End Times confusing

[escapefate]

I find that most things about the end times are confusing for people, getting 7 trumpets mixed up with 7 plagues and the Beast and the Anti-Christ.

I hate to admit that only until now in my mid 20s do i understand, or am beginning to understand what Ive been taught my whole life.

I understand the 7 trumpets and what they mean but I am not sure how the rapture fits into this. Do the 1st trumpet sound after the Rapture or is the rapture at the end of the 7th Trumpet. Is the 7th Trumpet end Christ's Second coming or is it only his Proclamation of his New Kingdom. Is the Rapture the second coming of Christ or will Christ not be present in the Rapture?

also I am confused about the role of the anti-christ and how he related to the Beast (the 8th King) Does the anti-christ simply get people to follow the beast?

And its also my understanding that the mark of the beast is only implemented after the Seven Plagues are released and the mark is used as a last ditch effort to cast out the remaining followers of Yahshua.It back fires in the face and their own economy fails and the people of the earth realize that Yahshua is providing divine protection to the remaining followers, so a universal death decree is signedto kill the 144,000but before it happens YahWeh speaks and causes an earthquake to destroy all structures on the planet. 45 Days pass and the world leaders realize the beast has deceived them and he is locked away.

I don't know what happens after that, does a new Holy City descend from the sky and a 1000 year reign of peace begin? after that 1000 years what happens?

I really REALLY don't want to be around for those 7 trumpets. Has anyone see the World Last Chance videos? I am not sure what church they are but they are very heavy on a Lunar Sabbath it seems.

 

[Sinthesis]

First, become familiar with the Old Testament. Most everything in Revelation has a corresponding analogue somewhere in the OT. The trials and tribulation of those in the OT are examples for everyone else.

 

[JLB]

I find that most things about the end times are confusing for people, getting 7 trumpets mixed up with 7 plagues and the Beast and the Anti-Christ.

I hate to admit that only until now in my mid 20s do i understand, or am beginning to understand what Ive been taught my whole life.

I understand the 7 trumpets and what they mean but I am not sure how the rapture fits into this. Do the 1st trumpet sound after the Rapture or is the rapture at the end of the 7th Trumpet. Is the 7th Trumpet end Christ's Second coming or is it only his Proclamation of his New Kingdom. Is the Rapture the second coming of Christ or will Christ not be present in the Rapture?

also I am confused about the role of the anti-christ and how he related to the Beast (the 8th King) Does the anti-christ simply get people to follow the beast?

And its also my understanding that the mark of the beast is only implemented after the Seven Plagues are released and the mark is used as a last ditch effort to cast out the remaining followers of Yahshua.It back fires in the face and their own economy fails and the people of the earth realize that Yahshua is providing divine protection to the remaining followers, so a universal death decree is signedto kill the 144,000but before it happens YahWeh speaks and causes an earthquake to destroy all structures on the planet. 45 Days pass and the world leaders realize the beast has deceived them and he is locked away.

I don't know what happens after that, does a new Holy City descend from the sky and a 1000 year reign of peace begin? after that 1000 years what happens?

I really REALLY don't want to be around for those 7 trumpets. Has anyone see the World Last Chance videos? I am not sure what church they are but they are very heavy on a Lunar Sabbath it seems.

I would suggest you study and learn what Jesus said first. Then Paul. Jesus' words are the foundation that Paul builds on.

Understanding Daniel's 70 weeks would be crucial as well.

First learn what these have to say, before you confuse yourself with the symbolic imagery of Revelation.

The Lord bless you as you draw near to Him and learn from the Spirit of Wisdom.


JLB

 

[John 8:32]

Just a few points...

Mat 24, Mark 13 and Luke 21 are very helpful. They are the keys to the seals...

1st Seal - Rev 6:2 And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer.

Mat 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
Mat 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

2nd Seal - Rev 6:3 And when he had opened the second seal, I heard the second beast say, Come and see.
Rev 6:4 And there went out another horse that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, and that they should kill one another: and there was given unto him a great sword.

Mat 24:7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

3rd Seal - Rev 6:5 And when he had opened the third seal, I heard the third beast say, Come and see. And I beheld, and lo a black horse; and he that sat on him had a pair of balances in his hand.
Rev 6:6 And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts say, A measure of wheat for a penny, and three measures of barley for a penny; and see thou hurt not the oil and the wine.

Mat 24:7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

4th Seal - Rev 6:7 And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see.
Rev 6:8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.

