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Blessing of Election !

brightfame52

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What is Gods purpose according to election?

Rom 9:11

11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth )

What is Gods purpose according to election? The purpose of God according to election is that salvation be accomplished by the work of his Son, that his Son might be the Firstborn among many brethren, all the honor and glory of the Firstborn belongs to Christ

Rom 8:28-29

28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
 

brightfame52

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Should we mention the doctrine of election to the unbeliever?

Some have told us that this great Biblical truth is an “in-house debate” and should not be brought up to the unbeliever. We should them at the place of their responsibility and never mention their inability we are told.

First, let me say with no uncertainty, the doctrine of election is not a “debate”. It is a biblical truth that is uncatagorically essential to the marvelous gospel of God’s free and sovereign grace. To deny election is to dethrone God. The gospel of “man’s free will” is another gospel. Read Galatians 1:6-10 to see what God says about that. The doctrine of election is not a “deep truth” that requires the exercised intellect of a trained theologian to comprehend. It is a simple truth that all of God’s children rejoice to believe.

Second, the scriptures give plenty of examples of this great truth not being “in-house”. Let me briefly mention just two. The first is none less than our Lord’s own evangelistic ministry. In Matthew 15, and Luke 7, we have recorded Jesus encounter with the Syrophenician woman. After pleading with the Lord for mercy on her demon possessed daughter, Jesus told her that He came for the lost sheep of Israel (the elect), and that He could not take the bread from the children and give it to the “dogs”. The Bible says, “she worshipped Him”. The Lord declared the doctrine of God’s sovereign election to bring this woman to understand her only hope was to bow in humble submission to the One who alone could save her. The second example is the conversion of the apostle Paul in Acts 9. God sends a disciple by the name of Ananias to confirm the gospel to this last and greatest (or least as he saw it ) apostle with the message of election; “he is a chosen vessel of mine” v.15.

The modem evangelistic appeal, devoid of God’s sovereign election, in essence, invites the unbeliever to “make a decision” without confronting them with the Sovereignty of God. It presents them with an “invitation”, an r.s.v.p… let them decide if and when they are ready. It feeds the pride of man. The true gospel message is one of sovereign grace that humbles the sinner to beg for a crumb of bread from the Master’s table. God gives grace to the humble. .’.He resists the proud. By Greg Elemquist
 

brightfame52

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What is the meaning of election?

The Greek word for election is ekloge (ek-log-ay') it means to pick out, choose, chosen, elect. It is to choose some people out of many people. Who does the choosing? God does the choosing. Do not be surprised majority of the churches that are Arminian believe this too. On what basis does God choose some out of many? This is where the rubber meets the road. The most crucial question is, on what bases does God elects some and leave others?

The meaning of unconditional election.

Arminians reply, God looks into the future and sees who will accept him, receive him, and God elects them on the basis of man’s will. The Scriptures make it very clear that Election to salvation is in no way conditioned by or dependent upon man. Unconditional means that there are no conditions that humans must meet, including faith. Faith is a gift of God (Rom. 12:3; Eph. 2:8). If human-generated faith plays a part in salvation, salvation is not entirely by grace. Now think about it, if election is of man’s will, then God is bound to man’s will. Then where is the sovereignty of God? Where is the mercy of God? Where is the grace of God? All these have no place as God is limited and he has no choice but he has to make the choice as per man’s decision. This kind of teaching is very heretical and slap on God’s sovereignty.

On the other hand, the Bible says just the opposite. God predestines and choose some according to his will and as per his own pleasure.

Eph 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;

9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:

10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:

11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:

"It is absurd to think that anything in us could have the least influence upon our election. Some say that God did foresee that such persons would believe, and therefore did choose them; so, they would make the business of salvation to depend upon something in us. Whereas God does not choose us FOR faith, but TO faith. "He hath chosen us, that we should be holy," (Ephesians 1:4), not because we would be holy, but that we might be holy." Thomas Watson

"Moreover, as God respects no persons, so He respects no conditions upon which He gives salvation to us." Thomas Goodwin

"The orthodox maintain that the good pleasure alone (of God) has place and think that no other cause can either be given or rightly sought [for election]." Francis Turretin

"The good pleasure of God is an act of the divine will freely and effectively determining all things." William Ames

If election is of foreseen faith, then God would not have elected man, but rather man would have elected God. Jesus said, there is no one good, but one, that is God.

"Nothing in my hands I bring,
Simply to thy cross I cling,"

Election is a glorious doctrine, as the sinner realize although he deserves hell, it was God who chose him. Election is a work performed by the God of glory. It lifts sinners from the darkness, destruction, doom, and death of sin to become God’s children. It brings glory to God, and nothing to man. It will praise of his glorious grace, which we do not deserve. Election is glorious. We were the chief of sinners, the king of sinners, hypocrites and totally deceived ourselves.

