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Woman on the Beast

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Instantly, Rome comes to mind as the only city renown to history, for over two thousand years, as The Seven Hills City. For The Seven Hills of Rome was a title applied to the original site of Rome since 390 B.C. In fact, with very “little” wisdom, anyone can answer the question — what great city seated on seven mountains reigned over the kings of the Earth in John’s day? Quite obviously, it was Rome!

The abomination of desolation in Matthew 24:15 was 1260 years (a year is as a day with the Lord) of Papal Rome rule from 538AD with Emperor Justinian’s decree and under the military protection of Belisarius and the beast (Pope) until the deadly wound came in 1798 by General Berthier who made his entrance into Rome and abolished the papal government and established a secular one. This is also confirmed in Revelation 12:6 the church of Jesus would hide in the wilderness for exactly 1260 days (years) or 3 ½ years.

This was the time when Rome persecuted the Christians and killed them which were around 500 million saints slain for the cause of their faith in Jesus. 1798 – 538 = 1260 days/years. Napoleon had closed down the Catholic Church and the Papacy, its power was thought to be forever broken. The wound was largely healed in 1929 when Mussolini gave the Vatican back to the Pope and established it as a country in it's own right in the Lateran Treaty. Today the Vatican has formal diplomatic relations with almost every country in the world.

Matthew 24:13 but he that shall endure unto the end the same shall be saved. This means the end of Papal rule in 1798. Vs. 14 and this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the entire world for a witness unto all nations and then shall the end come. This means that now the gospel can be preached through out the world as we have been set free from Papal authority even though Papal Rome will try to take its seat in Jerusalem, Daniel 11:36-45; 2Thessalonians 2:3, 4, which is also an abomination to God as Satan said “I will ascend into heaven; I will exalt my throne above the stars of God (other ruling powers) I will sit also upon the Mount of the Congregation in the sides of the north (Jerusalem). I will ascend above the clouds, I will be like the Most High,” Isaiah 14:12-14.

We will see history repeat itself in the end of days when the son of perdition takes his literal seat in Jerusalem on the very temple mount of God making martyr's of those who will not renounce Christ refusing to take the mark of this beast.



For an extensive study of who the women on the beast is go to www.vaticandesignexposed.com and also look up project Vatican. They are long studies, but worth the time to read so we will not be deceived in knowledge.​
 
The link I gave no longer exist. Here is the new link for it. Just type it in the way I have it here.

amazingdiscoveries.org/ Introduction to Vatican Design Exposed
 
This was your question: "Why not give the Scripture reference for the woman on the beast?"


This was my answer: "Rev chapter 17-18".

Still no answer. Why did you not give the Scripture reference in the first place? That you finally gave it because I asked is no answer.

I know the answer to the question. As do you. But I am wanting to hear your answer.

Quantrill
 
Still no answer. Why did you not give the Scripture reference in the first place? That you finally gave it because I asked is no answer.

I know the answer to the question. As do you. But I am wanting to hear your answer.

Quantrill
What are you talking about. You asked me for those scriptures I gave. What am I missing?
 
What are you talking about. You asked me for those scriptures I gave. What am I missing?

No, He did not ask you to post those scriptures.

He asked you why you didn't post the scriptures. Did you not want to reference it for some reason? What was that reason for not including the scriptures in your OP? That's what he wants to know. That is what you are missing!
 
I agree that the harlot of Rev 17-18 does seem to match Rome because of details like the 7 hills/mountains, and it being responsible for all martyrdoms and wars and murders.
But what makes me doubt this abit is that Rome is not "in the wilderness"?
There are actually quite a few cities with 7 hills/mountains including Jerusalem and Hollywood? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_claimed_to_be_built_on_seven_hills
Or 7 hills might not be in one city but 7 capitals, or it may symbolize 7 continents?

