Angels can not Sin !

[Elvispelvis]

The Angels:

# physical, personal beings
# carrying God's Name
# channels through which God's Spirit works to
# execute His will
# in accordance with His character and purpose
# and thereby manifesting Him.

One of the most common Hebrew words translated 'God' is 'Elohim', which really means 'mighty ones'; these 'mighty ones' who carry God's Name can effectively be called 'God' because of their close association with Him. These beings are the Angels.

The record of the creation of the world in Genesis 1 tells us that God spoke certain commands concerning creation, "and it was done". It was the Angels who carried out these commands:

"Angels, that excel in strength, that do His commandments, hearkening unto the voice of His word" (Ps.103:20).

It is therefore reasonable to assume that when we read of 'God' creating the world, this work was actually performed by the Angels. Job 38:4-7 hints this way too. Now is a good time to summarize the events of the creation as recorded in Gen.1:

Day 1 "God said, Let there be light: and there was light" (v.3)

Day 2 "God said, Let there be a firmament (sky, expanse) in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters (on the earth) from the waters (in the clouds)...and it was so" (v.6,7)

Day 3 "God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together (forming seas and oceans)...and let the dry land appear; and it was so" (v.9)

Day 4 "God said, Let there be lights...in heaven...and it was so" (v.14,15)

Day 5 "God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature...and fowl that may fly...and God created every living creature" (v.20,21) - i.e. "it was so"

Day 6 "God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature...cattle, and creeping thing...and it was so" (v.24).

Man was created on that same sixth day. "God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness" (Gen.1:26). We commented on this verse in Study 1.2. For the present, we want to note that "God" here is not just referring to God Himself in person - "Let us make man" shows that 'God' is referring to more than one person. The Hebrew word translated 'God' here is 'Elohim', meaning 'Mighty Ones', with reference to the Angels. The fact that the Angels created us in their image means that they have the same bodily appearance as we have. They are therefore very real, tangible, corporeal beings, sharing the same nature as God.

'Nature' in this sense refers to what someone is fundamentally like by reason of their physical structure. In the Bible there are two 'natures'; by the very meaning of the word it is not possible to have both these natures simultaneously.

God's Nature ('Divine nature')
# Cannot sin (perfect) (Rom.9:14; 6:23 cp. Ps.90:2; Mt.5:48; James 1:13)
# Cannot die, i.e. immortal (1 Tim.6:16)
# Full of power and energy (Is.40:28).

This is the nature of God and the Angels, and which was given to Jesus after his resurrection (Acts 13:34; Rev.1:18; Heb.1:3). This is the nature which we are promised (Lk.20:35,36; 2 Pet.1:4; Is.40:28 cp.v 31).

Human nature
# Tempted to sin (James 1:13-15) by a corrupt natural mind (Jer.17:9; Mk.7:21-23)
# Doomed to death, i.e. mortal (Rom.5:12,17; 1 Cor.15:22)
# Of very limited strength, both physically (Is.40:30) and mentally (Jer.10:23).

This is the nature which all men, good and bad, now possess. The end of that nature is death (Rom.6:23). It was the nature which Jesus had during his mortal life (Heb.2:14-18; Rom.8:3; Jn.2:25; Mk.10:18).

It is unfortunate that the English word 'nature' is rather vague: we can use it in a sentence like 'John is of a generous nature - it just isn't in his nature to be mean; but he can be rather proud of his car, which is just human nature, I suppose'. s.

Taken from Bible Basics. My elders are much better at grammar, punctuation , writing than I will ever be so with permission I let them speak. But I answer all questions.


The old testament is full future events , prophecy.
Please study the old testament.

 

[Oats]

interesting...dont know if i 100% agree...then what was satan

 

[Theofilus]

The Angels:

# physical, personal beings
# carrying God's Name
# channels through which God's Spirit works to
# execute His will
# in accordance with His character and purpose
# and thereby manifesting Him.

