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I have been confused by this question for a long time. When I believe in God, I believe that i will go to heaven if i die, because the book of Romans says: "For with the heart man believes to righteousness;and with the mouth confession is made to salvation." [Romans 10:10] I try my best to obey God's teaching and love everyone. but i can't do it entirely. I often sin and often confess. especially when i think about the Lord's word: "Not everyone who says to me, Lord, Lord, will go into the kingdom of heaven; but he who does the pleasure of my Father in heaven."[Matthew 7:12] I had no complain, no conflict, just accept everything no matter whether they are willing or unwilling. I tell myself, "Every frustration in your life is meaningful." But it is just outward behavior.The pain and the tangle deep inside still plagued me. What do you think of this question? Do you have the same puzzle? Have you found the way to solve this problem?
 
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Dear Sister sunshine, I came from such a religion that promoted doing and don'ting to the nth degree, ritual and tradition regulating everything we did, and yet with the promise if all went right until I died I might just make it, and that after I paid for all the forgiven sin paid for by Christ. When asked one time if I was saved I really didn't know what that really meant. I believed our Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and in my heart loved them, but knowing little more than what I was told.

There are Christians just as saved as me today that believe we can lose our salvation purchased for us by our Savior Jesus, or that we can even give it back. We have among us some that will not eat certain things, or observe certain days of obligation, and we read below that they are actually doing it to God in weakness, but we are to receive them; God does!!!
Rom 14:1 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.
Rom 14:2 For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.
Rom 14:3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.
Rom 14:6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

We are in a time of:
Rom 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
Rom 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed?
I'll leave of by posting a link to a pamphlet I wrote I hope will give you the safety we have in Christ. :wave2
Salvation with Security – 1, 2, 3
http://www.christianforums.net/Fell...ds/salvation-with-security-parts-1-2-3.52236/
 
"Not everyone who says to me, Lord, Lord, will go into the kingdom of heaven; but he who does the pleasure of my Father in heaven."[Matthew 7:12]

What pleasures the Father in Heaven, is that you have trusted in His Son.
If you've done this, then He will ALWAYS be pleasured with you, even tho you are a normal human being who fails, has issues, and is not always so perfect.......just like the rest of us.
Remember that God, came here, and lived as a human being, and understands how it feels to be human.
He knows that life is difficult and that we are "only human".
So, never be concerned that you have to earn God's love or that you have to be "good enough" for him to love you, and always know that God loves you just as you are, and saved you just as you are, and will never leave you and never let you go.
God is good all the time.
God is Love.
God loves you.
and remember that there is noone else like Jesus....
-
Nobody else like you..
-
 
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My Dear Sunshine. Welcome to our gang of fools for Christ. Your question is a valid one that many others wrestle with. You need to realize that our God is not some big puzzle for us to keep guessing how to please Him. The verse that you posted, plus a few more in the same context, tells the Truth.
Romans 10:9 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Romans 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Romans 10:11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Romans 10:12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved."

There it is Sunshine, direct from the Holy Lips of Almighty God. If you have done this you are biblically saved! So now, praise Jesus for your Salvation.
 
I have been confused by this question for a long time. When I believe in God, I believe that i will go to heaven if i die, because the book of Romans says: "For with the heart man believes to righteousness;and with the mouth confession is made to salvation." [Romans 10:10] I try my best to obey God's teaching and love everyone. but i can't do it entirely. I often sin and often confess. especially when i think about the Lord's word: "Not everyone who says to me, Lord, Lord, will go into the kingdom of heaven; but he who does the pleasure of my Father in heaven."[Matthew 7:12] I had no complain, no conflict, just accept everything no matter whether they are willing or unwilling. I tell myself, "Every frustration in your life is meaningful." But it is just outward behavior.The pain and the tangle deep inside still plagued me. What do you think of this question? Do you have the same puzzle? Have you found the way to solve this problem?

