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What do you say Luke 14:31-33 means? I was told I was way off.

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In Luke 14:31-33 Jesus uses somewhat of a parable about a weaker king coming against a greater king:


31Or what king on his way to war with another king will not first sit down and consider whether he can engage with ten thousand men the one coming against him with twenty thousand? 32And if he is unable, he will send a delegation while the other king is still far off, to ask for terms of peace.

33In the same way, any one of you who does not give up everything he has cannot be My disciple.


Who is the king with 10,000 men?
Who is the king with 20,000 men?
Who is the delegation?
What are the terms for peace?
What significance is there in these terms of peace being established while the stronger king is still far off?
 
In Luke 14:31-33 Jesus uses somewhat of a parable about a weaker king coming against a greater king:


31Or what king on his way to war with another king will not first sit down and consider whether he can engage with ten thousand men the one coming against him with twenty thousand? 32And if he is unable, he will send a delegation while the other king is still far off, to ask for terms of peace.

33In the same way, any one of you who does not give up everything he has cannot be My disciple.


Who is the king with 10,000 men?
Who is the king with 20,000 men?
Who is the delegation?
What are the terms for peace?
What significance is there in these terms of peace being established while the stronger king is still far off?
Jesus wants us established in the fact we need His power and our power alone is never going to be enough if we are going to war against the "principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places." In the war against evil there can be no terms of peace . It is a battle to the death us with Jesus on our side . It is brutal, I have had a small taste .
Who is the king with 10,000 men?
Us trying to battle evil on our own terms under our own power .
Who is the king with 20,000 men?
Evil .
Who is the delegation?
Our doubt and fears .
What are the terms for peace?
Our surrender to evil .
What significance is there in these terms of peace being established while the stronger king is still far off?
We may think we have a lot of time left in this world but time is rapidly coming to an end .
 
Jesus uses somewhat of a parable
It is a story teaching about counting the cost of being a disciple.
verse 28-30 about building a tower and having the money to complete it.


We rarely face discrimination because we are Christian.
How would you cope if your boss required you to promote anti Christian ideas at work?
Have you counted the cost of being visible a Christian at work.
 
I always thought it was about real life Christianity…

Resources are usually finite. Success is not guaranteed. Things can get difficult. How will one proceed?
 
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Post # 2 hawkman

So the weapons of our warfare play into if our force will win.

The divine nature of 2 Peter chapter 1

eddif
 
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I always thought it was about real life Christianity…

Resources are usually finite. Success is not guaranteed. Things can get difficult. How will one proceed?
You are right. It is complicated.
At least two driving forces.
The one new man is made of Jew and gentile.

These two are United in Christ Jesus. One is by faith the other is through faith.

As people we tend to pick our side, but in reality it is both seeking to be of one mind.

That sounds like a politically manufactured statement. Passion about who we are can continue, but concern about the other person should also continue.

In 2 Peter chapter 1
The next to the last step before Godly love is brotherly love. You know that mixed up person next to us. We seldom see ourselves as the mixed up person.

The steps in 2 Peter chapter 1 are what we proceed through. Addition formula (?).

Now I feel just about like an Old Testament prophet, (just what am I speaking about).

Pentecost came to help the Jews.
Gentile inclusion came to help the gentiles.
Both are basically very similar, but with a slight difference.

Mississippi redneck
eddif
 
Jesus wants us established in the fact we need His power and our power alone is never going to be enough if we are going to war against the "principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places." In the war against evil there can be no terms of peace . It is a battle to the death us with Jesus on our side . It is brutal, I have had a small taste .

Us trying to battle evil on our own terms under our own power .

Evil .

Our doubt and fears .

Our surrender to evil .

We may think we have a lot of time left in this world but time is rapidly coming to an end .
Do you agree that the theme here is total surrender?
 
It is a story teaching about counting the cost of being a disciple.
verse 28-30 about building a tower and having the money to complete it.
Yes, it's about counting the cost of becoming a disciple of Christ. That Jesus makes crystal clear. What does that mean in regard to total surrender, assuming that's the theme here?
 
I think of it more as being realistic to some extent. Opportunities may be lost…even friends and family…

Will one still follow?
 
