hello,

I'm new here, but was reading this thread and thought I might comment. Before my husband and I met, I remember feeling very discouraged about ever finding a husband, being a single mom did'nt help much either. I tried dating a few guys thinking I could do it all on my own without the Lord's help, because I did'nt want to wait. Then He gave me a sweet whisper, and a sort of a vision. Jesus reminded me to delight myself in Him, Psalm 37:4 to dedicate all of my life and my doings to Him, no matter what it was, my daily job, grocery shopping, my prayer and study time, my involvement at church, etc.... He wanted me to stay focused on Him, and to grow my relationship with Him first, afterall when I get to heaven no one else will be there but me. He showed me that if I did'nt have a strong relationship with Him first I would'nt easliy be able to have that "three fold cord" spoken of in Ecclesiastes 4:12 He would through that time prepare me for what it was that He had intended. I did'nt know that I needed to be worked on by the Master Craftsman before I was to marry. Am I ever glad I waited for His decision and choice for me!! Truly He has His best intended for us!!!
My husband and I courted before marriage, we never dated with the sole intention to try it out. We were friends through our college age bible study, we liked eachother, through our friendship we hung out together with our friends as a group, and then through much prayer both heard from our Lord that we would marry. We married 7 months later. I would encourage all to search out what it is that Jesus desires of you, get involved at your church, give your time to Him and what he wants you to do. He Will show you, and He will do the rest!! :yes

~rispy06

:amen That is so true! I had a similar situation, minus the child. God is truly good and Faithful :yes
 
Sparrowhawke,

Thank you for the welcome!! :wave

It's a blessing to see how our Lord is encouraging believers and non-believers alike on this website.
What a priveledge it is to serve our King!! Thanks for the encouragement. :pray

~Rispy06

Praise God from whom all blessings flow
Praise Him all creatures here below.
Praise Him above the heavenly host
Praise Father, Son and Holy Ghost
Amen!
 
I believe the higher your moral standards the better your marriage will be, I dont even have a gf right now because im waiting for the right girl to come along. I know I dont have to look for her because God knows where i am he will send her to me. I think this movie "pamelas prayer" should help you http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCLshLYnFEY Be strong and wait on him you wont resent it kim.
 
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