The Book of Matthew 5:1-48

[Enlightenedtruth]

I would like to ask about Matthew 5:5 first if I may:

5 Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

Do you believe this means those who are non-violent will be the ones to inherit the earth?

When I was 2 years old, my grandma had one of those old foot pedal sewing machines; my grandpa had made the cabinet for it. I was left unsupervised for just a bit; and I took every part I could off that machine, trying to understand how it worked. When I was caught everyone was a bit upset; cause grandma used that thing a lot to care for her family.
Grandpa worked on it for a while; then he stood up and said, "I don't know what the hell the boy did, but I can't figure it out". Grandma slapped him on the back of the head. She then called all the children to come, my younger aunt's and uncle. She apologized for hitting grandpa; and said she only did it because he had cussed, using the word "hell" in an improper way. She said while the word hell is in the Bible; discussing it in that context was fine, but using that word for any other purpose was cussing. She said violence begets violence; and she was ashamed of loosing her temper and smacking grandpa, especially in front of most everyone.

For those who might be curious; when my family took me home, grandpa did eventually figure it out. I had unhooked a wooden rod up inside the cabinet which drove the bobbin; if they had let me get near it while he was working on it, I could have shown him right away what he had missed.

 

[journeymanisnothing]

I would like to ask about Matthew 5:5 first if I may:

5 Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

Do you believe this means those who are non-violent will be the ones to inherit the earth?

No my friend. It means to think of yourself as you would any other man in the sight of God.
In Spirit, that is how God regards everyone of us. Like this,

Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Mt.5:3 KJV

In spirit we see we really own nothing. It all belongs to God. Nothing wrong with having money as long as we know Whose money it is.

 

[Enlightenedtruth]

No my friend. It means to think of yourself as you would any other man in the sight of God.
In Spirit, that is how God regards everyone of us. Like this,

Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Mt.5:3 KJV

In spirit we see we really own nothing. It all belongs to God. Nothing wrong with having money as long as we know Whose money it is.

I had shared a memory in my OP; specifically my grandma saying, "violence begets violence"; the first memory I have of that being said to me.

I know a fair number of Christian's own guns; and some (my sister in law as one example) believe they have a "God given right to defend themselves at any cost". I do not agree with that; my own Teachings as a child leaned heavy toward that "turn the other cheek" stance, Matthew 5:39.

Then there is Matthew 5:21; Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:. I know from another conversation in another thread that "God will forgive all sin, except the sin of blasphemy of the Holy Spirit". I was taught to kill was a "mortal Sin"; one that God would not forgive.

I would like to ask about the verse you did reference, Matthew 5:3. Does that mean people who "believe" they are filled with the spirit are not given the kingdom of Heaven?

 

[GodsGrace]

I had shared a memory in my OP; specifically my grandma saying, "violence begets violence"; the first memory I have of that being said to me.

I know a fair number of Christian's own guns; and some (my sister in law as one example) believe they have a "God given right to defend themselves at any cost". I do not agree with that; my own Teachings as a child leaned heavy toward that "turn the other cheek" stance, Matthew 5:39.

Then there is Matthew 5:21; Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:. I know from another conversation in another thread that "God will forgive all sin, except the sin of blasphemy of the Holy Spirit". I was taught to kill was a "mortal Sin"; one that God would not forgive.

I would like to ask about the verse you did reference, Matthew 5:3. Does that mean people who "believe" they are filled with the spirit are not given the kingdom of Heaven?

It means that they know they need God.
They aren't haughty or lofty. They know their need.

 

[Enlightenedtruth]

It means that they know they need God.
They aren't haughty or lofty. They know their need.

For Matthew 5:3 I do agree with that; but in my life time I have encountered a whole lot of people who are "holier than thou" in attitude, claiming to be filled with the spirit. I know I cannot change that; and a whole lot of it comes down to personal interpretation of the Scriptures.

I was taught to keep an open mind; and to hear what others have to say, because to assume that I know everything (or to hold myself above any other in Scripture) is inappropriate. Closing my eyes and allowing any other man to lead me about is silly; but I should still hear them and apply what they say to what I believe is "right and wrong" based on my own experience.

Another thought in this; how can God save a man who has already convinced themselves that they don't need to be saved, because they are already filled with the spirit and "without Sin".

 

[GodsGrace]

For Matthew 5:3 I do agree with that; but in my life time I have encountered a whole lot of people who are "holier than thou" in attitude, claiming to be filled with the spirit. I know I cannot change that; and a whole lot of it comes down to personal interpretation of the Scriptures.

