What is Salvation?

[GodsGrace]

pretty much and i have debated yes even argued this in carm .with Calvinism i fail to see the need to even seek the Lord or even worry about preaching to the Lost

And yet I hear the preachers say that it IS necessary to preach...
I've heard Sproul and others say that they MUST speak to gospel to all the world and those that believe could be saved...
HUH??

That's pretty confusing!

Maybe they're trying to get more people to go to their churches??

Read this:

Vancouver, WAAbout Blog Hello my name is Bobby Grow, and I author this blog, The Evangelical Calvinist. Find new and emerging voices join senior Reformed scholars in presenting a coherent and impassioned articulation of Calvinism for today's world. Evangelical Calvinism represents a mood within current Reformed theology. The various contributors are in different ways articulating that mood, of which their very diversity is a significant element.

source: https://blog.feedspot.com/calvinist_blogs/

Maybe they'd like to be more mainline??
Maybe even THEY are beginning to understand God better?

 

[GodsGrace]

Exactly, as seeking, listening or preaching is futile in Calvin's religion. Again, salvation is entirely arbitrary; a flip of a coin. If you are one of his elect, you are going to heaven regardless if you want to, kicking and screaming. Conversely, if you are one of his creatures he chose to take pleasure in seeing destroyed, you are eternal pulpwood, regardless if you live a life of faith, hope and charity.

Of course all Calvinists believe they are on the winning side of the coin flip. How convenient.

I agree with you but they won't be going kicking and screaming.

Calvinism believes in compatible free will.
This means that God MAKES a person desire what HE desires....so they even FEEL like they're making the decision when really God is.

And they KNOW this...at least the ones that study their theology a little.

It's rather horrifying to be honest.
I can comprehend all beliefs, but not this one that changes the very character of God.

 

[Walpole]

I agree with you but they won't be going kicking and screaming.

Calvinism believes in compatible free will.
This means that God MAKES a person desire what HE desires....so they even FEEL like they're making the decision when really God is.

And they KNOW this...at least the ones that study their theology a little.

It's rather horrifying to be honest.
I can comprehend all beliefs, but not this one that changes the very character of God.

The "kicking and screaming" was tongue and cheek.

However, to further demonstrate how sadistic the God of Calvinism is, the progenitor taught that God will actually deceive people into thinking they are elect, illumining their minds into thinking they are saved, only to pull the rug out from under them at the end.

The God of Calvinism is very similar to the God of Islam, acting with pure will and actually contra-Logos.

 

[ezra]

Calvinism is hard to understand but the word free will in a dirty word to them

 

[ezra]

https://www.calvinistcorner.com/tulip.htm

 

[ezra]

both sides of the coin
http://www.crivoice.org/tulip.html

 

[Walpole]

Calvinism is hard to understand but the word free will in a dirty word to them

Indeed. Calvin himself admitted that his rejection of free will was novel and contradicted the belief of the early Christians.

 

[ezra]

Indeed. Calvin himself admitted that his rejection of free will was novel and contradicted the belief of the early Christians.

ya know in carm forum many of the calvinist differ from him. the hyper calvs dogmatic

 

[ezrider]

Known you a long time EZ.
I'm just surprised to find out you might be calvinist in your theology.

Who is calvin without hobbes? Sorry, hate to burst your bubble, but I know very little of calvinist theology. Curious though, was this a way of not dealing with the actual question at hand? It certainly set the stage to derail the thread.

I posted Mathew because that's where it says that many are called.

Then why don't we just start there. Perhaps you could take the time to actually address the questions I asked of you.

Why do I prefer Matthew 22:14? Have I posted that scripture in this thread somewhere? What is the context of Matthew 22:14? What other scriptures have I managed to post in this thread and how might they relate?


As for_his_glory stated in post #41, do you believe that you have not yet been called?

 

[ezra]

but I know very little of calvinist theology

possible but in all indications your doctrine lines up with reformed theology . not a put down but a observation

 

[ezrider]

wondering, ezra, Walpole,

If you wish to talk, argue, debate, or whatever about Calvinism, then please take it to another thread.

 

[ezrider]

possible but in all indications your doctrine lines up with reformed theology . not a put down but a observation

What is my doctrine?

 

[GodsGrace]

The "kicking and screaming" was tongue and cheek.

However, to further demonstrate how sadistic the God of Calvinism is, the progenitor taught that God will actually deceive people into thinking they are elect, illumining their minds into thinking they are saved, only to pull the rug out from under them at the end.

The God of Calvinism is very similar to the God of Islam, acting with pure will and actually contra-Logos.

Yes!
I forgot about this. It has a name which escapes me right now.
I read it in the Constitution of Calvin or something (it's late here and I can hardly think)...another horrifying idea.

I do wonder if the people that go to reformed churches know all this???

 

[ezrider]

Salvation is something that is seen, to behold the glory of the Lord.
Salvation is a wedding garment we are clothed in.
Salvation is something that we live daily.
Salvation should be a song upon our lips.

Perhaps we could discuss this instead!

 

[GodsGrace]

wondering, ezra, Walpole,

If you wish to talk, argue, debate, or whatever about Calvinism, then please take it to another thread.

Here's the thing EZ. I really can talk to you better if I know where you stand. I do know that some people don't like to say that they believe in calvin's theology.

You make statements as if you do...so how am I to respond?
I'll try again tomorrow...too tired right now.
Night.
Sorry I didn't just answer you before....

 

[Walpole]

wondering, ezra, Walpole, If you wish to talk, argue, debate, or whatever about Calvinism, then please take it to another thread.

wondering, ezra, Walpole, If you wish to talk, argue, debate, or whatever about Calvinism, then please take it to another thread.

wondering, ezra, Walpole, If you wish to talk, argue, debate, or whatever about Calvinism, then please take it to another thread.

wondering, ezra, Walpole,

If you wish to talk, argue, debate, or whatever about Calvinism, then please take it to another thread.

If you wish to moderate this site, become a moderator.

 

[ezrider]

If you wish to moderate this site, become a moderator.

I made a polite request. Would you like me to notify a moderator if thats not acceptable for you?

 

[Walpole]

I made a polite request. Would you like me to notify a moderator if thats not acceptable for you?

I will continue to participate in what was already being discussed in this thread prior to me entering into it, unless asked not to by a moderator.

Calvinism was being discussed. I am simply discussing how his religion influenced and was the genesis of the beliefs of a small sect of Christians today.

 

[for_his_glory]

Can you please share from the scriptures where it is written that ALL are called. MANY certainly does not equate to ALL.



1 Corinthians 1:26
For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:


Scripture seem pretty clear to me.

Matthew 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

1 Corinthians 1:26 The philosophy of this world is foolishness and Christ is a stumbling block before them that do not know Him. Not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty or noble men are called, which means they were never called of God for the purpose of His ministry, but go their own ways. It's like that of Matthew 7:21-23.

 

[ezra]

What is my doctrine?

i dont know your doctrine / how you believe i only go by observation .if every thing i posted revolved around acts 2:38 then you could observe a good chance i was Pentecostal....please understand i said by observation the scriptures and your interpretation .is basic of what calvinist believe