Trinitry Truth

[jaybird]

I think accepting The Trinity is key to being a genuine follower of Christ

where does Jesus teach this? i would like to read more about it.

 

[Free]

where does Jesus teach this? i would like to read more about it.

Trinity perhaps not explicitly, but he does teach that one must believe he is God, yet that he is clearly not the Father, and that there is only one God. So implicitly, it rather seems like it.

 

[jaybird]

Trinity perhaps not explicitly, but he does teach that one must believe he is God, yet that he is clearly not the Father, and that there is only one God. So implicitly, it rather seems like it.

where does He teach this?

 

[Jim Parker]

Unfortunately, many cults and religions deny the truth of the Trinity. From Mormons to Jehovah Witnesses to Muslims they simply call Jesus a prophet or great teacher or anything other than God. However, from Genesis when God says, "Let us make man in our image" to the Jesus' Great Commission when he says, "Go and make disciples..." and then lists the Trinity we say God's word delineating that truth. Even the Apostle Thomas after Jesus rose from the dead said to Jesus, "My Lord and my God." Christians only need to do a little research to find numerous places where the Trinity is mentioned in the Bible.

The word "Trinity" is nowhere to be found.
BUT, if someone reads the Bible with the intention of finding out what it really says, he will find that the Father is God; (Jhn 6:27; [URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/1co/8/6/s_1070006']1Co 8:6; [URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/1co/15/24/s_1077024']1Co 15:24 and more[/URL][/URL]) the Son is God ( Jhn 5:18; [URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/phl/2/6/s_1105006']Phl 2:6; [URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/col/1/19/s_1108019']Col 1:19; [URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/col/2/9/s_1109009']Col 2:9[/URL][/URL][/URL]); and the Holy Spirit is God. (Act 5:3-4; [URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/mat/3/16/s_932016']Mat 3:16; [URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/mat/12/28/s_941028']Mat 12:28; [URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/mar/3/29/s_960029']Mar 3:29; [URL='https://www.blueletterbible.org/nkjv/luk/12/10/s_985010']Luk 12:10[/URL][/URL][/URL][/URL])
That is why Jesus commanded his apostles to baptize in the name of God which is: the Father, the son, and the Holy Spirit.

 

[Free]

where does He teach this?

Joh 8:24 "Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am He, you will die in your sins." (NASB)

He is italicized because it doesn’t appear in the Greek.

 

[Jim Parker]

He is italicized because it doesn’t appear in the Greek.

WHich renders the sentence:
"Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am, you will die in your sins."
"I AM" is the name that God used to identify Himself for Moses when HE spoke to Moses from the burning bush.
"I AM" is God's name.
By using it, Jesus said that He was God.

 

[jaybird]

Joh 8:24 "Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am He, you will die in your sins." (NASB)

He is italicized because it doesn’t appear in the Greek.

so what does appear in the original greek?
i always believed Jesus was referring to Himself as the Christ. people believed Jesus to be many things but it was Peter that gave the correct answer.
Matthew 16:13-20
13 Now when Jesus came into the district of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, “Who do people say that the Son of Man is?” 14 And they said, “Some say John the Baptist, others say Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets.” 15 He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?” 16 Simon Peter replied, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”

 

[Jim Parker]

so what does appear in the original greek?

"Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am, you will die in your sins."
"I AM" is the name that God used to identify Himself for Moses when HE spoke to Moses from the burning bush.
"I AM" is God's name.
By using it, Jesus said that He was God.

 

[Free]

so what does appear in the original greek?
i always believed Jesus was referring to Himself as the Christ. people believed Jesus to be many things but it was Peter that gave the correct answer.
Matthew 16:13-20
13 Now when Jesus came into the district of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, “Who do people say that the Son of Man is?” 14 And they said, “Some say John the Baptist, others say Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets.” 15 He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?” 16 Simon Peter replied, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”

Jesus’s answer is very clear and straightforward. There is simply no need to argue to Matt. 16. Doing so not only ignores the immediate context, it commits the fallacy of false dichotomy, as though Jesus cannot be both the I Am and the Son. Continuing in the context of John 8:

Joh 8:58 Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am." (NASB)

At least twice then in that chapter alone, Jesus refers to himself as “I Am”. The first time it is in reference to salvation, the second, to pre-existence. There cannot be any mistaking that Jesus is claiming divinity, claiming to be the I Am, and salvation is based in believing that.

