Authority Of Scripture?

[for_his_glory]

1. God is Spirit, John 4:24, not flesh and blood and in the OT either spoke directly to the prophets or by angels and also various objects like a burning bush or an Ass for example. Between the OT and NT God was silent towards Israel as when they returned to Israel from the Babylonian captivity they came back as merchants and not shepherds as they were disobedient to God going after other gods, Book of Malachi.

2. Jesus being the very Spirit of God before the foundation of the world as He and the Father are one was prophesied by the Prophets in the OT and spoken of by John the Baptist in the NT as John being the forerunner of Christ calling all to repent. As foretold Christ did come as the word of God made flesh (skin, bone, blood) to be that light that shines in darkness. He came as redeemer Savior through Gods grace as Christ is our faith that all can repent of their sins and have eternal life with the Father to all who will believe in Him as Lord and Savior. John 1:1-4; 1 Peter 1:13-21

3. After the sacrifice of Christ God raised Him from the grave and as He had to ascend back up to heaven the promise was that He would never leave us or forsake us as when He ascended He sent down the Holy Spirit (Spirit of God) to indwell all who will believe in Christ and His finished works on the cross. In the OT Gods Spirit fell on them for a time and purpose under heaven. Now we are indwelled with that power and authority through Gods grace that the Holy Spirit now works in us and through us teaching all things God wants us to learn. All three are Spiritual and Spiritual awaking's in us to know the will of God and walk in His statures. John 16:7-15

Ephesians 4: 5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism, 6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

1 John 5:6 This is he that came by water (word) and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth. 7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word (Jesus), and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. 8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water (word), and the blood: and these three agree in one.

God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit as all three coequal Gods Spirit.

Jesus being the right arm of God. Isaiah 53:1 Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the LORD revealed? 2 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. 3 He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

Jesus is the word of God. John 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

Jesus is word, light and life that is God come in the flesh. John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

Gods Holy Spirit has come to indwell us and teach us. John 14: 26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.


Scriptures that reference Jesus being referred to as God:
John 1:1-14; John 10:30; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8, 9; 1 John 5:7, 8, 20; 1 Corinthians 8:6; 2 Corinthians 3:17; 13:14; Isaiah 9:6; 44:6; Luke 1:35; Matthew 1:23; 28:19; John 14:16, 17; Genesis 1:1, 2 (cross reference John 1:1-14); 1 Corinthians 12:4-6; Ephesians 4:4-6; Colossians 1:15-17; John 14:9-11; Philippians 2:5-8; Rev 1:8


Scriptures that refer the Holy Spirit as being God:
Psalms 139:7, 8; John 14:17; 16:13; Isaiah 40:13; 1 Corinthians 2:10, 11; Zechariah 4:6; Luke 1:35; Ephesians 4:4-6; Romans 5:5; 1 Corinthians 6:19; Ephesians 1:13; 1 Thessalonians 1:5; Titus 3:5; 2 Peter 1:21; Jude 1:20

 

[Faith and Grace]

Because it simply did not provide an actual answer.

I asked if it was the Father or the Son who was manifested in the flesh?

The Father revealing Himself through the Son still refers to the Spirit of the Father in the Son, which the Spirit of the Father is invisible and therefore not seen or manifested.

Which one of these two was manifested, or became flesh?

Yes the Spirit of the Father was always in the Son, but that is not the question.

Which one of these two became flesh, the Father or the Son?

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth. John 1:14


And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness:
God was manifested in the flesh,
Justified in the Spirit,
Seen by angels,
Preached among the Gentiles,
Believed on in the world,
Received up in glory.
1 Timothy 3:16


The answer is very obvious yet you are dodging it.

I understand what you’re asking, and I’m not trying to dodge anything. The difficulty here is that Scripture never divides the incarnation into “which of the two divine persons became flesh,” because Scripture never presents God as two divine persons to begin with. That’s why the biblical language sounds different from the categories you are trying to force into the question. The New Testament never says “the Father became flesh” or “the Son became flesh” in the sense of a second divine person entering humanity. What Scripture actually says is simpler and more foundational: the Word became flesh (John 1:14) and God was manifest in the flesh (1 Tim. 3:16). The Word is God (John 1:1), and God is the Father (Mal. 2:10; John 17:3; Eph. 4:6). So when the Word becomes flesh, that is the Father’s own self-revelation in humanity—not a second divine person leaving heaven to become incarnate.

