Do Denominational Differences Really Matter?

[Rollo Tamasi]

I don't know much about SDA, but I don't think Mormon or JW are cults. I don't agree with them, but I have to hold out hope that God saves us even if we don't understand everything right. That by faith in Jesus, we are given Salvation. Because if that's not true, then there's no hope for any of us. Mormon's have extra books along with the bible. Those books I think are a sham, but I don't think they refuse their faith in Jesus or in God. Jehovah Witnesses studied the bible and developed many other theologies that aren't shared among other Christian groups, but I think their faith and trust in Jesus, and in God is still very real.

I think you need to sit down and discuss Jesus with both these groups and then see if you come away with the same beliefs you have now.

 

[Douglas Summers]

Ben Carson is a Seventh-day Adventist.

Is the SDA, Mormon, and JW churches cults?

Two of them are cults. SDA is not a cult. They believe that salvation is solely by grace and the Ten Commandments give quality of life to the Christian, which comes from the new man. They live by the law as an example for peace and tranquility , not under the law. This can only be done by the Spirit in that the law summed up is to love the Lord with all your heart mind and soul, and to love your neighbor as yourself. But any man who lives under the law is condemned already.

 

[smaller]

I do believe it is important for denominations to be honest about their faith, however, some of the differences are vexatious or no longer relevant. For example, the distinction between Eastern and Oriental Orthodoxy was relevant and important in the fourth and fifth centuries due to the compound problems created by Nestorius on the one hand and Eutyches on the other, but now is obsolete, and given the degree to which for example the Antiochians and Syriacs are suffering what amounts to a genocide, and the Copts and Greek Orthodox of Alexandria keep experiencing religious violence, there is no rationale for that schism to continue.

Well, obviously the "trouble" is that these sects have all tossed the only my group is right "heresy bombs" into each others camps. And now, to try to unwind that mess means that SOMEBODIES have to admit, IN WRITING, they were WRONG and move on.

They are going to have to suck back those bombs.

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

I think you need to sit down and discuss Jesus with both these groups and then see if you come away with the same beliefs you have now.

Maybe I should. With the focused topic of Jesus. Not anything else. But I don't know if that'll change my view. My view is based on how important knowledge is, because in Christian perspectives there are many views countering each other and in general still debated hotly by mature Christians, not just babes in the faith. For instance whether we are saved by faith, or by deeds, and what the difference is when we are called to have both faith and good actions brings a mix of understanding that a person can struggle with for years. there are many topics that we all don't share the same understanding with and disagree with one another about, even in the sitution where we are among Christians.

To further the point though, look at Proverbs 3:5, and Psalms 118:8. In both of those verses they convey to trust in God more then we do our own understanding, or in man's understanding. In other places of the bible it's said the value of being wise, and that wisdom comes with having many counselors, or at least listening to more then just yourself. So the bible is not saying to reject what others say or not seek wise consol, but that God is better then our understandings. Take that a step further and maybe even those who don't understand God!'s word correctly can still be saved. Right now that's my own personal hope too.

 

[smaller]

I "purposefully" DUMBED DOWN my sights with "all" christians to this simplicity, if for no other reason, to look favorably upon them for my "own good." This is my only doctrine at this point:

Romans 10:13
For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Maybe I should. With the focused topic of Jesus. Not anything else. But I don't know if that'll change my view. My view is based on how important knowledge is, because in Christian perspectives there are many views countering each other and in general still debated hotly by mature Christians, not just babes in the faith. For instance whether we are saved by faith, or by deeds, and what the difference is when we are called to have both faith and good actions brings a mix of understanding that a person can struggle with for years. there are many topics that we all don't share the same understanding with and disagree with one another about, even in the sitution where we are among Christians.

To further the point though, look at Proverbs 3:5, and Psalms 118:8. In both of those verses they convey to trust in God more then we do our own understanding, or in man's understanding. In other places of the bible it's said the value of being wise, and that wisdom comes with having many counselors, or at least listening to more then just yourself. So the bible is not saying to reject what others say or not seek wise consol, but that God is better then our understandings. Take that a step further and maybe even those who don't understand God!'s word correctly can still be saved. Right now that's my own personal hope too.

