Online Minister

[smaller]

It isn't personal. I wasn't the only one there. This isn't my interpretation. It's what I was told.

What was? Internally communicated? Audible voice? Face to face speech with an/some entity(s)? God, face to face?

And content of speaking as well, i.e. jots and tittles type speaking or general conversation.

It can all make for interesting dissections. Part of why I ask is that a lot of such experiences seem to line up remarkably with the experiencer's doctrinal positions/understandings. And equally remarkably they often vary.

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

Wish I had some hope or help to offer you about your brother. I've got family and friends that I'm worried about too, for their resting place after they die. I'm sure just about everyone who is Christian has this worry with someone they care about. We have to trust God, and then just hope. Granted some people are more gifted to teach and bring people to Jesus, and maybe you are a person like that, with that gift. So a path to take to becoming a real minister in a church, or a witness and teacher without the documentation to become a minister might be something for you to consider.

For me, all I have is trusting God, and slowly learning how his teachings are better, and have a better outcome then my own tries to approach any sitution. As of now I don't think I have a gift of teaching someone about Jesus and bringing them to Him (not that I haven't tried). So for me following the teachings of Jesus, the gospel as a whole, and study of the Old Testiment as well as the New Testiment letters is the best I can do and just have to hope and pray for the souls and the people I care about.

For you, good luck with whatever you descide.

 

[KevinK]

^Thank you! That really means a lot to me. No, I don't think I have a special gift. I used to; now I wonder sometimes if I'm a disappointment to God.

 

[KevinK]

What was? Internally communicated? Audible voice? Face to face speech with an/some entity(s)? God, face to face?

And content of speaking as well, i.e. jots and tittles type speaking or general conversation.

It can all make for interesting dissections. Part of why I ask is that a lot of such experiences seem to line up remarkably with the experiencer's doctrinal positions/understandings. And equally remarkably they often vary.

It was a person I'd never met before, haven't seen since, didn't speak a word of English, and knew things about me he shouldn't have known (there was an interpreter). And yes, I know how fake psychics work. He never asked me for a cent of money. In fact, I got a free trip to Hawaii out of it.

To be honest I don't know that I'm supposed to talk about it in detail. Just a feeling. I don't really care if no-one believes me. I think the experience was meant for me, and not a testimonial situation.

 

[ezra]

now I wonder sometimes if I'm a disappointment to God.

no your not a disappointment to GOD . i have no idea if what your posting is of God or not. visions are real and God speaks through visions. my suggestion is wait upon the Lord to see what takes place. each person has a gift God gave them. use it to the best of your ability. stop worrying about what everyone thinks of your post .it's between you and GOD

 

[smaller]

It was a person I'd never met before, haven't seen since, didn't speak a word of English, and knew things about me he shouldn't have known (there was an interpreter). And yes, I know how fake psychics work. He never asked me for a cent of money. In fact, I got a free trip to Hawaii out of it.

To be honest I don't know that I'm supposed to talk about it in detail. Just a feeling. I don't really care if no-one believes me. I think the experience was meant for me, and not a testimonial situation.

I was referring to your OBE or NDE or whatever it was.

 

[KevinK]

I was referring to your OBE or NDE or whatever it was.

Yeah, yeah, that's all part of the story. I know I've got it all disconnected; I apologize for that. Well, since the cat's out of the bag, I might as well give it all...

Some twenty years ago I got a strange phone call from a buddy of mine who lived in Hawaii (both my parents are from Hawaii, also). He said that he and his wife had befriended a man and his wife; they were both Japanese (my buddy's wife is also). He was a spiritual guru of some kind. There's no way I could be making this up. Through an interpreter (I spoke almost no Japanese at the time) this guru person told my buddy you have a friend who lives near San Francisco. My buddy knew he was talking about me. Guru gave a few more personal details about me he could not have known. Even my friend didn't know some of this. Guru said that I must come to Hawaii and meet with them, that it was very important. My bud donated his airline miles to bring me over.

I flew to the islands and we met in some kind of spiritual session that lasted all night. It was during that night that I had an Out-of-Body Experience. I went to Hell. Just the outermost level, where it's all black, and no presence of God. I talked with several souls condemned there. They were all there because of addictions (alcohol, gambling, etc.); they may also have been suicides (I'm not sure about that last part). When I returned to my body, guru asked me how my visit to Hell was. He already knew most everything I'd just experienced. He also said if I didn't change my ways, I would go to that place again- permanently. He described a couple "character flaws" I had; he was spot-on on everything, and very specific. I started to change my life from that point on. I did not want to end up in that place. This process is still continuuing; it is why I'm a member here. I've since studied hundreds of NDEs and OBEs, especially those describing Hell, though I don't claim to be an expert in this area. Guru was a Christian, by-the-way.