In other words, the incarnation is not the Father becoming a man instead of the Son, nor the Son becoming a man instead of the Father. The incarnation is the one God revealing Himself in the humanity called the Son, because the Son is the Word made flesh, not an eternal divine person who existed alongside the Father before incarnation. The question “Which one of the two persons became flesh?” assumes two divine persons before you ever get to the text. The apostles never frame the question that way; they speak of one God whose Word, whose presence, whose fullness dwells bodily in Christ (Col. 2:9). That is why Jesus can say, “He that hath seen Me hath seen the Father” (John 14:9)—because the incarnation is the Father’s self-manifestation, not a second divine mind being sent while the Father remains uninvolved. So the answer from Scripture is: God—His Word, His fullness, His own being—was manifested in the flesh, and the human life in which He appeared is what Scripture calls “the Son.”

 

[JLB]

The difficulty here is that Scripture never divides the incarnation into “which of the two divine persons became flesh,”

I would have to wholeheartedly disagree.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made… And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth. John 1:1-3,14

No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him. John 1:18

Plainly the Word refers to the Son.

The Son became flesh.

The Son is God.

No one has seen the Father.

Many saw the Son.

 

[Faith and Grace]

I would have to wholeheartedly disagree.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made… And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth. John 1:1-3,14

No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him. John 1:18

Plainly the Word refers to the Son.

The Son became flesh.

The Son is God.

No one has seen the Father.

Many saw the Son.

I understand your disagreement, but the very passages you’re quoting actually reinforce the distinction I’m making. John 1 does not say, “In the beginning was the Son.” It says, “In the beginning was the Word,” and it is only after the incarnation that John begins to speak of “the Son.” None of these passages call the pre-incarnate reality “the Son”; they consistently reserve Sonship for the incarnational moment. It says the Word was, but the Son now is. The Son is what the Word becomes when He takes on flesh (John 1:14). That is why John 1:18 speaks of “the only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father.” This is not describing an eternal second divine person who was always a “Son,” but the incarnate one who now exegetes and reveals the unseen God. Scripture never says anyone saw the Father, and yet people saw Jesus. That is precisely the point: the Word—who is God—became flesh and made the invisible God visible. The Son is God as revealed in the flesh, not God as a second eternal person beside the Father. John keeps the categories clean: the Word was with God and was God; the Word became flesh; and in that incarnate state, He is called “the only begotten Son.” There is no “Son” until there is incarnation, conception, and flesh. So when the text speaks of people seeing the Son while no one has seen the Father, it is not setting up two divine persons but showing how the one God, unseen in His transcendent being, becomes visible through His own self-revelation in Christ. The Son is the incarnate manifestation of the Father, not another divine mind who eternally existed alongside Him. Plainly says Word became Son no always was Son.

 

[JLB]

I understand your disagreement, but the very passages you’re quoting actually reinforce the distinction I’m making. John 1 does not say, “In the beginning was the Son.” It says, “In the beginning was the Word,” and it is only after the incarnation that John begins to speak of “the Son.” None of these passages call the pre-incarnate reality “the Son”; they consistently reserve Sonship for the incarnational moment. It says the Word was, but the Son now is. The Son is what the Word becomes when He takes on flesh (John 1:14). That is why John 1:18 speaks of “the only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father.” This is not describing an eternal second divine person who was always a “Son,” but the incarnate one who now exegetes and reveals the unseen God. Scripture never says anyone saw the Father, and yet people saw Jesus. That is precisely the point: the Word—who is God—became flesh and made the invisible God visible. The Son is God as revealed in the flesh, not God as a second eternal person beside the Father. John keeps the categories clean: the Word was with God and was God; the Word became flesh; and in that incarnate state, He is called “the only begotten Son.” There is no “Son” until there is incarnation, conception, and flesh. So when the text speaks of people seeing the Son while no one has seen the Father, it is not setting up two divine persons but showing how the one God, unseen in His transcendent being, becomes visible through His own self-revelation in Christ. The Son is the incarnate manifestation of the Father, not another divine mind who eternally existed alongside Him. Plainly says Word became Son no always was Son.

It seems you believe that Jesus Christ had His beginning at the incarnation, when He was born?


