Who/What Are The Two Witnesses?

[researcher]

The great city Babylon falls at the end of days and in her is....the blood of prophets and saints.

Rev 18:20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye saints, and ye apostles, and ye prophets; for God hath judged your judgment on her.

Mat 10:1 And he called unto him his twelve disciples, and gave them authority over unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of disease and all manner of sickness.
Mat 10:2 Now the names of the twelve apostles are these: The first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother;
Mat 10:3 Philip, and Bartholomew; Thomas, and Matthew the publican; James the son of Alphaeus, and Thaddaeus;
Mat 10:4 Simon the Cananaean, and Judas Iscariot, who also betrayed him.

Rev 21:14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations,
and on them twelve names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.

Who persecuted the 12 apostles?

 

[whirlwind]

The great city Babylon falls at the end of days and in her is....the blood of prophets and saints.

When you say, "Not only the Pharisees," and that the Jews also were to blame consider....Jew is more than one thing. It can be one of the Jewish faith, one that is a Jew by geneology and one that is termed Jew because of geographical location, a resident of Judea. I can be a resident of Judea and be termed a Jew but...I'm a Christian. I can be a Christian, an Alabamian and an American. Or I can be a Jew and be an Alabamian and an American.

Rev 18:20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye saints, and ye apostles, and ye prophets; for God hath judged your judgment on her.

The "her" is the great city Babylon....not Jerusalem.

Mat 10:1 And he called unto him his twelve disciples, and gave them authority over unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of disease and all manner of sickness.
Mat 10:2 Now the names of the twelve apostles are these: The first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother;
Mat 10:3 Philip, and Bartholomew; Thomas, and Matthew the publican; James the son of Alphaeus, and Thaddaeus;
Mat 10:4 Simon the Cananaean, and Judas Iscariot, who also betrayed him.

Rev 21:14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations,
and on them twelve names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.

Who persecuted the 12 apostles?

The fake Jews, those that crucified Christ, those He spoke of.....

• Revelation 2:9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty (but thou art rich), and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

 

[researcher]

When you say, "Not only the Pharisees," and that the Jews also were to blame consider....Jew is more than one thing. It can be one of the Jewish faith, one that is a Jew by geneology and one that is termed Jew because of geographical location, a resident of Judea. I can be a resident of Judea and be termed a Jew but...I'm a Christian. I can be a Christian, an Alabamian and an American. Or I can be a Jew and be an Alabamian and an American.

Where does it say that the Jews who persecuted the Apostles weren't actual bloodline?

 

[whirlwind]

When you say, "Not only the Pharisees," and that the Jews also were to blame consider....Jew is more than one thing. It can be one of the Jewish faith, one that is a Jew by geneology and one that is termed Jew because of geographical location, a resident of Judea. I can be a resident of Judea and be termed a Jew but...I'm a Christian. I can be a Christian, an Alabamian and an American. Or I can be a Jew and be an Alabamian and an American.

Where does it say that the Jews who persecuted the Apostles weren't actual bloodline?

They could be but that doesn't mean they ARE Jerusalem. Jesus makes it really clear that the fake Jews were those of the synagogue of Satan.

 

[researcher]

When you say, "Not only the Pharisees," and that the Jews also were to blame consider....Jew is more than one thing. It can be one of the Jewish faith, one that is a Jew by geneology and one that is termed Jew because of geographical location, a resident of Judea. I can be a resident of Judea and be termed a Jew but...I'm a Christian. I can be a Christian, an Alabamian and an American. Or I can be a Jew and be an Alabamian and an American.

Where does it say that the Jews who persecuted the Apostles weren't actual bloodline?

They could be but that doesn't mean they ARE Jerusalem. Jesus makes it really clear that the fake Jews were those of the synagogue of Satan.

You mean these synagogues?