5th Seal - Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
Rev 6:11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

Mat 24:9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.
Mat 24:10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
Mat 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
Mat 24:12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
Mat 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

6th Seal - Rev 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
Rev 6:13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
Rev 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

7th Seal - is made up of the Seven Trumpets.

The Seventh and last Trump is the return of Christ and the 7 Last Plagues.

Revelation contains some inset chapters to help clarify, chapter 7 is an example, so is chapter 12.

The outline above will help to get you started.

 

[escapefate]

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

but the 4th Trumpet is also 1/3 of the light of the moon and sun darkened.

 

[John 8:32]

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

but the 4th Trumpet is also 1/3 of the light of the moon and sun darkened.

The sixth seal is the heavenly signs that announce the Tumpets. It is also a marker that the 2-1/2 years of Tribulation are completed and the 1 year of the Day of the Lord is beginning. When the fourth Trumpet sounds the light of the sun, moon and stars is reduced by 1/3. What causes this? Volcanic eruptions? Dust storms? The atmosphere clouded over somehow? The sun, moon and stars actually dimmed? God does not specifically tell us. But the heavenly signs (sixth seal) are not the same, it is not a dimming of the light; but rather an increase of intensity and sources.

 

[Sinthesis]

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

but the 4th Trumpet is also 1/3 of the light of the moon and sun darkened.

The real message here is metaphoric, and can be better understood through reading about the 'Days of the Lord' visited upon other cultures in the OT.

 

[John 8:32]

The real message here is metaphoric, and can be better understood through reading about the 'Days of the Lord' visited upon other cultures in the OT.

I would politely disagree, there is only one Day of the Lord, and nothing else compares to it...

Joe 2:1 Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the LORD cometh, for it is nigh at hand;
Joe 2:2 A day of darkness and of gloominess, a day of clouds and of thick darkness, as the morning spread upon the mountains: a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after it, even to the years of many generations.

 

[Hope of glory]

Dear Escapefate:
The "end times" or "last days" will continue to be confusing to you unless you come to terms with a couple of facts.
There will be no rapture
The "last days" scripture speaks of are not in our present or future but nearly 2000 yrs in our past
We are not in the last days, we are in the "day of the Lord"...the age of the Kingdom of God.

I'm not trying to be rude but you need an entire "paradigm shift", most Christians do. If you are interested as to why I say these things we can discuss them.

Your brother, Hope of glory

 

[Joe Domingo]

Dear Escapefate:
The "end times" or "last days" will continue to be confusing to you unless you come to terms with a couple of facts.
There will be no rapture
The "last days" scripture speaks of are not in our present or future but nearly 2000 yrs in our past
We are not in the last days, we are in the "day of the Lord"...the age of the Kingdom of God.

I'm not trying to be rude but you need an entire "paradigm shift", most Christians do. If you are interested as to why I say these things we can discuss them.

Your brother, Hope of glory

If you decide to explain this please warn me ..as I don't want to be confused by it. My head may spin right off LOL
Seriously though - I can't even say anything about your view that hasn't already been said by so many. We simply disagree. I for one see only one day of the Lord and that is the day the Lord brings his judgment to the world as told by the Prophets. I'm still here and so are you so that day has not come.

 

[John 8:32]

Dear Escapefate:
The "end times" or "last days" will continue to be confusing to you unless you come to terms with a couple of facts.
There will be no rapture
The "last days" scripture speaks of are not in our present or future but nearly 2000 yrs in our past
We are not in the last days, we are in the "day of the Lord"...the age of the Kingdom of God.

I'm not trying to be rude but you need an entire "paradigm shift", most Christians do. If you are interested as to why I say these things we can discuss them.

Your brother, Hope of glory

*******************************

 

[Hope of glory]

Do you agree with that statement John 8:32?

 

[John 8:32]

Do you agree with that statement John 8:32?

Yes, I disagree with Preterism.

 

[turnorburn]

What make and model..

tob

 

[Eugene]

Would it help understanding to start with the Lord's Day? Revelation 1:10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and go the directions and viewpoints John was shown from that perspective?

Revelation 1:19 Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter.

From that future beginning of the Lord's Day, John is shown things He has seen. the things occurring during this present time of the church described in Revelation Chapters Two and Three which I believe we're near to talked of in Revelation 3:16, and the things to start hereafter from that future start of the Lord's Day Revelation 4:1.

