Is The Law of God Still in Force Today ?/Matthew 5:17,18

[WalterandDebbie]

What is the truth? Is the Law of God as revealed in the Old Testament done away with – obsolete and terminated – obliterated and nullified by God’s grace?
If so, then why did Jesus Christ declare, “Think not that I am come to destroy the law . . . I came not to destroy but to FULFILL” Matt.5:17, 18. He added, “For assuredly, I say to yoy, till haven and earth pass away, ONE JOT OR ONE TITTLE will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled” (v.18). Are heaven and earth still around? If so, then the Law of God is still in existence, also!

You will need an Adobe Reader to open the below link. http://webhelper.centurylink.com/in...//www.adobe reader/&r=http://www.adobe.com/

http://www.triumphpro.com/law-and-the-covenants.pdf

 

[Jethro Bodine]

What is the truth? Is the Law of God as revealed in the Old Testament done away with – obsolete and terminated – obliterated and nullified by God’s grace?
If so, then why did Jesus Christ declare, “Think not that I am come to destroy the law . . . I came not to destroy but to FULFILL” Matt.5:17, 18. He added, “For assuredly, I say to yoy, till haven and earth pass away, ONE JOT OR ONE TITTLE will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled” (v.18). Are heaven and earth still around? If so, then the Law of God is still in existence, also!

http://www.triumphpro.com/law-and-the-covenants.pdf

This is the exact verse that made me realize how wrong it was for the Protestant church to abolish the law. Jesus plainly said he did not come to destroy the law.

How we fulfill it is what changed, not the fact that it still gets fulfilled in this New Covenant.

 

[Deborah13]

What is the truth? Is the Law of God as revealed in the Old Testament done away with – obsolete and terminated – obliterated and nullified by God’s grace?
If so, then why did Jesus Christ declare, “Think not that I am come to destroy the law . . . I came not to destroy but to FULFILL” Matt.5:17, 18. He added, “For assuredly, I say to yoy, till haven and earth pass away, ONE JOT OR ONE TITTLE will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled” (v.18). Are heaven and earth still around? If so, then the Law of God is still in existence, also!

http://www.triumphpro.com/law-and-the-covenants.pdf

Which of the 613 laws do you suggest that a good Christian should do?

 

[Lewis]

There are 613 statuettes out of all them the sacrificial ones were done away with, because Yeshua was the ultimate sacrifice. But the moral statuettes still stand, like don't kill, rape, sleep with family members etc. All that stuff still stands

 

[Deborah13]

There are 613 statuettes out of all them the sacrificial ones were done away with, because Yeshua was the ultimate sacrifice. But the moral statuettes still stand, like don't kill, rape, sleep with family members etc. All that stuff still stands

Saturday sabbath, feasts, kosher food and clothing, wearing tzitzit on four corners, etc. still stands?
Those things are not ceremonial they are a way of life, God said so.

 

[Malachi]

What is the truth? Is the Law of God as revealed in the Old Testament done away with – obsolete and terminated – obliterated and nullified by God’s grace?
If so, then why did Jesus Christ declare, “Think not that I am come to destroy the law . . . I came not to destroy but to FULFILL” Matt.5:17, 18. He added, “For assuredly, I say to yoy, till haven and earth pass away, ONE JOT OR ONE TITTLE will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled” (v.18). Are heaven and earth still around? If so, then the Law of God is still in existence, also!

Before we draw any conclusion from this Scripture. We need to determine what exactly is meant by "Law" in this text? As you go through the Bible, you will find that the word "Law" can be used in a number of different ways, and it is the context which will determine the specific meaning. Without proper context, anything can be made to mean anything. In Scripture "Law" can mean:
1. The Torah or "the Law of Moses" (the first five books of the Bible) -- 2 Kgs 14:16.
2. Individual laws and statutes within the Torah (Deut 4:44)
3. Just the Ten Commandments (Deut 4:13)
4. The entire Old Testament (Mt 5:17,18)