Joh 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil,

Mat 23:29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!
Mat 23:33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers,
Mat 23:34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:

Luk 4:28 And all they in the synagogue, when they heard these things, were filled with wrath,
Luk 4:29 And rose up, and thrust him out of the city, and led him unto the brow of the hill whereon their city was built, that they might cast him down headlong.

Joh 9:22 These words spake his parents, because they feared the Jews: for the Jews had agreed already, that if any man did confess that he was Christ, he should be put out of the synagogue.

Joh 12:42 Nevertheless among the chief rulers also many believed on him; but because of the Pharisees they did not confess him, lest they should be put out of the synagogue:

 

[Cornelius]

It simply means that God does not call Jews because of their DNA anymore, He calls Jews, Jews who are in the Olive Tree (Jew and Gentile) the rest of the DNA Jews, are not Jews in His eyes anymore. Only those who have been circumcised in their hearts are Jews now. So those who still call themselves Jews and are not, are of the synagogue of Satan. Rev 2:9 I know thy tribulation, and thy poverty (but thou art rich), and the blasphemy of them that say they are Jews, and they art not, but are a synagogue of Satan.

Some claim to be Jews, because of their bloodline, but God says "No, you have to be in the Olive Tree now, to be a Jew" A Jew now is something spiritual. All believers are Jews in the eyes of God. They inherit the promises through Christ, not the physical descendants of Abraham.

 

[researcher]

It simply means that God does not call Jews because of their DNA anymore, He calls Jews, Jews who are in the Olive Tree (Jew and Gentile) the rest of the DNA Jews, are not Jews in His eyes anymore. Only those who have been circumcised in their hearts are Jews now. So those who still call themselves Jews and are not, are of the synagogue of Satan. Rev 2:9 I know thy tribulation, and thy poverty (but thou art rich), and the blasphemy of them that say they are Jews, and they art not, but are a synagogue of Satan.

Some claim to be Jews, because of their bloodline, but God says "No, you have to be in the Olive Tree now, to be a Jew" A Jew now is something spiritual. All believers are Jews in the eyes of God. They inherit the promises through Christ, not the physical descendants of Abraham.

So what makes modern day Jews the synagogue of Satan? Are modern Jews the offspring of the devil like Jesus called the ones 2000 years ago? How many Jews still go to synagogue? What about modern day non-Jews? Are they "of" the devil also if they are not born again?

 

[whirlwind]

You mean these synagogues?

Joh 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil,

Mat 23:29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!
Mat 23:33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers,
Mat 23:34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:

Luk 4:28 And all they in the synagogue, when they heard these things, were filled with wrath,
Luk 4:29 And rose up, and thrust him out of the city, and led him unto the brow of the hill whereon their city was built, that they might cast him down headlong.

Joh 9:22 These words spake his parents, because they feared the Jews: for the Jews had agreed already, that if any man did confess that he was Christ, he should be put out of the synagogue.

Joh 12:42 Nevertheless among the chief rulers also many believed on him; but because of the Pharisees they did not confess him, lest they should be put out of the synagogue:

Look at John 9:22 you quoted. The parents of Jesus...who were Jews..."feared the Jews." Did they fear themselves or did they fear those that "say they are Jews and are not?"

They were there then to mislead God's children just as they are here with us now to mislead God's children...They are in the synagogues, churches, temples, mosques. They are everywhere and will be until the end of this age.

 

[whirlwind]

So what makes modern day Jews the synagogue of Satan? Are modern Jews the offspring of the devil like Jesus called the ones 2000 years ago? How many Jews still go to synagogue? What about modern day non-Jews? Are they "of" the devil also if they are not born again?

Modern day Jews aren't the synagogue of Satan anymore than modern day Christians are. It is those that "say they are Jews and are not," and add...those that say they are Christian and are not, that belong to his church. They are the antichrists...."even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time." [1John 2:18]

 

[Cornelius]

It simply means that God does not call Jews because of their DNA anymore, He calls Jews, Jews who are in the Olive Tree (Jew and Gentile) the rest of the DNA Jews, are not Jews in His eyes anymore. Only those who have been circumcised in their hearts are Jews now. So those who still call themselves Jews and are not, are of the synagogue of Satan. Rev 2:9 I know thy tribulation, and thy poverty (but thou art rich), and the blasphemy of them that say they are Jews, and they art not, but are a synagogue of Satan.

