The truth about the 3 "Persons" of the Trinity

[John Zain]

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Please see post #2.
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[John Zain]

To me, the word “persons” can only refer to human beings!

The sexual explanation
Since all spirit beings are sexless …
they cannot actually be masculine "persons", but they must be neuter "it"s.
So, I look on the Triune Godhead as being 3 "Manifestations" of God.
And I look on angels and demons as neuter "it"s, and not masculine spirits.

The reason for the 3 “Persons”
God knows how difficult it would be for us to have a personal relationship with an "It".
So, the Triune God decided to portray "Themselves" as three "Persons"
... just for us ... just so we could relate to Them.
This is just one more demonstration of God’s great love for us.
The First Member ... Father God
The Second member ... the Son of God
The Third Member ... the Holy Spirit
(The Spirit is the humble Work-horse of the Godhead, and does not desire any praise.)

Specifically about “the Son of God”
If He was not made sexually, and if He was not created by God, how did He come into being?
Answer: He always was, He always existed (John 1:1).
But, how could anything that always existed ... be some kind of “Son”?
The "Son of God" is a name-title-term … a term of endearment used throughout the OT.
Gabriel told Mary to call the Baby: Jesus, the Son of the Highest, and the Son of God.
Gabriel never said that He was these things … He was just to be given these names.

It’s all about you and God
Would you feel comfortable trying to have a personal relationship with an "It"?
The NT says you must have a “knowing” relationship with Jesus to be a sheep-elect:
John 10:7-28, John 17:3, Holy Spirit dwelling and leading (Romans 8:14, 2 Timothy 2:19).

 

[Hitch]

Nonsense.

 

[handy]

God is not a man...

The Son emptied Himself and became a man.... but, the Father, the Spirit... never have been, never will be human.

 

[John Zain]

God is not a man...
The Son emptied Himself and became a man....
but, the Father, the Spirit... never have been, never will be human.

Conventional, traditional, etc. Christianity has always said:
Jesus Christ is "fully God" and "fully man".

I'm just presenting my opinion in these 2 threads ...
and I won't be arguing with anyone about this info.
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[cleanfreak]

Gabriel never said that He was these things … He was just to be given these names.

So who is he, and what are we to call him?

 

[John Zain]

So who is he, and what are we to call him?

Nothing has changed.
Gabriel told Mary to call the Baby: Jesus, the Son of the Highest, and the Son of God.
And we also are to call Jesus: the Son of the Highest, and the Son of God.
For more info, read the OP again, and the companion thread:
http://www.christianforums.net/showthread.php?t=41284

 

[cleanfreak]

Nothing has changed.
Gabriel told Mary to call the Baby: Jesus, the Son of the Highest, and the Son of God.
And we also are to call Jesus: the Son of the Highest, and the Son of God.
For more info, read the OP again, and the companion thread:
http://www.christianforums.net/showthread.php?t=41284

thanks for the link.....been out of the loop for the while. Now this makes sense

 

[poppers]

THE DOCTRINE OF THE TRINITY is unique to Christianity. No other faith, religion, sect or philosophy advocating one God also proclaims that there are three who are God. This apparent paradox does not mean that there are "three gods in one" but that one God exists as three distinct persons who are coequal, coinfinite, and coeternal, all possessing the same essential natures (Psalms 110:1; John 10:30). Each member of the Godhead---God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit---is therefore a separate person, individually possessing identical eternal attributes (Matt. 28:19). God is one, in essence, but three in persons.
Each person of the Godhead, has a specific purpose related to the eternal will and plan of God. The Scriptures ascribe distinct roles to each person that are not jointly shared by the other members of the Trinity. The Father is the author and the planner, the source of all things. The Son is the agent through whom the Father's plan is enacted. The Holy Spirit is the revealer and empowers the plan in our lives.
Trinitarian tenets are not abstract theology. They are practical and essential reasons for every believer in Jesus Christ to fully comprehend this doctrine. Your view of the Trinity determines your understanding of Christology, the person and works of Jesus Christ. Your view of the Holy Spirit affects your concept of living the Christian life. Your worship and spiritual life. Are possible only with the biblical perceptive of the Godhead. In short, if you are to love God and grow spiritually, you must understand the doctrine of the Trinity.
You may wonder how one God can exist in three persons; yet from Scripture you can know that He so exists! All that God has made known about Himself can be understood (Romans, 1:19-20), even the fact that He is singular in one sense and plural in another. Though your finite mind cannot comprehend the infinite, through the ministry of the Holy Spirit who reveals the Scriptures, you can understand and accept spiritual truth by means of faith (1 Corinthians 2:10-12).

