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Maybe an unpopular idea

Blake

Blake

Member
It seems like the great majority of Christians believe that geographical Israel and the Jews (whether Messianic or not) are Gods chosen. People are in cahoots watching Israel like prophesy watchdogs (not that anything is wrong with keeping watch).

It seems to me like it's possible that Israel is not necessarily the geographic location, but the body of Christ. And likewise we that have put on Christ are spiritual Jews, as He is no respecter of persons.

Can you help validate our invalidate my thought on this scripturally?
 
Blake said:
It seems like the great majority of Christians believe that geographical Israel and the Jews (whether Messianic or not) are Gods chosen. People are in cahoots watching Israel like prophesy watchdogs (not that anything is wrong with keeping watch).

It seems to me like it's possible that Israel is not necessarily the geographic location, but the body of Christ. And likewise we that have put on Christ are spiritual Jews, as He is no respecter of persons.

Can you help validate our invalidate my thought on this scripturally?
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welcome to the club. isreal then was the idea of what people God called them to serve. the church is called now to do that. while the futurist wont deny that. they just wont let go of the idea that isreal must be literally scene in prophetic utterance and yet ignore that the torah isn't meant to be a memorial. all manner of worship then always involved bloodshed. you had to cleanse the alter with that. that isn't needed anymore. the cross made that obsolete.

a jew that isn't saved is NOT chosen. and I finish with, signed a saved Ashkenazi Jew.
 
Gal_3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Mal_2:10 Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us? why do we deal treacherously every man against his brother, by profaning the covenant of our fathers?
Rom_12:5 So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.
Eph 2:14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
Eph 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
Eph 2:16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
 
This is why I find it interesting that so many people will find it so "spiritual" to go see the wailing wall, or visit the site of Gethsemane as if it would actually bring them closer to God.

You can just as close to God sitting in your room at home reading your bible and praying, as you can standing at some historical location in what used to be the ancient country of Israel.
 
Knotical said:
This is why I find it interesting that so many people will find it so "spiritual" to go see the wailing wall, or visit the site of Gethsemane as if it would actually bring them closer to God.

You can just as close to God sitting in your room at home reading your bible and praying, as you can standing at some historical location in what used to be the ancient country of Israel.
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I will say this being a jew. It would for me being that I know that I came from that land. to understand that culture is for me the only way I could get closer then I can after the deaths of my grandparents. so that is one motivation for me to go if I can. its taught to a jew that isreal is always part of him or her. don't forsake your homeland.
 
Blake said:
It seems like the great majority of Christians believe that geographical Israel and the Jews (whether Messianic or not) are Gods chosen.
Click to expand...

I'm one of those believers. :)

Romans 11
17 And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them became a partaker of the root and fatness of the olive tree,
18 do not boast against the branches. But if you do boast,remember that you do not support the root, but the root supports you.
.
.
 
Gary said:
I'm one of those believers. :)

Romans 11
17 And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them became a partaker of the root and fatness of the olive tree,
18 do not boast against the branches. But if you do boast,remember that you do not support the root, but the root supports you.
.
.
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I don't understand. Can you elaborate on this, or post a commentary on it maybe? I'm not seeing how it relates.
 
Gary said:
I'm one of those believers. :)

Romans 11
17 And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them became a partaker of the root and fatness of the olive tree,
18 do not boast against the branches. But if you do boast,remember that you do not support the root, but the root supports you.
.
.
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Rev_22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
 
Blake said:
I don't understand. Can you elaborate on this, or post a commentary on it maybe? I'm not seeing how it relates.
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"It seems like the great majority of Christians believe that geographical Israel and the Jews are Gods chosen".


Everything in the bible revolves around those two things. Israel and the Jews.

Since Israel became a nation in 1948, no other country in the world has been able to prevail against it. That's not just a coincidence.

To the Jew first, then the Gentile. Always in that order.

And your comment about being a spiritual Jew. Going from a spiritual Gentile to a spiritual Jew must mean that being a Jew holds some kind of significance. Am I right?
.
 
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Blake said:
It seems like the great majority of Christians believe that geographical Israel and the Jews (whether Messianic or not) are Gods chosen. People are in cahoots watching Israel like prophesy watchdogs (not that anything is wrong with keeping watch).

