Is This What I Read?

[IncredibleTransformation]

I was on this forum a few years ago under a different name and I quit. I think I had to go away and mature some more before I was ready for what the Lord had for me. Now that I came back, I see things a bit differently. I see the greatness of the Lord in many people on this forum. Some speak great words of wisdom and give great Bible studies. But as in all things of this world there are some issues. I believe the Lord wants to use me to address one of them.

I read yesterday that prayer will no longer work in America. I was in tears all night long after I read this. I mean we quote the scripture all the time from 2 Chronicles 7:14 "If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin and will heal their land."

Prayer is the very foundation of our faith. Without it we can't function as Christians. We need that closeness to the Lord. 1 Thess. 5:17 says "pray without ceasing." We need to pray for each other, for the church, and for every nation on earth.

The Lord loves His church. He is waiting to bless those who will answer His call to service. This is a passage from Matthew where Jesus laments over Jerusalem. But I believe this applies to His church today also. He said, "How often I wanted to gather your children together, as a hen gather her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing!" (Matthew 23:27) Jesus loves His church and wants us to live in that love and spread it to the world. So will you answer the call to love one another, the people on this forum, your neighbors, and those you don't agree with? Also, will you pray for them?

 

[WIP]

Jesus' words are immortal.
"If you abide in Me, and My words abide in you, you will ask what you desire, and it shall be done for you." John 15:7 NKJV

"Therefore I say to you, whatever things you ask when you pray, believe that you receive them, and you will have them." Mark 11:24 NKJV

"But you, when you pray, go into your room, and when you have shut your door, pray to your Father who is in the secret place; and your Father who sees in secret will reward you openly." Matthew 6:6 NKJV

“So I say to you, ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened." Luke 11:9-10 NKJV

"Watch and pray, lest you enter into temptation. The spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.” Matthew 26:41 NKJV

Then He spoke a parable to them, that men always ought to pray and not lose heart, saying: “There was in a certain city a judge who did not fear God nor regard man. Now there was a widow in that city; and she came to him, saying, ‘Get justice for me from my adversary.’ And he would not for a while; but afterward he said within himself, ‘Though I do not fear God nor regard man, yet because this widow troubles me I will avenge her, lest by her continual coming she weary me.’" Luke 18:1-6 NKJV

"But I say to you who hear: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, and pray for those who spitefully use you." Luke 6:27-28 NKJV

“Again I say to you that if two of you agree on earth concerning anything that they ask, it will be done for them by My Father in heaven. For where two or three are gathered together in My name, I am there in the midst of them.” Matthew 18:19-20 NKJV


"And whatever things you ask in prayer, believing, you will receive.” Matthew 21:22 NKJV

"Most assuredly, I say to you, whatever you ask the Father in My name He will give you. Until now you have asked nothing in My name. Ask, and you will receive, that your joy may be full." John 16:23-24 NKJV

Not to mention all the references where Jesus demonstrated the importance of prayer by praying himself.

Don't ever let anyone convince you that prayer has no value!

 

[Eugene]

I was on this forum a few years ago under a different name and I quit. I think I had to go away and mature some more before I was ready for what the Lord had for me. Now that I came back, I see things a bit differently. I see the greatness of the Lord in many people on this forum. Some speak great words of wisdom and give great Bible studies. But as in all things of this world there are some issues. I believe the Lord wants to use me to address one of them.

I read yesterday that prayer will no longer work in America. I was in tears all night long after I read this. I mean we quote the scripture all the time from 2 Chronicles 7:14 "If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin and will heal their land."

Prayer is the very foundation of our faith. Without it we can't function as Christians. We need that closeness to the Lord. 1 Thess. 5:17 says "pray without ceasing." We need to pray for each other, for the church, and for every nation on earth.

The Lord loves His church. He is waiting to bless those who will answer His call to service. This is a passage from Matthew where Jesus laments over Jerusalem. But I believe this applies to His church today also. He said, "How often I wanted to gather your children together, as a hen gather her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing!" (Matthew 23:27) Jesus loves His church and wants us to live in that love and spread it to the world. So will you answer the call to love one another, the people on this forum, your neighbors, and those you don't agree with? Also, will you pray for them?

