Bible Study Whom do I need to pray to for being saved? Either Jehovah or Jesus?

[Tracy J. Harper]

Yesterday, I met sister Lili, she asked me a question, “Whom do I need to pray to for being saved? Either Jehovah or Jesus? Jehovah is the Father, Jesus is the son. Father is greater than Son. Should we pray to the Holy Father Jehovah?
Isaiah 43:10-11, it recorded, ‘…before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no savior.’
And Exodus 3:15 records, ‘…the LORD God … is my name for ever, and this is my memorial to all generations.’
But ‘Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.’(Acts 4:12) (kjv) So I'm at a loss whose name I should pray! Can you tell me?”
I didn't answer her question. Because I thought I only prayed to Lord Jesus, and did as what Lord asked me to do, then I can be saved. I was confused about this question. Whom do I need to pray to for being saved?

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Romans 10:9-10 NKJV – that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation

Teen Missions Intl.

 

[Jim Parker]

Yesterday, I met sister Lili, she asked me a question, “Whom do I need to pray to for being saved? Either Jehovah or Jesus? Jehovah is the Father, Jesus is the son. Father is greater than Son. Should we pray to the Holy Father Jehovah?
Isaiah 43:10-11, it recorded, ‘…before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no savior.’
And Exodus 3:15 records, ‘…the LORD God … is my name for ever, and this is my memorial to all generations.’
But ‘Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.’(Acts 4:12) (kjv) So I'm at a loss whose name I should pray! Can you tell me?”
I didn't answer her question. Because I thought I only prayed to Lord Jesus, and did as what Lord asked me to do, then I can be saved. I was confused about this question. Whom do I need to pray to for being saved?

The Father is God; the Son is God; the Holy Spirit is God.

Just pray to God. Don't complicate it by over-analyzing. An angel will make sure your message gets to the right hypostases.

iakov the fool

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

The Father is God; the Son is God; the Holy Spirit is God.

Just pray to God. Don't complicate it by over-analyzing. An angel will make sure your message gets to the right hypostases.

iakov the fool

What's a hypostases?
Is that English?

 

[Tracy J. Harper]

Romans 10:9-10 NKJV – that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation

Teen Missions Intl.

The Lord Jesus said, “Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father which is in heaven.” (Matthew 7:21 7:22 kjv)
And the Scripture says, “you shall therefore be holy, for I am holy.” (Leviticus 11:45 kjv)
"Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord.” (Hebrews 12:14 kjv)
I often sin, and often confess. This means that I am not holy. Do you think such people as me could enter into the kingdom of heaven?

 

[Jim Parker]

What's a hypostases?
Is that English?

Hypostasis (ὑπόστασις) is a Greek word that gets translated into English as "person" when speaking of the Holy Trinity. "Person" does not carry the full meaning of hypostasis and is only an approximation. Thus of the Trinity we say there are Three "persons" in the Godhead; Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. But, no matter which words we use, we always run into the wall of our inability to accurately describe God and the Trinity remains a mystery.

iakov the fool

 

[Jim Parker]

I often sin, and often confess. This means that I am not holy. Do you think such people as me could enter into the kingdom of heaven?

Sounds like you're like David. Just keep it up til the end and you'll meet David and the rest of the saints.

iakov the fool.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

The Lord Jesus said, “Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father which is in heaven.” (Matthew 7:21 7:22 kjv)
And the Scripture says, “you shall therefore be holy, for I am holy.” (Leviticus 11:45 kjv)
"Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord.” (Hebrews 12:14 kjv)
I often sin, and often confess. This means that I am not holy. Do you think such people as me could enter into the kingdom of heaven?

If you can't get into heaven, then none of us have a chance.

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

John 14:8-14 (NIV)

8 Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us.”

9 Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11 Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the works themselves. 12 Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13 And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it.

Mathew 6:9-13 (NIV)

9 “This, then, is how you should pray:

“‘Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name,
10 your kingdom come,
your will be done,
on earth as it is in heaven.
11 Give us today our daily bread.
12 And forgive us our debts,
as we also have forgiven our debtors.
13 And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from the evil one.'