So those are the main details. I can't prove it happened, and have no desire to. I don't care if people believe it or not. I don't know if I should have kept it all to myself or not. The experience was for me, not a general testimony per se. But, I also worry about a family member who is an athiest. I don't know if he believes my story or not. I pray that some of it will sink in.

 

[smaller]

Yeah, yeah, that's all part of the story. I know I've got it all disconnected; I apologize for that. Well, since the cat's out of the bag, I might as well give it all...

Some twenty years ago I got a strange phone call from a buddy of mine who lived in Hawaii (both my parents are from Hawaii, also). He said that he and his wife had befriended a man and his wife; they were both Japanese (my buddy's wife is also). He was a spiritual guru of some kind. There's no way I could be making this up. Through an interpreter (I spoke almost no Japanese at the time) this guru person told my buddy you have a friend who lives near San Francisco. My buddy knew he was talking about me. Guru gave a few more personal details about me he could not have known. Even my friend didn't know some of this. Guru said that I must come to Hawaii and meet with them, that it was very important. My bud donated his airline miles to bring me over.

I flew to the islands and we met in some kind of spiritual session that lasted all night. It was during that night that I had an Out-of-Body Experience. I went to Hell. Just the outermost level, where it's all black, and no presence of God. I talked with several souls condemned there. They were all there because of addictions (alcohol, gambling, etc.); they may also have been suicides (I'm not sure about that last part). When I returned to my body, guru asked me how my visit to Hell was. He already knew most everything I'd just experienced. He also said if I didn't change my ways, I would go to that place again- permanently. He described a couple "character flaws" I had; he was spot-on on everything, and very specific. I started to change my life from that point on. I did not want to end up in that place. This process is still continuuing; it is why I'm a member here. I've since studied hundreds of NDEs and OBEs, especially those describing Hell, though I don't claim to be an expert in this area. Guru was a Christian, by-the-way.

So those are the main details. I can't prove it happened, and have no desire to. I don't care if people believe it or not. I don't know if I should have kept it all to myself or not. The experience was for me, not a general testimony per se. But, I also worry about a family member who is an athiest. I don't know if he believes my story or not. I pray that some of it will sink in.

Ah. Didn't realize the 2 events were connected.

Are you still connected or in contact with this guy, the guru guy?

 

[KevinK]

Ah. Didn't realize the 2 events were connected.

Are you still connected or in contact with this guy, the guru guy?

Negative. Don't even know where he is. I can't even remember his name now.

 

[smaller]

Negative. Don't even know where he is. I can't even remember his name now.

I'm also assuming that you may be somewhat familiar with the workings of "familiar spirits?"

Anyone that knows personal info about you that they shouldn't, may be engaged with matters beyond the pale, even if they have Jesus painted across their lips. Familiar spirits and OBE's are not always of the beneficial kind, nor are they accurate gauges of genuine scriptural understandings.

I could wax on, but it would be a long conversation.

 

[KevinK]

I do know about all that, even more than I should. I've seen Bryan Melvin's videos, for example, showing how demons will use false but very convincing visions. There's more, in fact a lot more, but I don't think it would be a good idea to mention it here. Trust me...I know.

I will say this: the Lord works in mysterious ways sometimes.

 

[smaller]

I do know about all that, even more than I should. I've seen Bryan Melvin's videos, for example, showing how demons will use false but very convincing visions. There's more, in fact a lot more, but I don't think it would be a good idea to mention it here. Trust me...I know.

I will say this: the Lord works in mysterious ways sometimes.

Well and good. One of the most public showings of the work of familar spirits is from Shirley Maclaine in her book which became a movie, "Dancing with the Light" wherein she engaged a "medium" who told her something only her and one other person on the planet knew.

It is a real phenomena.

I've seen more than a few people have their lives destroyed by playing with these "entities."

