It's not long before the persecution starts

[jasonc]

Deborah, do you not care at all when you hear. "Jesus! " said in a film as an explative?
Or when a priest or pastor is treated like an idiot?
Or when a man of God is shown to be defenseless against the forces of evil?

YES. I DO care what a movie producer produces.

And regarding Muslims - are you aware that if you wrote a book exposing them or making unflatterong remarks about them, you're life would be in danger?


Wondering

If you hear a movie that offends you simply don't watch it.

So it's a crime if an athiest mocks Jesus ?

 

[Mike S]

Christians: The world's most persecuted people: The former Chief Rabbi is appalled at the lack of protest about the treatment of Christians round the globe, and so should we be - http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...he-worlds-most-persecuted-people-9630774.html
Most people in the West would be surprised by the answer to the question: who are the most persecuted people in the world? According to the International Society for Human Rights, a secular group with members in 38 states worldwide, 80 per cent of all acts of religious discrimination in the world today are directed at Christians.

The Centre for the Study of Global Christianity in the United States estimates that 100,000 Christians now die every year, targeted because of their faith – that is 11 every hour. The Pew Research Center says that hostility to religion reached a new high in 2012, when Christians faced some form of discrimination in 139 countries, almost three-quarters of the world's nations.

 

[jasonc]

Do you live on the same planet I live??
Look and listen.
Maybe you'll see it.

Try serving.I served prior to the lifting of the ban of the lbgt in the military and yet I know of no chaplain who was forced to counsel gay marriages nor marry them.in fact my old chaplain refused to counsel a few .

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Can you give some examples of what you think this persecution will look like?

Destruction of personal property-including churches, bullying, threats. Boycotting of businesses owned by Christians.

My pastor said this morning basically what I'm saying: The Christians will be blamed for the liberals not having their candidate elected.

 

[jasonc]

Destruction of personal property-including churches, bullying, threats. Boycotting of businesses owned by Christians.

My pastor said this morning basically what I'm saying: The Christians will be blamed for the liberals not having their candidate elected.

Chik fil a,and hobby lobby and also the wedding photography and bakery issue with the lbgt

 

[Deborah13]

Not at all? That would mean there isn't one article reporting such?

Yes, that would appear to be the case.

The secular civil marriage contract.

What was said was that child are not allowed to privately pray when they eat lunch without being punished.
Now when someone makes a statement like that when they are promoting the idea of legal persecution, which is thread is about, then no there is not any such case. There are cases where schools have overstepped their legal obligations under the law and they have been forced to back off. In some cases by the ACLU.

As far as marriage goes I completely agree with you. But less than two yrs. ago, on this very forum I had a fight on my hands just convincing people that common law marriage was still legal in some states and they kept insisting that it was 'shacking up'. Now that they are sharing the marriage laws in their states with ssm, some of them are starting to understand how Christians shouldn't have ever been a part of secular marriage laws. It is those same laws that they are afraid will force pastors to marry ssm couples.

 

[GodsGrace]

This thread is about a persecution that is coming...not some perceived persecution that is already happening. The title to the thread is ...
"It's not long before the persecution starts"

We are not a communist country and even secular people do not want a communist country. We have a Constitution that even secular people want it enforced. It may not be the way Christians want to enforce it but if one is a true Libertarian they will respect other people rights the way they want their rights to be protected.

So everyone's rights are equal??
So SSM is OK?

If you agree with everything
You believe in nothing.

God has absolute morals.
All rights are not the same and only God's. " rights" should be accepted by Christians.

 

[Mustard Socks]

Deborah, do you not care at all when you hear. "Jesus! " said in a film as an explative?
Or when a priest or pastor is treated like an idiot?
Or when a man of God is shown to be defenseless against the forces of evil?

YES. I DO care what a movie producer produces.

So too did the Muslim that slaughtered Theo Van Gogh, a Dutch filmmaker, for readying to create the movie, Behind the Veil. This took place in Amsterdam in 2004.
Then there was the woman who went into hiding who initiated a "Draw Muhammad Day" event. She received death threats. As did the producers of the Canadian cartoon television series South Park. After they produced an episode that poked fun of all religious figures including Jesus. But it was certain Muslims that took offense to Muhammad being included and threatened the producers with death.

And let's not forget how Hillary blamed a movie at first for what transpired ultimately in Benghazi. That Muslim terrorist assault on an American compound resulted in four dead Americans and others severely wounded.

And regarding Muslims - are you aware that if you wrote a book exposing them or making unflatterong remarks about them, you're life would be in danger?

