Do Believers In Hell Fire Actually Believe?

[VirginShallConceive]

When I was a child, adults usually told me that Hell is a bad place that bad people go to after they die . . . for eternity. A few of these adults may have mentioned that there was a literal eternal fire burning down there, but what I can remember is that they all, for the most part, just agreed that it was a terrible place to be . . . for eternity. To be fair, there might be ways to torture someone that could be even worse than burning them alive. I am far from an expert on this, and I wish to keep it that way. Furthermore, if you are the Creator of the universe, any eternal torture device that you can think of is going to work effectively. You could make an eternal room of fluffy teddy bears that scream in the ears of the damned, and it could, theoretically, be the worst torture possible.

Lately, I just can't accept the notion that my Loving God would set up an eternal Hell of fire, or the equivalently painful Hell, whatever that might be. Lately, I've been having a hard time buying this:

"But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire." -Matthew 5:22

Really? Whoever shall say, "Thou fool", shall be in danger of hell fire?

I'm sure glad I don't use the word "Thou" as part of my normal discourse.


For those of you who say you actually believe that Hell is a place of actual, physical, eternal torment, how come you don't act like it? Seriously.

If I truly believed that my God had an eternal torture device set up, and all the praying in the world could never shake that reality:

1) I would never have children. No way am I creating a soul that could potentially end up in an eternal torture chamber. All of the eternal Paradise in the world is not enough of a flip-side to a bet that could end up with even one soul having to endure eternal torture.

2) If it was too late when I came to my reasoned conclusion and I already had children, my whole existence on this earth would be to make sure that my children's souls end up with me in Heaven . . . and I mean every waking second would be spent trying to ensure this. If I had to sterilize them myself to keep them from having precious grandbabies that could potentially end up in eternal Hell fire, I would most certainly do so.

3) If I was absolutely certain that all of my loved ones were on their way to Heaven, I would spend the rest of my life trying to save as many souls as I can. I certainly wouldn't be hanging out on the computer. I would need to talk to the vulnerable souls face to face. I wouldn't have a "day job". I wouldn't even need a house. Why? Because this life is infinitely short when compared with Eternity.

I don't see any Christian behaving in this way, and we all know it's a big world out there with billions of people. So don't tell me that you truly believe in eternal Hell fire.

 

[Webb]

You sound faithless.

 

[farouk]

V: I would encourage you to go back to the Bible and consider yourself (myself, ourselves, naturally speaking) as a sinner in the light of a holy God. The Biblical message of the loving Savior of sinners is precisely so we don't have to bear the consequences of our sins, if we believe.

God bless your trusting, further reading of His Word.

 

[VirginShallConceive]

You sound faithless.

Are you claiming to believe in eternal Hell fire?

 

[VirginShallConceive]

V: I would encourage you to go back to the Bible and consider yourself (myself, ourselves, naturally speaking) as a sinner in the light of a holy God. The Biblical message of the loving Savior of sinners is precisely so we don't have to bear the consequences of our sins, if we believe.

God bless your trusting, further reading of His Word.

And you, Farouk . . . are you claiming that you believe in eternal Hell fire?

 

[Webb]

Are you claiming to believe in eternal Hell fire?

I don't know how literal "hell fire" is, but whatever it is I understand it to be worse than human language can describe, and, yes, I understand whatever it is it is as lasting as the pleasure of heaven.

 

[farouk]

And you, Farouk . . . are you claiming that you believe in eternal Hell fire?

Go ahead and mock me; it's okay as far as I am concerned, if it gives me the opportunity to talk to you, Friend, but remember you are on a Christian site. Remember 'the exceeding sinfulness of sin', and how it prevents sinners from entering the heaven of a holy God, unless Someone is taking care of them by faith, as the Bible's central, loving message says.

 

[JLB]

When I was a child, adults usually told me that Hell is a bad place that bad people go to after they die . . . for eternity. A few of these adults may have mentioned that there was a literal eternal fire burning down there, but what I can remember is that they all, for the most part, just agreed that it was a terrible place to be . . . for eternity. To be fair, there might be ways to torture someone that could be even worse than burning them alive. I am far from an expert on this, and I wish to keep it that way. Furthermore, if you are the Creator of the universe, any eternal torture device that you can think of is going to work effectively. You could make an eternal room of fluffy teddy bears that scream in the ears of the damned, and it could, theoretically, be the worst torture possible.

