Mathematically Proving Universal Salvation is True

[HSong]

So, there I was doing my daily work, when I found a mathematical formula that can be used to show the Universal Salvation is true.
Everyone knows about taxes, so let's use that as an example.

Profit After Taxes (PAT)
= Before-Tax Profit – Taxes (Before-Tax Profit)
= Before Tax Profit (1 - Taxes)

Now qe can simplify this set of equations to the following:
PAT = BTP - Tx(BTP) = BTP (1 - Tx)

To prove this is true, let's use some random numbers, where
BTP = 777
Tx = 11

= -7770
777 - 11(777) = -7770
777(1-11) = -7770

Or if we want an even more random example, where
BTP = 19
Tx = 361

= -6840
= 19-361(19) = -6840
= 19(1-361) = -6840

Using algebraic variables, the formula that proves Universal Salvation as true is like the following:
z = x-y(x) = x(1-y)

This explains the Trinity. This is how God can exist in different forms, The Father, The Son, the Holy Spirit, yet each form equals each other.
Each member of the Trinity proves that Universal Salvation is true.

The Father: Matthew 6:9-10, NIV Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name, your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.
The will of God the Father is to fufill His promise to creation, to have all people worshipping Him in goodness and joy. Thus, all people will go to Heaven.

The Son: 1 Timothy 4:10 Jesus Christ, the savior of all men, especially those who believe.
Jesus Christ paid the wages of sin, which is death, for the sins of all people. Everyone will be saved through Him.

The Holy Spirit: Romans 15:13 May the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope.
God is a God of hope. Everyone has the hope to be saved. He fills you with all joy, to all people, to everyone, so there's peace everywhere. The Holy Spirit is the power that spreads this hope, that every person will receive salvation.

Thus, 1 Matthew 6:9-10 = Timothy 4:10 = Romans 15:13
They all prove each other true and serve as evidence for one another.

Thus, Universal Salvation is true.

 

[Edward]

Allright, now you did it. I'm confused. I'm terrible at math but luckily the Lord has made provision for me in that He is not the author of confusion!

Welcome to the forum.

 

[Free]

So, there I was doing my daily work, when I found a mathematical formula that can be used to show the Universal Salvation is true.
Everyone knows about taxes, so let's use that as an example.

Profit After Taxes (PAT)
= Before-Tax Profit – Taxes (Before-Tax Profit)
= Before Tax Profit (1 - Taxes)

Now qe can simplify this set of equations to the following:
PAT = BTP - Tx(BTP) = BTP (1 - Tx)

To prove this is true, let's use some random numbers, where
BTP = 777
Tx = 11

= -7770
777 - 11(777) = -7770
777(1-11) = -7770

Or if we want an even more random example, where
BTP = 19
Tx = 361

= -6840
= 19-361(19) = -6840
= 19(1-361) = -6840

Using algebraic variables, the formula that proves Universal Salvation as true is like the following:
z = x-y(x) = x(1-y)

This explains the Trinity. This is how God can exist in different forms, The Father, The Son, the Holy Spirit, yet each form equals each other.
Each member of the Trinity proves that Universal Salvation is true.

The Father: Matthew 6:9-10, NIV Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name, your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.
The will of God the Father is to fufill His promise to creation, to have all people worshipping Him in goodness and joy. Thus, all people will go to Heaven.

The Son: 1 Timothy 4:10 Jesus Christ, the savior of all men, especially those who believe.
Jesus Christ paid the wages of sin, which is death, for the sins of all people. Everyone will be saved through Him.

The Holy Spirit: Romans 15:13 May the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope.
God is a God of hope. Everyone has the hope to be saved. He fills you with all joy, to all people, to everyone, so there's peace everywhere. The Holy Spirit is the power that spreads this hope, that every person will receive salvation.

Thus, 1 Matthew 6:9-10 = Timothy 4:10 = Romans 15:13
They all prove each other true and serve as evidence for one another.

Thus, Universal Salvation is true.