Features of Babylon/Babel in Revelation/Apocalypse and other bible books include:
Name means "mixture/confusion/babble" or "gateway of God/gods" (Genesis 10-11; Rev 18:6).
Is a woman/harlot/prostitute (contrasted with virgin and often considered to be a church) and "mother of all harlots and abominations" (Revelation 17:1, 5, 15-16, 18; 18:2).
Rides the 7/8 headed 10 horned beast (Revelation/Apocalypse 17:7).
Reigns over the kings of the earth (Rev 17:18).
Described as "made all the nations to drink of the wine of the wrath of her sexual immorality", and with whom the kings/princes of the earth commit fornication/harlotry with (Revelation/Apocalypse 14:8; 17:2; 18:3, 6, 9, 23).
Called "mystery Babylon" (Revelation/Apocalypse 17:5).
Called "the great (city)" (Revelation/Apocalypse 14:8; 16:19; 17:1, 5, 18; 18:2, 10, 16, 18-19, 21). (Only 5 cities are called "great" in the bible: Asshur/Resen, Gibeon, Hamath, Jerusalem, and Babylon.)
Said to oversee global free trade (Revelation/Apocalypse 18:3, 11, 15, 17, 19, 23).
Said to be responsible for most all martyrdoms, wars, & murders (Revelation/Apocalypse 17:6; 18:24).
Has 7 hills/mountains and is apparently intended for Rome (Revelation/Apocalypse 17:9).
Is also in the wilderness (Revelation/Apocalyspse 17:3).
One world language/religion (in Genesis 10-11).
Has Jewish/Semitic residents (in Daniel).
Matches the Lion / Gold head (in Daniel);
Builders of Tower (in Genesis 10-11).
Sits in/amidst many waters (Rev 17:1, 15) (or "at the centre/heart of the waters" like Atlantis?)
Colours purple & scarlet (Rev 17:3; 18:16).
"decked with gold and precious stones and pearls" (Rev 17:4; 18:16).
Fire there similar to the fire of Rome (Rev 17:16; 18:8-9, 18).
Says "I sit a queen, and am no widow" (Rev 18:7).
Holds a golden cup/grail (Rev 17:4; 18:6).
Temple vessels taken away to Babylon (1 Esdras 1:54).
"fallen is Babylon the great" (Rev 14:8; 18:2).
Centre of Babylonian world map.
Peter was supposedly there or passed on a greeting from there (1 Peter 5:13).

(Nineveh in the Minor Prophets is also described similar.)

Candidates for "Babylon" in modern world:
Papacy/Vatican/Rome ("Cosmopolis"?)
Bilderbergers.
Masons.
Mecca.
New York (Twin Towers, same latitude as Rome).
Hollywood.
Atlantis / Tiahuanaco.
Publius Enigma (compare "Mystery Babylon").
"break the language barrier" (on Amplified Bible cover).
Babylon 5.
London (largest city of the world in late 1800s - early 1900s).
Constantinople (most cosmopolitan city of world in 1800s-1900s).

Rome at the time of the Apostles seems to match Babylon: "all roads lead to Rome"; Cato expelled moneylenders, spoke against alien influences; Cicero calls Rome a city formed from confluence of nations; Lucan says Rome not peopled by its own citizens but by scourings of world; "complaint of indigenous natives that capital had attracted vices of the universe & manners of opposite nations"; Constantius marvels at the haste with which all human beings of the world flock to Rome.

Modern Rome maybe also matches:
Pope JP2 Founded World Youth Day 1984.
Pope JP2 visited 129 countries.
2005 pope JP2 funeral "broadcast to every corner of the globe".
2009 Benedict xvi encyclical "super-UN".
Pope Francis person of the year on cover of Time Magazine.
2014 "pope" Francis gives orb with cross on it to Queen Elizabeth which the BBC said symbolizes "christian" royal dominion over the globe/world. (Catholic means "universal".)
2015 Pope Francis "new global authority" / "fix world"?
 
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No, He did not ask you to post those scriptures.

He asked you why you didn't post the scriptures. Did you not want to reference it for some reason? What was that reason for not including the scriptures in your OP? That's what he wants to know. That is what you are missing!
Please do not speak for another member as they are capable to speak for themselves. This only leads to confusion.