One of the most common Hebrew words translated 'God' is 'Elohim', which really means 'mighty ones'; these 'mighty ones' who carry God's Name can effectively be called 'God' because of their close association with Him. These beings are the Angels.

Taking verses out of context is bad enough, but taking individual words out of context to support a doctrine is going to far, in my opinion. On it's own, the word "elohim" is a plural word and does indeed mean "mighty ones", but it can be used to meany various things depending on context. Think of the English word "man". It can refer to an individual adult, male human being (as in "I am a man), or it can refer to all of humanity or some part of it, regardless of gender (as in "Man will some day colonize other planets"). Which meaning it has (or whether it has one of the other 28 possible meanings) can only be determined by looking at the context.You can't take just one meaning and apply it to all occurences of the word "man".

It is the same with the word "elohim". You just can't take one meaning and apply it to every occurance of that word. Sometimes it is used to refer to pagan gods and sometimes people are called el (the singular form of elohim). But sometimes, as is the case in the creation account, it is used to refer to God. You have to look at the context to see what is meant.

 

[Sinthesis]

The fact that the Angels created us in their image means that they have the same bodily appearance as we ha[/i]ve. They are therefore very real, tangible, corporeal beings, sharing the same nature as God.

Houston, we have a problem. :o

 

[DrFrank]

Demons Are Former Angels

This message ignores the Bible's teachings about Satan which are extremely important because they show the power that Satan has.Here are a couple verses from Chapter 12 in the Book of Revelation explaining the evil nature of many angels:

7A war broke out in heaven. Michael and his angels were fighting against the dragon (SATAN) and its angels. 8 But the dragon lost the battle. It and its angels (SATAN'S ANGELS THAT WE CALL DEMONS USED TO BE GOD'S ANGELS BEFORE SATAN CONVINCED THEM TO FOLLOW HIM) were forced out of their places in heaven 9 and were thrown down to the earth.Finally the old snake (CALLED THIS NAME BECAUSE HE FIRST APPEARED ON EARTH IN THE DISGUISE OF A SNAKE ) and his angels were thrown out.That snake, who deceives everyone (WHO IS STILL LEFT) on earth,(AFTER THE RAPTURE) is known as the devil and Satan.

A VERY DRAMATIC REFUTATION OF THE "ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED" HERESY !

 

[Vic C.]

The fact that the Angels created us in their image means that they have the same bodily appearance as we ha[/i]ve. They are therefore very real, tangible, corporeal beings, sharing the same nature as God.

Houston, we have a problem. :o

I agree! Even Jewish sources would consider this a heretical statement. Here is what the late and well respected commentator Rashi said about this:

Let us make man: Even though they [the angels] did not assist Him in His creation, and there is an opportunity for the heretics to rebel (to misconstrue the plural as a basis for their heresies), Scripture did not hesitate to teach proper conduct and the trait of humility, that a great person should consult with and receive permission from a smaller one. Had it been written: “I shall make man,†we would not have learned that He was speaking with His tribunal, but to Himself. And the refutation to the heretics is written alongside it [i. e., in the following verse:]“And God created (??????????) ,†and it does not say,“and they created ????????????.†- [from Gen. Rabbah 8:9]

http://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo ... rashi/true

So, we see this isn't even a new belief.

 

[Vic C.]

I urge everyone to NOT make this an end times or OSAS debate or you find your posts edited or deleted.

Thank you.

 

[Hawkins]

2 Peter 2:4
For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgment

Jude 1:6
And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their own home—these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day.

