[_ Old Earth _] A question of time

[brother Paul]

As many know, Petralona Man was originally dated to between 70,000 and 700,000 years old based on the surrounding geology. BUT...it made sense that a later human(s) could have wandered into or explored or taken up residence in a much older cave. Since then other dating methods have been applied shrinking the margin on both sides. Recent ESR dating has narrowed it further to be between 160,000 to 240,000 years old.

The problem is that even if we take the youngest possible date so far (160,000 yrs), that still means homo-sapiens were alive and well in Greece 100,000 years before the alleged out of Africa migration 60,000 years ago. There is so much mounting evidence against this incorrect yet accepted timeline (that was taught as established for decades) that I believe it is time they admit they made a mistake and then re-evaluate.

Some scientists who agree have proposed multiple migrations possibly stretching back closer to 200,000 years, but that still does not adequately explain how homo-sapien Neandertalis pre-dates the Petralona skull but at least another 100,000 years or more or the realities of Dali man in Asia (admittedly an archaic homo-sapien possibly 200,000years ago). Conclusion?

The Evolutionary Paleoanthropologist’s spin has simply been wr-wr-wrong, once again, yet taught as correct for many generations. Eventually textbooks and encyclopedias will once again have to be re-written to correct their hypothesis based interpretations and subsequent erroneous conclusions.

 

[Milk-Drops]

Neanderthal is not a human ancestor. :I

 

[brother Paul]

Homo-Sapien Neandertalis and Homo-Sapien Altai (Denisovans) are definite;y humans.

 

[Milk-Drops]

Homo-Sapien Neandertalis and Homo-Sapien Altai (Denisovans) are definite;y humans.

No, there is no such thing as a Homo-Sapien Neandertalis, there are Homo Neanderthalensis, but they are a diverging species. We are Sapien, they are not. They have several physical and genetic differences from Homo Sapiens. As for Denisovan, the research shows that they are a possibly a subspecies that are more related to us Homo sapians, but were also able to breed with Homo Neandertalis. That is interesting.

 

[Eugene]

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Thread reopened for replies.

 

[brother Paul]

No, there is no such thing as a Homo-Sapien Neandertalis, there are Homo Neanderthalensis, but they are a diverging species. We are Sapien, they are not. They have several physical and genetic differences from Homo Sapiens. As for Denisovan, the research shows that they are a possibly a subspecies that are more related to us Homo sapians, but were also able to breed with Homo Neandertalis. That is interesting.

Well MD more recent Anthropology appears to disagree with you.

Though this thread was not intended to be a debate about Neanderthals, but about how we are re-thinking the commonly accepted migration scenario (which you obviously have accepted) I do offer the following for your perusal.

https://www.livinganthropologically.com/anthropology/denisovans-neandertals-human-races

And this is supported by the recent finds in Morraco pushing homo sapien much further back..

John Hawkes puts it like this “We know for a fact that some Neandertal genes are today very common – for example, one 100-kilobase region occurs at a frequency of 28 percent outside of Africa. Any assignment to a species is a hypothesis, provisional on finding new facts to refute it. For the moment the facts point to them being the same species as us.”

There are many reasons for this more recent conclusion, not withstanding the definition of "species". In light of this, homo sapien Neandertalis, homo sapien Altai, and homo sapien Sapien are three sub-species of the same creature. See also Bednarik, R.G. (2012). "U–Th analysis and rock art: a response to Pike et al". Rock Art Research. 29 (2): 244–46.

As the Smithsonian summarizes "Neanderthals made and used a diverse set of sophisticated tools, controlled fire, lived in shelters, made and wore clothing, were skilled hunters of large animals and also ate plant foods, and occasionally made symbolic or ornamental objects. There is evidence that Neanderthals deliberately buried their dead and occasionally even marked their graves with offerings, such as flowers"

So aside from the fact that three varieties of homo sapien all socially and sexually interacted (producing fertile offspring), already sharing 99.7% genetic similarity (same proportional difference between a Norwegian and a person of Cantonese lineage today), they all exhibited these totally HUMAN behavioral patterns not found in any earlier primate species.

 

[brother Paul]

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Thread reopened for replies.

Thanks Eugene but we had not been informed it was closed....

 

[brother Paul]

Milk Drops, consider the beautifully crafted one piece chlorite bracelet found in the Denisovancave....expertly crafted using a handmade boring tool and then finely polished...clearly more than 40,000 years old…or the lovely ring found nearby that is carved out of solid marble? You can google these artifacts and even see them on You Tube. I mean, how can it be true that homo sapiens emerged and migrated from Africa 40 to 60,000 years ago when they were already in Siberia and already capable of making this expertly crafted Jewelry?

And the Neandertal finds that indicate a very sophisticated knowledge and technology for making their unique type of pitch (see Decoding Neanderthal on Nova) that involved a very intricate and specific process, 100s of 1,000s of years before the accepted human migration scenario. Undoubtedly these were intelligent and socializing human beings.

So even though many University Professors and Public School textbooks still state that "homo sapiens" first migrated out of Africa around 40 to 60,000 years ago, these other elements MUST BE been added in and the hypothesis changed to line up with all the data.

Isn't this the true purpose of objective scientific method to change with the discovery of new facts...if it were not then we would still be stuck on Newtonian Mechanics as an explanation of the Universe.