----------------------

With that in mind, I think there's merrit in the tradition in starting a prayer to God. "Dear God, ..." As Jesus taught to pray in the Lord's Prayer "Our Father in Heaven." And there is merrit in ending the prayer in Jesus. "... In Jesus's name, Amen." As Jesus told Philip and the apostles who wanted reassurance in their faith.

If a person has struggles with identifying Jesus and God as the same, as it's sometimes considered in some views of the Trinity, then let it be at ease because Jeuse said he will be at the right hand of God for our sales, and the Holy Spirit will be sent to us from God and Jesus to be with us. Even in prayer it's ok to identify both God Yahweh, and Jesus. Even if they are not a trinity they are together. Even in prayer.

 

[JLB]

Jehovah is the Father, Jesus is the son. Father is greater than Son. Should we pray to the Holy Father Jehovah?

Jehovah is not the name of God, but a perversion.

Pray to your Heavenly Father in Jesus Name.


JLB

 

[Tracy J. Harper]

The Father is God; the Son is God; the Holy Spirit is God.

Just pray to God. Don't complicate it by over-analyzing. An angel will make sure your message gets to the right hypostases.

iakov the fool

Yes, Jehovah, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are one. But I confused with that God had made it clear that only Jehovah was the Savior and the name of God, a name for ever in Old Testament. But after the Lord Jesus came to work in New Testament, the name of Jehovah was no longer mentioned, we have been enjoying the forgiveness of the Lord by the name Jesus. Why did God take different names in Old Testament and New Testament? What's the mystery of this?

 

[Eugene]

I often sin, and often confess. This means that I am not holy. Do you think such people as me could enter into the kingdom of heaven?

Dear Sister Tracy J. Harper, many make believing on the Lord Jesus complicated, and I'll just give you scripture I believe covers it to the uttermost.

Rom 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
Rom 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed?

There’s many a soldier that was saved while calling out for God’s help from a foxhole similar to what I believe the thief on the cross experienced according to Luke 23:42-43, And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. Luke 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise. Was he saved?

I wrote the following pamphlet I hope gives you the security you need to know that the finished work of our Savior on the cross toward us provided. Be blessed in Christ Jesus.

Salvation with Security – 1, 2, 3
http://www.christianforums.net/Fell...ds/salvation-with-security-parts-1-2-3.52236/

 

[Chopper]

Jehovah is not the name of God, but a perversion.

Pray to your Heavenly Father in Jesus Name.


JLB

What in the world are you saying JLB? "Perversion?" Here's the definition from Webster....
Definition of perversion

: sexual behavior that people think is not normal or natural:
:something that improperly changes something good
: the process of improperly changing something that is good

So, you are saying that the name for God Jehovah is a perversion? The Hebrew word for the English word Jehovah is Yhovah....Genesis 18:1 "And the LORD appeared"


Total KJV occurrences: 6521From H1961; (the) self Existent or eternal; Jehovah, Jewish national name of God: - Jehovah, the Lord. Compare H3050, H3069.yeh-ho-vaw'yehôvâhיְהֹוָה

 

[Jim Parker]

Yes, Jehovah, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are one. But I confused with that God had made it clear that only Jehovah was the Savior and the name of God, a name for ever in Old Testament. But after the Lord Jesus came to work in New Testament, the name of Jehovah was no longer mentioned, we have been enjoying the forgiveness of the Lord by the name Jesus. Why did God take different names in Old Testament and New Testament? What's the mystery of this?

There are many names of God in the Old Testament. Each of them reveal an aspect of God. Today, in English, we refer to God with the word "God" which includes all the meanings of all the OT names. It is the "generic" name of God.

Jesus is God in flesh. He is the same God as revealed in the OT by every name of God that was used.

Jesus is the one who opened the community of the people of God, previously open only to Jews, to any and all the Gentiles who would believe in Him.

Jesus is the one who takes away the sins of the world.

Jesus is the one who conquered death by His death.

Jesus will come to judge the living and the dead.

I hope that helps.

