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When is The Rapture, And How Does The Tribulation REALLY Work?

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When is The Rapture, And How Does The Tribulation REALLY Work?


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I am post-trib myself. I too was raised in a pre-trib and OSAS step-family. They followed all the popular teachings such as prosperity doctrine. While I do indeed believe these are false teachings and that my step family falls into the category of "fake Christians", I cannot accept that any and all who believe these things are fakes. One's views on exactly when the rapture occurs is not crucial to their salvation. Calling EVERYONE who believes in pre-trib "fake" is just wrong.
 
I agree with Dan that it is a false doctrine but not a loss of salvation. It could be a stumbling block thoigh. When they have to go through the tribulation they could lose faith.
Wouldn't it be fabulous if we had a Peter and Paul, two men of great faith, going round all the churches and also writing to them, to show us all what is wrong with the doctrines they teach. Any volunteers?
 
When is The Rapture

The Rapture occurs at His Coming, just after the Resurrection of the dead in Christ.


For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.
1 Thessalonians 4:15-17



  • that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep.




JLB
 
The word Rapture is not found in scripture as scripture calls it being caught up at the last trump, meaning the seventh trumpet of God, 1 Corinthians 15:51-58; 1Thessalonians 4:13-18, is explained in these verses if you read them for what they say. Rev 14:6-20 is the precursor for the catching up of the saints that makes up the true body of Christ. This is separating the wheat from the tares or in other words saints from sinners as sinners being those who have taken the mark of the beast in Rev 13. Christ is sending the angels to separate the wheat from the tares to protect His own in safety from the seven vial judgments that will take place, Rev 15:1-8; 16:1-21.

After mystery Babylon is revealed and then destroyed, Rev Chapters 17, 18, heaven rejoices her destruction as the beast and false prophet are cast into the lake of fire. It is not until we read in Rev 19 of Christ second coming as we, His Bride, have prepared ourselves, those in the grave and we that are still alive, to be caught up together to the clouds and given our new glorified bodies as we are arrayed in fine linen, clean and white then meet Christ in the air, 1Thessalonians 4:13-18. We are then joined to our Groom (Jesus) for the marriage supper (union) of the Lamb and His Bride. Fine linen means we are now arrayed in Gods righteousness.

Rev Chapters 19, 20 we the saints of God then come down to earth with Him as Jesus plants His feet on the Mount of Olives, Zechariah 14:4, to fight the final battle as He smites the nations and now rules over them. Jesus then binds Satan for a time (I don’t believe in a literal 1000 years, but only being symbolic in numbering) as then he will be loosed for awhile to try and attack the saints of God that are encamped in Gods protection. Jesus will then cast Satan into the lake of fire with the beast and the false prophet that has caused a great falling away, 2 Thessalonians 2:3. Then comes Gods final judgment on those who have rejected Christ and they are then cast into the lake of fire for their names were not found written in the Lambs Book of Life, Rev Chapter 20. Heaven and earth are restored and the New Jerusalem is ushered down and we are with the Lord for eternity.


Reference:
Genesis Chapter 49; Deuteronomy 31:28-30; Jeremiah 30:18-24; Daniel 12:1-4; Matthew 24:21-31; 25:31-33; John 6:37-40; Revelation 14:11-16

Reference to symbolic numbering of 1000) - Deuteronomy 7:9; 1Chronicles 16:15; Psalms 50:10; 90:4; 105:8 Ecc 6:6; 7:28; Daniel 5:1; 2Peter 3:8.​

The word Rapture is found nowhere in any scripture or in any concordances or Bible dictionaries. Some people have taken the transliterate word of the Greek, Harpazo, to mean Rapture, but the definition of this word is:


1. To seize, carry off by force, obtain by robbery


2. To seize on, claim for one's self eagerly


3. To snatch out or away

The Latin word rapio is where the word Rapture came from as it means to be seized or snatched up. No where in scripture does it say we will be seized or snatched up as we are obtained by robbery. We will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air after receiving our new glorified bodies that will be like Jesus and will evermore be with Him on the last day, John 6:40. It's no secret quiet rapture as many teach as the voice and the sound of a trumpet during the last day will be very loud and every eye will see Jesus return so it doesn't sound like we are seized or snatched up from the earth as God sends His angels out to gather the saints of God from the four corners of the earth, Rev 1:7; 1Thessalonians 4:13-18; Matthew 24:29-31.