To all the other scripture that you have been provided, I would like to add the following:

Rom 2:6-10 For he (God) will render (give, reward) to every man according to his works: to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life; but for those who are factious and do not obey the truth, but obey wickedness, there will be wrath and fury.
There will be tribulation and distress for every human being who does evil, the Jew first and also the Greek, but glory and honor and peace for every one who does good, the Jew first and also the Greek
.

So, when you believed, you took the first step. Now act like you believe and continue to do the things that please God which, according to Mat 25:31-46, are acts of mercy and love. Sometimes (maybe often) you won't feel like it because you're too tired, or too busy, or you really don't like that person, but do your best to go ahead and be merciful and loving anyway.

By being loving and merciful, you are imitating God and that's what we were created for, to be like God. We were created in His image and likeness. If you're trying your best then you are pleasing God and you'll just keep getting better at it. :)

Rom 5:8 But God shows his love for us in that while we were yet sinners Christ died for us.

my 2 kopecks
iakov the fool
 
1 John 5:13

“These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.” its called a know so salvation if you truly meant what you said to Christ when you got saved from the heart . a true sincere heart Ephesians 2 :8
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9Not of works, lest any man should boast.

10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.. remember its from the heart the mouth only says the words
 
1 John 5:13

“These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.” its called a know so salvation if you truly meant what you said to Christ when you got saved from the heart . a true sincere heart

Ephesians 2 :8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them..

remember its from the heart the mouth only says the words

Why do you insist on ignoring Ro 2:6-10?

For he (God) will render to every man according to his works: to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life; but for those who are factious and do not obey the truth, but obey wickedness, there will be wrath and fury. There will be tribulation and distress for every human being who does evil, the Jew first and also the Greek but glory and honor and peace for every one who does good, the Jew first and also the Greek.

Is that in your Bible or not?

iakov the fool
 
Why do you insist on ignoring Ro 2:6-10?

For he (God) will render to every man according to his works: to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life; but for those who are factious and do not obey the truth, but obey wickedness, there will be wrath and fury. There will be tribulation and distress for every human being who does evil, the Jew first and also the Greek but glory and honor and peace for every one who does good, the Jew first and also the Greek.

Is that in your Bible or not?

iakov the fool
Have you ever sinned even once, and does the context of this chapter end with Verse 6?

Rom 2:6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds.

It appears that you are in real trouble if you are counting on your good deeds to save you from judgment. How is that?

Rom 2:12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law.

Rom 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God.
 
Have you ever sinned even once, and does the context of this chapter end with Verse 6?

Rom 2:6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds.

It appears that you are in real trouble if you are counting on your good deeds to save you from judgment. How is that?

Rom 2:12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law.

Rom 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God.
it appears some still want to live under the shadow of the law.. {It appears that you are in real trouble if you are counting on your good deeds to save you from judgment.} real big trouble work based salvation will not work . if it was of works there would be no need for the cross and his death burial resurrection ,,,,,,,,,
 
-who you talking to?

Of course I'm talking to you, Ezra. I responded to your post.

if me works follow salvation we are saved by grace . there are a lot of things in my bible if your talking to me. i can share them. but if your not talking to me . life goes on

Works do not AUTOMATICALLY follow belief, Ezra. A believer has to exercise his free will to do them; he has to exert some effort and it's going to cost him something.

The "Cheap Grace" Gospel of "faith without works" is specifically rejected by James. He said faith without works is dead and will not save anyone.

Why do you suppose he said that if good works just automatically flowed from the believer?
Why do you think Paul had to tell the church that they should not continue to sin?
Why do so many letters of the NT tell us what to DO if all we have to do is believe?

Of course we are saved by the grace of God. His grace and mercy is the only possibility of salvation. We don't deserve eternal life. We sinned and the wages of sin is death. God has saved mankind from those wages; all of mankind will be raised immortal and imperishable. (1 Cor 15) But no one will be given eternal life just for saying "I believe" without following up their belief with the effort to live a holy life.

We don't earn eternal life by doing good works. We were created to do good works. If I buy a car that doesn't run like it was created to do, I get rid of it. If we, who were created by God to do good works, don't do those good works, we can expect to be rejected by God.

Luke 6:46 Why do you call me 'Lord, Lord,' and not do what I tell you?