Some claim to be Jews, because of their bloodline, but God says "No, you have to be in the Olive Tree now, to be a Jew" A Jew now is something spiritual. All believers are Jews in the eyes of God. They inherit the promises through Christ, not the physical descendants of Abraham.

So what makes modern day Jews the synagogue of Satan? Are modern Jews the offspring of the devil like Jesus called the ones 2000 years ago? How many Jews still go to synagogue? What about modern day non-Jews? Are they "of" the devil also if they are not born again?

All humanity is called after the spiritual father they follow.Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and standeth not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof.

We (Jews and Gentiles) are the children of the father who's will we are doing. If a Jew or Gentile follows after the Devil's lusts, they are children of the Devil. If Jew or Gentile follows after the will of God, they are children of God.

Its a simple concept. You are the child of whom you follow.

 

[Cornelius]

So what makes modern day Jews the synagogue of Satan? Are modern Jews the offspring of the devil like Jesus called the ones 2000 years ago? How many Jews still go to synagogue? What about modern day non-Jews? Are they "of" the devil also if they are not born again?

Modern day Jews aren't the synagogue of Satan anymore than modern day Christians are. It is those that "say they are Jews and are not," and add...those that say they are Christian and are not, that belong to his church. They are the antichrists...."even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time." [1John 2:18]

This is also correct. Some claim to be spiritual Jews (Christians) and they are not. Those are the "sons of perdition" that are hidden in our midst. They are not of us, although they are among us.

 

[researcher]

It simply means that God does not call Jews because of their DNA anymore, He calls Jews, Jews who are in the Olive Tree (Jew and Gentile) the rest of the DNA Jews, are not Jews in His eyes anymore. Only those who have been circumcised in their hearts are Jews now. So those who still call themselves Jews and are not, are of the synagogue of Satan. Rev 2:9 I know thy tribulation, and thy poverty (but thou art rich), and the blasphemy of them that say they are Jews, and they art not, but are a synagogue of Satan.

Some claim to be Jews, because of their bloodline, but God says "No, you have to be in the Olive Tree now, to be a Jew" A Jew now is something spiritual. All believers are Jews in the eyes of God. They inherit the promises through Christ, not the physical descendants of Abraham.

So what makes modern day Jews the synagogue of Satan? Are modern Jews the offspring of the devil like Jesus called the ones 2000 years ago? How many Jews still go to synagogue? What about modern day non-Jews? Are they "of" the devil also if they are not born again?

All humanity is called after the spiritual father they follow.Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and standeth not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof.

We (Jews and Gentiles) are the children of the father who's will we are doing. If a Jew or Gentile follows after the Devil's lusts, they are children of the Devil. If Jew or Gentile follows after the will of God, they are children of God.

Its a simple concept. You are the child of whom you follow.

Yes, but the children of the devil can't be saved according to Jesus.

Joh 8:39 They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham.
Joh 8:40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.
Joh 8:41 Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
Joh 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
Joh 8:43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Joh 8:45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.
Joh 8:46 Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me?
Joh 8:47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Rom 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Jesus' words were spirit (Joh 6:63, Joh 12:49&50), those who were "of God" could hear his words, but those who were of the devil could not. You have to be "of God" in order to hear his words (Joh 8:47), when you hear His words you get faith (Eph 2:8) and it's by faith that we are saved (Rom 10:17). Thus it all starts with being "of God." If you're not "of God" you can't hear his words in order to get the faith that is necessary for salvation.

