Atheist?

[ProdigalSon]

Id like to start out by saying that I'm not trying to offend or ruffle feathers.
but i do call my self an atheist, id if anyone had any questions for an atheist, Id be happy to oblige my main reasoning behind this is that i don't really have a lot of contact with anyone of religious background and i would love to bounce idea's back and forth.

By no means to i intend to show disrespect. as i think we i could have a dicussion with anyone on a mature level.

 

[duval]

Hi Prodigal

I have never had any trouble believing in God or the Bible. I'm always interested in sincere reasons others may have for not believing the same. I have a friendly ear and perhaps you can help me grow.

Duval

 

[ChattyMute]

Hi Prodigal

I have never had any trouble believing in God or the Bible. I'm always interested in sincere reasons others may have for not believing the same. I have a friendly ear and perhaps you can help me grow.

Duval

Well, I'm also an atheist, so I hope you don't mind if I chime in.

For starters I don't think I ever truly believed. I sincerely tried, but I can't force myself to believe something I don't. Also in my opinion, there are other belief systems out there that make more sense than Christianity. So that also contributes to me being a non-Christian. The concept of God in general doesn't make sense to me. I understand it in most cases, but it seems a little more on the irrational side (I mean no offense) in my view. In addition, I like evidence for things I believe in. I see no evidence for the Christian God that couldn't be explained naturally or be contributed to another God/gods. There are probably more reasons, but I can't think of any right now.

If this helps any, I've never had any bad experiences with the church or Christians. In fact, I loved my church. Still do in some ways.

 

[Ed the Ned]

I have a few questions?

What happens when you die?

What is your desire to live.

Who are you accountable to?

Where do differences between right and wrong come from. (Moral Code)

How do you explain Biblical prophecy and the accuracy thereof?

 

[logical bob]

I have a few questions?

I hope you don't mind if I have a go, given our recent exchange.

What happens when you die?

You die. That's it.

What is your desire to live.

Sorry, I'm not really sure what you mean.

Who are you accountable to?

My family, my friends, my community and myself.

Where do differences between right and wrong come from. (Moral Code)

From our upbringing, families and society. From our own feelings and judgements. From the need to live together as social animals.

How do you explain Biblical prophecy and the accuracy thereof?

I am not persuaded of the accuracy thereof.

 

[ChattyMute]

I have a few questions?

Okay.

What happens when you die?

You die. That's it. I have met a few atheists online who believe in an afterlife though.

What is your desire to live.

Why do I desire to live? Because it's the only life I've got, and I'm going to use it while I have it. For all the good and bad in this world.

Who are you accountable to?

Myself, and those around me are also taken into consideration.

Where do differences between right and wrong come from. (Moral Code)

Human empathy and social upbringing.

How do you explain Biblical prophecy and the accuracy thereof?

There's nothing to explain. The accuracy isn't nearly enough, if there at all.

 

[Mysteryman]

[quote="Ed the Ned":1gzkecx6]I have a few questions?

I hope you don't mind if I have a go, given our recent exchange.

What happens when you die?

You die. That's it.

What is your desire to live.

Sorry, I'm not really sure what you mean.

Who are you accountable to?

My family, my friends, my community and myself.

Where do differences between right and wrong come from. (Moral Code)

From our upbringing, families and society. From our own feelings and judgements. From the need to live together as social animals.

How do you explain Biblical prophecy and the accuracy thereof?

I am not persuaded of the accuracy thereof.[/quote:1gzkecx6]


Hi Bob

When do you see your view of morality being hindered in some way ?

Many people live by different standards of morality, but is it not true that confusion is based upon the fact that there is no foundation by which one can draw from ? For instance, here in the USA , our standard for driving a car is to drive on the right side of the road. And to drive at a certain speed on a given road. If everyone had a different view of how to drive their car. Wouldn't that cause confusion ? Well, isn't that the same when it comes to everyone having their own standard of morality ? Confusion resulting ?

 

[Ed the Ned]

Firstly regards to Biblical prophecy, and I may be wrong here, I dont think you have done enough homework. You are both (Bob and chattymute) stating you are athiests, being athiest how much time do you spend reading or studying the Bible and what it has to say. You claim that Biblical prophecy is not accurate. From what level of knowledge are you making those comments from?

 

[logical bob]

Hi Ed. I'd be happy to debate prophecy with you if you want, but is there honestly any point? It seems likely you'll either say that I'm attacking your faith because I don't agree with you or bring out that big list of "God makes the wise foolish" quotes that indicates you have little use for rational discussion.

If we're going to have this discussion, could you agree at the outset that you'll allow me to express my opinions and that you'll be willing to subject yours to proper scrutiny? Otherwise we'll be posting at cross purposes.

