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Intimate relationship with my Father

jaybo

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There are many, many posts about religion, doctrine, rituals, etc. on these forums but I can't recall seeing one that discusses the basis of Christianity: that we have been adopted by God to be His children and to have an intimate, loving relationship with Him.

The Old Testament discusses a distant, unapproachable God and a relationship with Him based on a priesthood that acts as an intermediary between His people and Himself. There is a lengthy, cumbersome law that was given through an intermediary that is above all impossible to keep in its entirety. Any violation of this law requires a punishment in order to appease the distant God who cannot tolerate any sin. And of course, the Israelites were punished many, many times for their violations.

Well, that situation has passed away, having been replaced by the New Covenant. God sent His Son to live for a while on the planet a) to give a knowledge of whom God really is, b) pay the final, full price for all sins committed -- past, present, and future, and c) most important, allow anyone to become one of His children. He wants an intimate, personal relationship based on love.

The easiest way to understand this is for anyone to imagine a perfect parent in their life. Not some distant relationship based on rules and punishment, but on the instinctive love that a parent naturally has for their child. This relationship does not require intermediaries, ornate rituals, "holy" behavior, and all the other trappings of the Old Covenant (and most unfortunately brought mistakenly into the New Covenant). All it requires is mutual love!

No parent expects their child to be perfect and flawless. It's understood that there will be shortcomings and mistakes, but that in no way affects the strong bond of love, acceptance, and forgiveness. God loves His adopted children, those who regard their parent not as some distant, formal rules enforcer, but as "Abba" or Daddy.

I love my eternal Abba who adopted me, an atheist, as His child. He has forgiven all my sins and brought me into His immediate family for eternity.

Compare that to the tragedy of religion that tries and tries and tries and tries to please God. What a total waste!
 

for_his_glory

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John 10:9 I am the door, if any man enter in, he shall be saved. Jesus was the word made flesh to dwell among us, John 1:14, to show us the way back to Gods grace. John 14:6 Jesus said, I am the way, the truth and the life, no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. Romans 10:9, 10 if thou shall confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shall believe in his heart that God has raised him from the dead thou shall be saved. Vs.10 for with the heart man believeth unto righteousness and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation

All we have to do is believe and confess that we are sinners and allow Gods righteousness to cleanse us and renew our spirit man. Jesus wants us to come as we are and allow him to make the changes that need made in our hearts. People want to clean the fish before they catch them, but Jesus says come as you are I will clean you from the inside out.

Titus 3:5-7; Ephesians 2:8,9 it's not by our works or good deeds that save us, because we are all sinners, it is by Gods grace and mercy that forgives our sins and washes us clean by the atoning blood of the Lamb (Jesus).

John 10:10 the thief (Satan) comes to kill, steal and destroy, but I came to give life abundantly. Satan is always there to try and steal the word of God from us and tempt us to sin and sometimes we will sin because we still live in this flesh, but now when we do sin we can be quick to repent of it and grace will forgive us every time, Matthew 18:22.

Grace does not give us a license to sin, but if you are sinning unknowingly then God will forgive you. Romans 3:23 for all have sinned and come short of the glory of God. If a person says they have never sinned then they are lying to you and their selves because God said all have sinned.

We now become as a newborn baby and our spirit needs nourishment from the word of God and the only way to get the nourishment we need is to get into the word and study it by allowing the Holy Spirit teach it to us for truth and understanding. Just pick out a verse at a time and read it and reread it until you gain understanding that produces knowledge through the Holy Spirit.

Titus 2:11-15 for the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. Teaching us that denying ungodliness and worldly lusts we should live soberly, righteously and godly in this present world. Jesus came to show us how to overcome the sin nature of the world by teaching us how to live a moral life compatible with the word of God.

Jesus gave of himself for all of us and redeemed us from the curse of sin by taking all our sin becoming the final blood sacrifice for his love towards everyone. When we come to Jesus it is Gods grace that forgives our sins and remembers them no more. Sin will always be present with us because the flesh will always sin for that is its nature, but when we ask Jesus into our hearts we also receive at that same moment the gift of the Holy Spirit which teaches us how to separate ourselves from the ungodliness and lusts of this world. We may have to live in this world, but as a child of God we are not part of this world because our inner man, or heart, has now become renewed in the Spirit of God and sinless through the grace of God.