Dear sister in Christ, I love that, and it brings to mind Elijah below lodging in a cave alone.
1Ki 19:10 . . I, even I only, am left; and they seek my life, to take it away.
1Ki 19:12 And after the earthquake a fire; but the LORD was not in the fire: and after the fire a still small voice.

Your testimony is evidence that you're listening to that still small voice. Thanks.

 

[Wrg1405]

The Lord loves His church. He is waiting to bless those who will answer His call to service. This is a passage from Matthew where Jesus laments over Jerusalem. But I believe this applies to His church today also. He said, "How often I wanted to gather your children together, as a hen gather her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing!" (Matthew 23:27) Jesus loves His church and wants us to live in that love and spread it to the world. So will you answer the call to love one another, the people on this forum, your neighbors, and those you don't agree with? Also, will you pray for them?

Prayer will always work and it should supplement love and vice versa, it's not contained to any particular country.
It's contained to the people that God has bought us alongside, those he has given us and laid on our hearts.

A nation is a nation with a government appointed by God. He has a purpose which he will work out. I don't think I can recall any nation that was or is a God fearing loving nation that seeks after his own heart.

Even Israel asked Samuel to appoint a King, this troubled Samuel and he prayed to God. God responsed with

It is not you they have rejected but they have rejected me as their king. He even told Samuel to warn them of the consequences but they still said "No give us a King so that we can be like other nations" so God said give them a King.

Those other nations had no interest in God or Gods way. So what we find is that today other nations will follow other nations and none of them are Godly. In the west we find gay rights in terms of marriage etc being the norm, in the Middle East we find homosexuals being killed for their practice. Both are ungodly.

What I find very interesting is your quote I read yesterday that prayer will no longer work in America.

What I find interesting and disconcerting is that we can feel that we can feel that prayer will not work in our own nation but at times we pray for other nations that God will move and we pray in faith for that.

I am not sure that we will ever have Godly nations/governments that will accept God as their King, historically it's never happened so why should it now?

What I do know is that within every nation their are people who have accepted God as their King, people like me, you Eugene, and many many others on this site who God will use to make a difference who will walk with the people within our nation, the people God has given us.

It's not wrong to pray for Godly leaders in government and we should do so. But in a sense I put more faith in the prayers that God lays on my heart for those that he has given me, and yes he has bought me alongside gay people, humanists, etc all I can do is reveal what the true king wants to be their King and pray for that, for them.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

I read yesterday that prayer will no longer work in America.

Perhaps they have come to the conclusion that God is telling us now what he told Jeremiah about praying for his people...'don't bother, I'm not going to listen.'

"So do not pray for this people nor offer any plea or petition for them; do not plead with me, for I will not listen to you." (Jeremiah 7:16 NIV)

 

[Christ_empowered]

I don't see why prayer wouldn't work for America. I mean, I think America may be in for some harsh treatment, but for different reasons than a lot of conservative Christians think...

...when the supreme court ruled in favor of same sex marriage...the very next day, a local church had on their sign facing the road: Pray for our nation.

Keep in mind...we've had the Iraq war, Afghanistan...we have millions of people who have slid into poverty, including a lot of kids...drug use is claiming lives daily, suicide rates are up, good jobs are hard to come by, the 1% control just about everything, while most people are scraping to get by...the severely mentally ill are often in prison or jail or skid row...racism is still a big issue, cops are killing people and now people are killing cops...

...and the local Baptist Church freaks out over legalized gay marriage. I think we're in for harsh treatment because of the way we keep doing violence overseas while oppressing so many here at home.

Still, PUSH--pray until something happens--right?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Keep in mind...we've had the Iraq war, Afghanistan...we have millions of people who have slid into poverty, including a lot of kids...drug use is claiming lives daily, suicide rates are up, good jobs are hard to come by, the 1% control just about everything, while most people are scraping to get by...the severely mentally ill are often in prison or jail or skid row...racism is still a big issue, cops are killing people and now people are killing cops...

All signs of a nation under the Judgment of God.
It occurred to me the other day that we are on the verge of another race war in this country. I really don't see how it's not going to break out in the open soon.

