Is Calvinism of the Bible?

[beloved57]

Uh, . . . . . so. . . by YOUR faith, you have put a thought in God's mind that you are "one of the elect"? :-? Again, . . . how do YOU know that God has elected YOU? Is it possible for someone to know about God, . . . very well, yet not be "one of the elect"? How do you know that YOU are, just because you just happen to believe it so radically?

Fact is, . . . .since you don't know the mind of this god you follow, . . . you can't.

God, however, in his love for all men, doesn't play favorites. That's the good news.

As a side note to your ultra-Calvinism, so, if God elects people for salvation, then there is no reason for missionaries to go to foreign lands. These "elect" will be in Heaven anyway.

orion get out of here with your athiest self lol..

 

[beloved57]

You know, like not calling everyone a liar who disagrees with your interpretation of Scriptures...

well He sure has not transformed your wicked devilish lies and false doctrine..

Gal 1:

8But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! 9As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!

Be sure you remember that verse when you appear before the Judgment Seat of God, my protester friend... The Gospel has already been preached, and for 1500 years before Mr. Jean Calvin began preaching another gospel of nonsense.

I see this is going nowhere, since you aren't going to answer my questions, so please don't bother writing me anymore about my status with Christ. IF you were consistent with the application of your theology, you would realize that no matter what I wrote, I would already be elect, so this merely reflects further the inconsistency and double-speak of Calvinism.

Regards

Take this my friend..

gal 1

8But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! 9As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!

with love the Apostle paul..lol

 

[francisdesales]

Be sure you remember that verse (Gal 1:8-9) when you appear before the Judgment Seat of God, my protester friend... The Gospel has already been preached, and for 1500 years before Mr. Jean Calvin began preaching another gospel of nonsense.

I see this is going nowhere, since you aren't going to answer my questions, so please don't bother writing me anymore about my status with Christ. IF you were consistent with the application of your theology, you would realize that no matter what I wrote, I would already be elect, so this merely reflects further the inconsistency and double-speak of Calvinism.

Regards

Take this my friend..

gal 1

8But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! 9As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!

with love the Apostle paul..lol

Uh, yea, ditto to what I said the first time... I've already responded to that.

You and Calvinism are preaching a new "gospel" one invented by a heretic 1500 years after the Church wrote the NT Bible. By your own mouth you are condemning yourself...

even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; As also in all [his] epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as [they do] also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. 2 Peter 3:16

Like I said before, beware of who you accuse of being a liar. You very well may be condemning yourself - to your own destruction... (which naturally begs the question to the Calvinist - "how can my misunderstanding of Scriptures lead to destruction when God has already ordained me as of the elect and NOTHING that I do can change that?")

 

[Orion]

Uh, . . . . . so. . . by YOUR faith, you have put a thought in God's mind that you are "one of the elect"? :-? Again, . . . how do YOU know that God has elected YOU? Is it possible for someone to know about God, . . . very well, yet not be "one of the elect"? How do you know that YOU are, just because you just happen to believe it so radically?

Fact is, . . . .since you don't know the mind of this god you follow, . . . you can't.

God, however, in his love for all men, doesn't play favorites. That's the good news.

As a side note to your ultra-Calvinism, so, if God elects people for salvation, then there is no reason for missionaries to go to foreign lands. These "elect" will be in Heaven anyway.

orion get out of here with your athiest self lol..

Did I strike a nerve, or do you just not know how to answer this very truthful fact? Oh, I'm not an atheist either, yet you judge me so? :smt104

Answer the question! How do YOU know if YOU are a person who GOD has chosen? You don't, according to elect-ism, and it would be your own human arrogance to believe that you're "one of the few select". You can't even judge people without insulting them, yet you think that you are somehow worthy of GOD'S selection! :-?

 

[Veritas]

Agreed, people are not lost because God didn't try saving them,

Good luck next time god ! a saviour who failed to save incredible..

That's not what I believe beloved57, please read my entire post.

