Why the seventh day is so important

[Heidi]

Do those who believe the seventh day is just a day of the week seriously think that it means relaxing on Sundays? Do you think that God would honor sloth enough to single out a day of the week for that very purpose? :o Sorry, but the seventh day is much more important than that and since sloth is a sin, then the word "rest" cannot mean relaxing.

The word "rest" in the bible almost always refers to Christ, especially when given to us as a commandment. God already knows that it is second nature to most of us to relax so of course, he wouldn't have needed to command us to do that.

But before Christ died, the Jews had no clue what God meant by rest (and still don't), so using human wisdom, just figured it meant relaxing. But it cannot mean relaxing because we all know how to relax on other days of the week.

The reason that the seventh day is important enough to include in the Ten Commandments is because it refers to Christ to whom we come for rest from our own work. We no longer have to work to get to heaven but rest in our Lord. Our work is thus finished forever, just like God's work of creation was finished forever. That's what God rested from on the seventh day and is what he wants us to rest from on the seventh day. Not resting from Godly or ungodly work and then returning to work on Mondays!

So those of you who still use human wisdom to understand the Sabbath will not see the importance of it and will not come to Christ for rest, but instead see it as resting from working at the hardware store, then returning to work on Mondays. And I can tell you, one thing, the latter is not at all what the seventh day rest means!

 

[farley]

I hate to have to be the one to point another one of your scriptural interpretational errors out to you, Heidi, but the seventh day of the week is Saturday, not Sunday.

The Sabbath means Saturday!

Sunday is the FIRST day of the week, always has been!

I've yet to see you acknowledge any merit to any position which conflicts with yours. I can't wait to see how you defend your position on this issue.

In Christ,

farley

 

[Heidi]

I hate to have to be the one to point another one of your scriptural interpretational errors out to you, Heidi, but the seventh day of the week is Saturday, not Sunday.

The Sabbath means Saturday!

Sunday is the FIRST day of the week, always has been!

I've yet to see you acknowledge any merit to any position which conflicts with yours. I can't wait to see how you defend your position on this issue.

In Christ,

farley

You have proven my point, perfectly, farley. You still see the Sabbath as a day of relaxing rather than as coming to Christ for rest. But I pity those who think it's Sunday, because then what? :o

 

[farley]

Heidi,

At least you're consistent!

In Christ,

farley

 

[Vic C.]

You can't "pin" a name of a day like Saturday or Sunday on the Sabbath. The days of the week started and ended at sunset for the Hebrews and the Jews. We who use the Gregorian calendar today start our days at 12 AM (midnight). Those who honor Saturday as the Sabbath, are just as much in err as those who see it as being Sunday.

BTW, sabbath means to rest, cease, desist. Originally they weren't even supposed to leave their homestead (property). They would stay home; eat, sleep, spend QUALITY time with family, engage in family-like activities, pray and/or study Scripture, eat (lol) and generally reflect upon the blessings that have been bestowed upon them.

 

[farley]

Vic,

You said...

You can't "pin" a name of a day like Saturday or Sunday on the Sabbath.

This seems to be a fairly LOOSE interpretation to me. Allowing this kind of latitude with every commandment would generate a lot of chaos.

Sunset or midnight aside, it is being done every week. And, has been done weekly for thousands of years.

In Christ,

farley

 

[Vic C.]

Vic,

You said...

You can't "pin" a name of a day like Saturday or Sunday on the Sabbath.

This seems to be a fairly LOOSE interpretation to me. Allowing this kind of latitude with every commandment would generate a lot of chaos.

Sunset or midnight aside, it is being done every week. And, has been done weekly for thousands of years.

In Christ,

farley

There is no "loose" translation here. The Fourth Commandment is the only Commantment involving a specific day. All the other Commantments apply to EVERY day of the week, month and year.

May I suggest you refer to a Jew or a Sabbatarian on this and not take my word for it? They know full well the Sabbath starts at sunset of the seventh day. They do everything they can to adhere to it. Here and in most parts of the world, they close their places of business early (here , it is aprox. 3PM) This gives them time to get home and finish preperation before sunset.

The Jewish calendar goes like this:

Nissan, Iyar, Sivan, Tammuz, Av, Elul, Tishri, Cheshvan, Kislev, Tevet, Shevat, Adar. In the case of a leap year, there is a Adar I and Adar II.