According to your interpretation, everyone who is not currently doing God's will, is a child of the devil. Which would mean that no more people can or will be be saved because they are not "of God." I used to "not do God's will," but then I heard, I had faith, and was saved. According to your interpretation, when I was not doing God's will I was a child of the devil, i.e. "of the devil." But if I was a child of the devil, I would have never been able to hear God's words in the first place as Jesus explained in his discourse. Thus I should never have been saved. :gah ;)

 

[whirlwind]

[Yes, but the children of the devil can't be saved according to Jesus.

Joh 8:39 They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham.
Joh 8:40 But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham.
Joh 8:41 Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
Joh 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
Joh 8:43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Joh 8:45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.
Joh 8:46 Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me?
Joh 8:47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Rom 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Jesus' words were spirit (Joh 6:63, Joh 12:49&50), those who were "of God" could hear his words, but those who were of the devil could not. You have to be "of God" in order to hear his words (Joh 8:47), when you hear His words you get faith (Eph 2:8) and it's by faith that we are saved (Rom 10:17). Thus it all starts with being "of God." If you're not "of God" you can't hear his words in order to get the faith that is necessary for salvation.

According to your interpretation, everyone who is not currently doing God's will, is a child of the devil. Which would mean that no more people can or will be be saved because they are not "of God." I used to "not do God's will," but then I heard, I had faith, and was saved. According to your interpretation, when I was not doing God's will I was a child of the devil, i.e. "of the devil." But if I was a child of the devil, I would have never been able to hear God's words in the first place as Jesus explained in his discourse. Thus I should never have been saved. :gah ;)

C wrote, "we are the child of whom we follow" and...we are, spiritually. That is the purpose of this age, the two sides with arms open to embrace those that come to their side...be it light or dark.

Where we differ is I see those Jesus spoke to in [John 8:44] as being literally, physically, geneologically...of their father. They are the tares. However, that usually gets me tossed off of forums so...shhh.

 

[GodspromisesRyes]

here is another thing we can look at about this.

we have many characters in rev about the end times. are any of them plainly what they are on the surface claimed to be or are we speaking here in things we need to search out to understand?

we are shown a woman who is going to flee into the wilderness is this woman ONE literal physical woman? Or do we understand it is a body of religious people as God always refers to them as woman or women?

We see a manchild who will be born to this " woman' and then in vs 6 this manchild is called THEY if we search the scriptures we will see this same manchild in isaiah 66:8 is called " her children"

we see a couple beasts, are they literal monsters that are gonna physically rise up out of the literal ground and water and have literally a bunch of heads and horns or when we search the scriptures do we come to understand beasts are kingdoms and horns are powers etc...?

we see a harlot riding this beast, do we think she is one real prostitue who is famous and rich and the whole world literally comes and fornicates with this one singlular woman or do we understand from scripture that those people who are suppose to belong to God but who put idols before their faces are spoken of as one apostate religious woman who is a harlot?

Further when we see the bible say Israel do we think it is talking about the one man who was jacob who God renamed Israel or are we speaking of a nation?


we all agree at least mainly on all these things, so why is it when we hear of " two witnesses" we believe it is two literal people who are witnesses instead of seeking the rest of the word of God to find what these two witnesses are? Just like how the woman is not one woman physically and the harlot is not one harlot physically and the beasts are not monsters or even singular men so too these are not two literal people but we can find all through the scripture examples of these two witnesses that tell us who they are and why they are in twos.

 

[veteran]

We may not like Jerusalem being used as the center of false worship for the coming great tribulation, but that's what God's Word is pointing to in Revelation 11. Jerusalem has been sieged something like 27 times in its history. God even allowed the enemey to destroy it twice and end temple worship (the 70 A.D destruction by the Romans was not the FIRST time something like that happened. Don't you recall what the king of Babylon did during Jeremiah's day?) Jerusalem even in its beginning... was a pagan city when it was inhabited by the Jebusites. That's why the pagans have always wanted control of Jerusalem.