Okay.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

I "purposefully" DUMBED DOWN my sights with "all" christians to this simplicity, if for no other reason, to look favorably upon them for my "own good." This is my only doctrine at this point:

Romans 10:13
For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Okay.

 

[smaller]

Okay.

I reject that anyone will be saved by having Trinity crib notes in their back pockets to recite at the Pearly Gates, BUT I accept that the Trinity is the most accurate description of the Godhead.

This description "helps" me to understand other "erroneous" descriptions, but it did NOT save me, or anyone else for that matter.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

I reject that anyone will be saved by having Trinity crib notes in their back pockets to recite at the Pearly Gates, BUT I accept that the Trinity is the most accurate description of the Godhead.

This description "helps" me to understand other "erroneous" descriptions, but it did NOT save me, or anyone else for that matter.

Believing that Jesus is God is what saved me.

 

[smaller]

Believing that Jesus is God is what saved me.

I think it's probably good to realize that "sincerity" of said beliefs can only be perceived by the holder, and not by creed incantations.

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

Okay.

Sorry Rollo if I came on too strong. I really do think it's a good idea to talk to those groups about their thoughts on Jesus. If it gets caught up in other subjects, it's easy to get caught up with them about being right or wrong. But for the most part I don't know how Mormons think of Jesus, and I think focusing on Jesus might shed light on JWs too, even though I know they don't accept Jesus as God, I don't know if they think Jesus is our example to be like or our salvation as well.

Sorry I got carried away trying to explain my thoughts. Any suggestions on questions or verses to bring up if I get the chance to talk to either a Mormon, or a JW about Jesus?

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Sorry Rollo if I came on too strong. I really do think it's a good idea to talk to those groups about their thoughts on Jesus. If it gets caught up in other subjects, it's easy to get caught up with them about being right or wrong. But for the most part I don't know how Mormons think of Jesus, and I think focusing on Jesus might shed light on JWs too, even though I know they don't accept Jesus as God, I don't know if they think Jesus is our example to be like or our salvation as well.

Sorry I got carried away trying to explain my thoughts. Any suggestions on questions or verses to bring up if I get the chance to talk to either a Mormon, or a JW about Jesus?

I have my own watchtower bible.
When I read the Bible and come across a passage that I know contradicts what they believe, I high light it in the watchtower.
Sometimes I find passages in the watchtower that contradicts themselves.
Needless to say, not many want to come my way and talk.

 

[reba]

When we claim to be of Christ and worship any denomination something aint right..
No harm in liking traditions
No harm in liking real laid back
No harm in meeting on Saturday
No harm in meeting on Wednesday nite
No harm in a head covering
No harm in showing emotions
it is when these type of things over shadow the gospel there is harm...
when we KNOW we are right and THEY are wrong..
God will find His sheep where ever they are... in a bar in a pew.
when the small c church one attends means more then the BIG C Church..
we do not have the same personalities ... example my sister loves to dress up i live in jeans and T shirts she likes tradition i like laid back

we both love the Lord.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

When we claim to be of Christ and worship any denomination something aint right..
No harm in liking traditions
No harm in liking real laid back
No harm in meeting on Saturday
No harm in meeting on Wednesday nite
No harm in a head covering
No harm in showing emotions
it is when these type of things over shadow the gospel there is harm...
when we KNOW we are right and THEY are wrong..
God will find His sheep where ever they are... in a bar in a pew.
when the small c church one attends means more then the BIG C Church..
we do not have the same personalities ... example my sister loves to dress up i live in jeans and T shirts she likes tradition i like laid back

we both love the Lord.

Amen sister,
com'on!!

 

[MrWGW]

Well, obviously the "trouble" is that these sects have all tossed the only my group is right "heresy bombs" into each others camps. And now, to try to unwind that mess means that SOMEBODIES have to admit, IN WRITING, they were WRONG and move on.