One thinks of Salman Rushdie and his work of fiction entitled, Satanic Verses.
He too went into hiding after being threatened with death.
Interestingly years later the former American musician Cat Stevens, now a Muslim convert who goes by the name Yusuf Islam, said years ago in an interview when asked if he'd carry out the fatwa (death warrant) the then Ayatollah of Iran put on Rushdie, yes! Because it would be his duty to defend the prophet.
He later tried to walk that statement back but apparently was unaware he was recorded at the time on a TV show.

Also, be aware that there are proxy offenses punishable by violence or even death according to the mind of some Muslims. For instance, years ago an American English teacher working in Sudan gifted a male Muslim student a teddy bear. The child took it upon himself to name the bear Muhammad.
The teacher was facing 40 lashes for his choice of teddy bear name.

Islam does not translate to peace. As in, it is a religion of peace. Rather, Islam translates to mean submission. Submission to the will of Allah. (God in Arabic). This is not an exclusive ideology regarding submission either. Not something that pertains only to Muslims submitting to the rules and teachings of the prophet. As we can come to understand when we read of any non-Muslim person being killed by a Muslim for an offense against Islam.
And of course we need not reiterate Muslim terrorists demonstrate Islam is not tolerant or inclusive.

 

[jasonc]

So everyone's rights are equal??
So SSM is OK?

If you agree with everything
You believe in nothing.

God has absolute morals.
All rights are not the same and only God's. " rights" should be accepted by Christians.

Okayy.

The first amendment allows fir all faiths to be practiced.one doesn't have a right to deny Jesus and live .therefire you must endorse a theocracy.we tolerate idolatry

There wasn't a marriage license requirement in the us until 1830.

 

[Runner]

Your liberal friends are fed up?
I feel for them.
They could try not listening to the. " Christians".
Just like I try not listening to liberals when they spout their really strange ideology.

But, of course, you don't succeed in not listening, do you? Oh, no, I don't think you succeed in not listening at all.

For quite some time, phony "Christians" have ruled the roost in the U.S. Now that is rapidly changing. Those who are fed up have reached a critical mass where they no longer fear the repercussions of expressing themselves and taking action. Ergo, the phony "Christians" will indeed face increased "persecution," and some of this will unfortunately spill over to genuine Christians. But it won't be persecution of Christianity per se.

There are as many sincere, genuine Christians on the left as there are on the right. It is those who think "liberal" equates to "un-Christian," or "ultra-right" equates to "Christian," who have the "really strange ideology." I don't even give the leaders of the ultra-right this much credit. They don't really believe "ultra-right" equates to "Christian." They believe - correctly - that by cloaking their agenda in terms of Christianity they will appeal to a certain yahoo segment of the populace. It is a completely calculating and cynical use of Christianity.

 

[GodsGrace]

What was said was that child are not allowed to privately pray when they eat lunch without being punished.
Now when someone makes a statement like that when they are promoting the idea of legal persecution, which is thread is about, then no there is not any such case. There are cases where schools have overstepped their legal obligations under the law and they have been forced to back off. In some cases by the ACLU.

As far as marriage goes I completely agree with you. But less than two yrs. ago, on this very forum I had a fight on my hands just convincing people that common law marriage was still legal in some states and they kept insisting that it was 'shacking up'. Now that they are sharing the marriage laws in their states with ssm, some of them are starting to understand how Christians shouldn't have ever been a part of secular marriage laws. It is those same laws that they are afraid will force pastors to marry ssm couples.

No one mentioned private prayer. But it's coming.
We used to pledge allegiance to the flag and pray.
Now we do neither because some groups, liberal, set out to remove God from everything.
I'd say they've had success.
Please do not change my words. The case of the ACLU was against schools allowing group prayer.
If you're going to discuss these matters you should be aware of the circumstances or say you don't know the facts.

 

[GodsGrace]

Okayy.

The first amendment allows fir all faiths to be practiced.one doesn't have a right to deny Jesus and live .therefire you must endorse a theocracy.we tolerate idolatry

There wasn't a marriage license requirement in the us until 1830.

So why can't we practice ours??
When you go shopping on Dec 20 does the cashier say " merry Christmas" or do they say. " happy holidays"?

It's CHRISTMAS, but they aren't allowed to acknowledge it.

 

[GodsGrace]

If you hear a movie that offends you simply don't watch it.

So it's a crime if an athiest mocks Jesus ?

Jason!
Are you serious?
I wish I was at my computer.
So do you think it's OK for atheists to oppress you and make fun of your religion?
Will you be able to keep your little girl from watching damaging TV shows or movies??
Please consider what you're saying.

 

[Mustard Socks]

What was said was that child are not allowed to privately pray when they eat lunch without being punished.

That is not true to what I actually wrote.

