Has Christianity always been controversial, even among Christians?

[His_nee (Jeff)]

Jesus prayed in the garden for his followers to be one just as he is one with the father (John 17:20-21 “My prayer is not for them alone. I pray also for those who will believe in me through their message, that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me.")
Referring to the current theme of this thread: is denominationalism inherently detrimental? Is there a way that we can have unity despite the different ways to worship?

yes,
no (unless everyone's willing)

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

If so, why? After all, there is only one God, one Word, and one Holy Spirit.

in the years between zero? and 40a/d/ there was on the earth only one Messiah Who was born a man, died, and was resurrected by Yhwh.
not 2 , not 3, only 1.
in the years between 2006B.C. and TODAY, there is still only one Messiah Who was born a man, died, and was resurrected by Yhwh.
not 2, not 3, only 1.
in all those years, there has never been anyone else who could save people from their sins. no other way.
in Him is unity. in Him is strength. in Him is Truth. HIs Name is Jesus (Yeshua). in Him is Life Eternal. there is no other way.
when His disciples gave up everything to follow Him they experienced unity, union with ABBA, strength in His Purpose and Plan, perfection as He decreed it, and power over sin and satan and demons and disease.
when they didn't give up everything to follow Him, they didn't have any of that. they didn't even have Him.
He gave simple , clear , instructions, and still had to "open their minds" to understand. (the fleshly mind could not understand Him).
His own disciples didn't understand until "He breathed on them" and gave them understanding.

 

[HalleluYAH]

God, His Word, and His Spirit:

Three parts, if you will, of One Entity.

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

in no way is Yhwh made up of any number of parts of anything. that's entirely outside what He reveals about Himself. even "Elohim" while and if and the way He is described as "plural" by men trying to explain, does not imply 'parts'.

 

[HalleluYAH]

Well, for example, Whose Spirit is the Holy Spirit? If not God's, then whose?

 

[Edward]

And it all began in the garden.. with "Yea, hath God said"

Genesis 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

tob

That's the 2nd thing that popped into my head. First I thought about the scribes and pharisees, then I thought, no it started even before that, in the garden...

I agree this is true but I think an even bigger problem is that people can't let go of their own pride and just follow the One that created us. We are so intent on doing things our own way and having our own way that we are unable to surrender to Him. We need to explain things for ourselves, understand things ourselves, and do things ourselves so we can say "We did it!" The truth is God did it!

Yep. Pride is the root of all controversy.

Would you know what's needed for avoiding denominationalism?

Yes sir. His name is Jesus Christ.

 

[Eugene]

in no way is Yhwh made up of any number of parts of anything. that's entirely outside what He reveals about Himself. even "Elohim" while and if and the way He is described as "plural" by men trying to explain, does not imply 'parts'.

Dear His_nee (Jeff), our doctrinal statement is “We believe that there is only one God, who is eternal and immutable, and manifests Himself in three distinct Persons; Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.”

I continue reading posts from you that suggest otherwise; do you believe this? I have asked before without reply, but will attempt to ask you again. Thanks.

Is our Father God?

Is Jesus God?

Is the Holy Spirit God?

 

[Kathi]

It will always be controversial how someone translates scripture.There are going to very different translations.As far as the secular world their will always be those who deny Christ and think Christians are just......weird

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

yhwh is father of all the living, yeshua is yhwh's salvation, the only begotten son of yhwh, always for ever with yhwh before anything was created. holy spirit makes three, but there's no satisfactory i know of to explain nor to understand in english (the jews/hebrews/israelites/ et al (a few anyway, the remnant, the humble) do well to allow hashem to be beyond comprehension and to revere him as holy. americans(gentiles) are (no polite way to say) not able to comprehend this when they try to put Yhwh in a box of any size or dimensions.
a few accept Yhwh as incomprehensible, and they do well.

 

[Eugene]

yhwh is father of all the living, yeshua is yhwh's salvation, the only begotten son of yhwh, always for ever with yhwh before anything was created. holy spirit makes three, but there's no satisfactory i know of to explain nor to understand in english (the jews/hebrews/israelites/ et al (a few anyway, the remnant, the humble) do well to allow hashem to be beyond comprehension and to revere him as holy. americans(gentiles) are (no polite way to say) not able to comprehend this when they try to put Yhwh in a box of any size or dimensions.
a few accept Yhwh as incomprehensible, and they do well.

His_nee (Jeff), am I to understand that you don’t speak English, and possibly use a translator to post here? You make the observation of Jesus being the salvation of God, Him being the only begotten Son of God, and both are correct, but with that you are limiting God to the very box you describe.

In my opinion Jesus is much more than what you are seeing as incomprehensible because there is more said of Him than you’re allowing to come forth. For instance:

Isa 40:3 The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness (John the Baptist), Prepare ye the way of the LORD (Jehovah), make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

Isa 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD (Jehovah); and beside me there is no saviour.
Isa 43:15 I am the LORD (Jehovah), your Holy One, the creator of Israel, your King.