The Lord was speaking about the entire Old Testament -- the Hebrew Tanach -- which for the Jews was Divinely inspired and meticulously preserved, so that every jot (smallest markings) and every tittle (least particle) was accounted for.So what Christ said was that:

1. He had not come to destroy or demolish the Old Testament (laws as well as prophecies).

2. He had come to fulfil the Old Testament. We need to go beneath the surface and see that the Greek word translated here is pleroo (play-ro-o), which means to make replete, satisfy, finish, complete. All the types, all the laws, all the sacrifices, and all the prophecies pertain to the Christ (the Messiah). The sacrifices have been fulfilled with the sacrifice of Christ on the Cross. The New Covenant has replaced the Old Covenant. Some prophecies have been fulfilled at His first coming, and many prophecies remain to be fulfilled until His second coming. But Christ came (1) to establish the Law of Christ (which is the essence of the Ten Commandments -- Rom 13:8-10) and (2) to abolish the levitical priesthood and all of its offerings (Heb 8:1-13).

3. God preserved the Old Testament in the Holy Bible (KJV) as well as in Hebrew (and other languages) so that every prophecy would remain unchanged until "all was fulfilled". Heaven and earth will ultimately be replaced with the "new heavens and the new earth", but until such time the Word of God and the prophecies of the OT will remain unchanged. Therefore "the Law" -- the Hebrew Tanach -- is still present in both Hebrew and English, and the Ten Commandments have been incorporated into the Law of Christ in the New Testament (Gal 6:2).

 

[Deborah13]

Before we draw any conclusion from this Scripture. We need to determine what exactly is meant by "Law" in this text? As you go through the Bible, you will find that the word "Law" can be used in a number of different ways, and it is the context which will determine the specific meaning. Without proper context, anything can be made to mean anything. In Scripture "Law" can mean:
1. The Torah or "the Law of Moses" (the first five books of the Bible) -- 2 Kgs 14:16.
2. Individual laws and statutes within the Torah (Deut 4:44)
3. Just the Ten Commandments (Deut 4:13)
4. The entire Old Testament (Mt 5:17,18)

The Lord was speaking about the entire Old Testament -- the Hebrew Tanach -- which for the Jews was Divinely inspired and meticulously preserved, so that every jot (smallest markings) and every tittle (least particle) was accounted for.So what Christ said was that:

1. He had not come to destroy or demolish the Old Testament (laws as well as prophecies).

2. He had come to fulfil the Old Testament. We need to go beneath the surface and see that the Greek word translated here is pleroo (play-ro-o), which means to make replete, satisfy, finish, complete. All the types, all the laws, all the sacrifices, and all the prophecies pertain to the Christ (the Messiah). The sacrifices have been fulfilled with the sacrifice of Christ on the Cross. The New Covenant has replaced the Old Covenant. Some prophecies have been fulfilled at His first coming, and many prophecies remain to be fulfilled until His second coming. But Christ came (1) to establish the Law of Christ (which is the essence of the Ten Commandments -- Rom 13:8-10) and (2) to abolish the levitical priesthood and all of its offerings (Heb 8:1-13).

3. God preserved the Old Testament in the Holy Bible (KJV) as well as in Hebrew (and other languages) so that every prophecy would remain unchanged until "all was fulfilled". Heaven and earth will ultimately be replaced with the "new heavens and the new earth", but until such time the Word of God and the prophecies of the OT will remain unchanged. Therefore "the Law" -- the Hebrew Tanach -- is still present in both Hebrew and English, and the Ten Commandments have been incorporated into the Law of Christ in the New Testament (Gal 6:2).

I don't believe we have the authority to change one jot or tittle, the Sabbath of the Ten Commandments is the 7th day Saturday Sabbath.