 

[poppers]

Man possesses three systems of human perception: rationalism, empiricism, and faith. Nothing is known that is not learned through one or a combination of these three systems. Rationalism relies on human ability to reason to establish by criterion for reality apart from the authority of divine revelation. Empiricism establishes reality based on observation and experience of the senses independently of spiritual revelation. Empiricism is based on the ability to see, hear, smell, taste, or touch. The third system, faith, is the only nonmeritorious system of perception. Faith establishes a certain reality based on the authority and veracity of God and His revelation rather than by any human ability. Only by means of faith can man comprehend the infinite spiritual truths which are beyond human finite reasoning powers or the sensory system (2Cor. 5:8; Heb. 11:1).

THE BIBLICAL CONFIRMATION​

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The word "Trinity" is not found in Scripture, but the concept is biblical. Rarely does a single passage of Scripture delineate point by point a complex doctrine. Rather, theologians formulate the principles of any major doctrine by comparing and correlating all related biblical passages. The believer should accept a doctrinal truth derived from many passages of Scripture just as he would accept a biblical principle directly stated in a single context. Over the years, the doctrine of the Trinity was likewise formulated by come combining all passages relating to God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.
Historically, the formal Doctrine of the Trinity derives from a succession of Early Church controversies and Councils that sought to explain the Biblical testimony regarding:
[FONT=&quot]1. [/FONT]The Oneness and Unity of God in Three Persons.
[FONT=&quot]2. [/FONT]The Deity of Christ.
[FONT=&quot]3. [/FONT]The Personality and Deity of the Holy Spirit.
The councils were held in response to the heresies such as monarchainism and Arianism. The Council of Nicaea (A.D. 325) affirmed that God the Son possess the same nature as God the Father. The Council of Constantinople (A.D. 381), confirm the deity of the Holy Spirit. In the following centuries, "Trinity" became a technical word for the three persons of the Godhead.
The concept of the Trinity is firmly established in both the old and the New Testaments.
The Hebrew word for God, (Elohim) is plural and indicates the existence of more than one person in the Godhead. When Genesis 1:1 declares "Elohim created the heavens and the earth," the plural asserts that all three persons had a part in creation. The father conceived the plan; the son accomplished creation (John 1:1-3; Col. 1:16; Heb. 1:2); and the Holy Spirit restored creation. "Gen. 1:2). After Satan's fall from heaven. (The angelic conflict)
Further Old Testament passages clearly declare the plurality of the Godhead.

"Come [Israel] dear to Me, listen to this: from the first I have not spoken in secret, from the time it took place, I was there. And now the Lord God[JHWH], "the Father" has sent Me, and His spirit." (Isaiah 48:16)

Generally, the Old Testament use of the word [JHWH] to refer to only one member of the Trinity. JHWH is the doubling of the verb “to be†meaning “absolute existenceâ€. Called the Tetragrammaton or "four letters", JHWH is the proper name for God or Lord. JHWH is considered sacred and never pronounced by devout Jews. We translate JHWH as Jehovah or Yahweh.
The context of a passage of Scripture indicates which member of the Trinity the Tetragrammaton describes. In Isaiah 64:8, Yahweh refers to God the father and in Isaiah 11:2, to God the Holy Spirit. Most uses of Yahweh, however, refer to God the Son since he is the visible person of the Trinity (John 46:4; cf., John 14:9-10; Isaiah 6; cf., John 12:39-41).
Numerous passages in the Old Testament document the pre-incarnate appearances---theophanies---of Yahweh or the Lord Jesus Christ to man. (Genesis 6:7-13; 18:1-33; 32:24-32; Exodus 3:2; cf., Acts 7:30-35; Exodus 13:21; 14:19; 23:20-23; 24:9-11; 32:34; 33:2; numbers 20:16; Judges 2:1-4; 6:11-24; Isaiah 63:9; Hosea 12:4)
occasionally, Yahweh implies all three persons as in the general blessing:

"The Lord [Yahweh] bless you, and keep you; the Lord make his face shine on you, and be gracious to you; the Lord lift up his countenance to you, and give you peace." (Num. 6:24-26)

 

[poppers]

Other Old Testament references to the Trinity include the pronouns "Us" where God refers to himself in the plural (Genesis 3:22; 11:7; Isaiah 6:8).

Then God [Elohim] said, "Let Us make man in Our image"---and God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him (Genesis 1:26a, 27a).