Is that what you believe?

 

[JLB]

Scripture never says anyone saw the Father, and yet people saw Jesus. That is precisely the point: the Word—who is God—became flesh and made the invisible God visible.

Now Moses was tending the flock of Jethro his father-in-law, the priest of Midian. And he led the flock to the back of the desert, and came to Horeb, the mountain of God. And the Angel of the LORD appeared to him in a flame of fire from the midst of a bush. So he looked, and behold, the bush was burning with fire, but the bush was not consumed. Then Moses said, “I will now turn aside and see this great sight, why the bush does not burn.”
So when the LORD saw that he turned aside to look, God called to him from the midst of the bush and said, “Moses, Moses!” And he said, “Here I am.” Then He said, “Do not draw near this place. Take your sandals off your feet, for the place where you stand is holy ground.” Moreover He said, “I am the God of your father—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.” And Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God. Exodus 3:1-6


Who do you believe Moses was looking upon?


The Father or the Son?

 

[Faith and Grace]

It seems you believe that Jesus Christ had His beginning at the incarnation, when He was born?


Is that what you believe?

I don’t believe that Jesus Christ “began” at the incarnation in the sense of God beginning to exist, because the divine identity revealed in Christ is eternal. What did begin at the incarnation is the Sonship—the human life, the mediatorial role, the flesh-and-blood existence through which God revealed Himself to the world. The Son is “made of a woman” (Gal. 4:4), “made under the law,” who “learned obedience” (Heb. 5:8), hungered, slept, suffered, died, and rose again. None of those things apply to God in His eternal, unbegotten deity. They apply to the incarnation. So when I say the Son begins in Bethlehem, I’m speaking exactly the way Scripture does: the child born is the Son given (Isa. 9:6); the Word becomes flesh and only then is called “the only begotten Son” (John 1:14, 18). The divine being revealed in the Son is eternal, but the Son as Son—the incarnate expression of God in human form—has His beginning in time, by conception and birth. That’s not something I’m imposing on the text; that’s the shape of the biblical narrative itself.

 

[JLB]

the Word becomes flesh and only then is called “the only begotten Son”

Do you believe the Word refers to the Son?

 

[JLB]

the Word becomes flesh and only then is called “the only begotten Son”

I disagree.

The Word is God, specifically the only begotten Son who was begotten before creation.

Then it was the only begotten Son who created all things as YHWH God.


He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.
Colossians 1:15-16

But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness; Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands. Hebrews 1:8-10


The Son is referred as God and LORD (YHWH) by the Father.

 

[Faith and Grace]

I disagree.

The Word is God, specifically the only begotten Son who was begotten before creation..... The Son is referred as God and LORD (YHWH) by the Father.

Q1. Can you show me a single place in Scripture where the phrase “the Son” is used before the incarnation, the conception, or Bethlehem?
If not, how can you insist the Son existed eternally?

Q2. Where does the Bible ever say, “the Son created all things”?
(Colossians 1:16 says ἐν αὐτῷ and refers back to the image, not to a pre-incarnate Son, and Hebrews 1:10 is a YHWH text applied to Christ’s incarnate identity.)

Q3. Where does Scripture distinguish the Logos (Ἐν ἀρχῇ ἦν ὁ Λόγος) from the Father as a second divine person?
Show me one verse in which the Logos speaks, thinks, wills, or interacts as a “second divine center.”

Q4. Why does John 1:1 say “In the beginning was the Logos” instead of “In the beginning was the Son”?
If Sonship existed eternally, why does John avoid the title entirely until verse 14?

Q5. If “the Word became flesh” (John 1:14), and becoming implies transition, how can an eternal Son exist before that becoming?

Q6. Why does John 1:18 identify the Son as the one who exegetes the unseen God, if the Son was supposedly eternally visible before the incarnation?

Q7. Hebrews 1:5 uses σήμερον (“today”).
How does an eternal Son have a today in which He is begotten?

Q8. Hebrews 1:5 quotes Psalm 2:7—

“You are My Son; today I have begotten You.”
How can this be eternal when the Greek perfect tense (γεγέννηκά) refers to a completed act with ongoing effects?

Q9. Can you point to any Greek lexicon where “today” (σήμερον) means “from all eternity”?