 

[Roro1972]

Yesterday, I met sister Lili, she asked me a question, “Whom do I need to pray to for being saved? Either Jehovah or Jesus? Jehovah is the Father, Jesus is the son. Father is greater than Son. Should we pray to the Holy Father Jehovah?
Isaiah 43:10-11, it recorded, ‘…before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no savior.’
And Exodus 3:15 records, ‘…the LORD God … is my name for ever, and this is my memorial to all generations.’
But ‘Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.’(Acts 4:12) (kjv) So I'm at a loss whose name I should pray! Can you tell me?”
I didn't answer her question. Because I thought I only prayed to Lord Jesus, and did as what Lord asked me to do, then I can be saved. I was confused about this question. Whom do I need to pray to for being saved?

john 15
16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you. imho

 

[King Dan of Great the 1st]

then let it be at ease because Jeuse said he will be at the right hand of God for our sales, and the Holy Spirit will be sent to us from God and Jesus to be with us.

Who is Jeuse?. lol.

 

[JLB]

What in the world are you saying JLB? "Perversion?" Here's the definition from Webster....
Definition of perversion

: sexual behavior that people think is not normal or natural:
:something that improperly changes something good
: the process of improperly changing something that is good

So, you are saying that the name for God Jehovah is a perversion? The Hebrew word for the English word Jehovah is Yhovah....Genesis 18:1 "And the LORD appeared"


Total KJV occurrences: 6521From H1961; (the) self Existent or eternal; Jehovah, Jewish national name of God: - Jehovah, the Lord. Compare H3050, H3069.yeh-ho-vaw'yehôvâhיְהֹוָה

# 3 - the process of improperly changing something that is good


Webster's Collegiate Dictionary:

“Jehovah — False reading of the Hebrew YHWH.”
(“Jehovah,” Webster's New Collegiate Dictionary, 1973 ed.)

Encyclopedia Americana:

“Jehovah — erroneous form of the name of the G-d of Israel.”
(Encyclopedia Americana, vol. 16., 1972 ed.)

Encyclopedia Britannica:

“The Masoretes who from the 6th to the 10th century worked to reproduce the original text of the Hebrew Bible replaced the vowels of the name YHWH with the vowel signs of Adonai or Elohim. Thus the artificial name Jehovah came into being.”
(“Yahweh,” The New Encyclopedia Britannica, vol. 12, 1993 ed.)

The Jewish Encyclopedia:

“Jehovah — a mispronunciation of the Hebrew YHWH the name of G-d. This pronunciation is grammatically impossible.”
(“Jehovah,” The Jewish Encyclopedia, vol. 7, 1904 ed.)

The New Jewish Encyclopedia:

“It is clear that the word Jehovah is an artificial composite.”
(“Jehovah,” The New Jewish Encyclopedia, 1962 ed.)


The Jewish Encyclopedia states that YHWH is "the distinctive personal name of the God of Israel", and describes the form "Jehovah" as "a philological impossibility".

 

[JLB]

What in the world are you saying JLB? "Perversion?" Here's the definition from Webster....
Definition of perversion

: sexual behavior that people think is not normal or natural:
:something that improperly changes something good
: the process of improperly changing something that is good

So, you are saying that the name for God Jehovah is a perversion? The Hebrew word for the English word Jehovah is Yhovah....Genesis 18:1 "And the LORD appeared"


Total KJV occurrences: 6521From H1961; (the) self Existent or eternal; Jehovah, Jewish national name of God: - Jehovah, the Lord. Compare H3050, H3069.yeh-ho-vaw'yehôvâhיְהֹוָה

Compare:

H3050 - Yah - Shortened form

H1943 - hovah - ruin, disaster - Do a study of H1943, the root is H1942 [it gets worse]



A compound word is two words together to form one word.

Example: halleluyah – to praise the lord in song

Strong’s # 3470 - Isaiah - Yĕsha`yah - from (03467) and (03050)

(03467) - yasha`- to save, be saved, be delivered

(03050) = yah - lord

Yĕsha`yah - the compound word means: the lord is deliverer [savior]


Let’s look at the other part of the compound word “Jehovah”.