Absolutely arbitrary and proves nothing about Universal Salvation. Wow. Stunning that you think this proves Universalism is true. Not one verse you have posted yet in these forums proves that it is true. Every single verse you've given, such as the above, is taken out of context, with the idea of Universal Salvation being read into them.

 

[2nd Timothy Group]

Absolutely arbitrary and proves nothing about Universal Salvation. Wow. Stunning that you think this proves Universalism is true. Not one verse you have posted yet in these forums proves that it is true. Every single verse you've given, such as the above, is taken out of context, with the idea of Universal Salvation being read into them.

I definitely lean in your direction of beliefs. However, that are quite a few passages that lend to the idea of all being saved.

Isaiah 53:6 ESV - "All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned--every one--to his own way; and the LORD has laid on him the iniquity of us all."

Think about it: What did you do, Free, to be placed under the Curse of the Lord? Right . . . you did nothing, for you were born under this Adamic Curse, a Curse that keeps a person held captive by the Devil to do his evil will. Who lifts this Curse? Jesus Christ, for this is His Purpose and it is His Work that produces a Holy Effect. That Holy Effect is a changed life due to the Sinful Nature being permanently cut away. That's what you deserve! You did NOT deserve the Sinful Nature, but you DO deserve to have it cut away, for this Curse is by the unholy work of Adam and Eve.

So, when thinking of this conundrum in this way, there is the slightest sliver of a chance that there is some Truth to it.

 

[ilovejcsog]

So, there I was doing my daily work, when I found a mathematical formula that can be used to show the Universal Salvation is true.
Everyone knows about taxes, so let's use that as an example.

Profit After Taxes (PAT)
= Before-Tax Profit – Taxes (Before-Tax Profit)
= Before Tax Profit (1 - Taxes)

Now qe can simplify this set of equations to the following:
PAT = BTP - Tx(BTP) = BTP (1 - Tx)

To prove this is true, let's use some random numbers, where
BTP = 777
Tx = 11

= -7770
777 - 11(777) = -7770
777(1-11) = -7770

Or if we want an even more random example, where
BTP = 19
Tx = 361

= -6840
= 19-361(19) = -6840
= 19(1-361) = -6840

Using algebraic variables, the formula that proves Universal Salvation as true is like the following:
z = x-y(x) = x(1-y)

This explains the Trinity. This is how God can exist in different forms, The Father, The Son, the Holy Spirit, yet each form equals each other.
Each member of the Trinity proves that Universal Salvation is true.

The Father: Matthew 6:9-10, NIV Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name, your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.
The will of God the Father is to fufill His promise to creation, to have all people worshipping Him in goodness and joy. Thus, all people will go to Heaven.

The Son: 1 Timothy 4:10 Jesus Christ, the savior of all men, especially those who believe.
Jesus Christ paid the wages of sin, which is death, for the sins of all people. Everyone will be saved through Him.

The Holy Spirit: Romans 15:13 May the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope.
God is a God of hope. Everyone has the hope to be saved. He fills you with all joy, to all people, to everyone, so there's peace everywhere. The Holy Spirit is the power that spreads this hope, that every person will receive salvation.

Thus, 1 Matthew 6:9-10 = Timothy 4:10 = Romans 15:13
They all prove each other true and serve as evidence for one another.

Thus, Universal Salvation is true.

Everyone has a choice. Why is it so important to prove your beliefs. Perhaps you have doubts?

 

[Hopeful]

So, there I was doing my daily work, when I found a mathematical formula that can be used to show the Universal Salvation is true.
Everyone knows about taxes, so let's use that as an example.

Profit After Taxes (PAT)
= Before-Tax Profit – Taxes (Before-Tax Profit)
= Before Tax Profit (1 - Taxes)

Now qe can simplify this set of equations to the following:
PAT = BTP - Tx(BTP) = BTP (1 - Tx)

To prove this is true, let's use some random numbers, where
BTP = 777
Tx = 11

= -7770
777 - 11(777) = -7770
777(1-11) = -7770

Or if we want an even more random example, where
BTP = 19
Tx = 361

= -6840
= 19-361(19) = -6840
= 19(1-361) = -6840

Using algebraic variables, the formula that proves Universal Salvation as true is like the following:
z = x-y(x) = x(1-y)

This explains the Trinity. This is how God can exist in different forms, The Father, The Son, the Holy Spirit, yet each form equals each other.
Each member of the Trinity proves that Universal Salvation is true.