Such biblically recorded conversations among the members of the Trinity serve to verify the existence of the threefold personality of God.
While these heavenly conversations among the members of the Godhead suggest a decision making process, they do not imply that God is indecisive. God knows all that is knowable and His mandates come from His infinite and eternal knowledge. He then communicates to us, describing His seemingly indescribable person and plan in terms of our human experience and in a form of expression we can understand. His language accommodates our limited ability to comprehend the infinite. Thus, we can understand God, what He has revealed about Himself, and what He has set forth in His divine decree.

The Essence of the Trinity​

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While emphasizing God as a triune being, understanding His person is essential. Immediately we face a problem; we need a specialized vocabulary. Each term must convey the exact meaning of each divine characteristic. Once mastered, this vocabulary will save thousands of words of explanation and lay the foundation for further categories of Bible doctrine. (Vernacular is very important, every field whether it be a mechanic, or a doctor, or a space engineer, or a theologian, has its own Vernacular. Bible doctrine is no different and it has its own Vernacular).
Before we can grasp the concept of the Trinity, we must first comprehend the oneness or the unity of the Godhead. The unity of the Trinity is defined as the three persons having one divine essence (Isaiah 48:16; Matt. 28:19; John 10:30; 2Cor. 13:14; Gal. 3:20 b; 1 Tim. 1:5a; James 2:19 a). Essence is the essential being or nature of a person, what that person is. Each member of the Godhead is a joint partaker of the same essence, the same majesty, and the same eternal glory.
Attributes are those intrinsic qualities which compose the essence of a person. Each person of the Godhead has identical and identifiable attributes. These divine attributes never change. Neither can they separate from divine essence as a whole. All divine attributes are of equal value. No one attribute overrides the other; all work in complete coordination without any compromises to His essence. Only through knowledge of His attributes can God's essence be known.

 

[poppers]

Sovereignty.​

God is sovereign; that is, God has absolute authority, will, and prerogative (Psalms 47:2; 93:1; Isaiah 46:7). Sovereign God is the Supreme Ruler of the universe, King of heaven and earth (Deut. 4:39; 1Chron. 29:11; 2 Chron. 20:6). His sovereignty is expressed in His divine decree.
With regard to the First Person of the Trinity, God the Father, the psalmist writes: "Thou alone, whose name is Yahweh, art the Most High over all the earth." (Psalms 83:18 b). Ultimately, the will of the Father will "be done, on earth as it is in heaven" (Matt. 6:10). Concerning the Son, the Father said: "But as for Me, I have installed My King upon Zion, My holy mountain" (Psalms 2:6). Jesus Christ as the God-man also declared His own sovereignty: "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth," (Matt. 28:18 b; cf., Phil. 2:11; Rev. 19:6). Although Satan is now the ruler of this world (John 12:31; cf., 16:11), the Lord's will is infinitely greater. How reassuring to know that Jesus Christ controls history and the destiny of believers (Psalms 33)! As sovereign, the Holy Spirit distributes spiritual gifts "to each one [believers], individually just as He wills" (1 Cor. 12:11).

Righteousness.​

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God is absolute righteousness---perfect goodness, sinless in character and person (Psalms 25:8; 34:8; 86:5; 119:68; Luke 18:19). The righteousness of God is the perfect standard of His essence. All of his attitudes and actions conform to His flawless righteousness.
The Father asserts His own righteousness: "my righteousness shall be forever "(Isaiah 51:8b); and the Son affirms the Fathers perfection. (Luke 18:19; John 17:25). The Son Himself is said to be "holy, undefiled, separated from sinners" (Hebrews 7:26), "righteous"(1 John 2:1), and the One "who knew no sin [He did not possess a sin nature]†(2 Cor. 5:21). His name. "Will be called, the Lord of our righteousness." (Jeremiah 23:6). The scriptural designation of the Holy Spirit as Holy signifies that He, possesses absolute righteousness.
God's absolute righteousness stands in marked contrast to relative righteousness in the human realm.

For all of us have become like one who is unclean, And all our [relativity] righteous deeds are like a filthy garment. (Isaiah 64:6a)

God's righteousness cannot accept anything less than his own perfect righteousness. Neither is He free to disregard nor forgive sin apart from the satisfaction or the perpetuation of His righteous claims. The righteousness of God can only condemn sin.
God's righteousness combines with His justice to form the holiness, or the integrity of God. Righteousness is the principle of God's integrity; justice is a function of God's integrity. What the righteousness of God demands, the justice of God executes. Righteousness and justice work together to prevent any compromise of his essence (Lev. 11:44-45; Exodus 15: 11; 19:10-16; Deut. 32:4; Isaiah 6:3; 1 John 2:29).