We're just following in the path of so many other nations before us. Nations just don't seem to govern their prosperity very well. It always leads to arrogance and a false sense of security.

Still, PUSH--pray until something happens--right?

...or until God says, 'don't bother, it's too late, they don't have ears to hear and never will'.
Is America there yet? At first I wanted to say, 'no'. But I'm leaning more toward the harsh reality that we have to suffer the consequences of our arrogance and self-indulgence before we'll be able to hear the voice of God again. That's just how it works.

 

[IncredibleTransformation]

All signs of a nation under the Judgment of God.
It occurred to me the other day that we are on the verge of another race war in this country. I really don't see how it's not going to break out in the open soon.

We're just following in the path of so many other nations before us. Nations just don't seem to govern their prosperity very well. It always leads to arrogance and a false sense of security.


...or until God says, 'don't bother, it's too late, they don't have ears to hear and never will'.
Is America there yet? At first I wanted to say, 'no'. But I'm leaning more toward the harsh reality that we have to suffer the consequences of our arrogance and self-indulgence before we'll be able to hear the voice of God again. That's just how it works.

You could be right. We could face judgment, but even God can change His mind. It starts with His people. If His people don't believe, repent, snd turn from Their sin, then for sure we are headed down the path of judgment.

 

[Christ_empowered]

maybe some of the social/cultural stuff going on in the US is part of judgment..."handed over to a reprobate mind," that kinda thing. I hadn't thought of that.

 

[IncredibleTransformation]

maybe some of the social/cultural stuff going on in the US is part of judgment..."handed over to a reprobate mind," that kinda thing. I hadn't thought of that.

I am sure that's part of it. This is just my thought, not something to build any theology on or anything. It seems like when prayer was taken out of schools this was when God took His hand of protection off the church. Now we were flying on our own to see how we would react to different things like abortion, homosexuality, etc. I don't' think we have done well. Instead of fighting abortion laws perhaps we should help woman that feel hopeless enough to seek and abortion and we should be examples of morality. Instead of either hating homosexuals or embracing them in our churches we should reach out to them in love and let them know they are sinning and Jesus is the answer. We have other issues also, we have a prison system that is completely out of control. This is something the church never talks about. We have become political instead of doing what we are supposed to do and that is preach the Gospel and bring people to repentance and His saving and healing power. We are being judged because of our own mistakes and sins. The Church needs to repent and do what they are supposed to do and the world will eventually come along. Like I said, just my thoughts not something to build a whole theology on.

 

[smaller]

I was on this forum a few years ago under a different name and I quit. I think I had to go away and mature some more before I was ready for what the Lord had for me. Now that I came back, I see things a bit differently. I see the greatness of the Lord in many people on this forum. Some speak great words of wisdom and give great Bible studies. But as in all things of this world there are some issues. I believe the Lord wants to use me to address one of them.

I read yesterday that prayer will no longer work in America. I was in tears all night long after I read this. I mean we quote the scripture all the time from 2 Chronicles 7:14 "If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin and will heal their land."

Prayer is the very foundation of our faith. Without it we can't function as Christians. We need that closeness to the Lord. 1 Thess. 5:17 says "pray without ceasing." We need to pray for each other, for the church, and for every nation on earth.

The Lord loves His church. He is waiting to bless those who will answer His call to service. This is a passage from Matthew where Jesus laments over Jerusalem. But I believe this applies to His church today also. He said, "How often I wanted to gather your children together, as a hen gather her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing!" (Matthew 23:27) Jesus loves His church and wants us to live in that love and spread it to the world. So will you answer the call to love one another, the people on this forum, your neighbors, and those you don't agree with? Also, will you pray for them?

I have, in the past, struggled with my prayers in the above regard. IF the above for example was done even by a few sincere believers, and I believe we ALL should have that same mind and intention, THEN why doesn't it happen and things rather seem to get progressively worse?

I might suggest we are not praying accurately, within the Divine Intentions of the Word of God.

As it pertains to believers, I have been blessed to NOT have to see any believer or any of you who have called upon Jesus to save, as eternally damned. I flatly refuse to set a single foot into those shoes because as I HOPE the very best for my own sorry hide, I extend that same HOPE to you all.

