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Reward?

J

joyinhim

Guest
I hear so many Christians say that we are being obedient so we can get reward.

Is that how God work? So all we have to do is that believe He is a Son of God and Savior and we are saved? The rest of the work is just for extra reward?


This kind of Christianity(interpretation)is very dangerouse.

With this kind of mentality not only are we going to be hypocrite Christans but also we are taking chance of losing our salvation IMHO.
 
joyinhim said:
I hear so many Christians say that we are being obedient so we can get reward.

Is that how God work? So all we have to do is that believe He is a Son of God and Savior and we are saved? The rest of the work is just for extra reward?


This kind of Christianity(interpretation)is very dangerouse.

With this kind of mentality not only are we going to be hypocrite Christans but also we are taking chance of losing our salvation IMHO.

This seems to be the popular concept behind the New Covenant theology. Many present-day Christians seem to believe that one was saved in the OT by 'works'. They don't realize that the 'criteria' for salvation (faith) has been in existence since Day One. NO ONE was ever saved by works but by faith. So, nothing has changed in this regard. While I may be just as guilty at times as the ones to which I refer, the behavior of many Christians today appears to be no different from those of the world. And yet we really NEED to be different without being sanctimonious.

Something that the New Covenant Christians TOTALLY ignore is the 'faith without works (deeds) is dead' scripture (James 2:18-25). This doesn't seem to fit into their theology at all. They convert that scripture to say, 'faith WITH works is legalism'. Strange indeed! Another one is found in Romans 3:31: "Do we then nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law." These scriptures are not talking about legalism but of observable deeds. So, how come New Covenant Christians hate the word "deeds" so much? We really DO need to get to the bottom of this.
 
It fits in mine perfectly Sputnik! Again with the assumptions there friend :)
 
SputnikBoy said:
joyinhim said:
I hear so many Christians say that we are being obedient so we can get reward.

Is that how God work? So all we have to do is that believe He is a Son of God and Savior and we are saved? The rest of the work is just for extra reward?


This kind of Christianity(interpretation)is very dangerouse.

With this kind of mentality not only are we going to be hypocrite Christans but also we are taking chance of losing our salvation IMHO.

This seems to be the popular concept behind the New Covenant theology. Many present-day Christians seem to believe that one was saved in the OT by 'works'. They don't realize that the 'criteria' for salvation (faith) has been in existence since Day One. NO ONE was ever saved by works but by faith. So, nothing has changed in this regard. While I may be just as guilty at times as the ones to which I refer, the behavior of many Christians today appears to be no different from those of the world. And yet we really NEED to be different without being sanctimonious.

Something that the New Covenant Christians TOTALLY ignore is the 'faith without works (deeds) is dead' scripture (James 2:18-25). This doesn't seem to fit into their theology at all. They convert that scripture to say, 'faith WITH works is legalism'. Strange indeed! Another one is found in Romans 3:31: "Do we then nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law." These scriptures are not talking about legalism but of observable deeds. So, how come New Covenant Christians hate the word "deeds" so much? We really DO need to get to the bottom of this.

Thank you sput for your Scriptural reference. :angel:
 
joyinhim said:
I hear so many Christians say that we are being obedient so we can get reward.

Is that how God work? So all we have to do is that believe He is a Son of God and Savior and we are saved? The rest of the work is just for extra reward?


This kind of Christianity(interpretation)is very dangerouse.

With this kind of mentality not only are we going to be hypocrite Christans but also we are taking chance of losing our salvation IMHO.
Christianity is not dangerous; misinterpretations are dangerous. Salvation is the free gift of God to those who believe by faith because of the grace of God, and salvation is not of works, lest any man should boast; but those that are saved are saved to do the works of God.

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. Ephesians 2:8-10

Your understanding has no scriptural backing. I would suggest that before you attempt to make an argument on your frail understanding that you pray for those that may read and hear your words so that your words are true as well as edifying unto others, and not tools for destruction. Jesus told Peter, "Get thee behind me Satan." Was Peter Satan, or was Peter being manipulated in his thoughts by Satan? Be careful, for the devil does not care who he destroys, and he does this by doubts, lies, and deception.