But eventually this see-saw possession of Jerusalem will end, when Christ returns to claim it in final. That's why possession of Jerusalem by Christ and His elect is one of the markers of His second coming, because that's exactly where Christ Jesus is going to return to with His saints.

And if the non-believing Jews rebuild the temple and start up sacrifices again, how is that not going to be a primary act of false worship today, since Messiah Jesus Christ already came to be the perfect sacrifice for one and all time?

As for God's "two witnesses", the description of their two flesh bodies laying the street of the great city (Jerusalem) is given there in Rev.11 as a specific literal event involving Jerusalem. Babylon is used as a symbol in Revelation not meaning the geographical city of Babylon (which is in today's Iraq) anymore than it's speaking of New York city, Rome, etc. God is using the historical destruction of geographical Babylon (Isa.21) as an "ensample" for the one in Revelation. So how Babylon is used as a symbol in Revelation can and does point to the whole 'beast' system that will be spread over all nations, but still, we are being shown Jerusalem in a fallen condition in Revelation 11, and as the epicenter of the beast's control, because that's where Rev.11 shows that beast (the devil) will ascend out of the bottomless pit to kill God's two witnesses.

Even Cyrus being sent by God to conquer historical Babylon points to Christ's second coming to end the Revelation Babylon system, since God called Cyrus His anointed, and used him to free His people Israel from the 70 year's Babylon captivity. And where does our Lord Jesus return to as written? To Jerusalem, to the Mount of Olives specifically (Zech.14).

 

[Cornelius]

According to your interpretation, everyone who is not currently doing God's will, is a child of the devil. Which would mean that no more people can or will be be saved because they are not "of God."

LOL Brother, sometimes you can talk a lot of nonsense. Where did I say that they cannot be saved?

ALL of us were children of the devil before we were saved. We all served him and not God. But God saved us from the ...........kingdom of darkness (where the devil ruled us as our king and father) and translated us into the Kingdom o His Son. Now we are children of God.

 

[researcher]

According to your interpretation, everyone who is not currently doing God's will, is a child of the devil. Which would mean that no more people can or will be be saved because they are not "of God."

LOL Brother, sometimes you can talk a lot of nonsense. Where did I say that they cannot be saved?

ALL of us were children of the devil before we were saved. We all served him and not God. But God saved us from the ...........kingdom of darkness (where the devil ruled us as our king and father) and translated us into the Kingdom o His Son. Now we are children of God.

Read it again. An offspring of the devil can't be saved. It's exactly what the Bible says.

 

[GodspromisesRyes]

Eph 2:1 ¶ And you [hath he quickened], who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Eph 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
Eph 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
Eph 2:4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
Eph 2:6 And hath raised [us] up together, and made [us] sit together in heavenly [places] in Christ Jesus:

because of nature we all were children of disobedience walking according to the devil the same spirit that works still in those who are still children of disobedience but we have been saved. There are only two people on the earth, Christ or Antichrist. Either a person is part of the body of Christ and Christ is come in their flesh or they are antichrist and they deny the father and son and do not confess Christ as coming in their flesh because in them is the spirit of error. John makes this clear in 1 and 2 john. Everyone is either of the same spirit as cain or the same as able, the same as judas or the same as Jesus until they are saved. Everyone who is not yet saved serves satan those in Christ, Christ.

back to the two witnesses here are some other examples of them
Exd 31:18 ¶ And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.

the word testimony is the same we witness. this is an OT type, we see this is written in stone with the finger of God but in the new covenant God writes His laws on our hearts which he turns from stone to flesh. We are in this earth walking witnesses to His gospel and law of faith in Christ. Jesus sent out the disciples by twos and told them they would be His witnesses in all the earth

Mar 6:7 And he called [unto him] the twelve, and began to send them forth by two and two; and gave them power over unclean spirits;
Luk 10:1 After these things the Lord appointed other seventy also, and sent them two and two before his face into every city and place, whither he himself would come.