When we can NOT even do this among ourselves, we are giant spiritual failures who damn each others at the drop of a hat. It is detestable in the sight of the Lord to do and practice our faith in this way. Shame upon every believer who would damn another believer to eternal hell. Such will never have a prayer answered, period.

Divide as you subjectively please. And expect to see the anti-fruit of your labors. (NOT speaking to anyone personally such as the opening poster, because the intention of that post is in Divine accord) but if the shoe fits I hope as you walk through the Water of the Word that leather shrinks on your own two feet til it hurts enough to put them off.

 

[smaller]

So what is the Real Divine Intention of Jesus?

Paul answers this clearly, in 1 Cor. 15:

1 Corinthians 15:24
Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

Get on the same page and you'll be less disappointed.

 

[smaller]

What is the ultimate prayer for believers?

I pray that God in Christ will "save" everyone I witness Him to. I pray that God will set the power of evil aside, once and for all. I pray that God's Mercy and Grace floods the earth and destroys that which is currently plaguing us all. I pray that God puts an end to the devil and his messengers on earth, who obviously "function" in MAN. I pray that DEATH will be swallowed up IN HIS LIFE.

God has promised a "shaking" one more time. That "shaking" will bring about the above. And the world will get progressively worse, til the end. No different than Pharaoh pursuing Israel to their own doom.

1 John 2:15
Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

 

[jasonc]

If AmericaAmerica was judged ,the whole world will be as well.Perhaps, it's just reaping.

 

[smaller]

If AmericaAmerica was judged ,the whole world will be as well.Perhaps, it's just reaping.

Israel didn't listen.

Jeremiah 34:17
Therefore thus saith the Lord; Ye have not hearkened unto me, in proclaiming liberty, every one to his brother, and every man to his neighbour: behold, I proclaim a liberty for you, saith the Lord, to the sword, to the pestilence, and to the famine; and I will make you to be removed into all the kingdoms of the earth.

Is America really listening? I might say, not.

 

[jasonc]

God deals with the world after the cross.He didn't Judge ancient China or older far from Isreal nations.

THE bible in the first half is focused mostly on Isreal and the coming Moshiac,the second half is the return and judgement of Isreal and the World.

 

[IncredibleTransformation]

What is the ultimate prayer for believers?

I pray that God in Christ will "save" everyone I witness Him to. I pray that God will set the power of evil aside, once and for all. I pray that God's Mercy and Grace floods the earth and destroys that which is currently plaguing us all. I pray that God puts an end to the devil and his messengers on earth, who obviously "function" in MAN. I pray that DEATH will be swallowed up IN HIS LIFE.

God has promised a "shaking" one more time. That "shaking" will bring about the above. And the world will get progressively worse, til the end. No different than Pharaoh pursuing Israel to their own doom.

1 John 2:15
Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

Have you ever read the sermon, "Sinners in the Hands of and Angry God?" It was a great sermon by Jonathan Edwards that started the 1st Great Awakening in America. He preached on repentance. It is said that people we so touched by the Holy Spirit that they were on the floor clinging to the legs of the pews and praying for forgiveness of sins. That was the first part of the revival, when the Church confessed their sins. That's the best place to start. Then we pray for God's will for our lives an the nation, not our own selfish goals and ambitions.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

You could be right. We could face judgment...

I submit to you that we already are under Judgment.
For example, the nation that is turning it's wealth over to aliens is under the judgment of God.

but even God can change His mind. It starts with His people. If His people don't believe, repent, snd turn from Their sin, then for sure we are headed down the path of judgment.

Righteous Jeremiah could not save the Jews from going into exile. In fact, Jeremiah went with the nation into exile. But the righteous have God's promise that it will go well with them in the midst of Judgment:

"9The look on their faces testifies against them; they parade their sin like Sodom; they do not hide it. Woe to them! They have brought disaster upon themselves. 10Tell the righteous it will be well with them, for they will enjoy the fruit of their deeds. 11Woe to the wicked! Disaster is upon them! They will be paid back for what their hands have done."
(Isaiah 3:9-11 NIV)

God said to Ezekiel that even righteous Noah and Daniel could not keep the Judgment from coming on His people:

"even though these three men, Noah, Daniel and Job were in its midst, by their own righteousness they could only deliver themselves," declares the Lord GOD." (Ezekiel 14:14 NASB)

It's not up to the righteous. It's up to the unrighteous to repent. But don't fret. God will show favor to the righteous in the midst of his Judgment. Think of Daniel and how God prospered him in the land of exile.