Yah - strong’s number 3050

The other part of this compound word is:

Hovah strong’s number 1943

1. ruin, disaster

Another form for 1943is:

havvah strong’s number 1942

1. desire
   1. desire (in bad sense)
2. chasm (fig. of destruction)
   1. engulfing ruin, destruction, calamity

KJV (15) - calamity, 4; iniquity, 1; mischief, 1; mischievous, 1; naughtiness, 1; naughty, 1; noisome, 1; perverse thing, 1; substance, 1; wickedness, 3;


# 1942 is from the word - hava'

1. to fall

Hoveh on the other hand means: 1st person, male, present tense - to be i.e. I AM - though written with a double vav

In modern Hebrew grammar this matter is so serious and important, that the verb ‘to be’ (‘I am’) is not used in the present tense at all!

Usage of the Hebrew verb ‘HOVEH’ (I am) would imply referring to oneself as being the Almighty!

 

[Douglas Summers]

Yesterday, I met sister Lili, she asked me a question, “Whom do I need to pray to for being saved? Either Jehovah or Jesus? Jehovah is the Father, Jesus is the son. Father is greater than Son. Should we pray to the Holy Father Jehovah?
Isaiah 43:10-11, it recorded, ‘…before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no savior.’
And Exodus 3:15 records, ‘…the LORD God … is my name for ever, and this is my memorial to all generations.’
But ‘Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.’(Acts 4:12) (kjv) So I'm at a loss whose name I should pray! Can you tell me?”
I didn't answer her question. Because I thought I only prayed to Lord Jesus, and did as what Lord asked me to do, then I can be saved. I was confused about this question. Whom do I need to pray to for being saved?

Hi Tracy, You do not pray to be saved, you believe to be saved. Your prayer is in acknowledging you are a sinner and thanks giving for God's mercy and grace. Until a man is convicted in his heart of his sinful nature, it is impossible to know or feel God,s grace. Then prayer has power, for through the work of the Father in Jesus The Christ, We now have access directly to the Father through the cross of Christ. Christ is the same God in the OT before His incarnation. What ever you learn or come to know about the nature of Christ and His mercy and grace towards us is the exact same nature as the Fathers. If you know Christ, you then know the Father. Christ now tells us to pray to the Father through His name (John 16: 22-31) Many denominations have what they call the sinners prayer? But salvation is not by saying a pre prepared prayer. It comes by conviction of the carnal soul crying out to God for what you now see clearly by the Light of God in Jesus Christ. Repentance and conversion have the same meaning. It's biblical meaning is to turn around or a change in the belief of God and man. Regeneration is what God does. Receiving the Holy Spirit (The new man)

 

[Chopper]

Compare:

H3050 - Yah - Shortened form

H1943 - hovah - ruin, disaster - Do a study of H1943, the root is H1942 [it gets worse]



A compound word is two words together to form one word.

Example: halleluyah – to praise the lord in song

Strong’s # 3470 - Isaiah - Yĕsha`yah - from (03467) and (03050)

(03467) - yasha`- to save, be saved, be delivered

(03050) = yah - lord

Yĕsha`yah - the compound word means: the lord is deliverer [savior]


Let’s look at the other part of the compound word “Jehovah”.


Yah - strong’s number 3050

The other part of this compound word is:

Hovah strong’s number 1943

1. ruin, disaster

Another form for 1943is:

havvah strong’s number 1942

1. desire
   1. desire (in bad sense)
2. chasm (fig. of destruction)
   1. engulfing ruin, destruction, calamity

KJV (15) - calamity, 4; iniquity, 1; mischief, 1; mischievous, 1; naughtiness, 1; naughty, 1; noisome, 1; perverse thing, 1; substance, 1; wickedness, 3;


# 1942 is from the word - hava'

1. to fall

Hoveh on the other hand means: 1st person, male, present tense - to be i.e. I AM - though written with a double vav

In modern Hebrew grammar this matter is so serious and important, that the verb ‘to be’ (‘I am’) is not used in the present tense at all!

Usage of the Hebrew verb ‘HOVEH’ (I am) would imply referring to oneself as being the Almighty!

What do you suggest. When I'm referring to the Godhead, should I stick with YHWH, and never with Jehovah, or Elohim?