Q10. If Colossians 1:14–17 is about a pre-existent Son, why does Irenaeus, the earliest systematic theologian, interpret it as referring to the incarnate Christ, not an eternal second person?

Q11. The term πρωτότοκος πάσης κτίσεως (“firstborn of all creation”) is an honorific denoting rank, not origin.
Why do you assume it means “first created” or “first to exist” when Paul is describing His supremacy after the incarnation?

Q12. Colossians 1:13–14 defines the Son as the One in whom we have redemption through His blood.
How could a pre-incarnate Son have blood?

Q13. In the Old Testament, God appears in heaven, in the tabernacle, in the cloud, in the fire, and in angelic form.
Do those multiple manifestations make multiple divine persons—or one God revealing Himself in many ways?

Q14. If the Father is “invisible” (1 Tim. 6:16), and the Son is “the image of the invisible God” (Col. 1:15), are you saying God had two visible images prior to the incarnation?

Q15. If the Son is “the express image” (χαρακτήρ) of God’s hypostasis (Heb. 1:3), how could that be true before He had a body (σῶμα), since χαρακτήρ refers to a stamped, visible imprint?

Q16. When Hebrews 1:10 applies Psalm 102 to Jesus, does that automatically make the Son a second divine person—
or does it simply identify Jesus with YHWH because He is YHWH in the flesh?

Q17. Since Hebrews 1:3 says the Son is the radiance of God's glory after “purging our sins,” how can this be describing a pre-incarnate identity?

Q18. Why does Hebrews never call the Son the Logos, if your claim is that the Son was eternally the Logos?

Q19. If the Son existed before creation, why do none of the following phrases ever appear in Scripture?

• “the eternal Son”
• “God the Son”
• “the Son created the world”
• “the Son was begotten before the world”
• “the Son was with the Father in eternity past”

Q20. Isn’t it true that every one of these statements is a theological deduction outside the text, not a quotation from the text?

 

[JLB]

Can you show me a single place in Scripture where the phrase “the Son” is used before the incarnation, the conception, or Bethlehem?
If not, how can you insist the Son existed eternally?

He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. Colossians 1:15-16

• For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth

But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands. Hebrews 1:8-10

• To the Son He says: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth, And the heavens are the work of Your hands.

The Son is called LORD (YHWH).



The Son is called God, by the Father.

But to the Son He says: “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;

 

[Faith and Grace]

He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. Colossians 1:15-16

• For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth

But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands. Hebrews 1:8-10

• To the Son He says: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth, And the heavens are the work of Your hands.

The Son is called LORD (YHWH).



The Son is called God, by the Father.

But to the Son He says: “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;

Q8. Hebrews 1:5 quotes Psalm 2:7—

“You are My Son; today I have begotten You.”
How can this be eternal when the Greek perfect tense (γεγέννηκά) refers to a completed act with ongoing effects?

Q9. Can you point to any Greek lexicon where “today” (σήμερον) means “from all eternity”?

The Bible does not use the phrase “God the Son” even one time. It is not a correct term because the Son of God refers to the humanity of Jesus Christ. The Bible defines the Son of God as the child born of Mary, not as the eternal Spirit of God (Luke 1:35). “Son of God” may refer to the human nature or it may refer to God manifested in flesh—that is, deity in the human nature. “Son of God” never means the incorporeal Spirit alone, however. We can never use “Son” correctly apart from the humanity of Jesus Christ. The terms “Son of God,” “Son of man,” and “Son” are appropriate and biblical. However, the term “God the Son” is inappropriate because it equates the Son with deity alone, and therefore it is unscriptural. The death of Jesus is a particularly good example. His divine Spirit did not die, but His human body did. We cannot say that God died, so we cannot say “God the Son” died. On the other hand, we can say that the Son of God died because “Son” refers to humanity.

If we could justify the use of the phrase “God the Son” at all, it would be by pointing out, as I have done, that “Son of God” encompasses not only the humanity of Jesus but also the deity as resident in the humanity. However, John 1:18 uses “Son” to refer to the humanity, for it says the Father (the deity of Jesus) is revealed through the Son. This verse of Scripture does not mean that God is revealed by God but that God is revealed in flesh through the humanity of the Son. "Son of God” refers to the humanity of Jesus. Clearly the humanity of Jesus is not eternal but was born in Bethlehem. One can speak of eternal existence in past, present, and future only with respect to God. Since “Son of God” refers to humanity or to deity as manifest in humanity, the idea of an eternal Son is incomprehensible. The Son (God's Humanity) of God had a beginning.