Quantrill asked me in his post # 3: Why not give the Scripture reference for the woman on the beast?

I had no idea what he was asking for as I gave many scriptures in the OP. After asking me this question I also gave him more reference by reading Rev 17-18.
 
Please do not speak for another member as they are capable to speak for themselves. This only leads to confusion.

Quantrill asked me in his post # 3: Why not give the Scripture reference for the woman on the beast?

I had no idea what he was asking for as I gave many scriptures in the OP. After asking me this question I also gave him more reference by reading Rev 17-18.

Am I speaking for another member? Has Quantrill complained to you that I have mischaracterized him in some way? You were already confused, me trying to clarify to you what I understood Quantrill to be saying has in no way added to his confusion or to yours.

Might I suggest to you, if you are going to create a thread and then be an active participant of it, then you should not attempt to be the moderator of that thread too! If you wish to be the moderator, then maybe you should limit your posts. You seem to take everything so personal.
 
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I agree that the harlot of Rev 17-18 does seem to match Rome because of details like the 7 hills/mountains, and it being responsible for all martyrdoms and wars and murders.
But what makes me doubt this abit is that Rome is not "in the wilderness"?
There are actually quite a few cities with 7 hills/mountains including Jerusalem and Hollywood? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_claimed_to_be_built_on_seven_hills
Or 7 hills might not be in one city but 7 capitals, or it may symbolize 7 continents?

Features of Babylon/Babel in Revelation/Apocalypse and other bible books include:
Name means "mixture/confusion/babble" or "gateway of God/gods" (Genesis 10-11; Rev 18:6).
Is a woman/harlot/prostitute (contrasted with virgin and often considered to be a church) and "mother of all harlots and abominations" (Revelation 17:1, 5, 15-16, 18; 18:2).
Rides the 7/8 headed 10 horned beast (Revelation/Apocalypse 17:7).
Reigns over the kings of the earth (Rev 17:18).
Described as "made all the nations to drink of the wine of the wrath of her sexual immorality", and with whom the kings/princes of the earth commit fornication/harlotry with (Revelation/Apocalypse 14:8; 17:2; 18:3, 6, 9, 23).
Called "mystery Babylon" (Revelation/Apocalypse 17:5).
Called "the great (city)" (Revelation/Apocalypse 14:8; 16:19; 17:1, 5, 18; 18:2, 10, 16, 18-19, 21). (Only 5 cities are called "great" in the bible: Asshur/Resen, Gibeon, Hamath, Jerusalem, and Babylon.)
Said to oversee global free trade (Revelation/Apocalypse 18:3, 11, 15, 17, 19, 23).
Said to be responsible for most all martyrdoms, wars, & murders (Revelation/Apocalypse 17:6; 18:24).
Has 7 hills/mountains and is apparently intended for Rome (Revelation/Apocalypse 17:9).
Is also in the wilderness (Revelation/Apocalyspse 17:3).
One world language/religion (in Genesis 10-11).
Has Jewish/Semitic residents (in Daniel).
Matches the Lion / Gold head (in Daniel);
Builders of Tower (in Genesis 10-11).
Sits in/amidst many waters (Rev 17:1, 15) (or "at the centre/heart of the waters" like Atlantis?)
Colours purple & scarlet (Rev 17:3; 18:16).
"decked with gold and precious stones and pearls" (Rev 17:4; 18:16).
Fire there similar to the fire of Rome (Rev 17:16; 18:8-9, 18).
Says "I sit a queen, and am no widow" (Rev 18:7).
Holds a golden cup/grail (Rev 17:4; 18:6).
Temple vessels taken away to Babylon (1 Esdras 1:54).
"fallen is Babylon the great" (Rev 14:8; 18:2).
Centre of Babylonian world map.
Peter was supposedly there or passed on a greeting from there (1 Peter 5:13).

(Nineveh in the Minor Prophets is also described similar.)