 

[Elvispelvis]

Dr Frank said;
This message ignores the Bible's teachings about Satan which are extremely important because they show the power that Satan has.Here are a couple verses from Chapter 12 in the Book of Revelation explaining the evil nature of many angels:

7A war broke out in heaven. Michael and his angels were fighting against the dragon (SATAN) and its angels. 8 But the dragon lost the battle. It and its angels (SATAN'S ANGELS THAT WE CALL DEMONS USED TO BE GOD'S ANGELS BEFORE SATAN CONVINCED THEM TO FOLLOW HIM) were forced out of their places in heaven 9 and were thrown down to the earth.Finally the old snake (CALLED THIS NAME BECAUSE HE FIRST APPEARED ON EARTH IN THE DISGUISE OF A SNAKE ) and his angels were thrown out.That snake, who deceives everyone (WHO IS STILL LEFT) on earth,(AFTER THE RAPTURE) is known as the devil and Satan.

Craig said;
I dont recall talking about satan the devil, demons, Why did you try to change my thread?
You are free to start your own post you know?
This post is about Angels cannot Sin.
You did not even try to answer any of the verses that I put forward, why are you not able to answer?

The verses I used from the old testament in Genesis you totally ignore because you are unable to answer you change the subject to Revalations the hardest book in the Bible to understand,
yet you a person who cant answer simple verses from the old testament you are an expert on Revelations.

By the way you used the verses in Revelations it tells a lot about your knowledge.
You couldnt care less what the Angels teach us! Obviously you have never read
Rev 22 18
I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.

So look back at how you quoted scripture you added things you took things away to suit your own interpretation.

Sin cerley Craig
ps
We certainly will post about Satan devil , demons, lucifer, as we progress for now I started in Genesis

I notice only one person tried to answer Genesis verses. Nobody commented what immortal beings
are mentioned in the Bible. Nobody came up with any descriptions of angels , why?
I was waiting for someone to say Angels have wings which they dont.
Angels do not have wings. Nor do they require wings to fly . The mighty ones have the Power Of God.

As a matter of fact the words satan, devil, lucifer, do not appear any where in the whole book of Genesis covering 2,000 years.

Is anyone wise enough to answer, why this is so ?

 

[Elvispelvis]

Hawkins said' 2 Peter 2:4
For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgment

Jude 1:6
And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their own home—these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day
.............................................................................................................................

Craig said:
Please take the time to answer the verses I put forward in Genesis if you are able of course.
Instead of putting up verses with no explanations.

It is not advisable to take the verses you did and take as a literal statements.

To try to grasp that Jesus does not speak English, He is a Jew!
All the writers of the new testament were and are and will be again Jews !

You are quoting an English Bible that was not written in English, Can you follow this?
The Bible was written In Hebrew and Greek. So take the time to look up all the words in Greek,
I assure you it is a parable, symbolic, metaphorical ,language.

Do not allow your opinion to be formed by a translation of the bible.
In the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who will judge the living and the dead, and in view of his appearing and his kingdom, I give you this charge:
2 Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage–with great patience and careful instruction.

Mat 13:34 All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and without a parable spake he not unto them:
Mar 4:11 And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all [these] things are done in parables:

3 For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
4 They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.
5 But you, keep your head in all situations, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, discharge all the duties of your ministry.

Are Christians astray from the Old testament?

Sin cerley Craig

 

[Elvispelvis]

Craig Said:
Since your answer was so vague I cant answer " Houston, we have a problem. "

Are you saying angels have wings and fly in heaven and Earth because you saw it on T V?

Our maybe you saw it in a movie , or you were visited by an Angel and you saw Her wings?
You were in Houston and a flying Angel saved you.?

Rashi saw the wings on the Angels that visited Abraham?

I wrote 250 words backed up with many verses and your intelligent reply is' Houston we have a problem.'
Sin cerly Craig

 

[Teach]

The Angels:
One of the most common Hebrew words translated 'God' is 'Elohim', which really means 'mighty ones'; these 'mighty ones' who carry God's Name can effectively be called 'God' because of their close association with Him. These beings are the Angels.

