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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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Can We Cease from Sinning While On Earth?
- Thread starter Pard
- Start date
jasoncran
Member
yes, but he himself is the one who entered our hearts and by his blood only are we allowed even to talk to god, or recieving eternal salvation.ORwarriOR said:
thats not saying that we shouldnt strive, but lets not set goals we cant keep. paul spoke on this in romans 7 and look at peter despite being filled with the holy ghost he still had sin in his life, in galatians paul confronted him about that.
name any saint that you know in the bible that was sinless, theres none the apostles never spoke of that.
T
Theofilus
Guest
Definitions
I have often seen (and taken part in) debates, where people basically agreed, but were arguing because they defined their terms differently, either using the same term to mean different things or different terms to mean the same thing. The words we use are often more of a reason for debate than our actual opinions. I think, therefrore, that it would be useful to define our terms to make sure we're all talking about the same thing. Even though it may seem obvious to us what these terms mean, it may be that others define them differently.
The first thing we need to define is what it means to "cease from sin". The way I see it, there are at least three possible definitions:
1. Ceasing from sin permanently. Using this definition would mean that a person who had ceased from sin would have reached a level of sanctification where he could say with certainty: "I will never again sin in all my life".
2. Ceasing from sin for a period of time. This definition means that we cannot know the future and therefore cannot say with certainty that we won't sin again, but each time we're tempted to sin we have a choice, either to give in and sin or to obey God and resist the temptation. If a person consistantly chooses to obey God, he could reach a point where he could say: "I have not sinned for the last <insert time period in weeks/months/years here>".
3. Ceasing from particular sins. Many people struggle in one particular area which they find very hard to control. It may be an addiction such as alcoholism or smoking or an attitude problem or any of a number of other things that they believe are sinful and which they can't seem to control. They might ask themselves: "Will I ever be able to stop committing this sin?" or "Will I ever be able to bring this area of my life under control?" Ceasing from sinning in this sense means that a person can reach the point where he can say "I had a serious problem with a particular sin in my life, but it is no longer a problem. I don't sin in that way any more."
Another term that needs to be difined is "sin". What people define as sin varies greatly and is affected by culture, denominations, experiences and other things. Some people limit their definition of sin to only actions while others include certain attitudes, thoughts, desires and emotions in their definition of sin. In addition to individual sins, the Bible speaks of sin as a force or power that influences individuals and the world as a whole.
What definitions we use will determine to a large extent whether we believe that we can cease from sinning. One person might say "We can cease from sin" and mean "We can stop committing sinful actions for a time, but can't be sure of the future", while another person might say "We can never stop sinning" and mean "We can never be sure that we'll never have sinful feelings again".
Even though we may disagree personally, I suggest that we agree to use one definition of "sin" and one definition of the phrase "cease from sin" for the purpose of this thread. And to make sure that we're actually answering the original poster's question, I would like to ask Pard to provide us with those definitions.
I have often seen (and taken part in) debates, where people basically agreed, but were arguing because they defined their terms differently, either using the same term to mean different things or different terms to mean the same thing. The words we use are often more of a reason for debate than our actual opinions. I think, therefrore, that it would be useful to define our terms to make sure we're all talking about the same thing. Even though it may seem obvious to us what these terms mean, it may be that others define them differently.
The first thing we need to define is what it means to "cease from sin". The way I see it, there are at least three possible definitions:
1. Ceasing from sin permanently. Using this definition would mean that a person who had ceased from sin would have reached a level of sanctification where he could say with certainty: "I will never again sin in all my life".
2. Ceasing from sin for a period of time. This definition means that we cannot know the future and therefore cannot say with certainty that we won't sin again, but each time we're tempted to sin we have a choice, either to give in and sin or to obey God and resist the temptation. If a person consistantly chooses to obey God, he could reach a point where he could say: "I have not sinned for the last <insert time period in weeks/months/years here>".
3. Ceasing from particular sins. Many people struggle in one particular area which they find very hard to control. It may be an addiction such as alcoholism or smoking or an attitude problem or any of a number of other things that they believe are sinful and which they can't seem to control. They might ask themselves: "Will I ever be able to stop committing this sin?" or "Will I ever be able to bring this area of my life under control?" Ceasing from sinning in this sense means that a person can reach the point where he can say "I had a serious problem with a particular sin in my life, but it is no longer a problem. I don't sin in that way any more."
Another term that needs to be difined is "sin". What people define as sin varies greatly and is affected by culture, denominations, experiences and other things. Some people limit their definition of sin to only actions while others include certain attitudes, thoughts, desires and emotions in their definition of sin. In addition to individual sins, the Bible speaks of sin as a force or power that influences individuals and the world as a whole.
What definitions we use will determine to a large extent whether we believe that we can cease from sinning. One person might say "We can cease from sin" and mean "We can stop committing sinful actions for a time, but can't be sure of the future", while another person might say "We can never stop sinning" and mean "We can never be sure that we'll never have sinful feelings again".