 

[Christ_empowered]

I'm beginning to think its not all doom-and-gloom. The transition into a "post-Christian" culture means that...many will give up church and do secular things, some will secular-ize their churches to accomodate a changing society...and some (many?) will reflect and "do" Christianity in a different, hopefully better, more humane+meaningful way. Oh...and some reactionary groups will retreat into anger, bitterness, and self-righteous indignation. Its a mixed bag, I guess.

Point is...there are genuinely saved, Born Again Christians in the US. They/we can and will adapt to changing circumstances without sacrificing The Good News. Many are called, few are chosen. Christianity never was a faith, a way of life, for the majority in any society. Some of Jesus' teachings, some of the core Christian concepts, made society better, more humane, more bearable, more...Christianized, I suppose...for a season. Now, its secular humanism (on a good day), utilitarian ethics, "progressive" concepts that are gradually changing the world...often (at least sometimes) for the better, too. Beats harsh, judgmental, punitive, reactionary, "Christianity" any day of the week, that's for sure.

 

[smaller]

Have you ever read the sermon, "Sinners in the Hands of and Angry God?" It was a great sermon by Jonathan Edwards that started the 1st Great Awakening in America. He preached on repentance. It is said that people we so touched by the Holy Spirit that they were on the floor clinging to the legs of the pews and praying for forgiveness of sins. That was the first part of the revival, when the Church confessed their sins. That's the best place to start. Then we pray for God's will for our lives an the nation, not our own selfish goals and ambitions.

I happen to dislike crowd manipulations by fear. But it suits the preaching class when they are trying to gather disciples so they can pay their own bills. I recognize it for what it is. But hey, if it works for them I'm not against Christ being preached in any manner, even if it's under pretence.

Christianity fell into this "something new and different" thing in order to differentiate from other preacher/sect competitors. That's why we are so divided. I don't really see any remedy to it.

IF we were Divinely Meant to "unify" we would be. But since we're not as a reality, then the only alternative is that divisions are Divinely Intended, which is a much more likely "reality" conclusion because that is the reality we face.

Unity of the faith is oddly only in the hands of the individuals pursuing it. For any of us to think that the Pope (or any other sectarian religious authority) is really interested in "unifying" with other individual believers, rather than furthering their own agendas, we will be sadly disappointed in our faith.

It's just not going to happen that way, and hasn't. And won't. When we pray for unity, we are actually praying that our adversaries be eliminated, are we not?

If only everyone believed "like me" the world would be a better place is probably not a legitimate faith quest. However scriptures DO present that believers WILL be "like" Jesus, when that time comes.

1 John 3:2
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

In the "mean"time we deal individually, with what is currently on our subjective plates. The current world of flesh men is Divinely Slated for divisions, down to each against the other. I prefer not to wallow in that particular mud myself. Were it not for my HOPE in Christ for all of us, I would have given up on this divided gig a long time ago, from the examples we currently have.

Our own warring country has went and stirred the hornets nest in the middle east, and then quite DISASTROUSLY are shipping the dismembered people HERE. It is simply INSANE. The whole d*** thing. And rather than step back from the plate, they are going to make it even WORSE.

Y'all might think that massively extinguishing in this manner is christian. I might see that God Divinely intended that conflict between the middle easterners and everyone else has been on the Divine Slate from way back. And as such, it won't be extinguishable. Our leadership is pathologically insane.

Genesis 16:
11 And the angel of the Lord said unto her, Behold, thou art with child and shalt bear a son, and shalt call his name Ishmael; because the Lord hath heard thy affliction.
12 And he will be a wild man; his hand will be against every man, and every man's hand against him; and he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren.

So, what have we now? This presence in our country and nearly every country on earth, killing.