Lately, I just can't accept the notion that my Loving God would set up an eternal Hell of fire, or the equivalently painful Hell, whatever that might be. Lately, I've been having a hard time buying this:

"But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire." -Matthew 5:22

Really? Whoever shall say, "Thou fool", shall be in danger of hell fire?

I'm sure glad I don't use the word "Thou" as part of my normal discourse.


For those of you who say you actually believe that Hell is a place of actual, physical, eternal torment, how come you don't act like it? Seriously.

If I truly believed that my God had an eternal torture device set up, and all the praying in the world could never shake that reality:

1) I would never have children. No way am I creating a soul that could potentially end up in an eternal torture chamber. All of the eternal Paradise in the world is not enough of a flip-side to a bet that could end up with even one soul having to endure eternal torture.

2) If it was too late when I came to my reasoned conclusion and I already had children, my whole existence on this earth would be to make sure that my children's souls end up with me in Heaven . . . and I mean every waking second would be spent trying to ensure this. If I had to sterilize them myself to keep them from having precious grandbabies that could potentially end up in eternal Hell fire, I would most certainly do so.

3) If I was absolutely certain that all of my loved ones were on their way to Heaven, I would spend the rest of my life trying to save as many souls as I can. I certainly wouldn't be hanging out on the computer. I would need to talk to the vulnerable souls face to face. I wouldn't have a "day job". I wouldn't even need a house. Why? Because this life is infinitely short when compared with Eternity.

I don't see any Christian behaving in this way, and we all know it's a big world out there with billions of people. So don't tell me that you truly believe in eternal Hell fire.

You should lead the way, since you seem to be convinced of the appropriate action.


JLB

 

[reba]

Some of the language that is being used in these forums is going to
stop.

I could not stand before God/Jesus and tell Him this person is
saved that one is not. That is His doing not ours.

We are to spread
the gospel. Knowing the gospel is not worded the same to each of our
understanding, but most Christians have guide lines.

Jesus said 'what
ever you do to the least of these you have done it unto Me.' We need to start
treating each other as Jesus would. That includes, giving a glass of water, to
which words we use.

Words that say in one form or another 'believe as
I do or your not saved' Will not be tolerated. Calling our brothers and sisters
liars, in any form, as in false..that is not true etc.

It is not that
difficult to say I disagree with that teaching here is why....



Would we really post all that we do (self included) if we could see with our
natural eyes Jesus looking over our shoulders?

Lets see if we can
discuss Scripture and our differences in a more Godly manor.

Php_4:8
Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest,
whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure,
whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there
be any virtue, and if
there
be any praise, think on these
things.

This was posted to another thread adapt it to this one... watch what you say and how you say it.

 

[WIP]

Stay on topic, please!

 

[Guest]

Lately, I just can't accept the notion that my Loving God would set up an eternal Hell of fire, or the equivalently painful Hell, whatever that might be. Lately, I've been having a hard time buying this

and what god are you referring too, the god that i am speaking of is holy and sinless. god doesn't send people to hell, god gave us a choice. people send themselves to hell by refusing salvation. people still refuse even at the end of their lives, which is the prime example of a hard heart. hell wasn't meant for people, it was made for the devil and his angels. god isn't just holy, he's sinless. why would god allow sin into the kingdom of heaven. Matthew 7:7 - are people asking, seeking and knocking.

 

[Webb]

Do believers in hell fire actually believe? I really don't know if Lk.16 is a parable or to be taken literally but the basic teaching s the same. If not before, the rich man certainly believed when lifted "up his eyes, being in torments" vs.23 and when he wanted his 5 brethren to be warned not to come to his place, vs 27-31. The demons of James 2:19 believed, compare Matt.25:41-47.

 

[Osgiliath]

When I was a child, adults usually told me that Hell is a bad place that bad people go to after they die . . . for eternity. A few of these adults may have mentioned that there was a literal eternal fire burning down there, but what I can remember is that they all, for the most part, just agreed that it was a terrible place to be . . . for eternity. To be fair, there might be ways to torture someone that could be even worse than burning them alive. I am far from an expert on this, and I wish to keep it that way. Furthermore, if you are the Creator of the universe, any eternal torture device that you can think of is going to work effectively. You could make an eternal room of fluffy teddy bears that scream in the ears of the damned, and it could, theoretically, be the worst torture possible.