Even though we may disagree personally, I suggest that we agree to use one definition of "sin" and one definition of the phrase "cease from sin" for the purpose of this thread. And to make sure that we're actually answering the original poster's question, I would like to ask Pard to provide us with those definitions.
watchman F
Member
To answer the question ''Can We Cease from Sinning While On Earth?'' the simple answer is yes. God can through the indwelling of Christ, and the empowerment of the holy Spirit keep us from ever sinning even here in this life. here are two of many verses that show this.
Jude:24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,
Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
If Christ live perfectly in His flesh He can live perfectly in mine as well.
Jude:24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,
Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
If Christ live perfectly in His flesh He can live perfectly in mine as well.
Ashua
Member
Danus said:
If you killed a man and never was caught. ten twenty thirty years down the road and science catches up to you. By this time in your life, you no longer commit crimes. You have walked in the law perfectly since the day you murdered a man in cold blood. You give to charity and you visit the sick and coach a little league team and rebuild hurricane ravaged cities and only commit good.
You now stand before the judge and he says, "before the verdict is read, is there anything you would like to say to the court?"
You say yes
"Judge, since the day I killed that man, I have walked perfectly in the law. I give to charity and visit the sick and coach a little league team and rebuild hurricane ravaged cities and only commit good. Yes, since that day in all my ways I have been blameless. I know what I did was wrong and I'm truly sorry, but I'm a "good guy" now. I'm hoping you'd understand and let me go. I'm a changed person. You are a righteous judge, surely you understand.
What do you think the judge is going to say?
He is going to say that it is precisely because he is a righteous judge that justice must be carried out. Your good cannot disannul the one evil you commited. Justice demands of you. Time does not forgive sin. Repentence in and of itself does not forgive sin. There was no Levitical sacrificial offering for WILLFUL sin-- Only unintentional. This is why we need Christ. To purge the criminal wrap sheet containing the record of offenses which testify to the righteous judge, the father of our transgressions. Christ took it away nailing it to the cross for them who belong to him.
Ashua
Member
Let me ask this, now:
Does the Holy Spirit dwell within the temple of God; the body of every believer? Is it possible for the Holy Spirit to cohabitate with sin? Indeed, the flesh does war against the Spirit and the Spirit against the flesh.
When Jesus delivered the woman caught in adultery from stoning, what did he say to her?
"Neither do I condemn thee: Go and try not to sin as much as you used to."?
No, he said:
"Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more."
We will sin. That is just a sad matter of reality. Still, God does not tempt us beyond our ability and in his word promised to always leave a way out. We sinners are without excuse. We are 'capable' of never sinning, but all sin and fall short of the glory of God. It is humanly possible to never sin. No one has ever done it besides Christ though.
Does the Holy Spirit dwell within the temple of God; the body of every believer? Is it possible for the Holy Spirit to cohabitate with sin? Indeed, the flesh does war against the Spirit and the Spirit against the flesh.
When Jesus delivered the woman caught in adultery from stoning, what did he say to her?
"Neither do I condemn thee: Go and try not to sin as much as you used to."?
No, he said:
"Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more."
We will sin. That is just a sad matter of reality. Still, God does not tempt us beyond our ability and in his word promised to always leave a way out. We sinners are without excuse. We are 'capable' of never sinning, but all sin and fall short of the glory of God. It is humanly possible to never sin. No one has ever done it besides Christ though.
Danus said:
I think you are right here. We are aksed to be holy instead of sinless.
"To sin no more" should be our will set in heart, we pretend this because God knows our hearts. Other than that, we try our best to depart from sin to reach holiness. Sinlessness is a measurement against Law, while saved Christians are no longer measured that way, that is, God doesn't view us that way. We are totally separated from Law. Thus we don't even call ourselves sinless (by law) anymore, no matter what. We call ourselves holy (separated from Law) instead. Our target is to follow Jesus Christ's teaching to reach holiness by faith.
1 Corinthians 15:56
The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law.
watchman F said:
I agree 100 %.
The proof is Jesus Himself. Jesus was fully man like us, having divested Himself of everything Divine, He lived a sinless life as a man empowered by the Spirit and submitted to the Father. He expects us to do the same as He has empowered us with the same Spirit and authority over our enemy. We should stop thinking that we are sinners and bound to make mistakes because that gives us licence to do so. The old man lived in sin. The new man lives in victory, more than a conqueror.
Adullam
Member
It depends on our identity. Jesus Himself left His former identity to become like us. Abram left his native soil, Moses chose to leave behind the pleasures of Egypt to follow God, the disciples forsook their lives to follow Jesus, Paul counted as dung all things that he might win Christ.
Have we forsaken our old identity and now are ONLY found in Him?
Have we forsaken our old identity and now are ONLY found in Him?