Taking verses out of context is bad enough, but taking individual words out of context to support a doctrine is going to far, in my opinion. On it's own, the word "elohim" is a plural word and does indeed mean "mighty ones", but it can be used to meany various things depending on context. Think of the English word "man". It can refer to an individual adult, male human being (as in "I am a man), or it can refer to all of humanity or some part of it, regardless of gender (as in "Man will some day colonize other planets"). Which meaning it has (or whether it has one of the other 28 possible meanings) can only be determined by looking at the context.You can't take just one meaning and apply it to all occurences of the word "man".

It is the same with the word "elohim". You just can't take one meaning and apply it to every occurance of that word. Sometimes it is used to refer to pagan gods and sometimes people are called el (the singular form of elohim). But sometimes, as is the case in the creation account, it is used to refer to God. You have to look at the context to see what is meant.

Thank you so much for putting the readers of this thread back on the right track. I agree with you, this interpretation is so far out in left field that it behoves me that it isn’t flooded with comments like yours.
The fact that it totally contradicts the two following verses seems to have no bearing on Elvis’ theory. (Theory being a polite word for delusional ramblings)

John (1:1-3) “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not anything made that was made.â€

Col. (1:12-16) “Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son: In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins: Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for himâ€
These verses single out Jesus, the Son, as the creator. Now I could run with these two verses and formulate my own theology about Jesus being the only creator, but then I would have to ignore Genesis, Revelation and other scriptures concerning the subject in order for that theology to hold.
Anyway this thread is definitely not worth anymore keystroke time.

2Ti (4:3) “For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching earsâ€

 

[Adstar]

I am glad many have come out quickly and firmly against this false doctrine.

Not only was it stated that angels cannot sin but even worse that angels created us in their image. satan would be very happy to see that being preached in a Christian forum.

I will add this scripture to those already quoted that clearly reveal the falsity of this doctrine put forward by the OP.


Revealtion 12
7 And war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels fought with the dragon; and the dragon and his angels fought, 8 but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them in heaven any longer. 9 So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

And a warning from Scriptures

Galatians 1
6 I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, 7 which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed.

Think of joseph smith and muhammed, they both claimed to have received their scriptures from an angel....


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[Hawkins]

Craig said:
Please take the time to answer the verses I put forward in Genesis if you are able of course.
Instead of putting up verses with no explanations.

The verse itself is quite self-explanary

It is not advisable to take the verses you did and take as a literal statements.

To try to grasp that Jesus does not speak English, He is a Jew!
All the writers of the new testament were and are and will be again Jews !

Even the Greek version will not vary that much. And it is not a good idea for me to trust knowledge than God Himself. And God directed the translation in those legitimate versions such as NIV and KJV.

You are quoting an English Bible that was not written in English, Can you follow this?
The Bible was written In Hebrew and Greek. So take the time to look up all the words in Greek,
I assure you it is a parable, symbolic, metaphorical ,language.

The point is, your translation is not more legitimate than those dedicated servants of God who translated the Greek version into other versions.

BTW, why not just show your translation of those verses, if you think that they shouldn't be translated that way?

 

[Elvispelvis]

This is the next installment explaining why angels cant sin.

The wages of sin is death! There fore if an Angel sins it must die!
Angels are immortal beings that cant die!

Angelic Appearances

The Angels being of God's nature, they must be sinless and therefore unable to die - seeing that sin brings death (Rom.6:23). They must have a literal, physical form of existence. It is for this reason that when Angels have appeared on earth they have looked like ordinary men:

- Angels came to Abraham to speak God's words to him; they are described as "three men", whom Abraham initially treated as human beings, since that was their appearance: "Let a little water, I pray you, be fetched, and wash your feet, and rest yourselves under the tree" (Gen.18:4)

- Two of those Angels then went to Lot in the city of Sodom. Again, they were recognized only as men by both Lot and the people of Sodom. "There came two Angels to Sodom", whom Lot invited to spend the night with him. But the men of Sodom came to his house, asking in a threatening way "Where are the men which came in to thee this night?"
. Lot pleaded, "Unto these men do nothing". The inspired record also calls them "men": "The men (Angels) put forth their hand" and rescued Lot; "And the men said unto Lot...The Lord hath sent us to destroy" Sodom (Gen.19:1,5,8, 10,12, 13).