Why would you tell anyone that good works are unnecessary? If we don't do what Jesus commanded then He isn't our Lord and we're not getting any eternal life.

my 2 kopecks
iakov the fool
 
Of course I'm talking to you, Ezra. I responded to your post.



Works do not AUTOMATICALLY follow belief, Ezra. A believer has to exercise his free will to do them; he has to exert some effort and it's going to cost him something.

The "Cheap Grace" Gospel of "faith without works" is specifically rejected by James. He said faith without works is dead and will not save anyone.

Why do you suppose he said that if good works just automatically flowed from the believer?
Why do you think Paul had to tell the church that they should not continue to sin?
Why do so many letters of the NT tell us what to DO if all we have to do is believe?

Of course we are saved by the grace of God. His grace and mercy is the only possibility of salvation. We don't deserve eternal life. We sinned and the wages of sin is death. God has saved mankind from those wages; all of mankind will be raised immortal and imperishable. (1 Cor 15) But no one will be given eternal life just for saying "I believe" without following up their belief with the effort to live a holy life.

We don't earn eternal life by doing good works. We were created to do good works. If I buy a car that doesn't run like it was created to do, I get rid of it. If we, who were created by God to do good works, don't do those good works, we can expect to be rejected by God.

Luke 6:46 Why do you call me 'Lord, Lord,' and not do what I tell you?

Why would you tell anyone that good works are unnecessary? If we don't do what Jesus commanded then He isn't our Lord and we're not getting any eternal life.

my 2 kopecks
iakov the fool
ya know what with a remark like The "Cheap Grace" Gospel of "faith without works" is specifically rejected by James .is not even worth my time to reply to . for one thats not what james is writing about. 2. your so far out in left field at this point .i doubt you find home plate. 3. for the RECORD GRACE IS NOT CHEAP . GOOD NIGHT TO YOU. i will not answer a foolish question . i would love to wade in on this.. but i aint. take 2 aspirin check in with me in the morning sigh * your not worth the time your blinded by religious legalism :confused:screwloose2
 
ya know what with a remark like The "Cheap Grace" Gospel of "faith without works" is specifically rejected by James .is not even worth my time to reply to . for one thats not what james is writing about. 2. your so far out in left field at this point .i doubt you find home plate. 3. for the RECORD GRACE IS NOT CHEAP . GOOD NIGHT TO YOU. i will not answer a foolish question . i would love to wade in on this.. but i aint. take 2 aspirin check in with me in the morning sigh * your not worth the time your blinded by religious legalism :confused:screwloose2

yawn
 
yawn all you want when you learn what the Bible has to say look me up {{ Of course we are saved by the grace of God. His grace and mercy is the only possibility of salvation. We don't deserve eternal life. We sinned and the wages of sin is death. God has saved mankind from those wages; all of mankind will be raised immortal and imperishable. (1 Cor 15) But no one will be given eternal life just for saying "I believe" without following up their belief with the effort to live a holy life.

We don't earn eternal life by doing good works. We were created to do good works. If I buy a car that doesn't run like it was created to do, I get rid of it. If we, who were created by God to do good works, don't do those good works, we can expect to be rejected by God. }}

what do you think Ephesians chapter 2 reads saved by grace through FAITH NOT OF OUR SELF. contrary to your legalistic belief God is not up in heaven just waiting to zap us with fire if we mess up . i suggest you read your bible more closer if your the type who thinks that at the first sin you commit .that your salvation is lost if eel sorry for you. on the other hand Grace was never a license to sin . if a person is using Grace as a opportunity ( continuing in that sin never repenting ) there is a good chance you was never saved .
 
when you learn what the Bible has to say look me up

What makes you think you know?

What qualifies you to be the Bible expert you seem to imagine you are?

Apparently you think that obedience to the Lord Jesus is "legalism."

what do you think Ephesians chapter 2 reads saved by grace through FAITH NOT OF OUR SELF.

Did you mean "WHY do you think..."?
Is that a question? Written questions end with a question mark, not a period.

