The Myth of saying that Jesus Christ died for all men without exception !

[savedbygrace57]

mk

He takes away the sin of the world.

Yes of His Sheep !

 

[MarkT]

That's not what John said.

I agree Jesus died for his sheep.

However you're forgetting the other side of the equation. His death was good for us who believe, but bad for those who do not believe. For we preach Christ Jesus and him crucified for all men, provided they believe. For those who do not believe, Jesus then becomes the stone that will make men fall. Men will trip over the fact he died for them. And then all men will have to answer to God because they did not believe his word and the whole world will be held accountable.

If Jesus didn't die for all, then why should any believe? But if he died for all, then men have no excuse.

Romans 9:33
as it is written,“Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone that will make men stumble, a rock that will make them fall; and he who believes in him will not be put to shame.”

1 Peter 2:8
and“A stone that will make men stumble, a rock that will make them fall”;for they stumble because they disobey the word, as they were destined to do.

 

[savedbygrace57]

mark

That's not what John said.

Yes it is !

His death was good for us who believe, but bad for those who do not
believe

Because they were not of His Sheep for whom His Death took away their sins. Jn 10:26

26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

The World of Jn 1:29 is His Sheep, Period !

 

[MarkT]

mark



Yes it is !



Because they were not of His Sheep for whom His Death took away their sins. Jn 10:26

26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

The World of Jn 1:29 is His Sheep, Period !

There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe. He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light. That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. John 1:7-10

The world does not know Jesus. His sheep do. The world can not be his sheep.

Jesus' death served a twofold purpose - to save his sheep, and to make men fall, especially the men of the house of Israel because God sent him to them and they did not know him and they would not believe in him. Now how are men to fall or be put to shame if he did not die for them? What does his death mean to the wicked if he did not die for them? Why should they repent and turn away from their sin if they can not be healed? Why should they believe and be saved? Paul tells us God desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of truth. 1 Tim. 2:4

 

[JCitoL]

jc

I have not assumed anything. Now try dealing with my points in the posts I have provided !

we have meant that the true God is omnipotent and therefore He can afford to save all humans/souls of the universe, while unlike Him we the people are not omnipotent and therefore as opposed to the true God we were not able to save any human/soul through all those millennia until now, here is how we still cannot save anyone without the true God even if there are millions of most regular spiritual servants/workers thereby, because is there a guarantee what the true God will do in the future as regards the salvation?!, before you know it(all of a sudden) He may have saved all people/souls of the universe, while at the same time some believers to turn out that still believe in the impossibility of overall salvation, and if He wills/wants to save all humans/souls of the universe completely and permanently, who are we that (to succeed) to forbid Him?!

Mark 13:33-37 "Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is. For the Son of Man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch. Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning: Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping. And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch."

Blessings

 

[savedbygrace57]

mark

Paul tells us God desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of
truth. 1
Tim. 2:4

And the all men my God desires to be saved and come to the knoweldge of the Truth shall be saved and come to the knowledge of the Truth. Job 23:13

13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.

 

[MarkT]

mark



And the all men my God desires to be saved and come to the knoweldge of the Truth shall be saved and come to the knowledge of the Truth. Job 23:13

13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.

We were all chosen by God and given various gifts and levels of faith. But the devil has planted his seed and he is out to destroy or change, if such a thing is possible, what God has ordained by his will and his mercy, what he has ordained in heaven to come to pass on earth, what he has created and made to exist, a kingdom for his Son. But it is an inescapable truth that the devil is the ruler of this world. He rules men's hearts and minds. So take care lest you stumble. So even though God has chosen you, you could fall. Jesus gave us many parables of servants who were disobedient, maidens who fell asleep. On the one hand we have the security of knowing God won't let us fall, on the other hand we know many will fall away, as Jesus predicted. So be on guard. The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom. Pr. 9:10 Without the fear of the LORD you have nothing. God did not intend for us to become complacent. If you feel secure that you are of God and that you are his sheep, but you do not fear God and you do not do his will, then you have no wisdom, no sense, and no understanding. Even Paul said, 'Woe to me if I don't preach' 1 Cor. 9:16 , 'and let anyone who thinks that he stands take heed lest he fall.' 1 Cor. 10:12 The fear of God is the beginning of wisdom. You can be kicked out of the kingdom, like any man, and many sons of the kingdom will be thrown into the outer darkness. Mt. 8:12 Not all believers are sheep. Sheep don't trample the word of God. All men means all men. God desires all men to be saved as Paul said. Can God change your destiny? I believe so.

 

[savedbygrace57]

mark

We were all chosen by God and given various gifts and levels of faith.

And the all men my God desires to be saved and come to the knoweldge of the Truth shall be saved and come to the knowledge of the Truth. Job 23:13

13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.

 

[ezra]

mark




And the all men my God desires to be saved and come to the knoweldge of the Truth shall be saved and come to the knowledge of the Truth. Job 23:13

13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.

i just hope all your family is on the wheel of you been chosen for salvation.. when GOD had it wrote he desired ALL men be saved ALL is what he meant.. not willing ANY perish but ALL come to repentance. WHO SO EVER is any body that calls up on him for salvation....... not certain select few. facts not myth........

 

[savedbygrace57]

ezra

when GOD had it wrote he desired ALL men be saved ALL is what he meant.

And the all men my God desires to be saved and come to the knoweldge of the Truth shall be saved and come to the knowledge of the Truth. Job 23:13

13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.

 

[Randy]

I have not read through this entire thread. Jesus shed His blood for the forgiveness of sin (not all man) As in "this is the blood of the New Covenant which I shed for the forgiveness of sin."

Its quite clear from Jesus that mankind needs to go to Him for life. Jesus baptizes with the Holy Spirit. John the immerser knew this even before the 12. Thats how God writes a new covenant on our hearts. (circumcision by the hands of God) Christ in Us.

Faith is key. Those that seek find. Those that ask receive and those that knock the door will be opened. But one must believe Jesus exists and is alive. Paul was appointed by a very much alive Jesus of Nazareth.

God didn't send or provide the lamb to punish but to save. God's motivation was love.

Randy

 

[savedbygrace57]

randy

Faith is key. Those that seek find

Thats works Salvation.

Faith is not key, Christ is Key !

 

[Stone-yarder]

This thread is not about how I know who are the Sheep. or How I know I am sheep.

Its to state a Myth, that Christ died for all men without exception, without any scripture stating that.

Really?

2 corinthians 5;15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

The definition of "all" is everybody. To easy, what else you got?

 

[savedbygrace57]

stone y

Really?

Really !

The definition of "all" is everybody

Yeah everybody Christ died for and are by Him made alive that they no longer live unto themselves but unto Him that did for them and rose again !

 

[Stone-yarder]

For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.

 

[savedbygrace57]

For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly.

Paul is speaking of God's Elect [believers], thats who Christ died for. Rom 8:33-34

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Yes before conversion the Elect are Ungodly !

 

[Stone-yarder]

Because, For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

 

[gr8grace]

nvm

 

[savedbygrace57]

Because, For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Yes, for all the elect did sin and come short of the Glory of God !

 

[Stone-yarder]

The elect and everybody who has ever lived,sinned, except for Jesus Christ of course.