I was taught to keep an open mind; and to hear what others have to say, because to assume that I know everything (or to hold myself above any other in Scripture) is inappropriate. Closing my eyes and allowing any other man to lead me about is silly; but I should still hear them and apply what they say to what I believe is "right and wrong" based on my own experience.

Another thought in this; hod can God save a man who has already convinced themselves that they don't need to be saved, because they are already filled with the spirit and "without Sin".

Agreed on all except we can't base scriptural truth on our own experience.
It still has to be biblically based.

Unless, if by personal experience, you mean like when I say that I know persons that know no theology but are going to heaven.

This is biblical however, now that I think of it...

 

[Enlightenedtruth]

Agreed on all except we can't base scriptural truth on our own experience.
It still has to be biblically based.

Unless, if by personal experience, you mean like when I say that I know persons that know no theology but are going to heaven.

This is biblical however, now that I think of it...

I have (and do) know people who have never touched a Bible or attended Church; but they are still good people who obey God's Commandments through the morals and values they were taught by their parents. They don't steal, lie or covet. They treat others with respect, and care about others.

As for personal experience of "right or wrong", my granny (dads side) would go into Church on Sunday and thump her Bible with the best of them; but the other six days of the week she had a tongue like a viper. She would say the most awful things about her fellow Church members, neighbors and even her own family. To my experience prior to that; that was not very "Christian like".

But even when someone says or does something that I deem wrong; there are still lessons that can be learned in that. My dad was a drunk who liked to hurt women and children; I decided I never wanted to be like him; and what I learned was not to drink. I also learned how not to speak to women; saying hurtful things serves no purpose. And I was taught by my grandpa (moms side) that you never hit a woman for any reason.

 

[GodsGrace]

I have (and do) know people who have never touched a Bible or attended Church; but they are still good people who obey God's Commandments through the morals and values they were taught by their parents. They don't steal, lie or covet. They treat others with respect, and care about others.

As for personal experience of "right or wrong", my granny (dads side) would go into Church on Sunday and thump her Bible with the best of them; but the other six days of the week she had a tongue like a viper. She would say the most awful things about her fellow Church members, neighbors and even her own family. To my experience prior to that; that was not very "Christian like".

But even when someone says or does something that I deem wrong; there are still lessons that can be learned in that. My dad was a drunk who liked to hurt women and children; I decided I never wanted to be like him; and what I learned was not to drink. I also learned how not to speak to women; saying hurtful things serves no purpose. And I was taught by my grandpa (moms side) that you never hit a woman for any reason.

:nod

 

[journeymanisnothing]

I had shared a memory in my OP; specifically my grandma saying, "violence begets violence"; the first memory I have of that being said to me.
I know a fair number of Christian's own guns; and some (my sister in law as one example) believe they have a "God given right to defend themselves at any cost". I do not agree with that; my own Teachings as a child leaned heavy toward that "turn the other cheek" stance, Matthew 5:39.

A slap in the face is an insult so, Do not repay evil with evil or insult with insult.
1Pet.3:9 NIV

Then there is Matthew 5:21; Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:. I know from another conversation in another thread that "God will forgive all sin, except the sin of blasphemy of the Holy Spirit". I was taught to kill was a "mortal Sin"; one that God would not forgive.

Murder is killing without just cause, angry with his brother without a cause Mt.5:22

I would like to ask about the verse you did reference, Matthew 5:3. Does that mean people who "believe" they are filled with the spirit are not given the kingdom of Heaven?

No

 

[Enlightenedtruth]

Murder is killing without just cause, angry with his brother without a cause Mt.5:22

According to Scripture, what would be "just cause"?

 

[journeymanisnothing]

According to Scripture, what would be "just cause"?

Justice is what the law demands. You understand what the law says.

 

[Enlightenedtruth]

Justice is what the law demands. You understand what the law says.

No, I have seen no "Law of God" that would justify or call for any man to kill another. Where in the Bible, or any Bible, does it give justifiable reasons to kill? God gives life, it belongs to God, and it is his to take.

 

[Hopeful 2]

I would like to ask about Matthew 5:5 first if I may:

5 Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

Do you believe this means those who are non-violent will be the ones to inherit the earth?

No.
It is those who humble themselves before God that will inherit the earth.

When I was 2 years old, my grandma had one of those old foot pedal sewing machines; my grandpa had made the cabinet for it. I was left unsupervised for just a bit; and I took every part I could off that machine, trying to understand how it worked. When I was caught everyone was a bit upset; cause grandma used that thing a lot to care for her family.
Grandpa worked on it for a while; then he stood up and said, "I don't know what the hell the boy did, but I can't figure it out". Grandma slapped him on the back of the head. She then called all the children to come, my younger aunt's and uncle. She apologized for hitting grandpa; and said she only did it because he had cussed, using the word "hell" in an improper way. She said while the word hell is in the Bible; discussing it in that context was fine, but using that word for any other purpose was cussing. She said violence begets violence; and she was ashamed of loosing her temper and smacking grandpa, especially in front of most everyone.