Man cannot save us or change us because man cannot see our hearts. We have got to get to that place where we say enough is enough I need help and when we cry out from the despairs of our hearts is where Jesus will meet us and come down to our level and speak to our hearts. When you do cry out to him be still and let him speak to you for Jesus will make himself known to all who ask with a sincere heart. Jude vs. 17-23 Keep yourselves in the love of God always looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternity.​
 

jaybo

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John 10:9 I am the door, if any man enter in, he shall be saved. Jesus was the word made flesh to dwell among us, John 1:14, to show us the way back to Gods grace. John 14:6 Jesus said, I am the way, the truth and the life, no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. Romans 10:9, 10 if thou shall confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shall believe in his heart that God has raised him from the dead thou shall be saved. Vs.10 for with the heart man believeth unto righteousness and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation

All we have to do is believe and confess that we are sinners and allow Gods righteousness to cleanse us and renew our spirit man. Jesus wants us to come as we are and allow him to make the changes that need made in our hearts. People want to clean the fish before they catch them, but Jesus says come as you are I will clean you from the inside out.

Titus 3:5-7; Ephesians 2:8,9 it's not by our works or good deeds that save us, because we are all sinners, it is by Gods grace and mercy that forgives our sins and washes us clean by the atoning blood of the Lamb (Jesus).

John 10:10 the thief (Satan) comes to kill, steal and destroy, but I came to give life abundantly. Satan is always there to try and steal the word of God from us and tempt us to sin and sometimes we will sin because we still live in this flesh, but now when we do sin we can be quick to repent of it and grace will forgive us every time, Matthew 18:22.

Grace does not give us a license to sin, but if you are sinning unknowingly then God will forgive you. Romans 3:23 for all have sinned and come short of the glory of God. If a person says they have never sinned then they are lying to you and their selves because God said all have sinned.

We now become as a newborn baby and our spirit needs nourishment from the word of God and the only way to get the nourishment we need is to get into the word and study it by allowing the Holy Spirit teach it to us for truth and understanding. Just pick out a verse at a time and read it and reread it until you gain understanding that produces knowledge through the Holy Spirit.

Titus 2:11-15 for the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. Teaching us that denying ungodliness and worldly lusts we should live soberly, righteously and godly in this present world. Jesus came to show us how to overcome the sin nature of the world by teaching us how to live a moral life compatible with the word of God.

Jesus gave of himself for all of us and redeemed us from the curse of sin by taking all our sin becoming the final blood sacrifice for his love towards everyone. When we come to Jesus it is Gods grace that forgives our sins and remembers them no more. Sin will always be present with us because the flesh will always sin for that is its nature, but when we ask Jesus into our hearts we also receive at that same moment the gift of the Holy Spirit which teaches us how to separate ourselves from the ungodliness and lusts of this world. We may have to live in this world, but as a child of God we are not part of this world because our inner man, or heart, has now become renewed in the Spirit of God and sinless through the grace of God.

Man cannot save us or change us because man cannot see our hearts. We have got to get to that place where we say enough is enough I need help and when we cry out from the despairs of our hearts is where Jesus will meet us and come down to our level and speak to our hearts. When you do cry out to him be still and let him speak to you for Jesus will make himself known to all who ask with a sincere heart. Jude vs. 17-23 Keep yourselves in the love of God always looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternity.​
Quoting out of context from eight(!) different Bible "books" is not a great way to convince people of anything. As my English teacher used to say, "context, context, context".
 

JLB

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Quoting out of context from eight(!) different Bible "books" is not a great way to convince people of anything. As my English teacher used to say, "context, context, context".

What do you find that is out of context in her post?


Making negative statements about people who are responding to your thread is not the best way to promote this subject.




JLB
 

jaybo

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What do you find that is out of context in her post?


Making negative statements about people who are responding to your thread is not the best way to promote this subject.




JLB
Here are the verses in the order she referred to them: John 10:9, John 1:14, John 14:46, Romans 10:9-10, Titus3-5-7, Ephesians 2:8-9, John 10:10, Matthew 18:22, Romans 3:23, Titus 2:11-15, Jude 17-23

That is my definition of eisegesis. Obviously, these verses are selected entirely out of context to try to prove her point. I am not interested in "the best way to promote a subject" but to understand the Bible's application to one's life -- in context..
 

jaybo

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What do you find that is out of context in her post?


Making negative statements about people who are responding to your thread is not the best way to promote this subject.




JLB
All of it. Again quoting out of context from eight(!) different Bible "books" is not a great way to convince people of anything. By selecting different verses -- there were no chapters or verses in the early texts -- from Scripture to prove a point is meaningless. Throughout the New Testament, Satan and other demons quote Scripture; it's not hard to do.