And again you make assumptions about atheists - in this case that we don't know our way round the Bible.

If you want to talk me through a fulfilled prophecy then I'm listening.

 

[seekandlisten]

I'd like to hear the Athiest's perspective on the whole 'Out Campaign' and such 'movements' in support of Athiesm. I agree to a certain extent with some of the issues that are being addressed but I am seeing a trend towards being very 'religious like'. The view that an Athiest holds no beliefs in a god or religion seems to be changing towards a 'set of beliefs' or 'movement' insinuating the same 'idea' as a religion. Thoughts?

cheers

(I asked this in another thread but figured it fit better here so I deleted and moved it.)

 

[ChattyMute]

Firstly regards to Biblical prophecy, and I may be wrong here, I dont think you have done enough homework. You are both (Bob and chattymute) stating you are athiests, being athiest how much time do you spend reading or studying the Bible and what it has to say. You claim that Biblical prophecy is not accurate. From what level of knowledge are you making those comments from?

No one has ever shown me a reason that the Bible is truth, so I take the prophesies the same way. I'm not all that good at debating, so I'll leave most of it up to bob (maybe contributing every now and then).

Reading the Bible has nothing to do with being an atheist. I don't have to read Hindu religious texts to know I don't believe in Hindu gods.

I'd like to hear the Athiest's perspective on the whole 'Out Campaign' and such 'movements' in support of Athiesm. I agree to a certain extent with some of the issues that are being addressed but I am seeing a trend towards being very 'religious like'. The view that an Athiest holds no beliefs in a god or religion seems to be changing towards a 'set of beliefs' or 'movement' insinuating the same 'idea' as a religion. Thoughts?

cheers

(I asked this in another thread but figured it fit better here so I deleted and moved it.)

Some atheists are religious like. For example, to state with full certainty that there is no God/gods (being a gnostic atheist) takes faith because there is no evidence for that positive claim.

The agnostic atheist view however is not religious. Many agnostic atheists believe some of the same things, but not everything. And believing in these certain things are not required to be an atheist, and no one I know of claims them to be.

Did I answer you question, or did you mean something else?

 

[seekandlisten]

Some atheists are religious like. For example, to state with full certainty that there is no God/gods (being a gnostic atheist) takes faith because there is no evidence for that positive claim.

The agnostic atheist view however is not religious. Many agnostic atheists believe some of the same things, but not everything. And believing in these certain things are not required to be an atheist, and no one I know of claims them to be.

Did I answer you question, or did you mean something else?

Pretty much. I don't believe in religion for the very reason of making 'absolute claims'. Athiests like yourself, bob, and promoters as Dawkins I can respect for the reasons put behind the belief. Same goes for some Christians and Muslims I have met that follow their religion with humility and don't assert their beliefs on you or at least do it repectfully. I see this trend of Athiests moving to be more like the 'religious' type and question it as it almost seems as 'fake' as other religions.

I also ask myself if one doesn't believe in god/gods why must they label themself, do note I realize everyone 'assumes' a label even without making the definite 'choice.' An example of what I'm getting at here is I don't believe in unicorns but I don't need to form a group that agrees with me. Do you see what I'm getting at? Now I understand that when you tell someone you don't believe in 'God', the term Athiest logically follows but I wonder why the need to 'form a group'? But I guess in the same sense, just like all religions, there will be 'poseurs' right?

I just throwing thoughts out there so correct me if I'm wrong in any of my assumptions.

cheers

 

[ChattyMute]

Pretty much. I don't believe in religion for the very reason of making 'absolute claims'. Athiests like yourself, bob, and promoters as Dawkins I can respect for the reasons put behind the belief. Same goes for some Christians and Muslims I have met that follow their religion with humility and don't assert their beliefs on you or at least do it repectfully. I see this trend of Athiests moving to be more like the 'religious' type and question it as it almost seems as 'fake' as other religions.

I also ask myself if one doesn't believe in god/gods why must they label themself, do note I realize everyone 'assumes' a label even without making the definite 'choice.' An example of what I'm getting at here is I don't believe in unicorns but I don't need to form a group that agrees with me. Do you see what I'm getting at? Now I understand that when you tell someone you don't believe in 'God', the term Athiest logically follows but I wonder why the need to 'form a group'? But I guess in the same sense, just like all religions, there will be 'poseurs' right?

I just throwing thoughts out there so correct me if I'm wrong in any of my assumptions.

cheers

The people you talk about I've noticed to be arrogant teens in rebellion (though just because you are teen atheist does not mean you are in rebellion) or people who are just generally stupid. There are people like that in all groups.