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Mat 24:36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
Mat 24:37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
Mat 24:38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
Mat 24:39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

John 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
John 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
 
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Praise GOD we don't know when the Caught up will happen. I do find if one is PRE then duh post is in error not of God and a false doctrine. If your post then duh pre trib is not of God is in error and a false doctrine. Praise GOD I am in no way like others. I can't find the PRE trib verse.. nor post trib verse so.. your post? Praise GOD! Your PRE? Praise God? Nice to talk about it share notes.. I can be wrong. :) yeah.. its about JESUS coming.. pre post.. HES COMING!

Toss all that out.. DO YOU KNOW HIM! Thats what matters not my personal belief as if haha thats Gods truth.
 
I may be out in left field (it won’t be the 1st time)
I have a simple question, (and I hope no one will think it a stupid one)
Why do most people claim only one of the following
1. pretrib, 2. midtrib 3 postrib 4. no trib 5. we’re now in the trib etc.
I am not unfamiliar with the many views of the rapture, especially its timing.

Why not embrace a timing such as 8 months after the desecration of the temple? Or some other time?
This pandemic has made me think a lot (ha, that’s a common admission nowadays)

Suppose, for example, that “pandemics of all sorts” break out, as bad or worse than we’ve been through. Would anyone want to (or could they?) endure that much tribulation?

It is my understanding that the 3.5 years after the antichrist is revealed is the “great tribulation” (the one that Christ said no one could survive if the days were not cut short).

So, again, why does it always have to be pre- mid- post, and not anything else?
 
So, again, why does it always have to be pre- mid- post, and not anything else?

Let’s start with scripture to build our understanding.

The words of Christ, should be our foundation.


For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15


  • that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep.


Here we have both the resurrection and rapture mentioned.

The resurrection comes first, then the rapture, however they both occur at His coming.



Can we agree on this ?





JLB
 
It seems to me that 2nd Thess, 2 from verses 2 -12 say that: 3…..for that day (day of the Lord) will not come until the rebellion (apostasy) occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed….

and then: ..... 7 …...but the one who now holds it back (lawlessness) will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way…..

and so the lawlessness created by the "man of sin" will be held back by the Holy Spirit existing in the churches by believers, but will be taken away, and that happens at the rapture when the believers disappear (after they realize that he is the "man of lawlessness). So sin will abound (the great tribulation of 3.5 years) after the rapture, and get so bad that it has to be cut short.
 
It seems to me that 2nd Thess, 2 from verses 2 -12 say that: 3…..for that day (day of the Lord) will not come until the rebellion (apostasy) occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed….

and then: ..... 7 …...but the one who now holds it back (lawlessness) will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way…..

and so the lawlessness created by the "man of sin" will be held back by the Holy Spirit existing in the churches by believers, but will be taken away, and that happens at the rapture when the believers disappear (after they realize that he is the "man of lawlessness). So sin will abound (the great tribulation of 3.5 years) after the rapture, and get so bad that it has to be cut short.

I responded to you.


Could we please start with the first letter Paul wrote to the Thessalonians, where he first explained the rapture and resurrection as well as the destruction of the wicked which occurs at His coming?

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15


Three things take place at His coming.


Two are mentioned in this verse.

The third is mentioned in 2 Thessalonians 2


JLB
 
I appreciate your response, (I've had guests at my house for a day or so, and couldn't respond immediately). Also, I had to leave (of my own accord) another Christian forum because of the severe chastisements I received, so I'd rather not enter into anymore "spirits of argumentation" that seems to result when "end times events" are discussed.

Let me say that I'm not a Bible scholar, so most Christians know more than I do. (I am 82). However there are still some things that seem a little mysterious to me. One of them is that in 1st Thess 4:17 (in spite of your incessant replies that involve "Christ's coming") it says that ..."caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air ..."