They number the days of the month instead of giving them names, as we do.

Todat is 18 Tishri.

 

[cj]

There is no "loose" translation here. The Fourth Commandment is the only Commantment involving a specific day. All the other Commantments apply to EVERY day of the week, month and year.

May I suggest you refer to a Jew or a Sabbatarian on this and not take my word for it? They know full well the Sabbath starts at sunset of the seventh day. They do everything they can to adhere to it. Here and in most parts of the world, they close their places of business early (here , it is aprox. 3PM) This gives them time to get home and finish preperation before sunset.

The Jewish calendar goes like this:

Nissan, Iyar, Sivan, Tammuz, Av, Elul, Tishri, Cheshvan, Kislev, Tevet, Shevat, Adar. In the case of a leap year, there is a Adar I and Adar II.

They number the days of the month instead of giving them names, as we do.

Todat is 18 Tishri.

And as I believe you know Vic,.... what you are touching on here is just the tip of the iceberg.

In love,
cj

 

[Vic C.]

And as I believe you know Vic,.... what you are touching on here is just the tip of the iceberg.

In love,
cj

You are correct cj. I will cease and desist ;-) from further posts here and return to my Mod duties... before I "muddy" the waters even more. 8-)

 

[Heidi]

I posted my OP to get rid of these human laws about the Sabbath and see it for what is is; rest from our own works as the means to salvation. But instead, posters are quibbling about about the law, which day is the Sabbath.

Colossians 2:16, "Therefore, do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ."

Colossians 2:20, "Since you died with Christ to the principles of the world, why as though you still belong to it, do you submit to its rules: 'Do not handle! Do not taste! Do not touch!' These are all destined to perish with use, because they are based on human commands and teachings."

Colossians 2: 13-14, "He forgave us all our sins, having canceled the written code with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross."

So why do so many not believe Paul? Why do they still quibble about a written code that has been canceled by Christ's death? For people so concerned about obedience, this is blatant disobedience!

Jesus fulfilled the whole law, all of it, which includes the Sabbath. The NT makes that very clear which is why you guys cannot find out which day is the Sabbath because the NT doesn't say it's a day of the week! Yet so many people see the Sabbath the way the Jews still do. Has Christ's death not affected you? If so, then why are you still obeying what are, as Jesus tells us, "Teachings that are but rules taught by men"?

So your quibbling about the law is as Paul says in Titus, foolish. Christ fulfilled it and if one honors Christ every day of the week, he will honor the Sabbath, not just singling out one day for it.

 

[farley]

Vic,

I'm confused!

If the Sabbath starts at sunset of the seventh day, Saturday, then why don't the Jews attend their services on Sunday mornings?

And, therefore, Christians attend their churches on Monday mornings?

Huhhhh?

In Christ,

farley

 

[Heidi]

Vic,

I'm confused!

If the Sabbath starts at sunset of the seventh day, Saturday, then why don't the Jews attend their services on Sunday mornings?

And, therefore, Christians attend their churches on Monday mornings?

Huhhhh?

In Christ,

farley

I can see why you're confused because the bible doesn't say which day is the seventh day...and for good reason.

 

[Vic C.]

Vic,

I'm confused!

If the Sabbath starts at sunset of the seventh day, Saturday, then why don't the Jews attend their services on Sunday mornings?

And, therefore, Christians attend their churches on Monday mornings?

Huhhhh?

In Christ,

farley

OK, I didn't mean to hijack Heidi's thread, so this will be my last. Your confusion is my typo. : Sunset of the sixth day (the day we call Friday) is when the Sabbath and their seventh day starts.

Here is a calendar...

http://www.jewfaq.org/current.htm

I can see why you're confused because the bible doesn't say which day is the seventh day...and for good reason.

That's because they didn't name the days like "we" did. Their calendar hasn't changed in over 5,700 years.

 

[SputnikBoy]

Do those who believe the seventh day is just a day of the week seriously think that it means relaxing on Sundays?

While farley has adequately addressed the above atatement from you, Heidi, that WAS an appalling error to have made!

Do you think that God would honor sloth enough to single out a day of the week for that very purpose? :o Sorry, but the seventh day is much more important than that and since sloth is a sin, then the word "rest" cannot mean relaxing.