They are going to have to suck back those bombs.

The schism occurred for a legitimate reason - Eutyches on the one hand, and rampant crypto-Nestorianism on the other. There was legitimate heresy, and the entire atmosphere of the late fifth / early sixth century church was extremely toxic.

The schism should have resolved after the Fifth Ecumenical Council, but did not, primarily due to anger over the shedding of blood and a religious quarrel between Emperor Justinian and his wife.

 

[MrWGW]

When we claim to be of Christ and worship any denomination something aint right..
No harm in liking traditions
No harm in liking real laid back
No harm in meeting on Saturday
No harm in meeting on Wednesday nite
No harm in a head covering
No harm in showing emotions
it is when these type of things over shadow the gospel there is harm...
when we KNOW we are right and THEY are wrong..
God will find His sheep where ever they are... in a bar in a pew.
when the small c church one attends means more then the BIG C Church..
we do not have the same personalities ... example my sister loves to dress up i live in jeans and T shirts she likes tradition i like laid back

we both love the Lord.

The only problem with the orherwise admirable expression of ecumenical unity you express is a sort of Pietist deprecation of doctrine. Doctrine is important, and heresies do exist and are not simply a mean-spirited classification hurled by state-backed churches at their opponents.

The unifying theme of all heresy is a challenge to the divinity or humanity of Jesus Christ, thus undermining Christian soteriology. If one denies, confuses or separates the humanity or divinity of the Lord, which groups lioe Jehovah's Wotnesses, Soccinians (Transylvanian and Hungarian Unitarians), and others do, it destroys the theological framework of Christian salvation, which is why pious Orthodox, Catholic and Protestant churches have always sought to condemn such error. That said, the methods used by some, in terms of killing heretics, are entirely loathesome if not themselves demonic (for example, the dreadful massacres of the Cathars).

 

[Sinthesis]

The only problem with the orherwise admirable expression of ecumenical unity you express is a sort of Pietist deprecation of doctrine. Doctrine is important, and heresies do exist and are not simply a mean-spirited classification hurled by state-backed churches at their opponents.

The unifying theme of all heresy is a challenge to the divinity or humanity of Jesus Christ, thus undermining Christian soteriology. If one denies, confuses or separates the humanity or divinity of the Lord, which groups lioe Jehovah's Wotnesses, Soccinians (Transylvanian and Hungarian Unitarians), and others do, it destroys the theological framework of Christian salvation, which is why pious Orthodox, Catholic and Protestant churches have always sought to condemn such error. That said, the methods used by some, in terms of killing heretics, are entirely loathesome if not themselves demonic (for example, the dreadful massacres of the Cathars).

Are any of these heresies currently present in the mainstream denominations?

 

[Nick]

You have to include everything that calls itself a church and/or christian. That includes Jw,mormon,scientology, westbro and so on. You cant pick and choose.

No, simply not correct. People will call themselves Christians. They may not be. Not everyone who says Lord Lord will enter the Kingdom.

JWs and Mormons are not Christians as they disagree with core tenants of the Christian faith. And add to the Bible.

 

[MrWGW]

Are any of these heresies currently present in the mainstream denominations?

Thankfully no, although from an Eastern/Oriental Orthodox perspective there are some denominations with equivalent problems (see Nicea II, Dositheus).

No, simply not correct. People will call themselves Christians. They may not be. Not everyone who says Lord Lord will enter the Kingdom.

JWs and Mormons are not Christians as they disagree with core tenants of the Christian faith. And add to the Bible.

On this point I think the "heresy" label comes in handy in that it allows us to broadly recognize self-identified Christians while rejecting their dogmatic errors unconditionally.

 

[Nick]

On this point I think the "heresy" label comes in handy in that it allows us to broadly recognize self-identified Christians while rejecting their dogmatic errors unconditionally.

Yes and no. I don't think this applies when talking about cults such as JWs and Mormons. However, the Christian church is indeed broad and I agree that within this we can apply the heresy label.