Another is the verses in Rev 6:15 which says " ...kings of the earth, the princes, the generals, the rich, the mighty, and everyone else, both slave and free, hid in caves and among the rocks of the mountains...." so that seems to say to me that the believers are not on earth. So the rest of Rev. happens without Christians (except those who convert inspite of the bad things happenings during the tribulation)

I am still studying, so its possible I will become a post-tribber. (but not yet)
 
When is the Rapture? Rosh Hashana (Feast of Trumpets).

How will the Tribulation workout..

Don't know exactly, we'll have a seat in Heaven watching tho
 
I appreciate your response, (I've had guests at my house for a day or so, and couldn't respond immediately). Also, I had to leave (of my own accord) another Christian forum because of the severe chastisements I received, so I'd rather not enter into anymore "spirits of argumentation" that seems to result when "end times events" are discussed.

Let me say that I'm not a Bible scholar, so most Christians know more than I do. (I am 82). However there are still some things that seem a little mysterious to me. One of them is that in 1st Thess 4:17 (in spite of your incessant replies that involve "Christ's coming") it says that ..."caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air ..."

Another is the verses in Rev 6:15 which says " ...kings of the earth, the princes, the generals, the rich, the mighty, and everyone else, both slave and free, hid in caves and among the rocks of the mountains...." so that seems to say to me that the believers are not on earth. So the rest of Rev. happens without Christians (except those who convert inspite of the bad things happenings during the tribulation)

I am still studying, so its possible I will become a post-tribber. (but not yet)
I was raised a pre-tribber. After reading a red-letter edition of the Bible, it really shed light on what Christ Himself had to say about it all. There was no way to remain in a pre-trib sleep after that. I gave up the 2 inch thick books trying to justify pre-trib and gave up what I wanted so much to believe. I accepted what Jesus said and accepted post-trib. It took a little while, but eventually Truth won out over emotion.
 
I been reading the Bible since I was 16 and I'm now 47. Its only strengthen my position in a pre-tribulation catching away. Many confuse Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke 21. Its been a common debate for years among Christians. One MUST study the Feasts and how they are applied to God's timeline. The Feasts of Tabernacles does not come before the Feast of Trumpets. It can't happen.

That would be as if the Feast of Unleavened Bread was before the Feasts of Passover, It can't happen, same as the Feasts of Pentecost can't happened until the Feasts of First Fruits was fulfilled first. There is an order to things, and its the study of these Feasts that sheds a lot of light on the subject matter.

I think we would all agree that we serve a God of Order and perfection. If you agree, then ask yourself. If Christ fulfilled all four of the Spring Feast precisely in order, why would Christ not fulfill the last three Fall Feats precisely in order?
 
Here are two books I would recommend, it will help you get a clear picture of what's going on in God's timeline and how important these Feasts truly are, especially on the subject matter at hand.409017_1_ftc.jpg9780768428278_1024x1024.jpg
 
We who make up the Church, the Bride, have a wedding day to expect. Correct? When and where does that take place? I believe this will help explain the timing of the Rapture.

Quantrill
 
We who make up the Church, the Bride, have a wedding day to expect. Correct? When and where does that take place? I believe this will help explain the timing of the Rapture.

Quantrill
The catching away will happen during the Fall (Autumn). Study the Feasts of the Lord to understand why I'm saying this. We shouldn't be ignorant about the times and seasons.
 
The catching away will happen during the Fall (Autumn). Study the Feasts of the Lord to understand why I'm saying this. We shouldn't be ignorant about the times and seasons.

I am not saying I disagree with you at this point. I am only saying the timing of our wedding day, when and where, would lend a lot to understand the timing of the Rapture. Not that we can identify the day or hour. But that we can place it in correct order with other end time events.

Quantrill
 
The wedding happens after The Feast of Trumpets. We know this because, it's the next Feast which is next to be fulfilled on God's prophetic calendar. The Wedding happens in Heaven after the Bride is gathered to Christ.
 
I responded to you.


Could we please start with the first letter Paul wrote to the Thessalonians, where he first explained the rapture and resurrection as well as the destruction of the wicked which occurs at His coming?

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15


Three things take place at His coming.


Two are mentioned in this verse.

The third is mentioned in 2 Thessalonians 2


JLB
The simplicity and straightforwardness of that verse escapes many as they try to cloud the Word of God with the words of man. Jesus clearly said this all happens on the Last Day.
 
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