Is It Possible For A Christian To Fall From "Grace"?

[Mike S]

So true.
People are using Scriptures here on this thread that people disagree what they mean.
So how do we get through that?
My interpretation of Scriptures is building up my faith in Christ.
Can others say the same thing about their interpretations?

All disciplines given to us in the New Testament are for our own good, not to condemn us with threats of losing our salvation.
That is very negative and does nothing to build up the body of Christ.
What it does is weaken the body of Christ which causes division, and that is not of God.

My interpretation of scripture is based on building up my faith in Christ as well. I really think we get the greatest understanding of God when we let the Bible in it's entirety, not single scriptures, inform us. Single concepts contained in single scripture passages can be difficult for us to understand unless we let them become a part of a whole. The more we read through the Bible, letting the Holy Spirit touch us and guide us, the more the grand themes of God's love is revealed to us - themes such as love thy neighbor and righteousness before God in our whole lives not just specific times of worship - the more these themes shape our thinking and behavior in Christ, the more we understand what God is accomplishing in us and through us. God's will becomes clear, and no single scripture standing alone can do that for us.

We live and worship in community, but, our relationship with God is individual. He meets us at the points of our need and pulls us to Him as completely as we're willing to submit. I try not to judge others too harshly, not knowing exactly where they are on their Christian journey. Rather than trying to browbeat others into accepting my understanding of scripture, I try to work out my own salvation with fear and trembling, knowing others must do the same. But, I know this, God is a mighty God and a sovereign God...when He calls we go.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

There are about 40,000 Christian denominations in the world, every one of which is going to tell you only they know what scripture plainly says.

All this proves is there are lots of liars in the church. It does not prove that the scriptures don't speak plainly.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Circumcision can never cause a person to lose their salvation.

The act itself is meaningless. It is the intent of the heart that decides whether your circumcision is an attempt to earn your salvation, or not. That is what God looks at.

IMO, this is not the main problem among Christians today. We're not busy trying to earn our salvation (at least not in the ways Paul talks about). We are busy indulging a grace that lets us off the hook in regard to obedience. It may be a far harder problem to overcome.

...we belong to God and whatever we do, we still belong to God.
We are already forgiven of our sins and they will be remembered no more.

The blood of Christ does not and can not forgive the sin of not believing or no longer believing in the blood of Christ. When a person no longer has faith in Christ for justification and relies on another way to be justified they lose the benefit of the blood of Christ for justification their faith had secured for them. No faith--no justification.

All disciplines given to us in the New Testament are for our own good, not to condemn us with threats of losing our salvation.
That is very negative and does nothing to build up the body of Christ.
What it does is weaken the body of Christ which causes division, and that is not of God.

Tell the Apostles, not us. They started it.

 

[JLB]

Let me be more blunt...the scripture doesn't plainly say anything, it only says what you interpret it as saying. There are about 40,000 Christian denominations in the world, every one of which is going to tell you only they know what scripture plainly says.

I have found that a person that has never been Baptized in the Holy Spirit, doesn't understand the scriptures the same way as someone who has.

That could be one difference.

At some point, you would think that everyone could agree on this scripture:

Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. John 14:6

Yet, there are Pastors who teach contrary to what Jesus says here.

Postmodern thought seems to be sweeping through the church.


JLB

 

[Willie T]

I have found that a person that has never been Baptized in the Holy Spirit, doesn't understand the scriptures the same way as someone who has.

That could be one difference.

At some point, you would think that everyone could agree on this scripture:

Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. John 14:6

Yet, there are Pastors who teach contrary to what Jesus says here.

Postmodern thought seems to be sweeping through the church.


JLB

And how many of us are willing to say that WE are the ones who have it wrong? Are you?
You see, it is always US who have the Holy Spirit, and understand correctly... NOT those other people. Funny how that works.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

The act itself is meaningless. It is the intent of the heart that decides whether your circumcision is an attempt to earn your salvation, or not. That is what God looks at.

IMO, this is not the main problem among Christians today. We're not busy trying to earn our salvation (at least not in the ways Paul talks about). We are busy indulging a grace that lets us off the hook in regard to obedience. It may be a far harder problem to overcome.



The blood of Christ does not and can not forgive the sin of not believing or no longer believing in the blood of Christ. When a person no longer has faith in Christ for justification and relies on another way to be justified they lose the benefit of the blood of Christ for justification their faith had secured for them. No faith--no justification.



Tell the Apostles, not us. They started it.

It's good to see you laughing.
With that avatar, I thought we were gonna have to start calling you grumpy.

 

[Jesse]

IMO, this is not the main problem among Christians today. We're not busy trying to earn our salvation (at least not in the ways Paul talks about). We are busy indulging a grace that lets us off the hook in regard to obedience. It may be a far harder problem to overcome.

So true!
A.W. Tozer said something about how the church sees obedience as works, we've meshed those 2 words together and somehow came up with the same definition for both.