 

[GraceBwithU]

Beloved57

Calvinists are proud to proclaim, "The basic principle of Calvinism is the sovereignty of God." This doctrine allowed John Calvin to interpret Scripture in any manner he desired in order to fit his Institutes theology. He simply claimed the sovereignty of God allowed it. God's other attributes such as love, justice, mercy and grace became less important so long as sovereignty reigned. John Calvin's extreme definitions of the election and sin (Total Depravity and Unconditioanl election) laid the foundation for the false doctrine that bears his name, Calvinism.

I truly believe you are sincere. I'm sure you do not intend to limit God's sovereignty. But to promote Calvin’s theology is to hold to one of the biggest misunderstandings of God’s sovereignty that exist today. The irony of it all is that God's sovereignty is exactly what Calvinist use to defend their narrow interpretation of God's word. John Calvin was an attorney before he was a reformist. His theology followed a humanistic interpretation.

 

[francisdesales]

John Calvin was an attorney before he was a reformist. His theology followed a humanistic interpretation.

From my extensive discussions with Calvinists, that is about the worse thing you can say to them!

Regards

 

[beloved57]

Agreed, people are not lost because God didn't try saving them,

Good luck next time god ! a saviour who failed to save incredible..

That's not what I believe beloved57, please read my entire post.

I read enuf its trash sir..

 

[beloved57]

Be sure you remember that verse (Gal 1:8-9) when you appear before the Judgment Seat of God, my protester friend... The Gospel has already been preached, and for 1500 years before Mr. Jean Calvin began preaching another gospel of nonsense.

I see this is going nowhere, since you aren't going to answer my questions, so please don't bother writing me anymore about my status with Christ. IF you were consistent with the application of your theology, you would realize that no matter what I wrote, I would already be elect, so this merely reflects further the inconsistency and double-speak of Calvinism.

Regards

Take this my friend..

gal 1

8But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! 9As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!

with love the Apostle paul..lol

Uh, yea, ditto to what I said the first time... I've already responded to that.

You and Calvinism are preaching a new "gospel" one invented by a heretic 1500 years after the Church wrote the NT Bible. By your own mouth you are condemning yourself...

even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; As also in all [his] epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as [they do] also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. 2 Peter 3:16

Like I said before, beware of who you accuse of being a liar. You very well may be condemning yourself - to your own destruction... (which naturally begs the question to the Calvinist - "how can my misunderstanding of Scriptures lead to destruction when God has already ordained me as of the elect and NOTHING that I do can change that?")

You are a liar, you dont bit more know God as a flea on a dirty dog..

 

[unred typo]

quote by orion:
As a side note to your ultra-Calvinism, so, if God elects people for salvation, then there is no reason for missionaries to go to foreign lands. These "elect" will be in Heaven anyway.

You err, not knowing the mysteries of this god, orion. They are going out to witness because God causes them to, don’t you know? It is also God’s sovereign will that they be the ones who discover their brothers and sisters in elec-dom. That way, they can show each other the secret handshake and give them the official decoder ring so everyone is on the same page theologically. Also, they can keep weaker members in line who might break ranks and run when they find out what they really believe. To be one of the elect is worth all the distaste their doctrines provoke in other mere humans. They are one of the elite, the proud, the chosen of God himself….chosen to be humble, not boasting of their own works, of course.

I wonder if they also pray that none of us evil ones made the list. Naw, there is more joy over one normal believer that repents from following Christ than over the 99 that already embrace the mystery of iniquity in Calvinism.

 

[unred typo]

Quote by beloved57:

You are a liar, you dont bit more know God as a flea on a dirty dog..

Are you calling your calvinist god a dirty dog or is dog not a typo for god? Your lack of proper punctuation is confusing. Do you mean that as a flea bites a dog, he has not bitten into your version of god? Oh, I see what you’re saying. I was only reading every other word, not everything in context. You mean he doesn’t know your god a bit more than a flea on a dirty dog would. And we thank God for that, don't we, francisdesales?

 

[francisdesales]

Quote by beloved57:

You are a liar, you dont bit more know God as a flea on a dirty dog..