As I have said, our salvation is completely the work of God. There is nothing we can do to earn salvation.
BUT faith without obedience is what the demons have. They believe that Jesus is the Christi, the son of the living God, and they have the good sense to tremble. I don't want to be in that same category so, I'm doing my best to not only believe in Jesus but also obey His commands.

Do you love Jesus? then do what He said at John 14:15: "If ye love me, keep my commandments."

contrary to your legalistic belief God is not up in heaven just waiting to zap us with fire if we mess up . ......... if your the type who thinks that at the first sin you commit .that your salvation is lost

I never suggested anything like that. Please don't make up nonsense and ascribe it to me.


Have a nice day.

iakov the fool
 
edited reba

Violation of 2.10 .. and mostly another gospel
 
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yawn all you want when you learn what the Bible has to say look me up {{ Of course we are saved by the grace of God. His grace and mercy is the only possibility of salvation. We don't deserve eternal life. We sinned and the wages of sin is death. God has saved mankind from those wages; all of mankind will be raised immortal and imperishable. (1 Cor 15) But no one will be given eternal life just for saying "I believe" without following up their belief with the effort to live a holy life.

We don't earn eternal life by doing good works. We were created to do good works. If I buy a car that doesn't run like it was created to do, I get rid of it. If we, who were created by God to do good works, don't do those good works, we can expect to be rejected by God. }}

what do you think Ephesians chapter 2 reads saved by grace through FAITH NOT OF OUR SELF. contrary to your legalistic belief God is not up in heaven just waiting to zap us with fire if we mess up . i suggest you read your bible more closer if your the type who thinks that at the first sin you commit .that your salvation is lost if eel sorry for you. on the other hand Grace was never a license to sin . if a person is using Grace as a opportunity ( continuing in that sin never repenting ) there is a good chance you was never saved .
Solid answer! The day I was saved my entire life, not my Sunday Life, was changed and the love in my heart of hearts wanted nothing more than to do the works that glorified the Triune God.
 
Did you mean "WHY do you think..."?
Is that a question? Written questions end with a question mark, not a period.
Jim,
That is a nasty habit and it is picking a fight. He might have structured his response a bit softer but then maybe God did not influence him to do that. Your nit picking is akin to, if you did not like it because I have an 8th grade GED, does not matter about the question mark, you knew it was a question.
 
We are all looking for answers, seeking how to be, and even if we can be as we should be. And where to draw the line, if we don't measure up. Is the line at, our trying, the thought hat counts, the faith and acceptance of Jesus, and faith and acceptance of God. There is the side of the line for what can we do, and then there is the side of the line, haven't we done enough? Or even can we do enough?

God has been so kind to us, even to call Himself our Father. Jesus encourages us to do this too. And I think for me looking at those aspects of how much do we do, in the same way a child does with their own dad looks at those issues, it's helped me fit an understanding around some of it. I have hope that it's close to being right, if it's not right.

Here's what I mean. Some time ago, when I was a cub living with my parents, I was doing something wrong, that I knew was wrong, but it was so enjoyable, exciting, and addicting I could only try and hide it from everyone around me, and hide it from my parents as well. For me the wrong that my dad confronted me on was going on the computer and looking up pornographic pictures. When he confronted me on it though, it was in a way out of sympthy, and he told me he knew this is a hard struggle and easy temptation, but that I needed to quit. I was so ashamed to be caught, and knew how awful it was, and that my dad has to be ashamed of me as well. But still he came to me at that time gently.

Now that story comes from my family not yours or anyone else's, and holds the dynamics between myself and my dad's relationship. But for me it was a lesson to me, even in the wrongs I do, the ones that makes everyone ashamed to even approach, my dad still loves me. With that in mind be strengthened. God loves us all and all of heaven celebrates when a sinner turns to God, and seeks to be his. Even to the extent to celebrate this more then celebrating the ones who stayed true. God loves us, let that strengthen you as you learn and try and struggle with how much you should do, how much is enough, and if believing is enough.