1Co 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

But God chose me!

'Twas not that I did choose Thee
For Lord That could not be;
This heart would still refuse Thee,
Hadst Thou not chosen me."

Joh 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you.

1Co 1:25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:

29 That no flesh should glory in his presence.

Election brings true humility.

Spurgeon said, “I know nothing, nothing again, that is more humbling for us than this doctrine of election. I have sometimes fallen prostrate before it, when endeavoring to understand it. I have stretched my wings, and, eagle-like, I have soared towards the sun. Steady has been my eye, and true my wing, for a season; but, when I came near it, and the one thought possessed me,—"God hath from the beginning chosen you unto salvation," I was lost in its lustre, I was staggered with the mighty thought; and from the dizzy elevation down came my soul, prostrate and broken, saying, "Lord, I am nothing, I am less than nothing. Why me? Why me?"

Friends, if you want to be humbled, study election, for it will make you humble under the influence of God's Spirit. He who is proud of his election is not elect; and he who is humbled under a sense of it may believe that he is. He has every reason to believe that he is, for it is one of the most blessed effects of election that it helps us to humble ourselves before God.”

http://www.sounddoctrine.net/
 

Butch5

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Eph 1:4-7

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:


5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,


6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.


7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

Hence one of the blessings of election in Christ before the foundation of the world, it is that the chosen ones have been accepted of the Father, hence in a accepted justified state with God the Father; And this again before the foundation of the world, and before Faith in time. God is well pleased with their persons, according as He chose them in Christ before the foundation, and as Paul wrote to the Corinthian Church 1 Cor 1:30

30 But of him [God the Father] are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
Actually, that passage is speaking of the Jews, not the Gentiles. Proof texting often leads to a misunderstanding of the text.
 

JLB

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What is Gods purpose according to election?

Those who were elected were elected for the purpose of establishing the lineage of the Messiah.

That is the context.

Election is for purpose not salvation.


Jesus Christ is salvation for those who believe and obey Him.


I tell the truth in Christ, I am not lying, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Spirit, that I have great sorrow and continual grief in my heart. For I could wish that I myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my countrymen according to the flesh, who are Israelites, to whom pertain the adoption, the glory, the covenants, the giving of the law, the service of God, and the promises; of whom are the fathers and from whom, according to the flesh, Christ came, who is over all, the eternally blessed God. Amen.
But it is not that the word of God has taken no effect. For they are not all Israel who are of Israel, nor are they all children because they are the seed of Abraham; but, “In Isaac your seed shall be called.” That is, those who are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God; but the children of the promise are counted as the seed. For this is the word of promise: “At this time I will come and Sarah shall have a son.”
And not only this, but when Rebecca also had conceived by one man, even by our father Isaac (for the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works but of Him who calls),
Romans 9:1-11


For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
John 3:16





JLB
 

tdidymas

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Those who were elected were elected for the purpose of establishing the lineage of the Messiah.

That is the context.

Election is for purpose not salvation.


Jesus Christ is salvation for those who believe and obey Him.


I tell the truth in Christ, I am not lying, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Spirit, that I have great sorrow and continual grief in my heart. For I could wish that I myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my countrymen according to the flesh, who are Israelites, to whom pertain the adoption, the glory, the covenants, the giving of the law, the service of God, and the promises; of whom are the fathers and from whom, according to the flesh, Christ came, who is over all, the eternally blessed God. Amen.
But it is not that the word of God has taken no effect. For they are not all Israel who are of Israel, nor are they all children because they are the seed of Abraham; but, “In Isaac your seed shall be called.” That is, those who are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God; but the children of the promise are counted as the seed. For this is the word of promise: “At this time I will come and Sarah shall have a son.”
And not only this, but when Rebecca also had conceived by one man, even by our father Isaac (for the children not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works but of Him who calls),
Romans 9:1-11


For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
John 3:16





JLB
Every scripture you quoted here supports the idea of election to salvation. "Whoever believes" are the ones elected. And it implies that whoever doesn't believe is not elected to salvation (in which they happily choose destruction because they just don't see it).

In order for you to claim that election is not to salvation, you need to prove your point by exegeting this statement:
"He predestined us to adoption as sons".

How do you think "to adoption as sons" is NOT "to salvation"?
 

Butch5

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Thats False, its speaks of people of all ethnicities.
No it doesn't. Read verse 12. We who first trusted in Christ. Literally it translates We who before hoped in the Christ. It wasn't Gentiles who first trusted or before hoped in the Christ, it was the Jews. Context is important. Context will show Reformed theology is wrong
 

JLB

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Every scripture you quoted here supports the idea of election to salvation. "Whoever believes" are the ones elected. And it implies that whoever doesn't believe is not elected to salvation (in which they happily choose destruction because they just don't see it).