Justice.​

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God's justice is absolute and in corruptible fairness. God treats all His creatures alike, without bias or partiality (Deut. 32:4; Neh. 9:33; Romans 2:11). He judges with perfect fairness; He never makes exceptions for anyone. As the function of God’s integrity, justice executes what righteousness demands (Lev. 19:2; Deut. 32:4; 2 Chronicles 19:7; Job 37:23; Psalms 19:9b; 50:6; Isaiah 2:2; 45:2; Jeremiah 50:7; John 17:11; Romans 3:26; Hebrews 11:30-31; 22:33; Rev. 3:7; 4:8; 6:10). What God's righteousness rejects or condemns---our sin nature and personal sins, His justice judges (Romans 5:12). What the righteousness of God excepts---His own righteousness in the believer (1 Cor. 1:30), the justice of God blesses. The justice of God is the source of both judgment and blessing. In order to reconcile sinful mankind to himself and yet satisfy His righteousness, the justice of God the Father imputed our sins to His Son and Judged Him as our substitute (John 3:16; Romans 3:24-26). He also appointed the Son the "righteous judge" (2 Tim. 4:8), giving him the "authority to execute judgment" (John 5:27). As an expression of His fairness, the Holy Spirit supplies, grace---His work that convicts "the world concerning sin, and righteousness, and judgment" (John 16:7-11).

 

[poppers]

Love.​

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God is eternal, unchangeable, perfect love (1 John 4:8b), his love along with righteousness and justice are the cause of all His actions. God's love and integrity are inseparably united; they are two sides of the same coin. Righteousness and justice are the bulwarks of God's love, "the foundation of His throne" (Psalms 89:14a). Integrity is the stability behind His love.

For the word of the Lord is up right; and all his work is done in faithfulness. He loves righteousness and justice. (Psalms 33:4-5 a).

There never was or will be a time when God does not have perfect love (1 Chron. 16:44; Psalms 118:1-4, 29; 136:1-26; 138:8).
God's love existed before the creation of man, Angels or the universe---before anything existed apart from God Himself. Therefore, he does not fall in love or begin to love. His love does not require inspiration or an object. His love is not disappointed, frustrated, or diminished by knowledge of the sins and the failures of his creatures. His love is not complicated by ignorance, silliness, or absurdities. Neither is His love emotional or sentimental. God does not have emotion. His love always functions in a rational manner. God's love is perfect because of His perfect integrity. God's love is expressed in three categories: divine self-love, divine impersonal love, and divine personal love.

Divine Self-Love.

Divine self-love is directed toward the perfect righteousness among the members of the Godhead. God loves His integrity and the perfect integrity belonging to each member of the Trinity. Each Person is worthy of admiration to an infinite degree. Not only does each member of the Trinity love Himself. But there never was a time that God the Father did not love God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit; or that God the Son did not love God the Father and God the Holy Spirit; or That God the Holy Spirit did not love God the Father and God the Son.

"For Thou didst love Me. [divine self-love] before the foundation of the world." (John 17:24b)

For God to love Himself and the other members of the Trinity there is no compromise of his essence. But how can God love sinful spiritually dead mankind who is totally unworthy without compromising his integrity? The answer to this question is found in two categories of God's love for mankind: divine impersonal love and divine personal love.

Divine Impersonal Love.

Divine impersonal love is the category directed towards all spiritually dead mankind. Impersonal love is unconditional; it does not depend on the merit of the object (us) but on the merit, and the integrity, of the subject (God). Divine impersonal love is the most powerful love that has ever existed. This love provided our so great salvation.

For God so loved [impersonal love] the world, that He gave His only begotten [uniquely born] Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish, but have Eternal Life. (John 3:16)

By this love [impersonal love] of God [the Father] was manifested in us, that God has sent His only begotten, [uniquely born] Son into the world so that we might live through him. (1 John 4:9)

But God demonstrates His own [impersonal love] towards us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us (Romans 5:8).

The cross is the greatest demonstration of God's [impersonal love] for all mankind. God the Father demonstrated His love for us in His decision to impute and judge all the sins of the human race in the impeccable human nature of Jesus Christ (John 3:16-17; Romans 5:8). Because Jesus Christ as God loved us,[impersonal love] he became true humanity in order to bear the imputation and judgments of all the sins of human history and to die as our substitute. God the Holy Spirit also demonstrated His love towards us when he made the decision to sustain the nature of Jesus Christ while He carried our sins in His own body on the cross (1 Peter 2:24)

Divine Personal Love​

Divine personal love is the category directed only toward perfect righteousness. Divine personal love is therefore conditional emphasizing the integrity of the object. To be the recipient of divine personal love, the object must possess perfect righteousness. Since Christ paid the penalty for sin on the cross the justice of God is free to impute the righteousness of God to every believer at the moment of faith in Jesus Christ (Romans 3:24-26).