- The New Testament comment on these incidents confirms that Angels are in the form of men: "Be not forgetful to entertain strangers; for some (e.g. Abraham and Lot) have entertained Angels unawares" (Heb.13:2).

- Jacob wrestled all night with a strange man (Gen.32:24), which we are later told was an Angel (Hos.12:4).

- Two men in shining white clothes were present at the resurrection (Lk.24:4) and ascension (Acts 1:10) of Jesus. These were clearly Angels.

- Consider the implications of "the measure of a man, that is, of the Angel" (Rev.21:17).

Angels Do Not Sin

To admit angels cant sin you would have to admit that satan didnt sin and your wrong about the devil.
To be contd........................................ Craig

 

[Teach]

I am glad many have come out quickly and firmly against this false doctrine.

Not only was it stated that angels cannot sin but even worse that angels created us in their image. satan would be very happy to see that being preached in a Christian forum.

I will add this scripture to those already quoted that clearly reveal the falsity of this doctrine put forward by the OP.

Think of joseph smith and muhammed, they both claimed to have received their scriptures from an angel....
All Praise The Ancient Of Days

Thank you Adstar for your insightful comments.
I would not be surprised that, if the OP was honest, he would reveal himself as a satanist. I know this is a strong word but this kind of false doctrine it is well deserved. As Paul in 1Corinthians (5:3) I have judged the OP already. Brethren be very cautious in your discissions with this wolf in sheeps clothing. I implor you hold true to the faith and oppose such doctrine of devils.

 

[XTruth]

The Angels:

# physical, personal beings
# carrying God's Name
# channels through which God's Spirit works to
# execute His will
# in accordance with His character and purpose
# and thereby manifesting Him.

One of the most common Hebrew words translated 'God' is 'Elohim', which really means 'mighty ones'; these 'mighty ones' who carry God's Name can effectively be called 'God' because of their close association with Him. These beings are the Angels.

You started your foundation off on sand. You should be lead to the truth about Elohim in order to be correctly guided... http://www.sitchiniswrong.com/Elohim/Elohim.htm

Here is that page:
Zecharia Sitchin is Jewish. I would imagine that he speaks Hebrew. However, when it comes to biblical Hebrew, he apparently doesn't know Hebrew grammar. Sound crazy? Think about it. You know English; you're reading it now, and you speak it. But could you successfully diagram the sentences in this paragraph? Could you explain all the verb tenses? Could you give me the grammatical relationships of all the prepositional phrases to the verbs which they modify? Could you explain all the subject-verb relationships? I hope you get the point. Grammatical analysis -- which is essential for correct translation -- is not the same as being a speaker of the language. If there were no difference, we wouldn't have English classes in middle school, high school, and college.

Let's apply this to the Hebrew Bible and Sitchin's comments about elohim. Contrary to what Sitchin says, elohim does *not* always mean "gods" (plural); the meaning of the term is to be determined by grammatical and contextual clues. Grammar is to language what your graphical internet browser is to the websites on the internet - it is the organizing vehicle that gives meaning to the data -bits of information. As you'll see below through the PDFs and the videos, this is very easily demonstrated. Grammar dictates the formation of words, the relationship of words to each other, and the meaning of those words with respect to that arrangement. Without attention to the rules of grammar that have governed the languages of ancient texts, you can make the texts say anything.

The PDF files below illustrate (from the Hebrew) that elohim often refers to a "god" or "God" (proper name). Besides this evidence from the Hebrew Bible, I have also posted examples from ancient Mesopotamian texts (Akkadian) from the famous El-Amarna texts where the plural word for "gods" ('ilanu) refers to a single person or god - just as in the case of Hebrew elohim. Why is Sitchin unaware of this material?