In order for you to claim that election is not to salvation, you need to prove your point by exegeting this statement:
"He predestined us to adoption as sons".

How do you think "to adoption as sons" is NOT "to salvation"?


Being predestined doesn't mean we are automatically saved and can never be lost.

Judas Iscariot, and the other Apostles were predestined to reign with Christ in the age to come.


So Jesus said to them, “Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. Matthew 19:28


Each person must believe and therefore obey the Gospel in order to be saved; to be in Christ.


Once a person is in Christ, the must remain in Christ.


Here is how we are Instructed to remain in Christ.


Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us. 1 John 3:24



Paul says it this way —

But I discipline my body and bring it into subjection, lest, when I have preached to others, I myself should become disqualified.
1 Corinthians 9:27


Paul taught clearly about walking in flesh, and practicing the works of the flesh.






JLB
 

tdidymas

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Being predestined doesn't mean we are automatically saved and can never be lost.

Judas Iscariot, and the other Apostles were predestined to reign with Christ in the age to come.


So Jesus said to them, “Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. Matthew 19:28


Each person must believe and therefore obey the Gospel in order to be saved; to be in Christ.


Once a person is in Christ, the must remain in Christ.


Here is how we are Instructed to remain in Christ.


Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us. 1 John 3:24



Paul says it this way —

But I discipline my body and bring it into subjection, lest, when I have preached to others, I myself should become disqualified.
1 Corinthians 9:27


Paul taught clearly about walking in flesh, and practicing the works of the flesh.






JLB
I take it that your answer is that election is not to salvation because you think:
1. salvation is ultimate, IOW eternal blessing, therefore:
2. adoption to sons means that a son of God can become not a son if he walks in the flesh
3. so adoption to sons is a potential salvation, not a final one
4. if a Christian doesn't work diligently at abiding in God's commandments, he'll ultimately be lost

Did I miss anything?
 

brightfame52

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No it doesn't. Read verse 12. We who first trusted in Christ. Literally it translates We who before hoped in the Christ. It wasn't Gentiles who first trusted or before hoped in the Christ, it was the Jews. Context is important. Context will show Reformed theology is wrong
Yes it does.
 

Butch5

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Yes it does.
Simply claiming "it does" doesn't make it so. If you read it in context rather than proof texting passages it's pretty clear. All through chapters 1 and 2 Paul refers to two different groups, us and you. The "us" group is the Jews, those who "first trusted" in the Christ. The "you" group are those who, after they heard . He carries this into chapter two where he clearly tells us who the two groups are. The "us" group are the circumcision and the "you" group are the uncircimcision. Thus we have the Jews and the Gentiles.
 

Butch5

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It speaks of the Church, the Body of Christ which is made up of all ethnicities.
No it doesn't. You're ignoring the context and presenting the passage falsely. This is why Reformed theology doesn't work. All it does is take passages like this out of context to claim they say things they don't say.

Paul clearly makes a distinction between the "we", "our", "us" group and the "you", "your" group. He says the, we/our/us group are those who first trusted in Christ. He says of the you/your group,

"that at that time you were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world." (Eph.2:12 KJV)

The you group were aliens from Israel. That's the Gentiles. The you group were strangers from the convents of promise, that's the Gentiles. They were without Christ and God, that's the Gentiles.

The you group is the Gentiles, the we/our/us group is the Jews.
 

brightfame52

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No it doesn't. You're ignoring the context and presenting the passage falsely. This is why Reformed theology doesn't work. All it does is take passages like this out of context to claim they say things they don't say.

Paul clearly makes a distinction between the "we", "our", "us" group and the "you", "your" group. He says the, we/our/us group are those who first trusted in Christ. He says of the you/your group,

"that at that time you were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world." (Eph.2:12 KJV)

The you group were aliens from Israel. That's the Gentiles. The you group were strangers from the convents of promise, that's the Gentiles. They were without Christ and God, that's the Gentiles.

The you group is the Gentiles, the we/our/us group is the Jews.
Yes it does !
 

Butch5

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Yes it does !
Your reply shows why there is so much error in Christian teaching. Instead of considering what the Scriptures say you just continue to parrot what you've been taught. Unless you start to consider the Scriptures you'll never learn the truth. But, what's even worse than that is that you will lead untold numbers of Christosns into error.
 

brightfame52

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Your reply shows why there is so much error in Christian teaching. Instead of considering what the Scriptures say you just continue to parrot what you've been taught. Unless you start to consider the Scriptures you'll never learn the truth. But, what's even worse than that is that you will lead untold numbers of Christosns into error.
Your opposing shows you are in error.
 
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