He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf that we might become the righteousness of God in him. (2Cor. 5:21)

God loves His own perfect righteousness wherever it is found, therefore, from the moment of salvation. Every believer is the object of divine personal love forever.

 

[poppers]

Eternal Life.​

God is. He is the absolute self-existing one, [Yahweh], the great "I am" (Exodus 3:14). Who has neither beginning nor end (Psalms 90:2; 102:27). Self- existing life of God means His existence is eternally self-contained and does not depend on anything external to Himself. When related to the Godhead, the Hebrew word [resit], translated "beginning" (Genesis 1:1), refers to the beginning of their work of creation, not the beginning of God. John 1:1 states that both God the Father and God the Son existed eternally prior to creation. They had no beginning. Jesus Christ was "with" the Father and already "was" when time began.

In the beginning was the word [Jesus Christ, Son of God], and the word was with God [the Father], and the word was God. (John 1:1)

The New Testament asserts that "eternal life---was with the Father" (1 John 1:2) and this same "life is in His" (1 John 5:11). Jesus Christ is the" Alpha and the Omega." in Revelation 1:8. "Alpha", is the beginning letter of the Greek alphabet, refers to the eternal existence of Jesus Christ. "Omega" the final letter of the Greek alphabet, refers to Jesus Christ in hypostatic union during His incarnation or first advent. He is the eternal Son of God and the Son of David, who in hypostatic union will return as the King of Kings and the Lord of Lords at his second advent to reign forever.
God is timeless, yet He invented time for the passing of human history. We think in terms of past, present, and future; of short or long periods; of years, months, days, hours, and seconds. But God likens our lives to "vapor" (James 4:14): here today and gone tomorrow. No wonder David exclaimed. What is man that thou dost take thought of him? (Psalms. 8:4a)
Yet, an eternal, loving God cares enough to extend a gracious offer for us to share His eternal life.

"He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him." (John 3:36)

Omniscience.​

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God is all-knowing. Omniscience derives from the Latin [Omni], which means "all," and [scientia], which means “knowledge†(and is where we get our word science from). Eternal God in three persons has always known all things, including both the actual and the possible past, present, and future events. Before the creation of the world, God knew every problem, every heartache, every moment of your life, including every sin you would ever commit. Although Omniscience transcends time and eternity, His knowledge of events before they occur does not violate, or interfere with your volition. By divine design, you are a free agent who can choose to partake or to reject God's grace. You are accountable to God for all of your decisions and actions. (Romans 14:12)
All three members of the Godhead are omniscient. The Father is "perfect in knowledge" (Job 37:16; cf., Matt. 6:8; 10:29-30; Acts 1:24); the Son knows "all things" (John 18:4; cf. John 12:37-41) and the Holy Spirit is called the "spirit of wisdom and understanding---Council and---knowledge" (Isaiah 11:2).

Omnipresence.​

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God exists beyond spatial limitations. He is Immanence and transcended. Immanence means His entire essence is always present everywhere in nature, in history, in all the affairs of mankind (Jeremiah 23:23-24; Acts 17:27-28). Transcendence means He is independent of the created universe so that no particular place exclusively contains Him (Psalms 113:5-6; Isaiah 55:8-9; John 8:23).
Immanence and transcendence exist in balance, so that "the whole earth is full of his glory." (Isaiah 6:3b). His whole being is present in every point in the universe, while at the same time He is â€holy" and "lofty and exalted" infinitely beyond the universe (Isaiah 6:1, 3a). The members of the Godhead pervade the universe, while at the same time They are free to be in a specific location, including:
[FONT=&quot]1. [/FONT]Giving the Law to Moses (Deut. 4:10)
[FONT=&quot]2. [/FONT]Appearing as a theophany (e.g. The burning bush, God appearing before Abraham, the pillar of fire before the Israelites in their Exodus) (Genesis 18:1; Exodus 3:2-6; Num. 14:10; 1 Kings 8:10-11; Isaiah 6; cf. John 12:37-41)
[FONT=&quot]3. [/FONT]Living on Earth as the incarnate person of Jesus Christ (John 1:14).
[FONT=&quot]4. [/FONT]Indwelling the believer (John 14:20, 23; 2 Cor. 6:16)
Omnipresence assures that no believer will ever be alone (Hebrews 13:5b). The Father fills heaven and earth (Jer. 23:23-24); The Son who is in the Father and in the believer (John 14:20; Col. 1:27) promises, "I him with you always." (Matt. 28:20); and the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit resides in every church age believer (1 Cor. 6:19).