It seems to me like it's possible that Israel is not necessarily the geographic location, but the body of Christ. And likewise we that have put on Christ are spiritual Jews, as He is no respecter of persons.

Can you help validate our invalidate my thought on this scripturally?
Click to expand...
Blake said:
It seems like the great majority of Christians believe that geographical Israel and the Jews (whether Messianic or not) are Gods chosen. People are in cahoots watching Israel like prophesy watchdogs (not that anything is wrong with keeping watch).

It seems to me like it's possible that Israel is not necessarily the geographic location, but the body of Christ. And likewise we that have put on Christ are spiritual Jews, as He is no respecter of persons.

Can you help validate our invalidate my thought on this scripturally?
Click to expand...
While I was reading this,(6) He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked. 1 John 2:6, I come to thought as I read your above statement, I'am to follow Christ in all my thinking to come into along with what you have said, but to also follow this rule in my way of thinking. And as many as shall walk by this rule, peace be upon them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God. Galatians 6:16.

Christians are to do as Jesus did. The implication in the larger context is that those who claim to be Christian must live morally, as He did. We are to follow His example and to have the same ethic as He did - especially as it echoes what He says in John 8:28-29, which strongly implies that His behavior was drawn directly from God the Father.
 
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Gary said:
"It seems like the great majority of Christians believe that geographical Israel and the Jews are Gods chosen".


Everything in the bible revolves around those two things. Israel and the Jews.

Since Israel became a nation in 1948, no other country in the world has been able to prevail against it. That's not just a coincidence.

To the Jew first, then the Gentile. Always in that order.

And your comment about being a spiritual Jew. Going from a spiritual Gentile to a spiritual Jew must mean that being a Jew holds some kind of significance. Am I right?
.
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Every thing in the Scriptures revolves around Jesus the Christ.

The land we call Israel today is not the land promised to Abraham a very small segment of it..
Gen_15:18 In the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:
God is faithful to His promise..
Jos 21:43 And the LORD gave unto Israel all the land which he sware to give unto their fathers; and they possessed it, and dwelt therein.
Jos 21:44 And the LORD gave them rest round about, according to all that he sware unto their fathers: and there stood not a man of all their enemies before them; the LORD delivered all their enemies into their hand.
Jos 21:45 There failed not ought of any good thing which the LORD had spoken unto the house of Israel; all came to pass.

1Co_15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
 
Gary said:
And your comment about being a spiritual Jew. Going from a spiritual Gentile to a spiritual Jew must mean that being a Jew holds some kind of significance. Am I right?
.
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Well, not exactly, in my perspective... no more than real circumcision means anything compared to the spiritual circumcision. Colossians 2:11. And Romans 2:28-29 seems to affirm.

Seems I find myself transitioning into amillenialistic replacement theology...

Gary I do still tend to think that God has a place in His heart for the Jews. I believe near the end we will see a mass conversion of Jews to Christianity. But as it stands, even the Apostles preached the gospel to the Jews, who were formerly Jews themselves who recognized the Messiah. Just some thoughts.
 
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Blake said:
It seems like the great majority of Christians believe that geographical Israel and the Jews (whether Messianic or not) are Gods chosen. People are in cahoots watching Israel like prophesy watchdogs (not that anything is wrong with keeping watch).

It seems to me like it's possible that Israel is not necessarily the geographic location, but the body of Christ. And likewise we that have put on Christ are spiritual Jews, as He is no respecter of persons.

Can you help validate our invalidate my thought on this scripturally?
Click to expand...

the hebrews had at least erstwhile(in the time before the New Testament) been the official representatives/ambassadors of the true Lord God and the right faith for this planet, now the situation is different, because not that there are no righteous hebrew worshipers/clerics even today, but the authoritarianism of the erstwhile scribes and pharisees threatened/hindered the possibility for the emergence and the existence of more righteous believers/clerics out of their community, and therefore God has taken their privilege to push the righteous around and hamper their spiritual life/activity on the path of the right faith, so now there are many righteous believers/worshipers/clerics/people from around the world

Romans 11:25 "I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in."

Blessings
 
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If I buy a plane ticket to Israel, and they drop me off in a place they call Israel, then I just take their word for that. Anything more is far more complicated than I care to get involved with.
 
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