Lately, I just can't accept the notion that my Loving God would set up an eternal Hell of fire, or the equivalently painful Hell, whatever that might be. Lately, I've been having a hard time buying this:

"But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire." -Matthew 5:22

Really? Whoever shall say, "Thou fool", shall be in danger of hell fire?

I'm sure glad I don't use the word "Thou" as part of my normal discourse.


For those of you who say you actually believe that Hell is a place of actual, physical, eternal torment, how come you don't act like it? Seriously.

If I truly believed that my God had an eternal torture device set up, and all the praying in the world could never shake that reality:

1) I would never have children. No way am I creating a soul that could potentially end up in an eternal torture chamber. All of the eternal Paradise in the world is not enough of a flip-side to a bet that could end up with even one soul having to endure eternal torture.

2) If it was too late when I came to my reasoned conclusion and I already had children, my whole existence on this earth would be to make sure that my children's souls end up with me in Heaven . . . and I mean every waking second would be spent trying to ensure this. If I had to sterilize them myself to keep them from having precious grandbabies that could potentially end up in eternal Hell fire, I would most certainly do so.

3) If I was absolutely certain that all of my loved ones were on their way to Heaven, I would spend the rest of my life trying to save as many souls as I can. I certainly wouldn't be hanging out on the computer. I would need to talk to the vulnerable souls face to face. I wouldn't have a "day job". I wouldn't even need a house. Why? Because this life is infinitely short when compared with Eternity.

I don't see any Christian behaving in this way, and we all know it's a big world out there with billions of people. So don't tell me that you truly believe in eternal Hell fire.

No, people don't REALLY believe in eternal hell-fire. If they REALLY believed God is going to brutally torture and burn unbelievers with fire for eternity, then their attitude about the whole thing reveals that they could care less if the majority of God's creatures are burned alive forever.

NO ONE honestly, truly believes in an eternal burning hell if we are to judge by their actions. If they saw a person in a home that was burning, they would put forth every effort to save them; they would cry and scream for help; they would be late for work; they would not stop until the people were rescued. Yet, those who teach eternal torment can spend their hours relaxing in front of the tube, texting their buddies on their iPhones, playing Angry Birds, visiting friends in the mountains, having dinners with big spreads with their families, spending weekends camping, vacationing, fishing, swimming, and playing, and then lay their heads upon a pillow every night and sleep soundly, while, according to their own teaching, countless millions are going to a place a trillion times worse than a burning house!

If they REALLY believed what they teach, they would never cease, day and night until they involuntarily dropped from exhaustion - and others came to take their places, in their efforts to save people from such an awful, horrifying fate! They excuse themselves by saying, "All we can do is warn." But if they were standing before a burning house would they preach a thirty-minute sermon, then turn and walk away, saying, "All we can do is warn?"

And how many do they meet day after day, and never mention their danger? If they REALLY believed what they preached, they would not be able to wait for God to send them to preach the Gospel! They would have to spend their every waking moment pleading, working, struggling, fighting to save people from such a fate. They would be compelled to spend hours upon hours in the chronic wards of hospitals, in rest homes, with the elderly and those working on dangerous jobs, begging people to repent and turn to Jesus before they die.

Anyone with the love of God in his heart would do this IF HE REALLY BELIEVED the fables that are being taught today about hell. Either those who teach eternal torture are self-absorbed and extremely calloused, or they REALLY do not believe what they teach.

 

[n2thelight]

http://www.christianforums.net/member.php?u=92792

VirginShallConceive

Lately, I just can't accept the notion that my Loving God would set up an eternal Hell of fire, or the equivalently painful Hell, whatever that might be. Lately, I've been having a hard time buying this:

http://www.christianforums.net/member.php?u=92792http://www.christianforums.net/member.php?u=92792http://www.christianforums.net/member.php?u=92792http://www.christianforums.net/member.php?u=92792

You would be correct in that notion,noone will go to a place called hell ,being tormented forever....

Life and Death: The Two Polar Opposites

​

The apostle Paul summed up the whole matter of people’s reward for sin when he wrote:

ROMANS 6:23
For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternallife through Christ Jesus our Lord.

Could anything be clearer than this text? The wages for sin is shown to be death, and eternal life is stated to be a gift from God, not something people already have. This is consistently expressed from Genesis to Revelation, notice:

MATTHEW 7:13-14

“Enter through the narrow gate, for wide is the gate and broad the road that leads to destruction and many enter through it, (14) but small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.”