 

[poppers]

Omnipotence.​

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God is all-powerful, unlimited in His ability and authority. His omnipotence guarantees that "nothing will be impossible with God." (Luke 1:37). If God is limited in any sense, the restriction is self-imposed, to be consistence with His essence. God can do all He wills, but may not will to do all that He can (Ephesians 1:11).
Omnipotence is the superior divine power of the Trinity. The Father is called "Almighty" (Job 11:7) and His power is eternal (Romans 1:20). The Son’s power created the universe and holds it together, perpetuating history (Isaiah 40:26; cf. Col. 1:16-17; Heb. 1:3). Jesus Christ is also called "Almighty, mighty and omnipotent." (Genesis 17:1; Isaiah 9:6; Rev. 4:8; 19:6), and is

Declared the Son of God with Power, by the Resurrection from the Dead, According to the Spirit of Holiness, Jesus Christ Our Lord. (Romans 1:4b)

The Holy Spirit supplies. The divine power for believers to execute the plan of the Father (Zech. 4:6; Acts 1:8; Romans 15:19".
During the Incarnation, Jesus Christ limited the independent use of His deity to strictly conform to the plan of the Father (John 5:17; 6:65; 8:28; Phil. 2:6-8) and to utilize the power of the Holy Spirit (Isaiah 42:1; Matt. 4:1; Luke 4:18-19; John 3:34). His purpose was to demonstrate to church age believer's that dependence on the Father’s plan and the Holy Spirit's power is necessary to learn, think, and apply Bible doctrine to fulfill the Christian life.

Immutability.​

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God is unchangeable. He is neither capable of nor susceptible to change. He his absolute stability. God's sovereign decision, His omniscience, His integrity, in fact all His characteristics are eternally the same and equal stature (Num. 23:19; Psalms 33:11; 102:27; Mal. 3:6). His Word and His works are unalterable.
Here is a very important question frequently asked, "If God is all-powerful, could he not alter anything He desires?" No! Each attribute is consistent with His integrity. No attribute can supersede or operate independently of God's other attributes. This means God will never act capriciously or arbitrarily or in violation of what He has already decreed. Therefore, God's omnipotence cannot override his immutability.
From God's immutability comes His faithfulness (Lam. 3:22-23). The Scriptures declare repeatedly that God is faithful, He is always reliable; God will never let anyone down. He is faithful to keep His Word (Heb. 6:17-19). Not one of His promises has ever failed (1 Kings 8:56). Although we may be faithless,. He remains faithful (2 Tim. 2:13). With the Father. There is "no variation, or shifting shadow" (James 1:17). Jesus Christ is “the same yesterday and today, yes, and forever" (Heb. 13:8). The Holy Spirit is faithful to assist the believer in all things (John 14:16) and to teach him God’s Word (1Cor. 2:13).

Veracity.​

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God is absolute truth (Psalms 12:6). His veracity is evident in His words (John 8:45-46), in His works (Psalms 33:4), and in His ways (Rev. 15:3). God means what He says in all His revelation, including mandates, promises and warnings. His faithfulness upholds His Word of truth (Psalms 100:5). The veracity of the Father is affirmed by the Son; "He who sent Me is true." (John 7:28; cf. John 17:3). Of Himself. Jesus said, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through Me" (John 14:6). In 1 John 5:7, "the Spirit is the truth."

 

[poppers]