Candidates for "Babylon" in modern world:
Papacy/Vatican/Rome ("Cosmopolis"?)
Bilderbergers.
Masons.
Mecca.
New York (Twin Towers, same latitude as Rome).
Hollywood.
Atlantis / Tiahuanaco.
Publius Enigma (compare "Mystery Babylon").
"break the language barrier" (on Amplified Bible cover).
Babylon 5.
London (largest city of the world in late 1800s - early 1900s).
Constantinople (most cosmopolitan city of world in 1800s-1900s).

Rome at the time of the Apostles seems to match Babylon: "all roads lead to Rome"; Cato expelled moneylenders, spoke against alien influences; Cicero calls Rome a city formed from confluence of nations; Lucan says Rome not peopled by its own citizens but by scourings of world; "complaint of indigenous natives that capital had attracted vices of the universe & manners of opposite nations"; Constantius marvels at the haste with which all human beings of the world flock to Rome.

Modern Rome maybe also matches:
Pope JP2 Founded World Youth Day 1984.
Pope JP2 visited 129 countries.
2005 pope JP2 funeral "broadcast to every corner of the globe".
2009 Benedict xvi encyclical "super-UN".
Pope Francis person of the year on cover of Time Magazine.
2014 "pope" Francis gives orb with cross on it to Queen Elizabeth which the BBC said symbolizes "christian" royal dominion over the globe/world. (Catholic means "universal".)
2015 Pope Francis "new global authority" / "fix world"?
Below is that of the seven remaining nations described as four beasts in Daniel 7:1-8 and the three kingdoms that were subdued by the little horn, which is the Roman Empire.

The three kingdoms that were subdued by the little horn of Daniel 7:24 are the Heruli, Vandals, and Ostrogoths who were eliminated by the year 538 AD under the leadership of the Eastern Roman Emperor Justinian whose deadly wound came in 1798.

Seven remaining nations that still exist today:

Babylonian Empire:
(Iraq) The lion represents the winged lions that guarded the royal places of Babylon. This Empire ran from 2000BC - 1759BC

Medo – Persian Empire:
(Iran) The ribs of the bear are part of the consuming greed that devours the first empire. This Empire ran approximately from 536BC - 330BC

Grecian Empire:
(Greece, Turkey, Syria, Egypt) Four wings of the leopard described the swiftness of this empire that ran from 334-331BC. It wrestled world dominion from Medo-Persia. After the death of Alexander the Great the kingdom was divided into four minor kingdoms that continued as prominent factors in world politics until the Roman Empire gathered it back as one kingdom.

Roman Empire: (little horn, Daniel 8:9-14, 23-27)
Iron represents the stronghold this nation had. Daniel chapter 2 mentions the iron element of this empire that it to will be divided and broken as God will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed.
This Empire ran from 753BC -27BC

The seven heads are that of the Babylonian Empire, Medo/Persian Empire, Grecian Empire and Roman Empire. The ten horns represent the nations the Roman Empire scattered to when the deadly wound was put upon them, Daniel 7:23-25; Rev 13:3. The deadly wound came in 1798 when General Berthier of France, who made his entrance into Rome, abolished the Roman government and established a secular one and captured Pope Pius VI, who soon died in captivity in Valence, on August 29, 1799. In 1801 Napoleon made an agreement with Pope Pius II establishing Napoleon’s Organic Articles of granting the Tribunal and the Corps legislative partial control of the concordat in order to help the state monitor any politically harmful Catholic or Protestant movements or activities. The wound was largely healed in 1929 when Mussolini gave the Vatican back to Pope Pius XI and established it as a country in it's own right in the Lateran Treaty.