 

[Elvispelvis]

Here are more scriptures talking about angels;


ANGELS Do Not Sin

The ANGELS being of God's nature, they cannot die. Seeing that sin brings death, it follows therefore that they cannot sin. The original Greek and Hebrew words translated 'Angel' mean 'messenger'; the ANGELS are the messengers or servants of God, obedient to Him, therefore it is impossible to think of them as being sinful. Thus the Greek word 'aggelos' which is translated 'ANGELS' is also translated 'messengers' when speaking of human beings - e.g. John the baptist (Mt.11:10) and his messengers (Lk.7:24); the messengers of Jesus (Lk.9:52) and the men who spied out Jericho (James 2:25). It is, of course, possible that 'ANGELS' in the sense of human messengers can sin.

The following passages clearly show that all the ANGELS (not just some of them!) are by nature obedient to God, and therefore cannot sin:

"The Lord hath prepared His throne in the heavens; and his kingdom ruleth over all ( i.e. there can be no rebellion against God in Heaven). Bless the Lord, ye His ANGELS, that excel in strength, that do his commandments, hearkening unto the voice of His word. Bless ye the Lord, all ye His hosts; ye ministers of His, that do his pleasure" (Ps.103:19-21).

"Praise him, all his ANGELS...his hosts" (Ps.148:2)

"The ANGELS...are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them (the believers) who shall be heirs of salvation?" (Heb.1:13,14).

The repetition of the word "all" shows that the ANGELS are not divided into two groups, one good and the other sinful. The importance of clearly understanding the nature of the ANGELS is that the reward of the faithful is to share their nature: "They which shall be accounted worthy...neither marry...neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the ANGELS" (Lk.20:35,36). This is a vital point to grasp. ANGELS cannot die: "Death...does not lay hold of ANGELS" (Heb 2:16 Diaglott margin) If ANGELS could sin, then those who are found worthy of reward at Christ's return will also still be able to sin. And seeing that sin brings death (Rom.6:23), they will therefore not have eternal life; if we have a possibility of sinning, we have the capability of dying. Thus to say ANGELS can sin makes God's promise of eternal life meaningless, seeing that our reward is to share the nature of the ANGELS. The reference to "the ANGELS" (Luke 20:35,36) shows that there is no categorization of ANGELS as good or sinful; there is only one category of ANGELS.

If ANGELS could sin, then God is left impotent to righteously act in our lives and the affairs of the world, seeing that He has declared that He works through His ANGELS (Ps.103:19-21). They are 'made Spirit' by God in the sense that He achieves all things by His spirit/power, acting through the ANGELS (Ps. 104:4). That they should be disobedient to Him is therefore an impossibility. The Christian should daily pray for God's Kingdom to come on earth, that His will should be done here as it is now done in heaven Mt. 6:10). If God's ANGELS had to compete with sinful ANGELS inheaven, then His will could not be fully executed there, and therefore the same situation would obtain in God's future Kingdom. To spend eternity in a world which would be a perpetual battlefield between sin and obedience is hardly an encouraging prospect, but that, of course, is not the case.

The old testament is full of future events, prophecy.
Please study the old testament.

 

[westtexas]

Taken from Bible Basics. My elders are much better at grammar, punctuation , writing than I will ever be so with permission I let them speak. But I answer all questions.

Have you got a website or source for the above? I'm curious what kind of "elders" and "church" teaches that Angels created man and calls it "Bible Basics".
Westtexas

 

[Vic C.]

Taken from Bible Basics. My elders are much better at grammar, punctuation , writing than I will ever be so with permission I let them speak. But I answer all questions.

Have you got a website or source for the above? I'm curious what kind of "elders" and "church" teaches that Angels created man and calls it "Bible Basics".
Westtexas

Yeah, I addressed this on the previous page. I'd like to see some proof too. :yes