The Divine Decree​

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God has always known his plan for the ages, and he has revealed His plan in a form His created beings could comprehend. The technological term for God's plan for mankind is called the divine decree. The decree is defined as God's eternal, holy, wise and sovereign purpose comprehending simultaneously all things that ever were or will be, in their causes, courses, conditions, successions, and relations, and determining their certain futurition. (Psalms 148:6).
In eternity past---prior to the creation of the heavens, earth, and mankind---the members of the Trinity formulated their decree. The decree included the creation of a perfect man as a free moral agent, though, from His omniscience, God knew that the first man would use his volition to sin and disobey Him. The original sin of Adam brought condemnation on himself and subsequently, on the entire human race (Romans 5:12). Now spiritually dead, mankind would be incapable of having a relationship with God. Nevertheless, from eternity past God still loved undeserving mankind with impersonal love, desire to bless mankind and wanted to share with mankind His eternal life.
Therefore, God decreed that sin and the resultant spiritual death of mankind would not terminate His plan. A way of salvation would be provided by which undeserving man could be brought back into eternal relationship and temporal fellowship with God without compromising divine essence. God's grace is the key. Under his policy of grace. God alone accomplishes the work and man receives the benefit, totally apart from his own merit or ability.
The work of God accomplishes on our behalf occurs in three phases: phase one salvation; phase two is the Christian way of life; and phase three is eternity. All three members of the Trinity contribute to make salvation a reality: God the Son, the second Person of the Trinity agreed to be sent by God. the Father, the first person of the Trinity, into the world by means of the virgin birth, to become true humanity, and to pay the penalty for sin (John 3:16; 6:38). The Holy Spirit, the Third Person of the Trinity, would be to agent of the Son's conception. (Luke 1:35) and sustain Him throughout His life on Earth (Matt. 12:18, 28; Luke 4:1, 14, 18; John 3:34; Acts 10:38).
The virgin pregnancy resulted in the birth of the unique person of the universe; Jesus Christ is God and man in one person forever (Luke 2:11). Different from God, Jesus Christ is true humanity; different from humanity, Jesus Christ is undiminished deity. Because of the virgin pregnancy, the humanity of Jesus Christ was born perfect, without a sin nature (the sin nature is passed down through the father in copulation, Jesus did not have a human father, therefore, no sin nature). Throughout His earthly ministry, the Son executed the will of the Father (John 8:29; Heb. 10:9). In His humanity He was tempted far beyond anything we can imagine, yet he remained sinless he was qualified to pay the penalty of sins for all mankind.

For the wages of sin is death, [spiritual death], but the free gift of God is eternal life in Jesus Christ our Lord (Romans 6:23).

As Jesus hung on the cross and was judged by the Father for our sins, the Holy Spirit faithfully continued to sustain Him (Heb. 9:14). When Christ said "It is finishedâ€(John 19:30), our salvation was accomplished. All three members of the Trinity contributed to our salvation.
Our acceptance of this magnificent gift of the grace of God is all that remains. How do we accept God's unspeakable gift?

"Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you shall be saved" (Acts 16:31a)

 

[Mike]

Poppers, is this your own work? Because if it's not, you're going to have to include references and credits. I'm frustrated by repeated anti-Trinitarian threads, but we all must stay within the guidelines of the ToS. :nod

 

[John 8:32]

Nonsense.

Not often we agree but on this one we are of like mind!

 

[123123]

This website will not allow any the trinity doctrine to be questioned with scripture. Sad as that may be, here are some quotes from sources you may respect.

A PROTESTANT publication states: "The word Trinity is not found in the Bible . . . It did not find a place formally in the theology of the church till the 4th century." (The Illustrated Bible Dictionary) And a Catholic authority says that the Trinity "is not . . . directly and immediately [the] word of God."—New Catholic Encyclopedia.

The Catholic Encyclopedia also comments: "In Scripture there is as yet no single term by which the Three Divine Persons are denoted together. The word [tri'as] (of which the Latin trinitas is a translation) is first found in Theophilus of Antioch about A. D. 180. . . . Shortly afterwards it appears in its Latin form of trinitas in Tertullian."

However, this is no proof in itself that Tertullian taught the Trinity. The Catholic work Trinitas—A Theological Encyclopedia of the Holy Trinity, for example, notes that some of Tertullian's words were later used by others to describe the Trinity. Then it cautions: "But hasty conclusions cannot be drawn from usage, for he does not apply the words to Trinitarian theology."

The Encyclopedia of Religion admits: "Theologians today are in agreement that the Hebrew Bible does not contain a doctrine of the Trinity." And the New Catholic Encyclopedia also says: "The doctrine of the Holy Trinity is not taught in the O[ld] T[estament]."

Similarly, in his book The Triune God, Jesuit Edmund Fortman admits: "The Old Testament . . . tells us nothing explicitly or by necessary implication of a Triune God who is Father, Son and Holy Spirit. . . . There is no evidence that any sacred writer even suspected the existence of a [Trinity] within the Godhead. . . . Even to see in [the "Old Testament"] suggestions or foreshadowings or 'veiled signs' of the trinity of persons, is to go beyond the words and intent of the sacred writers."—Italics ours.

The Encyclopedia of Religion says: "Theologians agree that the New Testament also does not contain an explicit doctrine of the Trinity."

Jesuit Fortman states: "The New Testament writers . . . give us no formal or formulated doctrine of the Trinity, no explicit teaching that in one God there are three co-equal divine persons. . . . Nowhere do we find any trinitarian doctrine of three distinct subjects of divine life and activity in the same Godhead."