One famous example: Then the devil took him to the holy city, had him stand on the highest point of the temple, and said to him, “If you are the Son of God, throw yourself down. For it is written, ‘He will command his angels concerning you’ and ‘with their hands they will lift you up, so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.’” Matthew 4:6

The teachings of the Lord in the Bible must be quoted in context in order to be truthful about what is said. Personally, I try to read the Bible as it was written, using logical breaks in the text to understand what is written. IMHO it was a very serious error to divide the Scripture into chapters and verses, as there are no such divisions in the early manuscripts. Choosing out-of-context selections from eight different "books" to prove a point proves one thing only: the poster has a predetermined point of doctrine to prove. The solution is not go to the "salad bar" of Scripture.
 

for_his_glory

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Quoting out of context from eight(!) different Bible "books" is not a great way to convince people of anything. As my English teacher used to say, "context, context, context".
Please show me where I have quoted out of context by using all those scriptures to teach from.
 

for_his_glory

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Here are the verses in the order she referred to them: John 10:9, John 1:14, John 14:46, Romans 10:9-10, Titus3-5-7, Ephesians 2:8-9, John 10:10, Matthew 18:22, Romans 3:23, Titus 2:11-15, Jude 17-23

That is my definition of eisegesis. Obviously, these verses are selected entirely out of context to try to prove her point. I am not interested in "the best way to promote a subject" but to understand the Bible's application to one's life -- in context..
What does the order have to do with what each one says about our relationship with the Father. Would it have been better to quote each one by the order they are placed in the Bible like Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, etc. etc.?
 

for_his_glory

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All of it. Again quoting out of context from eight(!) different Bible "books" is not a great way to convince people of anything. By selecting different verses -- there were no chapters or verses in the early texts -- from Scripture to prove a point is meaningless. Throughout the New Testament, Satan and other demons quote Scripture; it's not hard to do.

One famous example: Then the devil took him to the holy city, had him stand on the highest point of the temple, and said to him, “If you are the Son of God, throw yourself down. For it is written, ‘He will command his angels concerning you’ and ‘with their hands they will lift you up, so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.’” Matthew 4:6

The teachings of the Lord in the Bible must be quoted in context in order to be truthful about what is said. Personally, I try to read the Bible as it was written, using logical breaks in the text to understand what is written. IMHO it was a very serious error to divide the Scripture into chapters and verses, as there are no such divisions in the early manuscripts. Choosing out-of-context selections from eight different "books" to prove a point proves one thing only: the poster has a predetermined point of doctrine to prove. The solution is not go to the "salad bar" of Scripture.
We are not using the original manuscripts as such that were written by each Prophet and Apostle as they were written as separate letters, not as a book form like the Bible is constructed with each book, chapter and verse.

There is no mole hill for you to make a mountain out of as I was sharing what each individual Apostle wrote that is in agreement with the teachings of Christ.
 
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jaybo

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We are not using the original manuscripts as such that were written by each Prophet and Apostle as they were written as separate letters, not as a book form like the Bible is constructed with each book, chapter and verse.

There is no mole hill for you to make a mountain out of as I was sharing what each individual Apostle wrote that is in agreement with the teachings of Christ.
Everything that you quoted are small, out-of-context verses from a variety of NT "books". Of course they were separate letters; they're now bound together in one book that we call "The Bible". So what?

You or I or anyone else can take a few verses from here and there to try to prove a doctrinal point. There is no trick to that. The point is that anyone can create their own "gospel" by selecting only those verses that support their predetermined interpretation but for those of us who know the Bible well and read it in context, often with accompanying notes, that personal interpretation is very often biased.

Perhaps you should write this if you want to be straightforward: "There is no mole hill for you to make a mountain out of as I was sharing what each individual Apostle wrote that [I think] is in agreement with [what I think are] the teachings of Christ."
 

JLB

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Here are the verses in the order she referred to them: John 10:9, John 1:14, John 14:46, Romans 10:9-10, Titus3-5-7, Ephesians 2:8-9, John 10:10, Matthew 18:22, Romans 3:23, Titus 2:11-15, Jude 17-23

That is my definition of eisegesis. Obviously, these verses are selected entirely out of context to try to prove her point. I am not interested in "the best way to promote a subject" but to understand the Bible's application to one's life -- in context..


We wouldn’t know for sure, since you didn’t actually quote a scripture, but only provided a reference to a scripture and your opinion about the matter.


Here is your original post that you made, but don’t have one single solitary scripture in it, yet you accuse another member who did actually use scripture, of taking scripture out of context.

Jaybo said
There are many, many posts about religion, doctrine, rituals, etc. on these forums but I can't recall seeing one that discusses the basis of Christianity: that we have been adopted by God to be His children and to have an intimate, loving relationship with Him.