The Roman Empire began in 753BC by Romulus who founded Rome in 27BC with Augustus Caesar becoming the first emperor of Rome in 27 BC and died in 14AD. Rome controlled over two million square miles stretching from the Rhine River to Egypt and from Britain (England) to Asia Minor which made up the Grecian Empire of Greece, Turkey, Syria and Egypt. In 146BC the Romans destroyed Corinth during the Battle of Corinth and made the Greece Empire into a province of the Roman Empire. This timeline goes from 753BC to 27BC. Nero burned Rome in 64AD and blamed the Christian community in the city causing the Roman Empires first persecution of Christians. In 1453 was the rise of the Ottoman Empire that conquered Constantinople destroying the Byzantine Empire (Eastern Roman Empire) that reigned from 330AD to 1453AD. The Roman Empire was then called the Holy Roman Empire that was a political entity beginning in 800AD - 1806AD from the time of Charlemagne (Holy Roman Emperor) who protected Pope Leo III from Adrian's supporters in Rome to Francis II, King of France. Pope Pius VII was the Pope from 1800-1823. The Roman Empire is known today as Vatican City, a city-state surrounded by Rome and Italy who has diplomatic relations with every nation around the world.

The crowns on its heads show that this dragon claims royal authority against the true King who is God of all creation as he prepares to take his seat above all that which is Gods Kingdom claiming he is God as he prepares to deceive the world through that of an existing Roman Empire, Daniel 8:9-12; Isaiah 14:12-15.

The beast rises up out of the sea, Rev 13, as the sea here is symbolic of people and nations as in a sea of humanity, Daniel Chapter 7:1-8; Revelation 17:15. The seven heads are that of the Babylonian Empire, Medo/Persian Empire, Grecian Empire and Roman Empire. The ten horns represent the nations the Roman Empire scattered to when the deadly wound was put upon them, Daniel 7:15-28.

These ten nations were the Anglo-Saxons (Germans in Great Britain), the Franks (French), Suevi (Portuguese), Visigoths (Spanish), Burgundians (Swiss), Alemanni (Germans), Lombards (Italians), Ostrogoths, Heruli, and the Vandals in northern Africa. The last three being Ostrogoths, Heruli, and the Vandals had already been destroyed by the Roman Empire before their deadly wound came in 1798.

The beast out of the earth, Rev 13:11-18, is the revived Roman Empire (mystery Babylon, Rev 17:5) which causes man to take its mark. Daniel 7:25 and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, He will think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time, 2 Thessalonians 2:13-12.
 
Am I speaking for another member? Has Quantrill complained to you that I have mischaracterized him in some way? You were already confused, me trying to clarify to you what I understood Quantrill to be saying has in no way added to his confusion or to yours.

Might I suggest to you, if you are going to create a thread and then be an active participant of it, then you should not attempt to be the moderator of that thread too! If you wish to be the moderator, then maybe you should limit your posts. You seem to take everything so personal.
I will let Quantrill speak for himself as this is between him and I as you nor anyone could clarify that of what another is saying. Do you know the thoughts of another's mine, no. Not being rude, just saying we can not speak for another person not knowing the intents of their mind.

I am not being the moderator of this thread as I am involved in it. I'm just asking you to not speak for another member that I am waiting on for his direct reply. Please do not try to make it anything more than this, thank you.
 
The beast rises up out of the sea, Rev 13, as the sea here is symbolic of people and nations as in a sea of humanity, Daniel Chapter 7:1-8; Revelation 17:15. The seven heads are that of the Babylonian Empire, Medo/Persian Empire, Grecian Empire and Roman Empire. The ten horns represent the nations the Roman Empire scattered to when the deadly wound was put upon them, Daniel 7:15-28.

What is the Image of the Beast, the beast that this woman rides upon?

Revelation 13:15
And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.


What is this image, do you know?
 
I don't believe it's clear that (Rev. 17-18) are speaking specifically to Rome and Roman Catholicism. These are difficult chapters to interpret. I don't doubt that Roman Catholicism will be a part, but I believe Protestant churches will also be a apart. As well as pagan beliefs.

Understand, concerning my view of a pre-trib Rapture, The Roman and Protestant churches will still exist on the earth. They just won't have any Christians in them. But they will have people in them.

The label given the woman is 'Mystery Babylon'. (Rev. 17:5) This takes us all the way back to Babel in (Gen. 11). Thus this wicked system has been around from the beginning. Of course once the Church began at Pentecost, 'Mystery Babylon' would begin to make it's way into the Church. But it's bigger than the churches.