The New Encyclopædia Britannica observes: "Neither the word Trinity nor the explicit doctrine appears in the New Testament."

Bernhard Lohse says in A Short History of Christian Doctrine: "As far as the New Testament is concerned, one does not find in it an actual doctrine of the Trinity."

The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology similarly states: "The N[ew] T[estament] does not contain the developed doctrine of the Trinity. 'The Bible lacks the express declaration that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are of equal essence' [said Protestant theologian Karl Barth]."

Yale University professor E. Washburn Hopkins affirmed: "To Jesus and Paul the doctrine of the trinity was apparently unknown; . . . they say nothing about it."—Origin and Evolution of Religion.

Historian Arthur Weigall notes: "Jesus Christ never mentioned such a phenomenon, and nowhere in the New Testament does the word 'Trinity' appear. The idea was only adopted by the Church three hundred years after the death of our Lord."—The Paganism in Our Christianity.

Thus, neither the 39 books of the Hebrew Scriptures nor the canon of 27 inspired books of the Christian Greek Scriptures provide any clear teaching of the Trinity.

 

[Free]

This website will not allow any the trinity doctrine to be questioned with scripture. Sad as that may be, here are some quotes from sources you may respect.

A PROTESTANT publication states: "The word Trinity is not found in the Bible . . . It did not find a place formally in the theology of the church till the 4th century." (The Illustrated Bible Dictionary) And a Catholic authority says that the Trinity "is not . . . directly and immediately [the] word of God."—New Catholic Encyclopedia.

The Catholic Encyclopedia also comments: "In Scripture there is as yet no single term by which the Three Divine Persons are denoted together. The word [tri'as] (of which the Latin trinitas is a translation) is first found in Theophilus of Antioch about A. D. 180. . . . Shortly afterwards it appears in its Latin form of trinitas in Tertullian."

However, this is no proof in itself that Tertullian taught the Trinity. The Catholic work Trinitas—A Theological Encyclopedia of the Holy Trinity, for example, notes that some of Tertullian's words were later used by others to describe the Trinity. Then it cautions: "But hasty conclusions cannot be drawn from usage, for he does not apply the words to Trinitarian theology."

The Encyclopedia of Religion admits: "Theologians today are in agreement that the Hebrew Bible does not contain a doctrine of the Trinity." And the New Catholic Encyclopedia also says: "The doctrine of the Holy Trinity is not taught in the O[ld] T[estament]."

Similarly, in his book The Triune God, Jesuit Edmund Fortman admits: "The Old Testament . . . tells us nothing explicitly or by necessary implication of a Triune God who is Father, Son and Holy Spirit. . . . There is no evidence that any sacred writer even suspected the existence of a [Trinity] within the Godhead. . . . Even to see in [the "Old Testament"] suggestions or foreshadowings or 'veiled signs' of the trinity of persons, is to go beyond the words and intent of the sacred writers."—Italics ours.

The Encyclopedia of Religion says: "Theologians agree that the New Testament also does not contain an explicit doctrine of the Trinity."

Jesuit Fortman states: "The New Testament writers . . . give us no formal or formulated doctrine of the Trinity, no explicit teaching that in one God there are three co-equal divine persons. . . . Nowhere do we find any trinitarian doctrine of three distinct subjects of divine life and activity in the same Godhead."

The New Encyclopædia Britannica observes: "Neither the word Trinity nor the explicit doctrine appears in the New Testament."

Bernhard Lohse says in A Short History of Christian Doctrine: "As far as the New Testament is concerned, one does not find in it an actual doctrine of the Trinity."

The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology similarly states: "The N[ew] T[estament] does not contain the developed doctrine of the Trinity. 'The Bible lacks the express declaration that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are of equal essence' [said Protestant theologian Karl Barth]."

Yale University professor E. Washburn Hopkins affirmed: "To Jesus and Paul the doctrine of the trinity was apparently unknown; . . . they say nothing about it."—Origin and Evolution of Religion.

Historian Arthur Weigall notes: "Jesus Christ never mentioned such a phenomenon, and nowhere in the New Testament does the word 'Trinity' appear. The idea was only adopted by the Church three hundred years after the death of our Lord."—The Paganism in Our Christianity.

Thus, neither the 39 books of the Hebrew Scriptures nor the canon of 27 inspired books of the Christian Greek Scriptures provide any clear teaching of the Trinity.

Aside from some of the errors of the quotes, such as the irrelevance of the word 'Trinity' not appearing in Scripture, overall they don't prove anything. I could find just as many quotes from other sources that would say the teaching is clearly there in the NT.