Mat 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

Php 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

Do you in fact find a problem with these scriptures? There is a group that declares that Jesus was a god. I do not think they know my LORD. What say you?

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

I think if all people(even 'Christians') realized and acknowledged Jesus is Lord, and what He did for them, there wouldn't be so much disagreement....... before the world was ever created through Him, He knew us all by name, and even the number of hairs on our head!
While we were all sinners, dead in our trespasses, He loved us and planned to die for us willingly, obediently, to set free as many as believed on Him.... >>>

John 1:12 KJV - But as many as received him, to them - Bible ...
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
Philippians 3:7-15
King James Version (KJV)
7 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss

for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord:
for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,.......
.....
14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of Yhwh in Christ Jesus.
15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, Yhwh shall reveal even this unto you.

K9 Safe Search <terms: all things created by / through Him>
About 249,000 (6)results
John 1:3 NKJV - All things were made through Him, and - Bible ...
All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.
http://www.biblegateway.com:80/passage/?search=Colossians+1:16-18&version=KJV
Colossians 1:16-18 KJV - For by him were all things created ...
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or ...
http://www.biblegateway.com:80/passage/?search=Romans+11:36&version=GNT
Romans 11:36 GNT - For all things were created by him, and ...
For all things were created by him, and all things exist through him and for him. To God be the glory forever!
http://www.biblegateway.com:80/passage/?search=Colossians+1:15-18&version=KJV
Colossians 1:15-18 KJV - Who is the image of the invisible ...
15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: 16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible ...
http://www.biblegateway.com:80/passage/?search=Colossians+1:16&version=NKJV
Colossians 1:16 NKJV - For by Him all things were created ...
16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers.

Revelation 4:11 KJV - Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive ...
Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

 

[Eugene]

I think if all people(even 'Christians') realized and acknowledged Jesus is Lord, and what He did for them, there wouldn't be so much disagreement....... before the world was ever created through Him, He knew us all by name, and even the number of hairs on our head!
While we were all sinners, dead in our trespasses, He loved us and planned to die for us willingly, obediently, to set free as many as believed on Him.... >>>

John 1:12 KJV - But as many as received him, to them - Bible ...
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
Philippians 3:7-15
King James Version (KJV)
7 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss

for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord:
for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,.......
.....
14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of Yhwh in Christ Jesus.
15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, Yhwh shall reveal even this unto you.

K9 Safe Search <terms: all things created by / through Him>
About 249,000 (6)results
John 1:3 NKJV - All things were made through Him, and - Bible ...
All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.
Colossians 1:16-18 KJV - For by him were all things created ...
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or ...
Romans 11:36 GNT - For all things were created by him, and ...
For all things were created by him, and all things exist through him and for him. To God be the glory forever!
Colossians 1:15-18 KJV - Who is the image of the invisible ...
15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: 16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible ...
Colossians 1:16 NKJV - For by Him all things were created ...
16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers.

Revelation 4:11 KJV - Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive ...
Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

Lots of scripture, but is Jesus God?

 

[His_nee (Jeff)]

Lots of scripture, but is Jesus God?

indeed, Jesus is God, and He is coming soon to judge the world. those who have followed the anti- Christ will be thrown inthe lake of fire together with the great harlot (let the reader(*) beware and understand - the great harlot and mother of all harlots has deceived the whole world and all the governments and religioins of the world have committed fornication with her(**)), and those who have believed on the Name of the Son of God shall be received into Glory with Him at HIs Coming and forever !

(*)'reader' : hundreds of visitors, and even via dozens of 'robot' scavengers every day copying all the posts in every thread over and over and over again. google robots, bing robots, and others. (search engines)

(**) Revelation 1,2,3,17,18,19

 

[HalleluYAH]

indeed, Jesus is God, and He is coming soon to judge the world. those who have followed the anti- Christ will be thrown inthe lake of fire together with the great harlot (let the reader(*) beware and understand - the great harlot and mother of all harlots has deceived the whole world and all the governments and religioins of the world have committed fornication with her(**)), and those who have believed on the Name of the Son of God shall be received into Glory with Him at HIs Coming and forever !

(*)'reader' : hundreds of visitors, and even via dozens of 'robot' scavengers every day copying all the posts in every thread over and over and over again. google robots, bing robots, and others. (search engines)

(**) Revelation 1,2,3,17,18,19

John 1:1-4
1 In the beginning was the Word (Christ is the Word), and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

 

[Eugene]

indeed, Jesus is God, and He is coming soon to judge the world.

Thank you for the straight forward answer.

 

[Edward]

John 1:1-4
1 In the beginning was the Word (Christ is the Word), and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

Amen brother!

 

[Kathi]

indeed, Jesus is God, and He is coming soon to judge the world.

Yes and from the looks of our world it could be very soon