 

[JLB]

Q8. Hebrews 1:5 quotes Psalm 2:7—

Q9. Can you point to any Greek lexicon where “today” (σήμερον) means “from all eternity”?

The Bible does not use the phrase “God the Son” even one time. It is not a correct term because the Son of God refers to the humanity of Jesus Christ. The Bible defines the Son of God as the child born of Mary, not as the eternal Spirit of God (Luke 1:35). “Son of God” may refer to the human nature or it may refer to God manifested in flesh—that is, deity in the human nature. “Son of God” never means the incorporeal Spirit alone, however. We can never use “Son” correctly apart from the humanity of Jesus Christ. The terms “Son of God,” “Son of man,” and “Son” are appropriate and biblical. However, the term “God the Son” is inappropriate because it equates the Son with deity alone, and therefore it is unscriptural. The death of Jesus is a particularly good example. His divine Spirit did not die, but His human body did. We cannot say that God died, so we cannot say “God the Son” died. On the other hand, we can say that the Son of God died because “Son” refers to humanity.

If we could justify the use of the phrase “God the Son” at all, it would be by pointing out, as I have done, that “Son of God” encompasses not only the humanity of Jesus but also the deity as resident in the humanity. However, John 1:18 uses “Son” to refer to the humanity, for it says the Father (the deity of Jesus) is revealed through the Son. This verse of Scripture does not mean that God is revealed by God but that God is revealed in flesh through the humanity of the Son. "Son of God” refers to the humanity of Jesus. Clearly the humanity of Jesus is not eternal but was born in Bethlehem. One can speak of eternal existence in past, present, and future only with respect to God. Since “Son of God” refers to humanity or to deity as manifest in humanity, the idea of an eternal Son is incomprehensible. The Son (God's Humanity) of God had a beginning.

You asked for scripture and I quoted scripture.

Now it’s up to you to either believe or deny what the scriptures so plainly say.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Q1. Can you show me a single place in Scripture where the phrase “the Son” is used before the incarnation, the conception, or Bethlehem?
If not, how can you insist the Son existed eternally?

Happened to come across this, and thought I would ask. The dating here would be sometime between 700 BC and 500 BC, and the question put forth at the end of verse 4 is in the present tense.

1 The words of Agur the son of Jakeh, his utterance. This man declared to Ithiel—to Ithiel and Ucal: 2 Surely I am more ignorant than any man, and do not have the understanding of a man. 3 I neither learned wisdom, nor have I knowledge of the Holy Ones. 4 Who has ascended into heaven, or descended? Who has gathered the wind in His fists? Who has bound the waters in a garment? Who has established all the ends of the earth? What is His name, and what is His Son’s name, if you know? (Proverbs 30:3-4)

 

[Spirit & Truth]

Because it simply did not provide an actual answer.

I asked if it was the Father or the Son who was manifested in the flesh?

The Father revealing Himself through the Son still refers to the Spirit of the Father in the Son, which the Spirit of the Father is invisible and therefore not seen or manifested.

Which one of these two was manifested, or became flesh?

Yes the Spirit of the Father was always in the Son, but that is not the question.

Which one of these two became flesh, the Father or the Son?

And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth. John 1:14


And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness:
God was manifested in the flesh,
Justified in the Spirit,
Seen by angels,
Preached among the Gentiles,
Believed on in the world,
Received up in glory.
1 Timothy 3:16


The answer is very obvious yet you are dodging it.

May I take a shot at this question you are asking? Or are you specifically looking for an answer from F&G?

I also believe what Faith and Grace is stating in this thread. However, I also believe and know from experience that oneness, in fulness can be taught. It is a divine revelation that only the Lord can grant.

 

[JLB]

May I take a shot at this question you are asking? Or are you specifically looking for an answer from F&G?

I also believe what Faith and Grace is stating in this thread. However, I also believe and know from experience that oneness, in fulness can be taught. It is a divine revelation that only the Lord can grant.

Please by all means.

 

[JLB]

I also believe what Faith and Grace is stating in this thread.