Move on from that comfort of love, then there are the tasks at hand that we are charged with doing or not doing. From the start of Moses giving the Laws throughout the history of Isreal, there is a history of God saying His expectations, relieving the stresses of the nation once they turn back to Him, or letting them fall into the pits of punishments when they stray away. There are expectations, there are blessings and there are punishments, but wait there's more still. There is also praising God, there is fellowship, there is strength in faith such as in Job, Daniel, Ruth, and Ester, where each story had it's hardships and needed to rely on God to make it through. In all of it there is so much to learn, and if we can understand it, we can apply those lessons to our lives.

Now if we are God's family, and He truly is our Father, there is at play the lessons and the love a father teaches us, but there is also a strength in relationship as well. Our praise and worship I think is a joy to God, and it also give us strength in our Love for Him. Our fellowship also will help us or give us struggles. Depending on whether our fellowship is there with others who will strengthen us, encourage us, and Know God too, or if they are those that we are called to be a kindness to, but are the ones that make us question the right way. There are more then one kind of fellowships. Many kinds of friendships, and many habits, actions, and perspectives that hopefully strengthen us to God more. Try and gather at least a few stable aspects in your life to strengthen your relationship with God, and you'll be blessed for it.

Every time I hear someone say they are far away from their parents or the rest of their family, and they are glad for that, it make me sad for them. And I think how lucky I am to be close to my parents and my brothers, and that I need to tent to that more then I do, so that I don't lose that someday down the road.

Sorry for the long rant, but what I'm trying to say is this. God loves us, and our relationship with Him can be influenced by our actions. He will still love us, but the relationship will be stronger if we have the elements in our lives to stay in love with God too. Follow Him, strive with love for everyone, praisvHim, and say close to the Word, with our own study or bible study in groups.

Either way, be strengthened. The Good news of Jesus is that the creator of the universe loves us, calls us to be His own, and has paid a fierce price to buy us back from our sins and our shames. Love Him for it, and praise Him for His love, whenever you see it.
 
I have been confused by this question for a long time. When I believe in God, I believe that i will go to heaven if i die, because the book of Romans says: "For with the heart man believes to righteousness;and with the mouth confession is made to salvation." [Romans 10:10] I try my best to obey God's teaching and love everyone. but i can't do it entirely. I often sin and often confess. especially when i think about the Lord's word: "Not everyone who says to me, Lord, Lord, will go into the kingdom of heaven; but he who does the pleasure of my Father in heaven."[Matthew 7:12] I had no complain, no conflict, just accept everything no matter whether they are willing or unwilling. I tell myself, "Every frustration in your life is meaningful." But it is just outward behavior.The pain and the tangle deep inside still plagued me. What do you think of this question? Do you have the same puzzle? Have you found the way to solve this problem?

There is no puzzle. We bring nothing to the table. Salvation is not and cannot be based on sinful people, because of sin. So, end of that conversation.

As to the many dictates that we falsely perceive as 'dire,' they can all be addressed just as easily. We all bear an evil conscience. An imperfect conscience consisting of good and evil.

The evil that we are subjected to is of the tempter. This evil is internal. The tempter will not be moving on, past this earth or past the cross. Their evil game ends here, in the dead dust of our bodies.

Where we read "depart from me ye workers of iniquity" we should perceive that sin is of the devil (1 John 3:8) and we all sin, Gal. 3:22 among others. There is, simply, more than one party to the axiom's of sin. Can we hear "depart from me ye workers of iniquity?" And not be "damned to hell?" We should be honest and realize we "all" work iniquity and not shun to hear His Words, and think ourselves "immune."

Of course, if we realize our construction includes the tempter. We should not fear to hear God's Words of Life, and they are ALL LIFE to believers. They also address the workers of iniquity in our flesh, IN OUR BEHALF.

Jesus said that man shall live by every Word of God. Yes, even the bad ones. Matt. 4:4, Luke 4:4. When Jesus looked at Peter and addressed Satan Jesus was not talking to Peter, but rebuking Satan "in Peter." Was that detrimental to Satan or Peter? The answer should be obvious.

We are to be "turned" at His Rebukes, and understand "to whom" they are directed.
 

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