The seventh-day is good for the soul, Heidi. God knew this when He gave it. YOU - NO ONE ELSE - are applying the word 'sloth' to this argument as though you're speaking some kind of truth. This indicates yet again how little you know about the weekly Sabbath. The Sabbath is a day on which the exact opposite of 'sloth' can be accomplished.

The word "rest" in the bible almost always refers to Christ, especially when given to us as a commandment. God already knows that it is second nature to most of us to relax so of course, he wouldn't have needed to command us to do that.

You're ignoring the 'work six days of the week' part of the commandment, Heidi. The seventh-day (which is Saturday, in case you're still confused) is the culmination of the weekly cycle. It all makes absolute sense. I'll point out again also that God ALONE is responsible for the seven-day cycle of our earthly calendar. So, it was His intention from the beginning of Creation that the days be numbered in this manner. It isn't rocket science ...then again, we're referring to God so maybe it is.

But before Christ died, the Jews had no clue what God meant by rest (and still don't), so using human wisdom, just figured it meant relaxing. But it cannot mean relaxing because we all know how to relax on other days of the week.

The reason that the seventh day is important enough to include in the Ten Commandments is because it refers to Christ to whom we come for rest from our own work.

But it was given BEFORE the need for Christ, Heidi. You've been told this on a number of occasions and you're so one-track minded that you don't listen. God set aside the 7th-day BEFORE any human fell into sin and had a need for a Savior.

We no longer have to work to get to heaven but rest in our Lord.

Again, the one-track mind syndrome. Keeping the Sabbath is NOT working one's way to heaven. Then again, maybe it is to some. And the Sabbath IS a DAY, Heidi, despite what you keep pushing to the contrary.

Our work is thus finished forever, just like God's work of creation was finished forever. That's what God rested from on the seventh day and is what he wants us to rest from on the seventh day. Not resting from Godly or ungodly work and then returning to work on Mondays!

Hoo boy! And don't forget that YOU started this thread.

So those of you who still use human wisdom to understand the Sabbath will not see the importance of it and will not come to Christ for rest, but instead see it as resting from working at the hardware store, then returning to work on Mondays. And I can tell you, one thing, the latter is not at all what the seventh day rest means!

According to the Gospel of Heidi! You're really something, Heidi!

 

[Heidi]

Sorry, Sputnik, but there is nothing in the NT since Christ died to support your statements. Absolutely none. So since you cannot back up your comments with scripture, then I do not consider you informed on this subject at all. You haven't a clue what Paul means by Jesus cancelling the written code by nailing it to the cross. Not a clue. You also obey a shadow instead of understanding the reality of the Sabbath.

But this thread separates the Pharisees from the true believers. The Pharisees see the law the way the Jews do and the true believers believe Paul. And since Jesus himself couldn't convince the Pharisees, then Christ's followers certainly won't be able to either.

Therefore, I'll leave you Pharisees to keep quibbling about the law which Paul tells us not to do. But the irnoy with that is that for being so concerned about breaking the law, you don't care if you disobey Paul's teachings! Another contradiction. Most of the true believers have left this forum because they see the futility of arguing with Pharisees which I am about to do also. You can argue into eternity about which day to stay home from work. Christ is my Sabbath rest. I'm sorry, you rely on human wisdom instead of spiritual wisdom when trying to understand the bible, but being Pharisees, you have made it quite clear that you are still under OT law, not grace. I'll continue to pray for you.

 

[SputnikBoy]

Sorry, Sputnik, but there is nothing in the NT since Christ died to support your statements. Absolutely none. So since you cannot back up your comments with scripture, then I do not consider you informed on this subject at all. You haven't a clue what Paul means by Jesus cancelling the written code by nailing it to the cross. Not a clue. You also obey a shadow instead of understanding the reality of the Sabbath.

A 'shadow' of WHAT, Heidi? How long before it sinks in that the Sabbath was initiated BEFORE 'shadows' were required. There WERE indeed shadows that pointed to Jesus but these were initiated AFTER the fall of man. The very fact that the opening statement of your initial post (i.e. Sabbath being Sunday) indicates that you haven't got a clue what you're talking about. Sorry, but a spade is a spade.

But this thread separates the Pharisees from the true believers.

Not good, Heidi. Not good at all!