The Father: Matthew 6:9-10, NIV Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name, your kingdom come, your will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.
The will of God the Father is to fufill His promise to creation, to have all people worshipping Him in goodness and joy. Thus, all people will go to Heaven.

The Son: 1 Timothy 4:10 Jesus Christ, the savior of all men, especially those who believe.
Jesus Christ paid the wages of sin, which is death, for the sins of all people. Everyone will be saved through Him.

The Holy Spirit: Romans 15:13 May the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope.
God is a God of hope. Everyone has the hope to be saved. He fills you with all joy, to all people, to everyone, so there's peace everywhere. The Holy Spirit is the power that spreads this hope, that every person will receive salvation.

Thus, 1 Matthew 6:9-10 = Timothy 4:10 = Romans 15:13
They all prove each other true and serve as evidence for one another.

Thus, Universal Salvation is true.

Your math makes no sense.

 

[2nd Timothy Group]

Everyone has a choice. Why is it so important to prove your beliefs. Perhaps you have doubts?

I am guessing because HSong believes that it is edifying information for a person to know.

Don't we build each other up at this site?

 

[ilovejcsog]

I am guessing because HSong believes that it is edifying information for a person to know.

Don't we build each other up at this site?

Not if their taking out of the picture.

 

[ilovejcsog]

Not if their taking out of the picture.

They are

 

[2nd Timothy Group]

Not if their taking out of the picture.

So, if your child makes a mistake, you don't build them up? You don't encourage?

Hebrews 3:13 NIV - "But encourage one another daily, as long as it is called "Today," so that none of you may be hardened by sin's deceitfulness."

So here we are, being told to encourage others to ensure that they are not deceived. But you are saying that this person is taking Scripture out of context, which indicates deception, and yet you're unwilling to encourage and build up?

Hsong is the exact person that needs our encouragement.

 

[Free]

I definitely lean in your direction of beliefs. However, that are quite a few passages that lend to the idea of all being saved.

Isaiah 53:6 ESV - "All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned--every one--to his own way; and the LORD has laid on him the iniquity of us all."

Think about it: What did you do, Free, to be placed under the Curse of the Lord? Right . . . you did nothing, for you were born under this Adamic Curse, a Curse that keeps a person held captive by the Devil to do his evil will. Who lifts this Curse? Jesus Christ, for this is His Purpose and it is His Work that produces a Holy Effect. That Holy Effect is a changed life due to the Sinful Nature being permanently cut away. That's what you deserve! You did NOT deserve the Sinful Nature, but you DO deserve to have it cut away, for this Curse is by the unholy work of Adam and Eve.

So, when thinking of this conundrum in this way, there is the slightest sliver of a chance that there is some Truth to it.

I have yet to see a verse or passage in the two recent threads that supports Universalism. All, or nearly all, of those given have been taken grossly out of context, as I have shown.

From a human perspective, we like to think in terms of fairness. So, it seems unfair that we have been born into sin, and we reason that it is only fair that we have it removed, that we deserve it. However, is that what the Bible says? Yes, we are born into sin and so have no choice in the matter. Yet, God holds us morally culpable for our sin. He has certainly provided the way to be made right and reconciled to him, but I am not convinced that we "deserve to have it cut away" as it relates to the idea of Universalism.

Unbelievers are "children of wrath" (Eph 2:3), who stand condemned because they reject Christ and his atoning work (John 3:15-18). They get thrown into the lake of fire (Rev 20:15) and there is never an indication that once there, they can be saved and come out (Mat 18:8; 25:41, 46; Mark 3:29; 9:48; Rev 20:10; 21:8).

Annihilationism has much more support than Universalism, although I reject that as well.

 

[Free]

So, if your child makes a mistake, you don't build them up? You don't encourage?

Hebrews 3:13 NIV - "But encourage one another daily, as long as it is called "Today," so that none of you may be hardened by sin's deceitfulness."