I think of it more as being realistic to some extent. Opportunities may be lost…even friends and family…

Will one still follow?
I see the reality being one must face the fact that they can't beat the greater king. And so the only option is to ask for terms of peace with that king because you can't beat him.

Of course, because you are weaker, there is no room for negotiation and so the terms are total and unconditional surrender (you must give up everything-vs.33). And this must be done before the battle starts.

So who is the greater king who we should unconditionally surrender all to because we have considered the costs and know we can't prevail against him and must become their servant?
 
Jesus has overcome the world. We haven’t. Our ultimate victory in Christ is guaranteed but life is full of trouble here on earth. Taking that into account…

Will we follow Him?
 
Do you agree that the theme here is total surrender?
Jesus wants us established in the fact we need His power and our power alone is never going to be enough if we are going to war against the "principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places." In the war against evil there can be no terms of peace . It is a battle to the death us with Jesus on our side . It is brutal, I have had a small taste .
What should have added to the above is Jesus needs us to be wholly committed and nothing less . Total surrender to His will in our lives .
What are the terms for peace?
I think the surrender can be a complete and total to the point of no longer following Christ . But also it could be to the point you are a Christian but denying the power of Christ in your life . Standing on the sideline watching .
 
Here is the whole thing:
The Cost of Discipleship

25Now great crowds accompanied him, and he turned and said to them, 26“If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple. 27Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple. 28For which of you, desiring to build a tower, does not first sit down and count the cost, whether he has enough to complete it? 29Otherwise, when he has laid a foundation and is not able to finish, all who see it begin to mock him, 30saying, ‘This man began to build and was not able to finish.’ 31Or what king, going out to encounter another king in war, will not sit down first and deliberate whether he is able with ten thousand to meet him who comes against him with twenty thousand? 32And if not, while the other is yet a great way off, he sends a delegation and asks for terms of peace. 33So therefore, any one of you who does not renounce all that he has cannot be my disciple.

Who Me is right. It is not about spiritual warfare or are the parties representing various ones. It is solely about, you will not like it, the COST of following Jesus and decided whether you are willing to pay that price. And, you really won't like this, there is no Holy Spirit in there making, helping or ensuring that you will make it. And, what is really worse, is the one considering following Jesus needs to realize that there is NO SEPARATION between discipleship and salvation. Yes, in this parable, Jesus is telling those who would want his FREE GIFT of salvation (tongue in cheek) they must consider whether they are going to PAY THE PRICE WHICH WILL ENTAIL WORK) to belong to Him.

All those who love their free salvation and hate the idea of being obligated to do anything need to take a black marker and cross this one out. Not only is Jesus not saying salvation is free, he is saying it will cost a man.
 
The Cost of Discipleship
...is not the cost of being made righteous in Christ!

The cost of discipleship is the price one pays for obeying Christ rather than the flesh. That cost in no way MAKES a person righteous. A person is MADE righteous FOR FREE as a gift of God's grace in the forgiveness of their sin received by faith. That's what makes it a free gift. You don't work for it. You receive it as a free gift.
 
I see it as the cost of being a true disciple of Christ as we put Him first and above everything else in our life running the good race and not being weary wanting to give up when times get hard for us as they will.

Key verses:
Luke 14:26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.
Luke 14:27 And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple.

Hate not only means that you put Christ first above you and your family. It doesn't mean you are to hate your family.
 
...is not the cost of being made righteous in Christ!

The cost of discipleship is the price one pays for obeying Christ rather than the flesh. That cost in no way MAKES a person righteous. A person is MADE righteous FOR FREE as a gift of God's grace in the forgiveness of their sin received by faith. That's what makes it a free gift. You don't work for it. You receive it as a free gift.
That dead horse again! You know, you cling to that like a legal argument.
 
The cost of the deal with the greater king that we must consider to be at peace with him is total and unconditional surrender of all.
The parable is about you counting the cost to you to follow Him and will you do so? He is the pearl of great value that a man must sell all he has to BUY.

I know you probably hate those verses but they are nevertheless there. If you spent as much energy on obeying them as you do on insisting you needs do nothing, life would be better. Why not surrender instead of fighting it clinging desperately to all is free of cost? You could still look into the mirror each morning and tell that man he IS righteous already if that makes you feel better although I personally think focusing on how righteous you are is too narcissistic for God to find attractive.
 
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