Following are some verses of scripture that mention the rewards that you are doubting. Note also that salvation comes by believing the Word of God, that Jesus died for our sins, and that he was resurrected to eternal life, just as we will be. A believer becomes a believer when he is born again. Jesus said that we are born again when we are born of the Spirit of God. Salvation comes upon hearing the Word of God and by believing God, we are born again.

5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. 8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. John 3:5-8


Matthew 5:12
Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.


Matthew 5:46
For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?


Matthew 6:1
Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.


Matthew 6:2
Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.


Matthew 6:4
That thine alms may be in secret: and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly.


Matthew 6:5
And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.


Matthew 6:6
But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.


Matthew 6:16
Moreover when ye fast, be not, as the hypocrites, of a sad countenance: for they disfigure their faces, that they may appear unto men to fast. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.


Matthew 6:18
That thou appear not unto men to fast, but unto thy Father which is in secret: and thy Father, which seeth in secret, shall reward thee openly.


Matthew 10:41
He that receiveth a prophet in the name of a prophet shall receive a prophet's reward; and he that receiveth a righteous man in the name of a righteous man shall receive a righteous man's reward.


Matthew 10:42
And whosoever shall give to drink unto one of these little ones a cup of cold water only in the name of a disciple, verily I say unto you, he shall in no wise lose his reward.


Matthew 16:27
For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.


Mark 9:41
For whosoever shall give you a cup of water to drink in my name, because ye belong to Christ, verily I say unto you, he shall not lose his reward.


Luke 6:23
Rejoice ye in that day, and leap for joy: for, behold, your reward is great in heaven: for in the like manner did their fathers unto the prophets.


Luke 6:35
But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.

Luke 23:41
And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.

1 Corinthians 3:8
Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour.

1 Corinthians 3:14
If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.

1 Corinthians 9:17
For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.

1 Corinthians 9:18
What is my reward then? Verily that, when I preach the gospel, I may make the gospel of Christ without charge, that I abuse not my power in the gospel.

Colossians 2:18
Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,

Colossians 3:24
Knowing that of the Lord ye shall receive the reward of the inheritance: for ye serve the Lord Christ.

1 Timothy 5:18
For the scripture saith, Thou shalt not muzzle the ox that treadeth out the corn. And, The labourer is worthy of his reward.

Hebrews 11:26
Esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt: for he had respect unto the recompence of the reward.

2 John 1:8
Look to yourselves, that we lose not those things which we have wrought, but that we receive a full reward.

Revelation 11:18
And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

Revelation 22:12
And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
 
Solo,

I never debate Scriptures. I am just expressing my observation of church goers in general.

I am talking in a practical point of view.

We know if we are true followers by our fruit. Fruit won't lie. We can talk forever without any fruit.

Jeus wants us to produce fruit in our Christianity.
 
Way to back peddle there joyinhim. Why not just admit to the fact that maybe - just maybe you are in error.
 
joyinhim said:
Solo,

I never debate Scriptures. I am just expressing my observation of church goers in general.

I am talking in a practical point of view.

We know if we are true followers by our fruit. Fruit won't lie. We can talk forever without any fruit.

Jeus wants us to produce fruit in our Christianity.

Since you do not debate scriptures, then I suggest that you do not debate opinions. Opinions are not near as stable as the scriptures.

I agree with you that the fruits of one do not lie. The fruits of many believers are evident throughout the various denominations that are Bible believing gathering places, whether they be in a church building or a home. The fruits of the Spirit are evidenced by certain traits, and the fruits of the flesh are evidenced by certain traits (see Galatians 5). I can appreciate that. It is better to be kind, tenderhearted, forgiving toward one another, than it is of being bitter, wrathful, angry, clamoring (protesting), and evil speaking. You pray for me in these areas and I'll pray for you.