What part exactly?

I also believe and know from experience that oneness, in fulness can be taught.

Ok.

I would like to understand what you yourself mean by “oneness”.

 

[Spirit & Truth]

Please by all means.

Thank you Brother! Before I type my answer, I want to make it clear, I am not here to debate anybody or right or wrong anyone. Merely just share what the Lord has revealed to me personally o my walk. I respect all of you and enjoy watching these conversations. Some of it gets a bit to complicated.... in fact a bit more complicated than I think God wants His word to be portrayed. But, I have not been studying quite as long as all of you either. Thank you for allowing me the opportunity to answer what I think you are asking.


-I asked if it was the Father or the Son who was manifested in the flesh?- is the question.

My answer would be- God, AKA The Word, AKA the Holy ghost, A SPIRIT, humbly came down, as a spirit, manifested Himself in the flesh, the Son (Yaweh/Jesus), in Which He did so, to set an example, and be the ultimate Blood sacrifice for the atonement of sin of His creation(man). So that when man, the flesh, dies, the spirit, can dwell in eternity, with Him who sits On His Throne as the fullness of God the man and God the spirit.


Why does he reference the son?= If Mary had given Birth to the "father', we would be questioning how that is suppose to help us live as a reflection. we would be wondering why God the father had to be born as a human child instead of just creating Himself from sand as He did with Adam. There would be so much missed if we stated that Mary gave birth the the father in the flesh. He had to be born into iniquity just Like we are in order to be the ultimate example.

When He is spoken of as sitting on the right hand of the father, this is a reference to the fact that He sits surrounded and full of the 'Glory"( not susbtance") of God. Jesus is His name, Just as I have a name. I am a mother, a daughter and a sister. But my name is the same. Each roll is different, each roll can accomplish the same things. As a mom, I can run a business. However, when its time to work, I step into the traits and roll of boss. I can be a sister and mom at the same time, however, I wont speak to my brother as I would My son. yet all three rolls has the anointing of God placed on my life as a soul winner, I can play that roll no matter what other thing I am doing at any given time. Yet I will not speak to a lost soul the way I would my father.

I can't say that I have ever seen God as the father and the son, but not Jesus as the father. Jesus said. If you have seen me, You have seen my Father. Isaiah 9:6 says- " For unto us a child is born(Jesus), Unto us a son is given. And the government shall be on His shoulder, and His name shall be called Wonderful, counselor, the Mighty God, the Everlasting Father, The Prince of peace....... Jesus is as much the father as He is the son in this scripture.

Anyway- This is just what the Lord has revealed to me. Although I have not added much scripture, I am adding the wheel of prophecy that shows all scripture that supports Oneness. I don't believe in my spirit that anyone would be able to take this revelation from me or convince me otherwise. Once I got it, Its like the same as receiving the Holy Ghost, no one can ever tell you you didn't.


Anyway- I hope this is at least part of what you were asking. If not, I would love to hear the answer you were looking for. I am open to hearing and learning other stuff. Thank you again for the opportunity to answer my brother.

 

[JLB]

My answer would be- God, AKA The Word, AKA the Holy ghost, A SPIRIT, humbly came down, as a spirit, manifested Himself in the flesh, the Son (Yaweh/Jesus), in Which He did so, to set an example, and be the ultimate Blood sacrifice for the atonement of sin of His creation(man). So that when man, the flesh, dies, the spirit, can dwell in eternity, with Him who sits On His Throne as the fullness of God the man and God the spirit.

I believe I understand your answer to the question which was…Who was manifested in the flesh, the Father or the Son?

Your answer seems to be the Son.

Is this right?

 

[JLB]

My answer would be- God, AKA The Word, AKA the Holy ghost, A SPIRIT, humbly came down, as a spirit, manifested Himself in the flesh, the Son (Yaweh/Jesus), in Which He did so, to set an example, and be the ultimate Blood sacrifice for the atonement of sin of His creation(man). So that when man, the flesh, dies, the spirit, can dwell in eternity, with Him who sits On His Throne as the fullness of God the man and God the spirit.

Here is a scripture that I hope we can discuss a little.

For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one. 1 John 5:7

• and these three are one.

To me this says these three individual divine persons or divine beings, are one;
One in unity, as in a family.


Is this the way you see this scripture?