Are you calling your calvinist god a dirty dog or is dog not a typo for god? Your lack of proper punctuation is confusing. Do you mean that as a flea bites a dog, he has not bitten into your version of god? Oh, I see what you’re saying. I was only reading every other word, not everything in context. You mean he doesn’t know your god a bit more than a flea on a dirty dog would. And we thank God for that, don't we, francisdesales?

LOL! Well, it's typical, because that is how this guy reads the Scriptures - every other verse is interpreted, while the others ignored... This guy sounds like another cult-follower, because his is the typical reaction of someone who dares disagrees with their "inspired" interpretation of Scriptures. What is sad is that he STILL refuses to answer the many meaningful questions of myself and Orion. Simple common sense collapses the entire facade of Calvinism.

Regards

 

[Vic C.]

I have to do this;

beloved, you are blocked from posting in the Apologetics forum. :-?

I read enuf its trash sir..

You are a liar, you dont bit more know God as a flea on a dirty dog...

Unred, please back off from fueling the fire of I add you to the list. :-?

 

[Drew]

Take this my friend..

gal 1

8But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! 9As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!

with love the Apostle paul..lol

The irony here is that Calvinists in this forum seem to think that the gospel is "you can be justified by faith and go to heaven when you die". While that is true (and posters familiar with me might know in what sense I mean this), the gospel is not, repeat not, "justification by faith". Paul describes it as follows in Romans 1:

the gospel he promised beforehand through his prophets in the Holy Scriptures 3regarding his Son, who as to his human nature was a descendant of David, 4and who through the Spirit[a] of holiness was declared with power to be the Son of God by his resurrection from the dead: Jesus Christ our Lord.

The gospel is that Jesus has risen from the dead and is Lord of the Universe. Justification by faith and "going to heaven when you die" is one result of this, but there is so much more.

 

[Orion]

I have to do this;

beloved, you are blocked from posting in the Apologetics forum. :-?

Well, shoot. Now I won't have an answer to my question about how HE knows that God chose to elect him. Oh well. Probably a smart move anyway. He seemed more troll-ish to me anyway.

 

[mondar]

John Calvin was an attorney before he was a reformist. His theology followed a humanistic interpretation.

From my extensive discussions with Calvinists, that is about the worse thing you can say to them!

Regards

Francisdesales, please dont boast of your extensive discussions with Calvinists as though you know something.
You seem only to be displaying ignorance in your posts. Do you have any idea of the etymology of the word "humanism?" To confuse 15th or 16th century classical humanism with the modern anti-God philosophical humanism would only make most Calvinists laugh.

Calvin was maybe not the most well known classical humanist, but he was a humanist. He had a classical education in latin and greek, and was opposed to the philosophy of scholasticism. But so were many Catholics. Did you ever read of the humanism of Desiderius Erasmus? Many within the walls of the Vatican were humanists. This does not mean they were anti-God.

Can I make a suggestion that you read up on the term "humanism." Try searching Wiki on Humanism.

 

[unred typo]

quote by mondar:

Francisdesales, please dont boast of your extensive discussions with Calvinists as though you know something.
You seem only to be displaying ignorance in your posts. Do you have any idea of the etymology of the word "humanism?" To confuse 15th or 16th century classical humanism with the modern anti-God philosophical humanism would only make most Calvinists laugh.

Francisdesales is not ignorant of what Calvinists believe. He knows more than ‘something’ and if there is any ignorance to be pointed out, it is not something that Calvinists can laugh about. As usual your condescending posts are more history and vocab lessons than dealing with the OP. We are getting an education in obscure and archaic words, though. :-D Thanks, Mondar.

 

[mondar]

quote by mondar:

Francisdesales, please dont boast of your extensive discussions with Calvinists as though you know something.
You seem only to be displaying ignorance in your posts. Do you have any idea of the etymology of the word "humanism?" To confuse 15th or 16th century classical humanism with the modern anti-God philosophical humanism would only make most Calvinists laugh.

