Tribulation is the persecution of Christians

[JLB]

 

[RandyK]

As I've said many times, the "Great Tribulation" is a Jewish Punishment. Jesus said so in his Olivet Discourse, most clearly put in Luke's version, ch. 21.

This Tribulation of the Jewish People, called the Jewish Diaspora, hurt both unbelievers and believers. It hurt unbelievers because they deserved it and were being punished for their attitude towards Jesus and his disciples.

But it also hurt believers because being Jewish and being Israeli they lost their country to the Romans also. Though they were not the targets of God's punishment, God did allow them to suffer the loss of their homeland along with their wicked countrymen. And in exposing and allowing the sins of their wicked brethren, God allowed them to suffer the sins of Jewish unbelievers, as well as the sins of Gentile pagans.

And so it is, that believers do suffer Tribulation in this world, and not necessarily because they are being chastised or punished. It is simply God's will to allow us to suffer some of the afflictions of this world while holding out a message of grace to those whose sins have brought this tribulation upon us.

 

[JLB]

As I've said many times, the "Great Tribulation" is a Jewish Punishment. Jesus said so in his Olivet Discourse, most clearly put in Luke's version, ch. 21.

The great tribulation is the persecution of the Church.

Jesus was teaching the leadership of His Church.

Please read these words and you will understand how clearly and plainly it was said to His disciples; those who follow Him.


“Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake. Matthew 24:9

• and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake.

It doesn’t come any plainer and clearer than that.


The great tribulation is the persecution of Christians.

American Christians
Jewish Christians
Nigerian Christians
European Christians
Chinese Christians
Mexican Christians
Syrian Christians


Please wake up.

 

[RandyK]

The great tribulation is the persecution of the Church.

Jesus was teaching the leadership of His Church.

Please read these words and you will understand how clearly and plainly it was said to His disciples; those who follow Him.


“Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake. Matthew 24:9

• and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake.

It doesn’t come any plainer and clearer than that.


The great tribulation is the persecution of Christians.

American Christians
Jewish Christians
Nigerian Christians
European Christians
Chinese Christians
Mexican Christians
Syrian Christians


Please wake up.

I'm well awake (sigh).

If you look back over my comments you will see that I did *not* deny that Tribulation includes the persecution of Christians. My point is that it is not *just the persecution of Christians.* It also may include the trouble suffered by people under punishment from God.

Now, if you're saying that Tribulation is *strictly* the persecution of Christians, I will take issue with that. I've pointed to the "Great Tribulation," mentioned by Jesus in his Olivet Discourse, in which he described as "great tribulation" or "great distress" a Jewish Punishment that would come in his generation and last until his 2nd Coming.

Please be alert to this point, and I need not repeat it.

 

[JLB]

I'm well awake (sigh).

If you look back over my comments you will see that I did *not* deny that Tribulation includes the persecution of Christians. My point is that it is not *just the persecution of Christians.* It also may include the trouble suffered by people under punishment from God.

Now, if you're saying that Tribulation is *strictly* the persecution of Christians, I will take issue with that. I've pointed to the "Great Tribulation," mentioned by Jesus in his Olivet Discourse, in which he described as "great tribulation" or "great distress" a Jewish Punishment that would come in his generation and last until his 2nd Coming.

Please be alert to this point, and I need not repeat it.

The Jews will be the ones doing the persecution against Christians in Jerusalem during the great tribulation.

The Jews are the ones wanting the temple built for “their” messiah.

 

[RandyK]

The Jews will be the ones doing the persecution against Christians in Jerusalem during the great tribulation.

The Jews are the ones wanting the temple built for “their” messiah.

Are we talking about "Tribulation," generically, or specifically, the "Great Tribulation" Jesus mentioned in the Olivet Discourse? Christians, of course, do go through Tribulation in this present age. "In the world you will have Tribulation," Jesus said. John 16.33.

But with respect to Jesus citing the "Great Tribulation" or the "Great Distress" to come upon his generation, he was speaking to the Israeli nation and specifically to his Disciples. Jesus was warning them that they would suffer trouble inasmuch as the entire nation would be thrown into "Tribulation" via the Roman Army that is coming to punish Israel. Though Christians were not the targets of God's retribution He would allow them to suffer the loss of their homeland along with their ungodly countrymen.

Jeremiah went through turmoil with his countrymen, as well, when the Babylonian Army came to Jerusalem to desolate it. God does allow believers to suffer the negative effects that happen when God judges this wicked world.

But the "Great Tribulation" Jesus defined as a Jewish Punishment, even if the suffering was shared by Christian Jews who did not deserve it. Read was Jesus said about who suffers this Tribulation primarily, and what it consists of....

Luke 21.20 “When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near. 21 Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those in the city get out, and let those in the country not enter the city. 22 For this is the time of punishment in fulfillment of all that has been written. 23 How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! There will be great distress in the land and wrath against this people. 24 They will fall by the sword and will be taken as prisoners to all the nations. Jerusalem will be trampled on by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled........
32 “Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened."

There it is. Jesus defined the "Great Tribulation" as a "time of punishment" for Israel and for Jerusalem, to take place in his generation. The 70 AD fall of Jerusalem was but the beginning of "Gentile times" corresponding to a long age of Jewish Tribulation and exile.

Obviously, this punishment from God upon Israel resulted from Israel's rejection of their Messiah, as well as from the wickedness they displayed in their nation and against Christians. And as they did this Jewish believers would be victimized by these atrocities in Israel and elsewhere.

As such, this Tribulation is, as I call it, the Jewish Diaspora of the NT age, which is the worst punishment Israel has ever experienced, or ever will experience. The fall of Jerusalem to the Romans was but the beginning of centuries of Jewish suffering, as they wandered into various countries and were rejected for various reasons.

This period of Jewish Diaspora also included Russian pogroms and the Nazi Holocaust, as well as the Intifadas of the Muslim Middle East in our time. The attack of Antichrist or at Armageddon will be the last bout of Tribulation that Israel experiences, I believe.

 

[JLB]

Are we talking about "Tribulation," generically, or specifically, the "Great Tribulation" Jesus mentioned in the Olivet Discourse? Christians, of course, do go through Tribulation in this present age. "In the world you will have Tribulation," Jesus said. John 16.33.

The great tribulation.


The great tribulation is persecution against Christians.

 

[RandyK]

The great tribulation.


The great tribulation is persecution against Christians.

Tribulation is indeed inclusive of persecution of Christians. In the Olivet Discourse, the persecution of Christians entails persecution against *Jewish* Christians. By extension this applies to non-Jewish Christians as well.

 

[JLB]

Tribulation is indeed inclusive of persecution of Christians. In the Olivet Discourse, the persecution of Christians entails persecution against *Jewish* Christians. By extension this applies to non-Jewish Christians as well.

Amen.

Christians will be persecuted during the great tribulation.