So here we are, being told to encourage others to ensure that they are not deceived. But you are saying that this person is taking Scripture out of context, which indicates deception, and yet you're unwilling to encourage and build up?

Hsong is the exact person that needs our encouragement.

This seems to miss the context. It isn't that we are merely "being told to encourage others to ensure that they are not deceived," it's about being "hardened by sin's deceitfulness."

Heb 3:13 But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. (ESV)

The issue in this passage is about sin and an unbelieving heart that would keep someone who professes Christ from entering God's rest. There really isn't anything about general encouragement to avoid deception in one's theology.

2Ti 3:16 All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,
2Ti 3:17 that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work. (ESV)

So, how do we go about correcting someone without first pointing out that they're taking scripture out of context? What about when we have then provided that context, but they're unwilling to even acknowledge they are wrong?

 

[2nd Timothy Group]

All, or nearly all, of those given have been taken grossly out of context

Awwwww . . . I'm not sure that it's quite that bad.

In looking at the teaching from the viewpoint of Circumcision of the Heart, there is a door that is left open for "all are saved." To balance this doctrine with tons of Scripture would take some time, but well worth it . . . as it focuses on the Gospel of Christ.

 

[ilovejcsog]

So, if your child makes a mistake, you don't build them up? You don't encourage?

Hebrews 3:13 NIV - "But encourage one another daily, as long as it is called "Today," so that none of you may be hardened by sin's deceitfulness."

So here we are, being told to encourage others to ensure that they are not deceived. But you are saying that this person is taking Scripture out of context, which indicates deception, and yet you're unwilling to encourage and build up?

Hsong is the exact person that needs our encouragement.

Corrections:. Not if they are taking Jesus out of the picture. They believe all are saved, thus they eliminate the need for Jesus death. That eliminates Christianity also.

 

[ilovejcsog]

So, if your child makes a mistake, you don't build them up? You don't encourage?

Hebrews 3:13 NIV - "But encourage one another daily, as long as it is called "Today," so that none of you may be hardened by sin's deceitfulness."

So here we are, being told to encourage others to ensure that they are not deceived. But you are saying that this person is taking Scripture out of context, which indicates deception, and yet you're unwilling to encourage and build up?

Hsong is the exact person that needs our encouragement.

Encouragement to deny Christ?

 

[ilovejcsog]

They are

Insert Jesus in between "taking" and "out". Sorry!

 

[2nd Timothy Group]

So, how do we go about correcting someone without first pointing out that they're taking scripture out of context?

This would apply, providing that it isn't yourself that is misunderstanding the Holy Intentions of the Lord in His writings.

I, myself, attempt to take a much less dogmatic position upon God's Word. I find this "way" to be less offensive.

 

[2nd Timothy Group]

Corrections:. Not if they are taking Jesus out of the picture. They believe all are saved, thus they eliminate the need for Jesus death. That eliminates Christianity also.

Ok, if this is the path that God has given you as you interface with people . . . and children, then so be it. I'll choose the path of interfacing with the "less desirable" people, for these are the ones who need the Father more. So as you step aside and refuse to help those who you feel are struggling, I will step in and encourage them in their walk.

 

[2nd Timothy Group]

Encouragement to deny Christ?

If you honestly believe that this is what I am talking about, then it is unlikely that we will successfully communicate in the future. And so I encourage you to step up to the next level of Christian Maturity and leave behind these kinds of insinuations (that are obviously ridiculous).

 

[Free]

This would apply, providing that it isn't yourself that is misunderstanding the Holy Intentions of the Lord in His writings.

I am quite certain that it isn't I that is misunderstanding in these cases. I could be wrong, of course, but I am certain that my understandings are at least more correct than those being presented. I have given ample commentary as to why I believe that to be the case.

I, myself, attempt to take a much less dogmatic position upon God's Word. I find this "way" to be less offensive.

In what way are you less dogmatic? I'm going to assume that for you truth actually matters and can be knowable, although each of us is imperfect in our knowing.

And you didn't actually answer my question.