Francisdesales is not ignorant of what Calvinists believe. He knows more than ‘something’ and if there is any ignorance to be pointed out, it is not something that Calvinists can laugh about. As usual your condescending posts are more history and vocab lessons than dealing with the OP. We are getting an education in obscure and archaic words, though. :-D Thanks, Mondar.

Unred, I have often and honestly wondered why you bother writing some of the things you do. In the last post I complained that Francisdesales does not seem to know the difference between 16th Century humanism and modern humanism. You come in with sarcasm making statements not even related to the issue (the humanism of John Calvin). I have often noticed that when I post, you seem to race others to argue sarcasticly with "the Calvinist." To what purpose is this behavior? You actually believe your behavior "Godly?

Please go back and reread the previous posts. Try to notice that the essence of my complaint related to humanism and not Calvinism in general.

 

[francisdesales]

John Calvin was an attorney before he was a reformist. His theology followed a humanistic interpretation.

From my extensive discussions with Calvinists, that is about the worse thing you can say to them!

Regards

Francisdesales, please dont boast of your extensive discussions with Calvinists as though you know something.

As usual, you make a fool out of yourself by beginning a discussion with your condescending attitude. Perhaps you should read what you are responding to before you make such nonsense comments. I was commenting on something made by Grace, I was not defining ANYTHING! Read the context again. I merely said that calling a Calvinist a humanist was a major issue for Calvinists. Do you now deny that by your whining reaction? I didn't define humanism. And finally, refering me to Wikepedia? Please... I know what humanism is - and calling a Calvinist one is a slap in the face...

Being a humanist has little to do with whether one believes in God or not, so I don't know where you came up with that. To the Calvinist, they place the sovereignty of God before ALL else, even man's ability to choose right from wrong. Humanism is not at odds with God, but the level of cooperation or synergy that exists between the two when a man must "choose". Calvinists have told me time and again that humanisim is opposed to their view of the interaction between God and man.

I have no desire to continue to talk Calvinists, as they are like nailing jello to a tree, in my experience... They say one thing, and then mean another. They will NOT HAVE synergy, despite it being in the bible. No thanks, that is like trying to get certain Protestants to admit that sola scriptura is not biblical... Common sense just won't work there.

To those with ears...

Regards

 

[mondar]

As usual, you make a fool out of yourself by beginning a discussion with your condescending attitude.

As usual, you begin a discussion with some name calling.

....snip...........
I merely said that calling a Calvinist a humanist was a major issue for Calvinists. Do you now deny that by your whining reaction?

Of course more insults. Heh, do you confuse name calling and insults for an intelligent apologetic?

By the way, if the historical context of the term "humanist" is understood, there is no reason why any Calvinist should be bothered in the least by the term. Of course those who do not understand that the etemology of the term refers to something different.... but nevermind, I think I am waisting effort. I doubt you care what the term humanist means, your interest is to insult and call names. Sigh, so shallow.

I didn't define humanism. And finally, refering me to Wikepedia? Please... I know what humanism is - and calling a Calvinist one is a slap in the face...

Being a humanist has little to do with whether one believes in God or not, so I don't know where you came up with that. To the Calvinist, they place the sovereignty of God before ALL else, even man's ability to choose right from wrong.

Again you show your ignorance of Calvinism. Yes, Calvinists believe that man is totally depraved. This does not mean man has no ability to choose right from wrong. I think you guys sit around making stuff up.

Humanism is not at odds with God, but the level of cooperation or synergy that exists between the two when a man must "choose". Calvinists have told me time and again that humanisim is opposed to their view of the interaction between God and man.

I have no desire to continue to talk Calvinists, as they are like nailing jello to a tree, in my experience... They say one thing, and then mean another. They will NOT HAVE synergy, despite it being in the bible. No thanks, that is like trying to get certain Protestants to admit that sola scriptura is not biblical... Common sense just won't work there.

To those with ears...

Finally, a term which is actually used in theology today. I am surprised. Yes, Calvinists deny syergism. We claim to be monergists. Salvation is wholy the work of God for man, and not the work of man for God. That is monergism. Synergism is the Catholic doctrine. Why francisdesales, that was a pleasent surprise.