I believe 'Mystery Babylon' is identical with the 'Mystery of Iniquity' that Paul spoke of in (2 Thess. 2:7). And the Roman Church at that time would be a faithful church.

I believe 'Mystery Babylon' incorporates all man made religious beliefs into one. Just like Babel was the uniting of man to build outside of God, and so must have a religious base also.

I believe the woman is the Babel religious system, and the beast is the Babel political system. My opinion.

Quantrill
 
Concerning (Rev. 17-18), I believe ch. 17 deals with the woman, the Babel religious system. And, ch. 18, deals with the beast on which the woman rides, the Babel political system.

I would say first, because it is that which is usually believed in Christianity, that the 7 mountains that the woman sits on are not literal mountains, and do not represent the city of Rome.

She, the great whore, sits on many waters, or nations. (Rev. 17:7) The waters are interpreted for us in (Rev. 17:15) as peoples, multitudes, nations, and tongues.

The information I give now comes from (Joseph A Seiss, The Apocalypse, p. 391-394) as quoted in (The Revelation Of Jesus Christ, John Walvoord, Moody Press, 1978, p. 251-254)

(Rev. 17:9) "And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. And there are seven kings...." This verse is not describing the woman. It is describing the beast, the political Babylon.

A mountain is often used in Scripture to represent a kingdom. David said, (Ps. 30:7) "LORD, by thy favor thou hast made my mountain to stand strong...." And speaking of Babylon we are told in (Jer. 51:25) "Behold, I am against thee, O destroying mountain...and will make thee a burnt mountain." And of course, (Dan. 2:35) "...the stone that smote the image became a great mountain that filled the whole earth."

As there are 7 imperial powers, so there are 7 Kings representing those powers. Rome will certainly be one of those powers and will represent the 6th. (Rev. 17:10) "And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come...." The 'one is' is the Roman empire in Johns day. The one future is that of the Tribulation period.

The 5 that are fallen would be Greece, Persia, Babylon, Assyria, and Egypt. And you can find the Mystery Babylon religion in all of them. The Great whore has been around that long as she has sat on all of them. In my and others opinion.

Quantrill
 
I don't believe it's clear that (Rev. 17-18) are speaking specifically to Rome and Roman Catholicism. These are difficult chapters to interpret. I don't doubt that Roman Catholicism will be a part, but I believe Protestant churches will also be a apart. As well as pagan beliefs.

Understand, concerning my view of a pre-trib Rapture, The Roman and Protestant churches will still exist on the earth. They just won't have any Christians in them. But they will have people in them.

The label given the woman is 'Mystery Babylon'. (Rev. 17:5) This takes us all the way back to Babel in (Gen. 11). Thus this wicked system has been around from the beginning. Of course once the Church began at Pentecost, 'Mystery Babylon' would begin to make it's way into the Church. But it's bigger than the churches.

I believe 'Mystery Babylon' is identical with the 'Mystery of Iniquity' that Paul spoke of in (2 Thess. 2:7). And the Roman Church at that time would be a faithful church.

I believe 'Mystery Babylon' incorporates all man made religious beliefs into one. Just like Babel was the uniting of man to build outside of God, and so must have a religious base also.

I believe the woman is the Babel religious system, and the beast is the Babel political system. My opinion.

Quantrill
This is not about denomination/nondominations as God does not recognize them or any organized religion, but only knows His own by what is in their heart.

There will be many Roman and Protestant church's here on the earth when Christ returns that even they will be destroyed for following after the harlot that is leading them astray.

Per 2Thessalonians 2:7 you have to read vs. 1-12, cross referencing it with Rev 13, 17, 18 and 19 to understand that the mystery to some people will remain a mystery until it's to late as they have not studied about who this mystery Babylon is that started with the Babylonian Empire clear through the last Empire being the Roman Empire that still exist today as all seven have always persecuted God's people making many of them die a martyr's death that included many Prophets and Apostles.

All seven Empires are a false religious group that has always exalted themselves above God.
 
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