Theists label us as such. Some do it to separate themselves from theists. I take that label as part of my many, many other labels because it is a quick summary of what I do not believe for theists (assuming that person actually knows what an agnostic atheist is).

I do see what you are getting at, but there also aren't proclaimed unicorn believers out there who come together every Sunday to discuss and further their faiths and/or try to get others to believe in the same thing. At least not that I know of. If the whole world was basically one faith, or lack of faith, such as people not believing in unicorns, then I doubt the labels would continue to be used. Did that make sense?

And yes, in every group.

 

[seekandlisten]

The people you talk about I've noticed to be arrogant teens in rebellion (though just because you are teen atheist does not mean you are in rebellion) or people who are just generally stupid. There are people like that in all groups.

Theists label us as such. Some do it to separate themselves from theists. I take that label as part of my many, many other labels because it is a quick summary of what I do not believe for theists (assuming that person actually knows what an agnostic atheist is).

I do see what you are getting at, but there also aren't proclaimed unicorn believers out there who come together every Sunday to discuss and further their faiths and/or try to get others to believe in the same thing. At least not that I know of. If the whole world was basically one faith, or lack of faith, such as people not believing in unicorns, then I doubt the labels would continue to be used. Did that make sense?

And yes, in every group.

Yes that does clarify a couple of things for me. Thanks

 

[seekandlisten]

What is the general opinion of the 'Out Campaign'? For it, against it, mixed feelings?

I actually agree with the 'issue' being addressed in other events such as the 'Smut for Smut' demonstration, but the 'Out Campaign' not so sure as I agree.

cheers

 

[ChattyMute]

What is the general opinion of the 'Out Campaign'? For it, against it, mixed feelings?

I actually agree with the 'issue' being addressed in other events such as the 'Smut for Smut' demonstration, but the 'Out Campaign' not so sure as I agree.

cheers

I don't even know what that is... *goes to look it up*
I like the intentions. It's looking to shows theists that atheists can be bad and good just like everyone else, and it is trying to help atheist to not be afraid of hiding what they believe. Nothing wrong in that.
I don't see anything particularly dogmatic about it from a quick glance, except for separation of church and state.

 

[seekandlisten]

What is the general opinion of the 'Out Campaign'? For it, against it, mixed feelings?

I actually agree with the 'issue' being addressed in other events such as the 'Smut for Smut' demonstration, but the 'Out Campaign' not so sure as I agree.

cheers

I don't even know what that is... *goes to look it up*
I like the intentions. It's looking to shows theists that atheists can be bad and good just like everyone else, and it is trying to help atheist to not be afraid of hiding what they believe. Nothing wrong in that.
I don't see anything particularly dogmatic about it from a quick glance, except for separation of church and state.

I see your point. I agree that the athiest shouldn't have to hide their beliefs. The issue I had was more along the lines of 'get the t-shirt and join us attitude' giving it the 'religious vibe'. The intentions behind it I don't necessarily disagree with. I guess like any cause it is promoting awareness which I can support.

 

[Mysteryman]

Since Christians believe that we have eternal life, and atheist do not. We feel that we are not wasting our time on such a forum because time is not the issue.

However, why does an atheist waste thier precious time here, since time is of the most importance to them ? You know -- live just so long and die and its all over ! Why not spend your precious time somewhere else , since you could die tomorrow and all of this time spent here is for naught ?

 

[logical bob]

I see where seekandlisten is coming from regarding the Out Campaign and the new atheism in general. I was pretty dismayed when the British Secular Society put posters on the side of London buses saying "There is probably no God." It seemed to me like taking on one of the less appealing characteristics of religion.

I raised similar questions at RDF and the reaction I got was that it was fine for Europeans, who don't really encounter much in the way of religion, but that if you live in parts of America it can be hard to be honest about your atheism. I was hearing from people who made the experience of "coming out" sound as traumatic as it is for gay people from conservative backgrounds. It was also pointed out that things are even worse in some countries since some Muslims believe that apostates should be killed. All this meant that people wanted to belong to a movement for support. I couldn't really argue with that, and I was reminded of it yesterday when I saw a documentary which said that 40% of Americans believe that the world will end with a battle between Christ and Antichrist at Armageddon. I find it hard to imagine living in a place like that.

I think also that people do get angry about some aspects of fundamentalist Islam and, in America, fundamentalist Christianity - and especially their influence on public life. It's not surprising that that anger focuses itself on a sort of counter-movement.

That said, I've never felt the slightest desire to buy a T-shirt or go to a convention.

 

[duval]

Hi folks

I would like to have someone take a prophesy of the Messiah and from the standpoint of the atheist show how it falls short. I make this request only that I might study it and compare it with my understanding of it.

duval