Now when someone makes a statement like that when they are promoting the idea of legal persecution, which is thread is about, then no there is not any such case. There are cases where schools have overstepped their legal obligations under the law and they have been forced to back off. In some cases by the ACLU.

Thank you. That admission refutes your former statement that my actual remarks were "not true at all."

The thread title states, it's not long before the persecution starts. My point being, it isn't something that is likely to happen in future if. Rather,there are evidences it is occurring now. And has been for some time. It is known as soft persecution. Think of that old axiom, nobody expected the Spanish inquisition.
Yes, they should have. Because what led to it was very subtle. And yet it was the foretelling of things to come.
And at this stage of soft persecution of Christians, the dismissive that commonly occurs when it is reported or becomes an issue of concern in discussions is that remark that claims, Christians are just upset because our privilege is being challenged.

Or, no, it isn't really persecution. You're just upset that America doesn't run the way you all want it to anymore.
Putting the onus on the Christians to prove they're really being targeted to conform and concede to worldly ideas that state, because the law says unrighteousness is tolerable in the secular realm we must not object from a religious perspective.

Or, that we must compromise our faith and values if we're in business. Freely, but not actually free, to leave our faith at the door of our business when it comes to the State laws that command we do that when a special privileged class enters in and asks us to do so themselves as they demand a service we cannot provide in good conscience.

And when our military is now accepting Tranny's in service, we have but to remember that the Chaplain's office is severely compromised in the military. As are religious rights and liberties of Christian soldiers. How does this happen? Because you do not have constitutional rights when in service in the military.

The idea that persecution could happen disparages those who have suffered what is happening now. That's my point.
No, they're not putting us in cages and burning us to death while screaming, Alluah Akbar, yet. Nor are they going door to door to collect bibles.
That doesn't mean what does happen, what is tried against Christian students in government schools isn't a persecution for that student and their faith. Just because it is repealed later doesn't revoke the impact the offense by the school against the Christian student had at the moment it occurred.
They try is offensive. The repeal is the salve. The try shouldn't have even occurred in a free first amendment country.

As far as marriage goes I completely agree with you. But less than two yrs. ago, on this very forum I had a fight on my hands just convincing people that common law marriage was still legal in some states and they kept insisting that it was 'shacking up'. Now that they are sharing the marriage laws in their states with ssm, some of them are starting to understand how Christians shouldn't have ever been a part of secular marriage laws. It is those same laws that they are afraid will force pastors to marry ssm couples.

I would say the ACLU at the very least, as well as any number of Christian legal defense organizations, would fight any measure to make pastors comport with such a demand. I also don't think it would even pass constitutional muster.

Though I don't doubt the effort will be tried being pastors have been persecuted in other ways already from the LGBTQ platform of offense and by state entities.

Not that long ago in Texas where the state demanded Houston pastors turn over their sermons for review. And most recently something akin to that demand for sermons in defense of LGBTQ rights when a Christian State employee and pastor also was fired. Then the State demanded he turn over his sermons too. That case is still ongoing as far as I know. The Texas one was smashed thank God.


With regard to the secular civil union licensing by a State, I believe we will see a Christian movement to separate ourselves from that contract in near future. In fact I believe we have to in order to embrace righteousness and push for our religious freedom in a rapidly changing America that is fast becoming one that embraces secular humanism. As it is certainly one wherein government funded schools are teaching just that.

 

[GodsGrace]

But, of course, you don't succeed in not listening, do you? Oh, no, I don't think you succeed in not listening at all.

But, of course, you don't succeed in not listening, do you? Oh, no, I don't think you succeed in not listening at all.

For quite some time, phony "Christians" have ruled the roost in the U.S. Now that is rapidly changing. Those who are fed up have reached a critical mass where they no longer fear the repercussions of expressing themselves and taking action. Ergo, the phony "Christians" will indeed face increased "persecution," and some of this will unfortunately spill over to genuine Christians. But it won't be persecution of Christianity per se.

There are as many sincere, genuine Christians on the left as there are on the right. It is those who think "liberal" equates to "un-Christian," or "ultra-right" equates to "Christian," who have the "really strange ideology." I don't even give the leaders of the ultra-right this much credit. They don't really believe "ultra-right" equates to "Christian." They believe - correctly - that by cloaking their agenda in terms of Christianity they will appeal to a certain yahoo segment of the populace. It is a completely calculating and cynical use of Christianity.

For quite some time, phony "Christians" have ruled the roost in the U.S. Now that is rapidly changing. Those who are fed up have reached a critical mass where they no longer fear the repercussions of expressing themselves and taking action. Ergo, the phony "Christians" will indeed face increased "persecution," and some of this will unfortunately spill over to genuine Christians. But it won't be persecution of Christianity per se.