The Pharisees see the law the way the Jews do and the true believers believe Paul. And since Jesus himself couldn't convince the Pharisees, then Christ's followers certainly won't be able to either.

Therefore, I'll leave you Pharisees to keep quibbling about the law which Paul tells us not to do. But the irony with that is that for being so concerned about breaking the law, you don't care if you disobey Paul's teachings!

Paul, Paul, Paul. You talk as though he were God! I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that I don't give a darn about Paul's teachings if they disagree with GOD'S teachings. I don't believe that they do, I quickly add, but so many people misinterpret Paul's writings to the point where they DO seem to contradict God. You're obsessed with Paul, Heidi. He seems to permeate your whole being. You're giving Paul some authority to change God's Laws and times that I see as being no less than blasphemy ...not on Paul's part (because I don't believe he was doing this) but on your part.

Another contradiction. Most of the true believers have left this forum because they see the futility of arguing with Pharisees which I am about to do also.

True believers, eh? While I do agree with you that quitting is sometimes the better part of valor, it's also often because the kitchen is getting too hot. You initiated this thread knowing that you were going to stir up a hornets nest. There are others on this board who are true believers (how dare you imply that they are not!) but who don't feel the need to say it as repeatedly as you do. I don't recall where any of the Sabbatarians on this forum have said or even implied that they are better Christians than you are.

You can argue into eternity about which day to stay home from work.

The 'argument' in this particular case was initiated by YOU. Heidi! Did you naively believe that everyone was going to agree with you on this issue?

Christ is my Sabbath rest.

Nice. But it doesn't make an ounce of sense. The Sabbath is a DAY ...the seventh one to be precise.

I'm sorry, you rely on human wisdom instead of spiritual wisdom when trying to understand the bible, but being Pharisees, you have made it quite clear that you are still under OT law, not grace. I'll continue to pray for you.

Thanks, Heidi, a few prayers for me certainly wouldn't go astray. Honestly, as a person I have nothing against you. I just believe that you're more than a tad obsessive about Paul who you use incessantly in your desire to get rid of the Sabbath. If you dislike the Sabbath so much, then don't keep it. But don't let the fact get you down that there are others who DO believe in keeping the weekly Sabbath. Don't worry ...they won't contaminate you. Just live with it. It really IS pretty easy.

 

[Heidi]

So you don't believe everything Paul says, is that correct? :o

A shadow of what Jesus would do with his blood, Sputnik. Do you not believe the bible when it says shadow? Or aren't you interested in it enough to try to figure it out?

The law itself is not a personal relationship with God, only the Spirit gives us that. The law exists only to tell us what is right and wrong. Therefore, worshipping the law is the same as worshipping words or objects instead of having a personal relationship with the living God. That is how one gets to heaven, not by following rules and regulations.

That is also why Paul says that we are no longer under law as long as we are born again of the Holy Spirit. The Spirit leads us to love each other and do good works. But those who are not born again of the Holy Spirit like the Jews and the Pharisees think that by obeying the law they will get to heaven. They try to "decide" to love each other which is as impossible as consulting a rule book to see how to love our spouses instead of genuinely loving them from our hearts which is authentically expressed to them. It's also like trying to not think of an elephant once someone tells us not to.

As the bible says, "Flesh and blood cannot enter heaven." Therefore, obeying the whole law without being born again is a waste of time because it's done without the Spirit. But those who are born again of the Spirit respond out of love, not duty, chore, or obligation. Therefore as paul says, they will automaitcally obey the law because there is no effort, simply a response from the heart.

If you don't understand this, then there isn't much I can do for you, Sputnik. Sorry.

 

[cj]

But don't let the fact get you down that there are others who DO believe in keeping the weekly Sabbath. Don't worry ...they won't contaminate you. Just live with it. It really IS pretty easy.[/color]

If only it were that simple.

Tell you what, if you don't like sin just don't worry about it and maybe it won't contaminate you. Just live with it. Others do, its easy to them.

Ohh boy.

SputNik, "Sabbath-keeping" teaching is false, its not just something some do.

And if the teaching is false the issue is false, and thus against God.

Not speaking against it, ignoring it, is not being true to the preaching of the full gospel of God.

Speaking against the lie of "Sabbath-keeping" is not a personal issue, its preaching the full gospel.

Therefore what you just said above is that we should stop preaching the gospel.

