Read the warning passages. They are for those who "don't want to change". Esp Heb 12:6, and "scourge". Not pretty.
As God is our Heavenly Father, He has the right to discipline us. What does v.11 tell us?
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OSAS The Truth
- Thread starter Rollo Tamasi
- Start date
As God is our Heavenly Father, He has the right to discipline us. What does v.11 tell us?
Gary
Member
How does one recognize this event taking place? How does one know when the Holy Spirit comes upon them?
Again, just asking.
.
Malachi
Member
Gary,
Believing that the New Birth is irreversible, and knowing if one is personally born again are two separate issues, which should be kept separate.
Is the New Birth irreversible? Absolutely. Why, because the sinner is "born from above", "born of God", "born again". Just as a physical birth is irreversible, the spiritual birth is also irreversible. Furthermore the gift of eternal life is first of all a GIFT and secondly it is ETERNAL.
How does one know one has been born again? That's a matter for another thread.
What happens if a believer sins and falls? That too is a matter for another thread.
There are many who believe that the New Birth is reversible because they do not fully understand what Scripture has revealed.
Gary
Member
Who said anything about the New Birth being irreversible?
Malachi
Member
You did not, but the OP referred to the New Birth, and OSAS is the belief that it is irreversible. I trust you hold to that view also.
J
Jesse
Guest
In the verse you offered in 1 Peter, the imperishable is not salvation, but the seed - the seed is imperishable. It will remain in you IF you do not walk away.
The warning of the great apostasy should be enough to convince anyone that a person can fall away.
A person can also be born again yet still walk away.
.....and to Karl - Yes, I said that I could fall away in my post in the other thread, please do not take words away from what I posted, anyone can go back and read what I wrote.
Gary
Member
Actually I don't. But that matter is for another thread.
You and I, and everyone on this forum continues to sin, don't we?
Gary
Member
Falling away and walking away forever are not the same thing.
John 10:27; NIV
"My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me".
Does that sound like a person who walks away forever?
Do they hear the voice of Jesus when he calls to them?
Asking Jesus into your life is not only words it is action as well.How has that person's life changed?Are they salt and light of this earth?Are they still the same person who confessed 10 years ago?Has there been changed of the heart?
You should not deliberately sin.You should do your best to be a faithful servant of Our Lord and Savior.You can not just say "I will go do this that is wrong but that is ok I am a Christian God will forgive me".That is mocking God and He does not like that.
Good question Gary, here the Scriptural answer,
Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. 1Pe 1:23
The seed speaks of the semen or sperm of the Holy Spirit (just like He impregnated Mary), the Word is the egg or ovum, when the sperm enters the egg a life is conceived,
For all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away: 1Pe 1:24
Peter tells us what verse the Lord used to reveal to him his sinful state, Isa 406-8, hence that was the egg used for the conception of zoe or eternal life in Peter, the day this happen in his life is recorded for us in Luke 5:8, but since it was a time of transition he didn't receive the Holy Spirit until after Jesus had resuscitated.
But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you. 1Pe 1:25
Then he sums it up with saying that is how we are born again, the subject of his discourse.
So just like we know the name of our earthly father and mother, we know the Holy Spirit is our Father and the verse used to reveal to us our sinful state is our mother, also we know when we were born the first time so will we know, without a shadow of doubt, when we were born again, there was a drastic change in our outlook on life, the things we found sinful pleasure in just the day before became disgusting to us.
That is how I know I'm born again and that is how you can know you are born again, but it's not for you or me to pass judgment on someone else as to whether they are born again or not, that is between the Lord and them alone.
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J
Jesse
Guest
Are you using falling away as in apostasy, and walking away is turning our backs on God? Just to clarify.
I can not imagine turning my back on God or falling away, but it is possible because the Bible tells us it is. A person who has not turned away from God will follow Jesus and will know His voice, but there are some who once followed him, heard his voice, but was tempted, fell into sin, started practicing sin and then forgot all about God. Men love the darkness more than the light.
A dog will return to its vomit.
Gary
Member
If you think that you could walk away from God, return to your vomit, and never come back again, then what kind of a relationship with God are you talking about?
It's certainly nothing expressed here.
I don't understand.Would you mind explaining the difference? Please.
.
Gary
Member