There are as many sincere, genuine Christians on the left as there are on the right. It is those who think "liberal" equates to "un-Christian," or "ultra-right" equates to "Christian," who have the "really strange ideology." I don't even give the leaders of the ultra-right this much credit. They don't really believe "ultra-right" equates to "Christian." They believe - correctly - that by cloaking their agenda in terms of Christianity they will appeal to a certain yahoo segment of the populace. It is a completely calculating and cynical use of Christianity.

You're right about this:
Yes . I don't understand how a liberal person could call himself a Christian.
Do you think Jesus was liberal?

 

[GodsGrace]

That is not true to what I actually wrote.

Thank you. That admission refutes your former statement that my actual remarks were "not true at all."

The thread title states, it's not long before the persecution starts. My point being, it isn't something that is likely to happen in future if. Rather,there are evidences it is occurring now. And has been for some time. It is known as soft persecution. Think of that old axiom, nobody expected the Spanish inquisition.
Yes, they should have. Because what led to it was very subtle. And yet it was the foretelling of things to come.
And at this stage of soft persecution of Christians, the dismissive that commonly occurs when it is reported or becomes an issue of concern in discussions is that remark that claims, Christians are just upset because our privilege is being challenged.

Or, no, it isn't really persecution. You're just upset that America doesn't run the way you all want it to anymore.
Putting the onus on the Christians to prove they're really being targeted to conform and concede to worldly ideas that state, because the law says unrighteousness is tolerable in the secular realm we must not object from a religious perspective.

Or, that we must compromise our faith and values if we're in business. Freely, but not actually free, to leave our faith at the door of our business when it comes to the State laws that command we do that when a special privileged class enters in and asks us to do so themselves as they demand a service we cannot provide in good conscience.

And when our military is now accepting Tranny's in service, we have but to remember that the Chaplain's office is severely compromised in the military. As are religious rights and liberties of Christian soldiers. How does this happen? Because you do not have constitutional rights when in service in the military.

The idea that persecution could happen disparages those who have suffered what is happening now. That's my point.
No, they're not putting us in cages and burning us to death while screaming, Alluah Akbar, yet. Nor are they going door to door to collect bibles.
That doesn't mean what does happen, what is tried against Christian students in government schools isn't a persecution for that student and their faith. Just because it is repealed later doesn't revoke the impact the offense by the school against the Christian student had at the moment it occurred.
They try is offensive. The repeal is the salve. The try shouldn't have even occurred in a free first amendment country.




I would say the ACLU at the very least, as well as any number of Christian legal defense organizations, would fight any measure to make pastors comport with such a demand. I also don't think it would even pass constitutional muster.

Though I don't doubt the effort will be tried being pastors have been persecuted in other ways already from the LGBTQ platform of offense and by state entities.

Not that long ago in Texas where the state demanded Houston pastors turn over their sermons for review. And most recently something akin to that demand for sermons in defense of LGBTQ rights when a Christian State employee and pastor also was fired. Then the State demanded he turn over his sermons too. That case is still ongoing as far as I know. The Texas one was smashed thank God.


With regard to the secular civil union licensing by a State, I believe we will see a Christian movement to separate ourselves from that contract in near future. In fact I believe we have to in order to embrace righteousness and push for our religious freedom in a rapidly changing America that is fast becoming one that embraces secular humanism. As it is certainly one wherein government funded schools are teaching just that.

Great post.

 

[Mustard Socks]

Try serving.I served prior to the lifting of the ban of the lbgt in the military and yet I know of no chaplain who was forced to counsel gay marriages nor marry them.in fact my old chaplain refused to counsel a few .

That was wrong of your former old chaplain. In my opinion.

 

[jasonc]

Jason!
Are you serious?
I wish I was at my computer.
So do you think it's OK for atheists to oppress you and make fun of your religion?
Will you be able to keep your little girl from watching damaging TV shows or movies??
Please consider what you're saying.

This forum isn't the government.it has a right to censor . the first amendment only applies to the government . I prefer that.


So you are against an atheist buying and renting property to express his views.I'm not.

Movies,I wouldn't take a child to a movie that is filled with trash.my decision not the law.

 

[GodsGrace]

Try serving.I served prior to the lifting of the ban of the lbgt in the military and yet I know of no chaplain who was forced to counsel gay marriages nor marry them.in fact my old chaplain refused to counsel a few .

You can't give Mike S a like and then turn around and write this.
Mike is right and your chaplain is not the only one in the world!

 

[jasonc]

That was wrong of your former old chaplain. In my opinion.

To keep their marriage and a rather then tell them to repent say it's ok .it's not a sin?