JOHN 3:16
“For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.”

ROMANS 8:13
For if you live according to the sinful nature, you will die; but if by the spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.

GALATIONS 6:8
The one who sows to please the sinful nature from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the spirit, from the spirit will reap eternal life.

PROVERBS 11:19
The truly righteous man attains life, but he who pursues evil goes to his death.

All these passages clearly describe the two separate destinies of the righteous and the unrighteous. The “righteous” are people who are in-right-standing with God because they’ve accepted his sacrifice for their sins, the “unrighteous” are those who are not in-right-standing with their Creator because they’ve rejected his offer of salvation. The former will inherit eternal life, whereas the latter will reap the wages of sin and be destroyed.

Yet those who adhere to the eternal torture doctrine mysteriously don’t accept this blatantly clear biblical truth. They don’t believe that the two polar opposites are life and death; they believe the two polar opposites are eternal life in heavenly bliss and eternal life in burning torment. Sounds ridiculous, doesn’t it? They may not phrase it in such an open manner, but this is what they actually believe when it comes down to it.

Excellent study at the below link

http://www.hell-know.net/

 

[JLB]

You would be correct in that notion,noone will go to a place called hell ,being tormented forever....

Life and Death: The Two Polar Opposites

The apostle Paul summed up the whole matter of people’s reward for sin when he wrote:

ROMANS 6:23
For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternallife through Christ Jesus our Lord.

Could anything be clearer than this text? The wages for sin is shown to be death, and eternal life is stated to be a gift from God, not something people already have. This is consistently expressed from Genesis to Revelation, notice:

MATTHEW 7:13-14

“Enter through the narrow gate, for wide is the gate and broad the road that leads to destruction and many enter through it, (14) but small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.â€

JOHN 3:16
“For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.â€

ROMANS 8:13
For if you live according to the sinful nature, you will die; but if by the spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.

GALATIONS 6:8
The one who sows to please the sinful nature from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the spirit, from the spirit will reap eternal life.

PROVERBS 11:19
The truly righteous man attains life, but he who pursues evil goes to his death.

All these passages clearly describe the two separate destinies of the righteous and the unrighteous. The “righteous†are people who are in-right-standing with God because they’ve accepted his sacrifice for their sins, the “unrighteous†are those who are not in-right-standing with their Creator because they’ve rejected his offer of salvation. The former will inherit eternal life, whereas the latter will reap the wages of sin and be destroyed.

Yet those who adhere to the eternal torture doctrine mysteriously don’t accept this blatantly clear biblical truth. They don’t believe that the two polar opposites are life and death; they believe the two polar opposites are eternal life in heavenly bliss and eternal life in burning torment. Sounds ridiculous, doesn’t it? They may not phrase it in such an open manner, but this is what they actually believe when it comes down to it.

Excellent study at the below link

http://www.hell-know.net/

Here is a good study link for you - it's called the bible!

Some even consider it to be God's word!


12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works. 14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. Revelation 20:12-15


And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.

8 But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death." Revelation 21:8

And something else you may want to consider while you are directing people to reject what God has to say in favor of some teaching on the internet -


For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; 19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. Revelation 22:18-19


... and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life.


JLB

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

When I was a child, adults usually told me that Hell is a bad place that bad people go to after they die . . . for eternity. A few of these adults may have mentioned that there was a literal eternal fire burning down there, but what I can remember is that they all, for the most part, just agreed that it was a terrible place to be . . . for eternity. To be fair, there might be ways to torture someone that could be even worse than burning them alive. I am far from an expert on this, and I wish to keep it that way. Furthermore, if you are the Creator of the universe, any eternal torture device that you can think of is going to work effectively. You could make an eternal room of fluffy teddy bears that scream in the ears of the damned, and it could, theoretically, be the worst torture possible.

Lately, I just can't accept the notion that my Loving God would set up an eternal Hell of fire, or the equivalently painful Hell, whatever that might be. Lately, I've been having a hard time buying this:

"But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire." -Matthew 5:22

Really? Whoever shall say, "Thou fool", shall be in danger of hell fire?

I'm sure glad I don't use the word "Thou" as part of my normal discourse.


For those of you who say you actually believe that Hell is a place of actual, physical, eternal torment, how come you don't act like it? Seriously.