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

I think there's merrit to the old Testiment law to not seek out mediums, or read omens. Even if things work out, or on the rarity for the better, I think our faith and trust in God is diminished, the more a person seeks the advise of a medium. That said though, I don't know where to cross the line. Where do you put the boundary between a prophet, someone who has a gift from God, and a medium who may have a connection, but not to be trusted. When people are desperate enough to seek anyone, if a person comforts them that they are a Christian with a spiritual gift should they turn away anyways? Time might be able to tell if a person is a conman or if there's something to their claims, based on whether what they say turns out to be true or not. But time isn't what tells us if those that had merrit are from God or not.

 

[KevinK]

I'm going to mention one more thing I saw, just because. It's kind of weird, just to warn you, so if you don't like weird, don't read any further...

As I descended to the pit, I also caught a glimpse of a couple things that lay just outside the Gate of Hell. There was a large room/cavern to one side. I peered inside as I passed by. I don't think you could guess in a million years what I saw...

...it was a Multi-Level Marketing meeting! You know, MLM, also called Network Marketing. Those companies that try to build up huge sales pyramids by signing up all your friends and family. Those people are one step from going to Hell! I've thought these organizations are evil, and this seems to confirm it. If you're contemplating getting involved with one of these companies, you've now been warned.

 

[KevinK]

I think there's merrit to the old Testiment law to not seek out mediums, or read omens. Even if things work out, or on the rarity for the better, I think our faith and trust in God is diminished, the more a person seeks the advise of a medium. That said though, I don't know where to cross the line. Where do you put the boundary between a prophet, someone who has a gift from God, and a medium who may have a connection, but not to be trusted. When people are desperate enough to seek anyone, if a person comforts them that they are a Christian with a spiritual gift should they turn away anyways? Time might be able to tell if a person is a conman or if there's something to their claims, based on whether what they say turns out to be true or not. But time isn't what tells us if those that had merrit are from God or not.

Well, a couple distinctions I should make...I did not seek him out, he "summoned" me. If he was a conman, he was not a very good one, as he at no time asked for any money, and I did not give him any. Targeting me in the first place could not have been financially-motivated, as I was not wealthy. In fact, he and his wife fed us all quite lavishly thoughout the night (apparently you work up quite the appetite descending to the netherworld).

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

Well, a couple distinctions I should make...I did not seek him out, he "summoned" me. If he was a conman, he was not a very good one, as he at no time asked for any money, and I did not give him any. Targeting me in the first place could not have been financially-motivated, as I was not wealthy. In fact, he and his wife fed us all quite lavishly thoughout the night (apparently you work up quite the appetite descending to the netherworld).

It didn't sound like a con to me either. But on the other side of things from your and Smaller's conversation, having visions or whatnot from a spirit but not from God is more what I meant. Some of that a person has to just trust or not trust that the other person has a gift from God, or doesn't.

 

[KevinK]

The guru basically said I need to start treating people a whole lot better, and start following the Lord's way, instead of my own. Also mentioned I had some kind of special "mission"- still haven't figured out what that might be.

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

I'm sorry for sounding like a skeptic, KevinK. I honestly didn't mean to and didn't realize I was until I read your responses. I think I spent too much time somewhere where skeptism is the only dominant voice, so making an effort to support your stance even before saying what your stance is may have become a habit. Thank you for sharing your experiences, and being strong enough or encouraged enough to do so.

Again I'm sorry.

 

[KevinK]

No apology necessary. I believe this experience was meant for me mostly, and not a general testimonial.

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

No apology necessary. I believe this experience was meant for me mostly, and not a general testimonial.

It could be both. Personally, I'm always intreasted in other people's experiences, expecially the spiritual ones. But on that note, in the past my intreast has been too much. A good amount of what I said I'm trying to apply to myself so that I don't seek out the kind that aren't from God, or be swayed by those who only claim to be from God. I grew up with an interest in miracles, ghosts,near death experiences, mediums and such, even at a point looked at reincarnation, and a series of books about a guy who says he's having a conversation with God while writing the conversation down. I've also seen my grandmother seek healing so much, and hold onto the hope of being healed so tightly that anyone who claimed to be able to heal and had a convention, she would go to, even if it was at the risk of her health.

Being tempered with the knowledge of cons placed on the faithful, and trying to apply God's teachings to not seek out mediums has led me to the position I'm in. But It's also along experiences in my life. And I don't want my caution or my intrest to discourage you or lead you the wrong way. So please accept my appology. Even if you don't think it's needed. I need to give it for discouraging you.