30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption. 31 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice: 32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you. Ephesians 4:30-32

14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord: 15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled; Hebrews 12:14-15
 
solo

thank you for your prayer,

Everything I post here is my observation. and they are all my convictions. I dont debate what I am convicted about. If I have been spreading lies I will be in deep trouble with the Lord. Why would I waste my time taking chance damaging my walk with the Lord? I don't play Christian.
 
joyinhim said:
solo

thank you for your prayer,

Everything I post here is my observation. and they are all my convictions. I dont debate what I am convicted about. If I have been spreading lies I will be in deep trouble with the Lord. Why would I waste my time taking chance damaging my walk with the Lord? I don't play Christian.
Since you don't play Christian, then I suspect you will walk in the Spirit exhibiting fruits of the Spirit. Read up on the rewards of believers, and study the born of God experience of the born again after hearing and believing on the Word of God.
Thanks,
Michael
 
So am I to understand by this thread and another on OSAS theology; that you stand in complete judgement of mankind whenever you feel convicted to do so?

Judgement is the Lord's, friend. Your opinions dressed in his name do him no justice. Is it his purpose you're trying to serve here, or your own?
 
Denote: this...

Is it his purpose you're trying to serve here, or your own?

...is a question not a judgement.

It is something every God-loving Christian should ask themselves however; with whatever they say attributed to his name.
 
Solo said:
joyinhim said:
solo

thank you for your prayer,

Everything I post here is my observation. and they are all my convictions. I dont debate what I am convicted about. If I have been spreading lies I will be in deep trouble with the Lord. Why would I waste my time taking chance damaging my walk with the Lord? I don't play Christian.
Since you don't play Christian, then I suspect you will walk in the Spirit exhibiting fruits of the Spirit. Read up on the rewards of believers, and study the born of God experience of the born again after hearing and believing on the Word of God.
Thanks,
Michael

solo,

I also don't take every one's advice especially people who have such a big difference interpreting the Scriptures and how we live it.
 
joyinhim said:
Solo said:
joyinhim said:
solo

thank you for your prayer,

Everything I post here is my observation. and they are all my convictions. I dont debate what I am convicted about. If I have been spreading lies I will be in deep trouble with the Lord. Why would I waste my time taking chance damaging my walk with the Lord? I don't play Christian.
Since you don't play Christian, then I suspect you will walk in the Spirit exhibiting fruits of the Spirit. Read up on the rewards of believers, and study the born of God experience of the born again after hearing and believing on the Word of God.
Thanks,
Michael

solo,

I also don't take every one's advice especially people who have such a big difference interpreting the Scriptures and how we live it.

joyinhim,

Maybe you should listen to the Holy Spirit when a Christian brother or sister is trying to clue you in on an area that has become a blind spot for you. Since you have such a big difference interpreting the Scriptures, perhaps you should read why I suggested that you walk in the Spirit instead of the flesh. Also I posted a number of Scripture references where rewards are mentioned. I suggested that you read those and also that you study salvation and the born of the Spirit teachings of the Scriptures. The three things that I suggested for you to do were to read about the rewards of believers, salvation (born again, born of the Spirit of God salvation), and walking in the Spirit. This would address your negativity that you cast at the beginning post of this thread. All of these are milk of the word doctrines which the Holy Spirit of God would teach you through your prayful time in the Word.

13 For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another. 14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 15 But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another. 16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. 17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. 18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. 19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. 24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. 25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. 26 Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another. Galatians 5:13-25
 
solo, I have been listenning to the Holy Spirit. You should start to serve Him with all you might then you will know what I am talking about.

You sound like so typical church goers. If you can not see something very wrong with the Christian community, you are not really seing the whole reality.

Whole commitment is the only way for the Lord. If we are not totally commited to Him we will be decived easily.

"Wide is the road to destruction"

May God be with you.
 
Vic, how did I over water ? You are continuing being evasive. :sad
 
Solo, good job on the reference material (saves me a lot of work).

merry Menagerie said:
It fits in mine perfectly Sputnik! Again with the assumptions there friend
It's pretty much the only thing Sputnik does. I'm beginning to wonder if he/she owns a Bible.

joyinhim, the way I see it, you can build a big church, but if it isn't what God has commanded you to do, it doesn't earn you any rewards. And there are a lot of big churches that are not built on the Rock. Consider what Jesus said about the pharisees who love to be seen by men.

An elder in my church puts it like this; at the final judgement, some of those who did their own thing "for God" will come out smelling like smoke!

Revelation 19:8, they may also be naked.
 
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