If I truly believed that my God had an eternal torture device set up, and all the praying in the world could never shake that reality:

1) I would never have children. No way am I creating a soul that could potentially end up in an eternal torture chamber. All of the eternal Paradise in the world is not enough of a flip-side to a bet that could end up with even one soul having to endure eternal torture.

2) If it was too late when I came to my reasoned conclusion and I already had children, my whole existence on this earth would be to make sure that my children's souls end up with me in Heaven . . . and I mean every waking second would be spent trying to ensure this. If I had to sterilize them myself to keep them from having precious grandbabies that could potentially end up in eternal Hell fire, I would most certainly do so.

3) If I was absolutely certain that all of my loved ones were on their way to Heaven, I would spend the rest of my life trying to save as many souls as I can. I certainly wouldn't be hanging out on the computer. I would need to talk to the vulnerable souls face to face. I wouldn't have a "day job". I wouldn't even need a house. Why? Because this life is infinitely short when compared with Eternity.

I don't see any Christian behaving in this way, and we all know it's a big world out there with billions of people. So don't tell me that you truly believe in eternal Hell fire.

Do you believe any bible verse(s) that speak of heaven, an eternal, perfect place set up for people who do not deserve it?

 

[John 8:32]

People in hell fire do not believe. They are dead, burned to ashes and dead for all eternity. They can't do anything, they do not exist anymore.

 

[Webb]

People in hell fire do not believe. They are dead, burned to ashes and dead for all eternity. They can't do anything, they do not exist anymore.

Tell that to the rich man in Lk.16, that should ease his torment, vs.23,24.

 

[Osgiliath]

Tell that to the rich man in Lk.16, that should ease his torment, vs.23,24.

That "parable" has nothing to do with the afterlife, or Heaven an Hell. The parable is about The Jews (the Rich Man's) inheritance being given to The Gentiles (Lazarus), because The Jews rejected The One (Christ) who would be RAISED FROM THE DEAD.

• Luke 16:31 "And he said unto him, If they [the Jews] hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead [Christ]." (and they still have not been persuaded)

It is impossible for the parable to be literal Webb. Here is the Scriptural proof:

• John 3:13 "And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven."

Jesus said "NO ONE has ever ascended up to heaven...."

This Scripture especially applies to the parable of Lazarus and The Rich Man; due to the fact that Christ was still on Earth when the parable was given. How could Lazarus have ascended to Heaven if Jesus plainly said NO ONE has ascended up to Heaven?

It's a parable Webb, and it is about the inheritance of the Jews (the Rich Man) being given to the Gentiles (Lazarus). [See my detailed (and Scriptural) post in the thread: The Rich Man and Lazarus - post #47]

It has nothing to do with an eternal torture chamber, which is actually primitive, savage, Pagan mythology that was added to Christianity in the 3rd Century A.D.

 

[John 8:32]

That "parable" has nothing to do with the afterlife, or Heaven an Hell. The parable is about The Jews (the Rich Man's) inheritance being given to The Gentiles (Lazarus), because The Jews rejected The One (Christ) who would be RAISED FROM THE DEAD.

• Luke 16:31 "And he said unto him, If they [the Jews] hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead [Christ]." (and they still have not been persuaded)

It is impossible for the parable to be literal Webb. Here is the Scriptural proof:

• John 3:13 "And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven."

Jesus said "NO ONE has ever ascended up to heaven...."

This Scripture especially applies to the parable of Lazarus and The Rich Man; due to the fact that Christ was still on Earth when the parable was given. How could Lazarus have ascended to Heaven if Jesus plainly said NO ONE has ascended up to Heaven?

It's a parable Webb, and it is about the inheritance of the Jews (the Rich Man) being given to the Gentiles (Lazarus). [See my detailed (and Scriptural) post in the thread: The Rich Man and Lazarus - post #47]

It has nothing to do with an eternal torture chamber, which is actually primitive, savage, Pagan mythology that was added to Christianity in the 3rd Century A.D.

No man has ascended to heaven and furthermore, Christ said to the twelve during His last night on earth that no one ever goes to heaven...

Joh 13:33 Little children, yet a little while I am with you. Ye shall seek me: and as I said unto the Jews, Whither I go, ye cannot come; so now I say to you.

He had already said this publicly to the Jews twice (John 7:34 & John 8:21), now He was privately telling this to the ones who would become Apostles.