The Old Testament discusses a distant, unapproachable God and a relationship with Him based on a priesthood that acts as an intermediary between His people and Himself. There is a lengthy, cumbersome law that was given through an intermediary that is above all impossible to keep in its entirety. Any violation of this law requires a punishment in order to appease the distant God who cannot tolerate any sin. And of course, the Israelites were punished many, many times for their violations.

Well, that situation has passed away, having been replaced by the New Covenant. God sent His Son to live for a while on the planet a) to give a knowledge of whom God really is, b) pay the final, full price for all sins committed -- past, present, and future, and c) most important, allow anyone to become one of His children. He wants an intimate, personal relationship based on love.

The easiest way to understand this is for anyone to imagine a perfect parent in their life. Not some distant relationship based on rules and punishment, but on the instinctive love that a parent naturally has for their child. This relationship does not require intermediaries, ornate rituals, "holy" behavior, and all the other trappings of the Old Covenant (and most unfortunately brought mistakenly into the New Covenant). All it requires is mutual love!

No parent expects their child to be perfect and flawless. It's understood that there will be shortcomings and mistakes, but that in no way affects the strong bond of love, acceptance, and forgiveness. God loves His adopted children, those who regard their parent not as some distant, formal rules enforcer, but as "Abba" or Daddy.

I love my eternal Abba who adopted me, an atheist, as His child. He has forgiven all my sins and brought me into His immediate family for eternity.

Compare that to the tragedy of religion that tries and tries and tries and tries to please God. What a total waste!

Again, making negative comments about someone is not the best way to promote your subject.


For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved. John 3:16-17




JLB
 
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JLB

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Let’s all work together to promote a healthy discussion about our relationship with our Heavenly Father.
 

JLB

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No parent expects their child to be perfect and flawless. It's understood that there will be shortcomings and mistakes, but that in no way affects the strong bond of love, acceptance, and forgiveness. God loves His adopted children, those who regard their parent not as some distant, formal rules enforcer, but as "Abba" or Daddy.


Amen. God has been extremely patient with me over the years.


He has nurtured me and corrected me. As I have grown older however, He has required that I obey Him, more and more. I don’t see this as Him being a dictator or rules enforcer, but a strong loving Father who knows what’s best for all His children.


Keeping His commandments is the way of love; loving God and loving my brothers and sisters in Christ. I have found when I spend time with Him, He strengthens me and gives me understanding to see from His perspective, in which I find that His commandments are not a burden, but a delight.


For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 1 John 5:3


  • And His commandments are not burdensome.




JLB
 

jaybo

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We wouldn’t know for sure, since you didn’t actually quote a scripture, but only provided a reference to a scripture and your opinion about the matter.


Here is your original post that you made, but don’t have one single solitary scripture in it, yet you accuse another member who did actually use scripture, of taking scripture out of context.



Again, making negative comments about someone is not the best way to promote your subject.


For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved. John 3:16-17




JLB

If I don't quote Scripture then of course I can't be accused of taking what I quote out of context. I was replying to a post that quoted separate verses from eight different NT "books" to prove some doctrinal point. That is a great example of eisegesis. Satan, when talking with Jesus in the wilderness, quoted Scripture out of context to try to prove his point. It's a clever but wrong way to use the Bible regardless of who does it.
 

jaybo

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BTW, the subject of the OP is "intimate relationship with my father". Arguing about the meaning of certain out-of-context Scripture quotes has nothing to do with the OP.
 

JLB

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If I don't quote Scripture then of course I can't be accused of taking what I quote out of context.

Amen, this is true.


You can certainly be considered as someone who promotes man made doctrine, if you never use scripture.


There are plenty of scriptures that show us God’s great love for us, as well as His desire for His people to practice righteous.



Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. 1 John 3:7


To be righteous is to be “right with God”.




JLB
 
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JLB

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I was replying to a post that quoted separate verses from eight different NT "books" to prove some doctrinal point.


I didn’t see where her scriptures were taken out of context.


Why don’t we focus on the relationship we have with our Heavenly Father, and the scriptures that promote this concept.


I think we all know that doing things against His will is not how we develop a good relationship with our Heavenly Father.



Adulterers and adulteresses! Do you not know that friendship with the world is enmity with God? Whoever therefore wants to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God. James 4:4


  • Whoever therefore wants to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God.






JLB
 

JLB

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BTW, the subject of the OP is "intimate relationship with my father". Arguing about the meaning of certain out-of-context Scripture quotes has nothing to do with the OP.

I agree. Please don’t make that accusation anymore.
 
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