Act 1:8 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.

Jesus was the fulfillment of the ark of the covenant in which the tablets of witness were placed that contained the commandments on stone written with the finger of God. The witnesses are believers in Jesus that go out as He ordained two by two into the world to testify of Him. They are Hid in Christ and He in them, God has circumsided their hearts and turned them from stone to flesh and written the commandments on their hearts and they must take the gospel to the ends of the earth as a witnesses TO everyone making all innocent through salvation or guilty through unbelief.

Just as babylon in revelation is a picture of an overall harlot system so too jerusalem is a picture of the church the city of God heb 12:22-24 WE the people of God are jerusalem, we are zion, the daughters of zion the city of God etc... not a physical location on earth. it is the temple and the city that get measured and those outside of in the court are christians who are not drawing neigh to God and entering into the holy place through Christ. THEY get trampled 42 months by the beast. The temple of God in rev is the same as in zech it is the PEOPLE OF GOD whom the Holy Spirit dwells in. it is US and US alone who are fitly framed together into a Holy Temple! and it is US that gets measured not a physical city. The things that happened before are just examples to us of spiritual matters that we see in Christ.

 

[researcher]

Just as babylon in revelation is a picture of an overall harlot system so too jerusalem is a picture of the church the city of God heb 12:22-24 WE the people of God are jerusalem, we are zion, the daughters of zion the city of God etc... not a physical location on earth. it is the temple and the city that get measured and those outside of in the court are christians who are not drawing neigh to God and entering into the holy place through Christ. THEY get trampled 42 months by the beast. The temple of God in rev is the same as in zech it is the PEOPLE OF GOD whom the Holy Spirit dwells in. it is US and US alone who are fitly framed together into a Holy Temple! and it is US that gets measured not a physical city. The things that happened before are just examples to us of spiritual matters that we see in Christ.

New Jerusalem = saints, agree.

42 months, no.

Rev 11:1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.
Rev 11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

That was about Jerusalem & Rome during the 70AD war.

 

[GodspromisesRyes]

New Jerusalem = saints, agree.

42 months, no.

Rev 11:1 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.
Rev 11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

That was about Jerusalem & Rome during the 70AD war.

lol i love ya researcher and besides the preterism i find your posts great LOL the problem with what you are saying here is that this isnot what happened in 70 ad. this scripture says "the the court which is WITHOUT THE TEMPLE LEAVE OUT and measure it not for IT IS GIVEN unto the gentiles and the holy city shall they tread under foot 42 months.

This is showing that the part that is measured is measured but the area that is given to be trampled by gentiles DOES NOT get measured. that is the temple and altar and them that worship therein.

In 70 ad not just the city wsa given to be trampled but also the whole temple was destroyed burnt down people killed in the temple not just the court and city. so it makes no sence for the prophecy to say just the court and city were given over when then it was all destroyed. This is a future event in rev. also there were no two witnesses as described in rev 11 in 70 ad, there also was not the beast of rev 13 in 70 ad. only ONE of the heads of that beast in rev 13 existed at the time of 70 ad and that is rome, that is the head that john describes as Rev 17:10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, [and] the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.
Rev 17:11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

we see from daniel who some of these are, in daniels day he told of the one that was(babylon) down to the last one (he didnot mention those before his time) just as with john he spoke of those before his own time which was 5 the one that existed in his own day he said of it "one is" and then says about the next that the other isnot yet come. The one in johns day was rome, but we see that rome was not the last one on the list. Rome in 70 ad against jerusalem does not filfill the 7th or 8th which are the beast kingdom of rev 13 that contain within it the demon kings of all of those 7 prior beast kingdoms. the beast kingdom in rev 13 is the same as the fourth beast daniel saw in a vision that rome in 70 ad does not fit that description.

Beyond that in 70 ad there were no witnesses killed who then were resurrected from the dead in front of their enemies and who ascended into heaven with all their enemies watching it happen.