 

[n2thelight]

Dear Escapefate:
The "end times" or "last days" will continue to be confusing to you unless you come to terms with a couple of facts.
There will be no rapture
The "last days" scripture speaks of are not in our present or future but nearly 2000 yrs in our past
We are not in the last days, we are in the "day of the Lord"...the age of the Kingdom of God.

I'm not trying to be rude but you need an entire "paradigm shift", most Christians do. If you are interested as to why I say these things we can discuss them.

Your brother, Hope of glory

If we were in the Day of the Lord,we would not now be in flesh bodies

I Corinthians 15:50 "Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption."

I Corinthians 15:51 "Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,"

 

[John 8:32]

Dear Escapefate:

The "end times" or "last days" will continue to be confusing to you unless you come to terms with a couple of facts.
There will be no rapture
The "last days" scripture speaks of are not in our present or future but nearly 2000 yrs in our past
We are not in the last days, we are in the "day of the Lord"...the age of the Kingdom of God.

I'm not trying to be rude but you need an entire "paradigm shift", most Christians do. If you are interested as to why I say these things we can discuss them.

Your brother, Hope of glory

If we were in the Day of the Lord,we would not now be in flesh bodies

I Corinthians 15:50 "Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption."

I Corinthians 15:51 "Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,"

Isa 13:6 Howl ye; for the day of the LORD is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.
Isa 13:7 Therefore shall all hands be faint, and every man's heart shall melt:
Isa 13:8 And they shall be afraid: pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them; they shall be in pain as a woman that travaileth: they shall be amazed one at another; their faces shall be as flames.
Isa 13:9 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.
Isa 13:10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.
Isa 13:11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

Isa 34:8 For it is the day of the LORD'S vengeance, and the year of recompences for the controversy of Zion.

Jer 46:10 For this is the day of the Lord GOD of hosts, a day of vengeance, that he may avenge him of his adversaries: and the sword shall devour, and it shall be satiate and made drunk with their blood: for the Lord GOD of hosts hath a sacrifice in the north country by the river Euphrates.

Joe 1:15 Alas for the day! for the day of the LORD is at hand, and as a destruction from the Almighty shall it come.
Joe 1:16 Is not the meat cut off before our eyes, yea, joy and gladness from the house of our God?
Joe 1:17 The seed is rotten under their clods, the garners are laid desolate, the barns are broken down; for the corn is withered.
Joe 1:18 How do the beasts groan! the herds of cattle are perplexed, because they have no pasture; yea, the flocks of sheep are made desolate.
Joe 1:19 O LORD, to thee will I cry: for the fire hath devoured the pastures of the wilderness, and the flame hath burned all the trees of the field.
Joe 1:20 The beasts of the field cry also unto thee: for the rivers of waters are dried up, and the fire hath devoured the pastures of the wilderness.

Joe 2:1 Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the LORD cometh, for it is nigh at hand;
Joe 2:2 A day of darkness and of gloominess, a day of clouds and of thick darkness, as the morning spread upon the mountains: a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after it, even to the years of many generations.
Joe 2:3 A fire devoureth before them; and behind them a flame burneth: the land is as the garden of Eden before them, and behind them a desolate wilderness; yea, and nothing shall escape them.

You are confusing the Kingdom of God, established at the return of Christ, with the Day of the Lord. The Day of the Lord is the final year of the 3-1/2 years we call the Great Tribulation. It is the time God supernaturally intervenes and punishes men to bring them to repentance.

The Day of the Lord is heralded by the sixth seal, the heavenly signs...

Rev 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
Rev 6:13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
Rev 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
Rev 6:15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
Rev 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
Rev 6:17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Now beginning in Rev 8 we read about the Day of the Lord and it's purpose...

Rev 9:20 And the rest of the men which were not killed by these plagues yet repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk:
Rev 9:21 Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.

 

[Eugene]

Isa 13:6 Howl ye; for the day of the LORD is at hand

When do you think that Day of the Lord, the Lord's Day, and those things written of prophesy In that Day begin?

 

[John 8:32]

Isa 13:6 Howl ye; for the day of the LORD is at hand

When do you think that Day of the Lord, the Lord's Day, and those things written of prophesy In that Day begin?

2-1/2 years into what we call the Great Tribulation. What is labeled as the GT is the 3-1/2 year period prior to the Millenium. The first 2-1/2 years is pretty much man-made, the remaining year is the Day of the Lord and is God's direct intervention.

 

[Joe Domingo]

the Great day of the Lord.

I see this as the Last Day of this age, Yom Kippur, when all of mankind have died. Some will die from warring with the Messiah, the rest will die from scorching. After that it's judgment time.