How much more anti-Christ can one be.


In love,
cj

 

[SputnikBoy]

So, cj, going along to church on Saturday to hear the Word of God is more 'sinful' than going along to church on Sunday to hear the Word of God? Have I got that right?

I'll just remind you that the majority of mainstream Christians believe that they are abiding by the 4th-commandment when they keep Sunday ...they REALLY believe it to be the Sabbath day. Heidi has already demonstrated several times that SHE believes that Sunday is the Sabbath. AND, she's against it since she sees that as 'working one's way to heaven'.

Now, I know that you're not Heidi but you ARE still vague as to where you stand on this issue. So, please tell me, are most mainstream Christians guilty of the same sin that you accuse me of? If not, why? They - for all intents and purposes - purport to keeping the weekly Sabbath, as much as they might say that the commandments are gone. I'm more than curious as to how you will handle this question ...and it DOES require a clear and concise (non-cryptic) answer.

As an addendum to the above question ...do YOU attend church every Sunday, cj? If so, are you not then supporting mainstream Christianity's belief that Sunday is the Sabbath Day? And they DO believe it's the Sabbath whether you like it or not. Does that not place you in the same category of 'sinner' that you would place me? Would that not make you 'guilty by association'?

 

[John the Baptist]

John here: Here is a post that I find very interesting from another site that fits the bottom line of the Sabbath issue here, it seems to me? You know, Christ said that IF you love me keep my commandments!! I have removed the posters name & to whom it was posted. (:wink


SIN NO MORE


Those who are truly in Christ are indeed under grace and no longer under the law.

Obviously this by no means gives a license to sin. Actually it is quite the opposite.

We are called to be Holy!

Those who are TRULY IN CHRIST are in the PROCESS of TURNING AWAY FROM SIN.


1Jo 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither knoweth him.


1Jo 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

1Jo 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

1Jo 3:10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.


Those who are truly in Christ are immediately convicted by God’s Holy Spirit if they should sin. They immediately repent and are much less likely to make the same mistake again.

Those who are truly in Christ agree with God that SIN IS TERRIBLE. IT SEPERATES US FROM GOD.

They know…..


WE ARE CALLED TO BE HOLY!


I am the Lord who brought you up out of Egypt to be your God; therefore be holy, because I am holy.
(Leviticus 11:45)

Speak to the entire assembly of Israel and say to them: Be holy because I, the Lord your God, am holy. (Leviticus 19:2)

Consecrate yourselves and be holy, because I am the Lord your God. Keep my decrees and follow them. I am the Lord, who makes you holy. (Leviticus 20:7-8)

But just as He who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; for it is written: Be holy, because I am holy. (1 Peter 1:15-16)


God would not tell us to do something He wasn’t prepared to ENABLE us to do. Those who obey God and study His word in a humble Spirit, who seek His wisdom and ask His strength to flee temptation, God enables to do so.

Those who are truly in Christ are the minority.


The majority are DEAD IN THEIR SINS. They are in the process of completing their sins.


We were created to do God’s will not ours. Those who are truly in Christ soon find themselves doing God’s will. Those who are rebelling against God are doing Satan’s will, as God allows.


" ... an experience of evil hath God given to the sons of man to humble him thereby" (Ecc. 1:13).


Are you a new creature??? Are you in the process of turning away from sin? Are you listening to God?


If you still like your sins, you are in disagreement with God. All the death and suffering in this world are the result of ONE act of disobedience in the Garden of Eden.

SIN IS TERRIBLE, IT SEPARATES US FROM GOD.


You cannot have fellowship with God if you keep returning to your sins. You cannot!

You are not listening to God if you keep returning to your sins.

So let me ask, if you are continuing to do the same old sinful things, WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE LISTENING TO???????


Satan is the “voice of reason.â€Â


John 5:30
By myself I can do nothing;

Phi 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.


Is that coherent enough for you? You are a self proclaimed child of the devil. Those who teach tolerance of sin DON’T KNOW GOD.


QUIT LYING TO GOD'S CHILDREN!

John again: About these two class? this is openly seen in lifes journey, huh? Also, does not one class [continually] record in the heavenly record books, every conceivable Revelation 17:5 excuse for not obeying the Lord? Simpley put, which class does the Word of God say is Born Again?? Acts 5:32 :