 

[iLOVE]

What is the truth? Is the Law of God as revealed in the Old Testament done away with – obsolete and terminated – obliterated and nullified by God’s grace?
If so, then why did Jesus Christ declare, “Think not that I am come to destroy the law . . . I came not to destroy but to FULFILL” Matt.5:17, 18. He added, “For assuredly, I say to yoy, till haven and earth pass away, ONE JOT OR ONE TITTLE will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled” (v.18). Are heaven and earth still around? If so, then the Law of God is still in existence, also!

http://www.triumphpro.com/law-and-the-covenants.pdf

Galatians 4 New King James Version (NKJV)

4 Now I say that the heir, as long as he is a child, does not differ at all from a slave, though he is master of all, 2 but is under guardians and stewards until the time appointed by the father. 3 Even so we, when we were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world. 4 But when the fullness of the time had come, God sent forth His Son, born[a] of a woman, born under the law, 5 to redeem those who were under the law, that we might receive the adoption as sons.
6 And because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into your hearts, crying out, “Abba, Father!” 7 Therefore you are no longer a slave but a son, and if a son, then an heir of[b] God through Christ.

 

[Malachi]

I don't believe we have the authority to change one jot or tittle, the Sabbath of the Ten Commandments is the 7th day Saturday Sabbath.

No man has this authority, but God certainly has it, and Christ certainly has it.

Christ declared that He had authority over the sabbath day when He said "For the Son of Man is Lord even of the sabbath day" (Mt 12:8; Mk 2:28; Lk 6:5).

He then instructed Paul to write (Col 2:16,17):
16Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
As you will note "days" is in italics. It is the sabbath which is mentioned, and what Paul is telling the Colossians is that all the Jewish holy days, feast days, and sabbath days were a "shadow of things to come", but Christ is the reality. Therefore the observance of these days belongs to the Old Covenant (which was also a "shadow") , not the New.

Finally we have the apostle John telling us that he was in the Spirit ON THE LORD'S DAY (Rev 1:10). The Lord's Day is the first day of the week, not the sabbath. And the apostolic churches as well as churches in the first century (and to this day) met for worship on the Lord's Day (which is also the day of rest and good works).

 

[Malachi]

This is the exact verse that made me realize how wrong it was for the Protestant church to abolish the law

The "Protestant church" did no such things. Christ by His own one perfect sacrifice for sin abolished the Old Covenant and replaced it with the New Covenant. A close study of the epistle to the Hebrews will confirm this. The Old Covenant was the "shadow", the New Covenant is the eternal reality in Christ. It is God who promised this New Covenant a long time ago.

 

[Deborah13]

No man has this authority, but God certainly has it, and Christ certainly has it.

Christ declared that He had authority over the sabbath day when He said "For the Son of Man is Lord even of the sabbath day" (Mt 12:8; Mk 2:28; Lk 6:5).

He then instructed Paul to write (Col 2:16,17):
16Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
As you will note "days" is in italics. It is the sabbath which is mentioned, and what Paul is telling the Colossians is that all the Jewish holy days, feast days, and sabbath days were a "shadow of things to come", but Christ is the reality. Therefore the observance of these days belongs to the Old Covenant (which was also a "shadow") , not the New.

Finally we have the apostle John telling us that he was in the Spirit ON THE LORD'S DAY (Rev 1:10). The Lord's Day is the first day of the week, not the sabbath. And the apostolic churches as well as churches in the first century (and to this day) met for worship on the Lord's Day (which is also the day of rest and good works).

I know all this, thus you have made my point about the Ten Commandments.

Where in scripture does it say that the Lord's Day is the first day of the week? And if it is not considered a sabbath then why do so many Christians teach that it is a day of rest and people shouldn't work on that day?

 

[JLB]

This is the exact verse that made me realize how wrong it was for the Protestant church to abolish the law. Jesus plainly said he did not come to destroy the law.

How we fulfill it is what changed, not the fact that it still gets fulfilled in this New Covenant.

How would Jesus destroy the Law?


JLB

 

[ezrider]

How would Jesus destroy the Law?