 

[JLB]

And how many of us are willing to say that WE are the ones who have it wrong? Are you?
You see, it is always US who have the Holy Spirit, and understand correctly... NOT those other people. Funny how that works.

19 Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back,
20 let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins.
James 5:19-20

In this scripture, there are two people contrasted.

One has wandered from the truth, and is now defined as a sinner.

The other person, who has turned him back to the truth, has done so out of love; A love for God and a love for God's people... as it says -
...will save a soul from death and cover a multitude on sins.

Cover a multitude of sins, is love language, for love covers a multitude of sins.


JLB

 

[Mike S]

19 Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back,
20 let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins.
James 5:19-20

In this scripture, there are two people contrasted.

One has wandered from the truth, and is now defined as a sinner.

The other person, who has turned him back to the truth, has done so out of love; A love for God and a love for God's people... as it says -
...will save a soul from death and cover a multitude on sins.

Cover a multitude of sins, is love language, for love covers a multitude of sins.


JLB

So, It's my Christian duty to turn you back and save your soul from death. You can begin your redemption by admitting that you have interpreted all the scriptures incorrectly. Be aware, I'm doing this out of love for you.

 

[JLB]

So, It's my Christian duty to turn you back and save your soul from death. You can begin your redemption by admitting that you have interpreted all the scriptures incorrectly. Be aware, I'm doing this out of love for you.

So, It's my Christian duty to turn you back and save your soul from death. You can begin your redemption by admitting that you have interpreted all the scriptures incorrectly. Be aware, I'm doing this out of love for you.

It's not your Christian duty to turn a person who has wandered from the truth, back to the truth, if you yourself don't know the truth.

You yourself must first know the Truth.


JLB

 

[mswright6488]

Grace is Gods safety net in which we fall back in... when we miss the mark.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

It's not your Christian duty to turn a person who has wandered from the truth, back to the truth, if you yourself don't know the truth.

You yourself must first know the Truth.


JLB

LOL, truth vs. truth.
Who will win?
To tell you the truth, I don't know.

 

[Mike S]

It's not your Christian duty to turn a person who has wandered from the truth, back to the truth, if you yourself don't know the truth.

You yourself must first know the Truth.


JLB

I do know the truth. You see, the scripture speaks plainly to me. It's you who is confused.

See how this works? You have no authoritative moral standing to tell me, nor anyone else, what is the truth. You are a fallible creature, just like the rest of us.

Welcome to the human family.

 

[Karl]

Lots of thoughts in here about this......
Lets first look at the first scripture and not start with Galatians 5:2 shall we,
Galations 5:1 So Christ has really set you free. Now make sure that you STAY FREE, and DON'T get tied up again in the SLAVERY OF THE LAW. NLT

Ok before we go any farther here lets point out a few things......
Up until this time period, all people including the Galations, new thee way of getting right with God was by the jewish laws and jewish traditions including what is spoken as the law of moses.....

Ok now YOU have got to understand that God snatched Paul up out of His old life and we all know what this was.
Now then HE gave Paul an assignment and this assignment was to take this new covenant and teach it to the gentiles and show them that it really works.

Romans 8:6 But our High priest has been given a ministry that is far superior to the ministry of those who serve under the old laws, for He is the one who GUARANTEES for us a better covenant with God, based on better promises.
Romans 8:13 When God speaks of a new covenant, it means He has made the first one obsolete. It is now out of date and ready to be put aside.

Now then you have to understand that this is all new to the people through out the world. This Gospel of Christ which has brought into being a NEW COVENANT with the Almighty God. "Paul's assignment"

Now lets look at 2,3,4 shall we,
Galations 5:2 Listeen! I paul, tell you this: If you are counting on circumcision to make you right with God, then Christ can NOT help you.
Galations 5:3 I'll say it again. If you are trying to find favor with God by being circumcised, you must obey all of the regulations in the whole law of moses.
Galations 5:4 For if you are trying to make your selves right with God by keeping the law, you have been cut off from Christ! You have fallen away from God's GRACE or the Grace Of God,
Lets look at the word Grace for a moment shall we, There are many definitions through out the word of God but for this post I am going to share what I have found to say it best...
GRACE...God's overwhelming desire to treat us as if sin never happened....

In these 3 scriptures you find Paul talking to the galations once again, This was not pauls first time here and we see this in verses 7-10, Any way, PAUL had found that some of the believers thinking had returned unto the old ways or old law once again and were trying to get right in God's eyes through the law and one part was circumcisiom.

Now God replaced these laws because he saw that they were NOT working for NO man could ever keep them. God wanted worship not sacrifices and this is another topic.....Back to this,
Paul was there shaking things up a bit inorder to get these off track galations back on track with the Gospel of Christ. Imagine Paul there preaching and teraching this new gospel of Christ all over again, He is showing them that when you try to be justified by the law, you in turn are falling out of this Grace of God. Now what does Paul mean by this?