Paul confirms this in Rom. 10:9-13.

 

[jaybird]

WHich renders the sentence:
"Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am, you will die in your sins."
"I AM" is the name that God used to identify Himself for Moses when HE spoke to Moses from the burning bush.
"I AM" is God's name.
By using it, Jesus said that He was God.

Exodus 3:14
God said to Moses, “ I AM WHO I AM.” And he said, “Say this to the people of Israel: ‘ I AM has sent me to you.’”
“ I AM WHO I AM.”
“ I AM.”
similar but not the same

 

[Free]

Exodus 3:14
God said to Moses, “ I AM WHO I AM.” And he said, “Say this to the people of Israel: ‘ I AM has sent me to you.’”
“ I AM WHO I AM.”
“ I AM.”
similar but not the same

It’s the same.

 

[jaybird]

Jesus’s answer is very clear and straightforward. There is simply no need to argue to Matt. 16. Doing so not only ignores the immediate context, it commits the fallacy of false dichotomy, as though Jesus cannot be both the I Am and the Son. Continuing in the context of John 8:

i agree, its pretty straight forward, He is the Christ and Peter confirms this.

Joh 8:58 Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am." (NASB)

At least twice then in that chapter alone, Jesus refers to himself as “I Am”. The first time it is in reference to salvation, the second, to pre-existence. There cannot be any mistaking that Jesus is claiming divinity, claiming to be the I Am, and salvation is based in believing that.

Paul confirms this in Rom. 10:9-13.

i believe Jesus existed before Abraham as well. but i still do not see in any of the passages Jesus commanding believers to believe He is the Most High? where is that passage?

 

[jaybird]

It’s the same.

five words is the same as two words?

 

[Free]

five words is the same as two words?

Selective reading, again.

Exo 3:14 God said to Moses, "I AM WHO I AM"; and He said, "Thus you shall say to the sons of Israel, 'I AM has sent me to you.'" (NASB)

One can easily notice that YHWH uses I AM of himself. That is exactly what Jesus uses of himself.

 

[Free]

i agree, its pretty straight forward, He is the Christ and Peter confirms this.


i believe Jesus existed before Abraham as well. but i still do not see in any of the passages Jesus commanding believers to believe He is the Most High? where is that passage?

Please respond seriously and directly to what I have written. I will not put up with such dishonest discussion.

 

[jaybird]

Please respond seriously and directly to what I have written. I will not put up with such dishonest discussion.

im serious, Peter did say Jesus was the Christ.

and the second use they are telling Jesus He is not yet 50, how could He have known Him, He says before Abraham He existed.
and where does Jesus command believers that they MUST believe He is the Most High?

 

[Free]

im serious, Peter did say Jesus was the Christ.

and the second use they are telling Jesus He is not yet 50, how could He have known Him, He says before Abraham He existed.
and where does Jesus command believers that they MUST believe He is the Most High?

I have the verse in John 8:24 but you are intent on not engaging with it. Please engage with it or don’t bother engaging in this thread anymore.

 

[jaybird]

I have the verse in John 8:24 but you are intent on not engaging with it. Please engage with it or don’t bother engaging in this thread anymore.

but john 8 24 does not have Jesus commanding anyone to believe He is the Most High?
Jesus says I am He. they ask Him who are you, He says the same one He has been saying since the beginning. that would be the Christ.

 

[Free]

but john 8 24 does not have Jesus commanding anyone to believe He is the Most High?
Jesus says I am He. they ask Him who are you, He says the same one He has been saying since the beginning. that would be the Christ.

You must be joking. I simply cannot take you seriously anymore.

http://christianforums.net/Fellowship/index.php?threads/trinitry-truth.73906/page-2#post-1417657

http://christianforums.net/Fellowship/index.php?threads/trinitry-truth.73906/page-2#post-1417661

 

[jaybird]

You must be joking. I simply cannot take you seriously anymore.

its pretty bold to say Jesus teaches one MUST believe He is the Most High when there is no scripture that says that.
John 8 24 does not say that, your adding an assumption and worse, your making that assumption a command from Jesus.
what does Jesus mean when He makes the statement, the Christ, the Most High, im not sure, im not the final authority, but i would never try and teach people, thats what Jesus really meant, as if i have the authority to speak for the Christ. my goodness!