JLB

This is actually a good question? If the law still exists, and we are not under it, then did he destroy it or not? And if he didn't destroy it, then how would he make it of none effect? To understand what Jesus was saying here, we must first seek to understand the gospel of Christ and the promise of the new Covenant. The Law and the Prophets were not destroyed that you should or shouldn't obey them, but that they might continue to testify of the Work of Christ. And once the Spirit of Truth has revealed unto us Christ in the Law and the Prophets, then by Faith we are no longer under the Law. It does not hold the same value to us, because we have come before the Lord himself to teach us. Just because an artist learns to paint using paint by numbers, does not mean that paint by numbers set needs to be destroyed. But once the artist becomes like Picasso, of what value is the paint by numbers to him? A cook uses a cookbook and follows the recipe very closely. But a great Chef already knows the fundamentals of those recipes and goes on the create his own great dishes.

The Law and the Prophets testify of the wrath of the Lord according to the old covenant, and the Law and the Prophets also testify of the Grace and Mercy of the Lord and the promises of the new covenant confirmed in Christ Jesus. If your true faith lies in Christ, then you would know the promise's of Lord, and that his wrath would be withheld, that you might come before the Lord in His Grace, and that the Spirit of the Lord would teach you of Christ himself.

God is a consuming fire, and when we hear the Spirit of the Lord convict us of our sin by the knowledge of the Law, our hearts burn within us, and we feel lost and separated from God. Through our obedience to this Law, we repent and try to do better next time, hoping to not be a disappointment to our Lord when he comes. Listening to the Spirit of Wrath and Judgement that we might perfect ourselves in the image of the Law.

Rom 1:18-19 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

But God did leave unto you a commandment. You should heed it's warning.

Deut 18:18-19 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him. And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.

But do you listen to the Spirit of Christ, or do you hear the Spirit of Wrath? The Spirit of Wrath reveals itself by the Knowledge of the Law, and can be found by reading your your Bibles. But the Spirit of Christ will never be revealed from the pages of a book, He will only be revealed in the depths of your heart. That is where you shall find Him, you have only to first believe. There under His Covenant of Peace, He would send forth the Spirit of Truth that would testify of all the things concerning Christ. There we would learn of Christ and walk in his kingdom protected from the knowledge of wrath, that we might learn of his righteousness in the absence of fear. He has not come unto you as a consuming fire that you should fear Him.

Jesus said "my sheep hear my voice." Do you even know how to hear his voice? How do you know the difference between the Spirit of Truth and the Spirit of error? He has told you how to listen. It is up to you to believe his word.

John 14:25-26 These things have I spoken unto you, being yet present with you. But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

John 15:26-27 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me: And ye also shall bear witness, because ye have been with me from the beginning.

In the absence of the Spirit of Christ within your heart, when you hear the Spirit of the Lord speak to you, you will only hear of the wrath and judgement, and the promise of your salvation shall remain hidden from you.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

The "Protestant church" did no such things. Christ by His own one perfect sacrifice for sin abolished the Old Covenant and replaced it with the New Covenant. A close study of the epistle to the Hebrews will confirm this. The Old Covenant was the "shadow", the New Covenant is the eternal reality in Christ. It is God who promised this New Covenant a long time ago.

The mistake you are making is thinking that the New Covenant abolished the law. Jesus said he did not come to do that. That forces us to consider what he did come to do with the law. He alludes to it right in the very same passage where he said he did not come to abolish the law.

He said nothing can disappear from the law UNTIL one of two conditions were met. He satisfied one of them: The fulfillment. Because the fulfillment has been accomplished some of the law can 'disappear' (not be abolished--he said he did not come to do that). The author of Hebrews explains that what Christ did was fulfill, not abolish, various laws. A fulfilling that allowed them to be set aside as unneeded now (not abolished). Christ has fulfilled them so that we don't need to continue to do them over and over. That is hardly an abolishing of the law, but rather a 'disappearing' of those various laws, made possible by what he DID come to do--fulfill the law, not abolish it.

You prolly won't understand this until you see an example of how Christ fulfilled, not abolished, a law, and which effectively made it 'disappear' from the law in that we don't have to literally do it anymore.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

How would Jesus destroy the Law?


JLB

By leaving it unfulfilled, and, telling others they don't have to 'keep' it.

 

[JLB]

By leaving it unfulfilled.

There is no such thing as literally destroying the Law.


This was a term used in His day among rabbis.

To mis-interpret the Law was said to "destroy" the Law.