For those who might be curious; when my family took me home, grandpa did eventually figure it out. I had unhooked a wooden rod up inside the cabinet which drove the bobbin; if they had let me get near it while he was working on it, I could have shown him right away what he had missed.

 

[journeymanisnothing]

No, I have seen no "Law of God" that would justify or call for any man to kill another. Where in the Bible, or any Bible, does it give justifiable reasons to kill?

They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act. Now Moses in the law commanded us that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou? Jn.8:4-5 KJV

Have you ever read the Torah? The death penalty was prescribed by God to keep order in society.
The false witnesses who testified against our Lord would have been put to death had He accused them.

God gives life, it belongs to God, and it is his to take.

Life is sacred. That's why Jesus stopped them from condemning her and bringing condemnation on themselves.

 

[Enlightenedtruth]

They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act. Now Moses in the law commanded us that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou? Jn.8:4-5 KJV

Have you ever read the Torah? The death penalty was prescribed by God to keep order in society.
The false witnesses who testified against our Lord would have been put to death had He accused them.

Life is sacred. That's why Jesus stopped them from condemning her and bringing condemnation on themselves.

I've never read the Torah; and do not accept that Book as being the "absolute authority" on "all things God". Others can believe as they see fit; but it is my understanding the 10 Commandments were given unto the Tribes of Israel first, and Thou shalt not kill was listed. If the Tribes decided to make a "list of just causes" to kill in violation of God's Commandment; that is their choice and not mine. I will not accept the "Laws of the pharisees" over the "Laws of God".

 

[journeymanisnothing]

I've never read the Torah; and do not accept that Book as being the "absolute authority" on "all things God". Others can believe as they see fit; but it is my understanding the 10 Commandments were given unto the Tribes of Israel first, and Thou shalt not kill was listed.
If the Tribes decided to make a "list of just causes" to kill in violation of God's Commandment; that is their choice and not mine. I will not accept the "Laws of the pharisees" over the "Laws of God".

The Pharisees as a sect didn't exist when the law was instituted.

 

[Enlightenedtruth]

The Pharisees as a sect didn't exist when the law was instituted.

Matthew 23:1-39 Christ did speak of the "scribes and pharisees" quite a bit. The scribes were the ones who did write the "laws" as given to them by the pharisees. What Moses was given was passed by word of mouth from one generation to the next; until the scribes started writing such things down. Do you believe the all powerful pharisees would not make adjustments as to their "Godly vision" of what should be? If God Himself did not mean simply Thou shalt not kill; then why did He give that Commandment in the first place?

 

[journeymanisnothing]

Matthew 23:1-39 Christ did speak of the "scribes and pharisees" quite a bit. The scribes were the ones who did write the "laws" as given to them by the pharisees.

The law was written before the sect called the Pharisees lived on earth.

What Moses was given was passed by word of mouth from one generation to the next; until the scribes started writing such things down.

No my friend. Moses wrote the law as it is stated in the Bible and that written lawhasn't changed.

Do you believe the all powerful pharisees would not make adjustments as to their "Godly vision" of what should be?

Yes, but they changed it by interpretation and formed the Talmud (oral law.)

If God Himself did not mean simply Thou shalt not kill; then why did He give that Commandment in the first place?

Becuase killing an attacker to protect your family isn't murder. It's justified under the law.

 

[Enlightenedtruth]

Becuase killing an attacker to protect your family isn't murder. It's justified under the law.

I am not a fan of the Book of Romans, but will quote Romans 12:19

19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

No where in the NT did Christ give any "law" to justify killing; and there are too many Books and chapters where Christ and his Disciples did repeat; thou shalt not kill, to list them all here. NKJV

Brother I hope that you, and no other; is ever put into the position where you feel that is your only choice.

 

[journeymanisnothing]

I am not a fan of the Book of Romans, but will quote Romans 12:19

19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

Paul was speaking specifically about believers suffering because of their faith.

No where in the NT did Christ give any "law" to justify killing; and there are too many Books and chapters where Christ and his Disciples did repeat; thou shalt not kill, to list them all here. NKJV

Our Lord affirmed law enforcement officials to protect innocent life including deadly physical force.

Brother I hope that you, and no other; is ever put into the position where you feel that is your only choice.

I have been. I'm thankful it turned out well for the criminal. I had mercy on criminals because I was one.