It's quite simple realy,
Paul is showing them that YOU the galations had excepted Jesus as your Lord and Savior, you entered into a NEW Covenant with God and were made right in His sight (God) by the shed blood of Christ. Now some of you are going back to the old ways of doing things which do not even count any longer to be made right in the eyes of God.

His speaking of "falling out of Grace" Well Paul is simply telling them that they are acting as if the death of Jesus on the cross and the shedding of the Blood of Jesus means nothing... It is as if some of you Galations are turning away from this Free Gift of Salvation through Christ Jesus (which is the only way to the Father) and going back to your old ways of doing things which have no use or value in Getting right with God or being in Right Standing with God.

Again you need to remember that all these people knew under the old law was how bad they were and now here comes Paul telling them that they are bleesed and the righteousness of God in Christ Jesus and so forth.
Also REMEMBER THIS............there are many laws talked about in the bible or in Thee Written Word Of God.
Anything that God put intomotion is a law. The law of sowing and reaping or the power of your words etc.
Those are just 2 of many used for example.

So now you can see that being circumcised or not has no value in the spiritual realm. It's simply a tradition passed down. Falling out of GRACE that you read in Galations from the writings of Paul is ONLY his way of showing the GALATIONS that they were turning thier backs on Gods Salvation this free gift by the shed blood of Jesus on the cross for them by once again returning to the old way of doing things which was not going to do them any good.
How could it, for we read in Roman 8 (above) and in verse 1 of Galations 5 and through out the wortd of God. That the old law was done away with...

The old testament Is NOT Dead or Of No Value, however you have to be very careful how you pull a scripture from the Old Testament and use it with one of the New Terstament... as one does when pulling scriptures out of any place in the written word of God and using them to prove you belief or point for it just does not work like that.

I hope this helps clear the air on this topic and I pray that your understanding of the Written Word Of GOD will continue to grow and grow and mature unto new revolations from God. Be Blessed and Know Jesus Christ is Lord.
Jim

While I agree with some of what you have said, I think we must remember the Galatians were not Jews, the were Gentiles, hence they didn't know the Jewish Law, this false doctrine of having to keep the Jewish Law was new to them, it came in by false teachers after Paul had left. Paul wrote this epistle to correct them which is evident from Gal 1:6-9.

We see the same thing today in the Church, false teachers introducing new revelation from the Word of God, ...it's the tickling of the ears..

 

[Karl]

The act itself is meaningless. It is the intent of the heart that decides whether your circumcision is an attempt to earn your salvation, or not. That is what God looks at.

IMO, this is not the main problem among Christians today. We're not busy trying to earn our salvation (at least not in the ways Paul talks about). We are busy indulging a grace that lets us off the hook in regard to obedience. It may be a far harder problem to overcome.



The blood of Christ does not and can not forgive the sin of not believing or no longer believing in the blood of Christ. When a person no longer has faith in Christ for justification and relies on another way to be justified they lose the benefit of the blood of Christ for justification their faith had secured for them. No faith--no justification.



Tell the Apostles, not us. They started it.

Can you give us an example of someone that has stopped trusting in the Blood from the New Testament and has lost their justification?

And you can't say the Galatians because Paul closes this epistle with calling them brothers. Gal 6:18

 

[Jethro Bodine]

It's good to see you laughing.
With that avatar, I thought we were gonna have to start calling you grumpy.

'Sir' will suffice.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

'Sir' will suffice.

Yes, of course, Sir Grumpy.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Can you give us an example of someone that has stopped trusting in the Blood from the New Testament and has lost their justification?

And you can't say the Galatians because Paul closes this epistle with calling them brothers. Gal 6:18

Matthew 18:23-35 NASB

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Grace is Gods safety net in which we fall back in... when we miss the mark.

But when the mark you miss is God's grace, because of unbelief in God's grace in salvation, you hit hard on the pavement.

 

[Jesse]

If this is true, how can a Christian fall from "Grace"? What is "Grace"?

It seems people see grace as only being saved and forgiven of sins, but it is much more than that because there are works we are to do here, we are supposed to love here, we're not supposed to sin, and how do we do all that? By grace!

Why is it, when we are speaking of grace, it always turns around to a salvation issue? This life is not all about salvation, it's about God empowering us with His grace to do what He has called us to do - that's what Paul said we could fall from (not excluding falling from salvation) but immediate concern is falling from that which God has given to us and empowers us.

The gospel came to us in power, resurrection power:
1 Thess 1:5 or our gospel did not come to you in word only, but also in power.

Resurrection power because it is no longer I, but Christ living in me, we died, we were bought with a price and now it is His life we're living, our are hidden in Christ.
Colossians 3:3 For you have died and your life is hidden with Christ in God.4When Christ, who is our life, is revealed, then you also will be revealed with Him in glory

This is grace, it empowers us to not only be saved but to walk as Christ walked
1 John 2:6 By this we know that we are in Him: 6the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.

This is the grace Paul is talking about falling from, the ability to BE Christ to others here, to love them and the Lord and to do the work He has called us to do, and to keep from stumbling.

For whatever it's worth....