To correctly interpret the Law was said to "fulfill" the Law.


Today, under the New Covenant there is no Levitical Priesthood, Physical Circumcision is not required, we are not required to travel to Jerusalem for Pentecost, we don't stone people to death for not keeping the Sabbath, food laws and feast days are not required.

We don't observe new moons or Sabbaths, or special clothing requirements...

The Law of Moses is obsolete.

The Laws of God that Abraham walked in, and are written on our heart and mind are for us to obey.


And having been perfected, He became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him, Hebrews 5:9



JLB

 

[smaller]

What is the truth? Is the Law of God as revealed in the Old Testament done away with – obsolete and terminated – obliterated and nullified by God’s grace?
If so, then why did Jesus Christ declare, “Think not that I am come to destroy the law . . . I came not to destroy but to FULFILL” Matt.5:17, 18. He added, “For assuredly, I say to yoy, till haven and earth pass away, ONE JOT OR ONE TITTLE will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled” (v.18). Are heaven and earth still around? If so, then the Law of God is still in existence, also!

http://www.triumphpro.com/law-and-the-covenants.pdf

Every Word of God from the O.T. was from Jesus Christ, The Word of God.

That Word of God was made FLESH. Every Word of HIM was contained in Christ in BODILY form. His Own Word never left Him or departed from Him upon resurrection.

When His Spirit dwells within us, as such, so does EVERY WORD of God abide in us all.

Those who deny any Word of God are under various kinds of deception. Any who eradicate or seek to eliminate or wipe away the Word of God are ILL directed.

And in this matter we should understand that the LAW is against us, even as we bear it, internally.

Most who hold up the law, do so for their own self justifications, where there are none available.

The law rightfully exposes sin and evil and condemns it all. As such it is our ally in this regards, but it is also our enemy because we all still have sin.

Jesus was very clear about the fact that man shall live by EVERY WORD of God. We just have a very hard time finding LIFE in the Words of adversity, but LIFE is there to be found.

 

[JLB]

Every Word of God from the O.T. was from Jesus Christ, The Word of God.

That Word of God was made FLESH. Every Word of HIM was contained in Christ in BODILY form. His Own Word never left Him or departed from Him upon resurrection.

When His Spirit dwells within us, as such, so does EVERY WORD of God abide in us all.

Those who deny any Word of God are under various kinds of deception. Any who eradicate or seek to eliminate or wipe away the Word of God are ILL directed.

And in this matter we should understand that the LAW is against us, even as we bear it, internally.

Most who hold up the law, do so for their own self justifications, where there are none available.

The law rightfully exposes sin and evil and condemns it all. As such it is our ally in this regards, but it is also our enemy because we all still have sin.

Jesus was very clear about the fact that man shall live by EVERY WORD of God. We just have a very hard time finding LIFE in the Words of adversity, but LIFE is there to be found.

1 My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world. 3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 1 John 2:1-3

 

[TOG]

Christ by His own one perfect sacrifice for sin abolished the Old Covenant

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them (Matt, 5:17 ESV)​

One of those isn't right.

The TOG​

 

[Jethro Bodine]

There is no such thing as literally destroying the Law.


This was a term used in His day among rabbis.

To mis-interpret the Law was said to "destroy" the Law.

The net effect of which is to not keep the law.

To correctly interpret the Law was said to "fulfill" the Law.

The net effect of which is to keep the law, not destroy/abolish it.

Today, under the New Covenant there is no Levitical Priesthood, Physical Circumcision is not required, we are not required to travel to Jerusalem for Pentecost, we don't stone people to death for not keeping the Sabbath, food laws and feast days are not required.

We don't observe new moons or Sabbaths, or special clothing requirements...

The Law of Moses is obsolete.

Some of the law of Moses was made obsolete and no longer needed by the work of Christ. The mistake the church made was to think that means the law was abolished. Hardly. Jesus did not abolish the law, he fulfilled it's requirements. So well in fact that there is no further action required in regard to the literal first covenant worship, cleanliness, separation, and penal laws that get fulfilled by his work on the cross.