Christian Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
-
-
Guest, Join Papa Zoom today for some uplifting biblical encouragement! --> Daily Verses
Marriage: On What Basis?
- Thread starter Tissue
- Start date
@Tina: Off-topic.
@Shad: You're starting to make me angry. I'm not a fundamentalist; that doesn't mean 'I have commitment problems', or 'I am a weak Christian.' I am a ministerial student. I consider my faith the highest, most important thing in my life. I plan to devote my life in entirety to ministering to others. I am in every way a Christian, and participate in orthodoxy. I just happen to believe a few things differently than you do. If you cannot understand that in such a way that you and I may commune and converse together, than that is your shortcoming, not mine. Christianity is far more generous than your extremely narrow world-view.
@Shad: You're starting to make me angry. I'm not a fundamentalist; that doesn't mean 'I have commitment problems', or 'I am a weak Christian.' I am a ministerial student. I consider my faith the highest, most important thing in my life. I plan to devote my life in entirety to ministering to others. I am in every way a Christian, and participate in orthodoxy. I just happen to believe a few things differently than you do. If you cannot understand that in such a way that you and I may commune and converse together, than that is your shortcoming, not mine. Christianity is far more generous than your extremely narrow world-view.
Tina
Member
Tissue said:
How am I off-topic ? .....
That most major religions are against homosexuality and only a minority are for it in no way convince you still that man is made for woman and woman made for man and no other way ???
You claim to be a ministerial student and claim your Christian faith to be the highest, yet you don't seem to demonstrate such faith with what the bible says in plain clear language about homosexuality. You are trying to defend the minorities' beliefs and practices that go against the BIble ....
*sigh*
It is off-topic because this topic is concerned with how we should understand marriage in a world where marriage is defined by the government, where marriage is a social institution, where non-Christians marry, etc.
That religions have an opinion on the moral nature of homosexuality is not at all relevant. You're trying to prove to me that homosexuality is morally wrong. For the purposes of this topic, I don't care one way or another. I am interested in what your definition of marriage is, and why you believe that, and how you understand your definition as applying to those who do not believe the same way you do.
As for the rest of your accusations, I am responding to them via PM. Let's be mature here for the rest of the topic, and stop making personal attacks.
It is off-topic because this topic is concerned with how we should understand marriage in a world where marriage is defined by the government, where marriage is a social institution, where non-Christians marry, etc.
That religions have an opinion on the moral nature of homosexuality is not at all relevant. You're trying to prove to me that homosexuality is morally wrong. For the purposes of this topic, I don't care one way or another. I am interested in what your definition of marriage is, and why you believe that, and how you understand your definition as applying to those who do not believe the same way you do.
As for the rest of your accusations, I am responding to them via PM. Let's be mature here for the rest of the topic, and stop making personal attacks.
GodspromisesRyes
Member
tissue- i do not for myself find the issues of marriage and homosexuality to be controversial, they are parts of life that we deal with and make decisions on and that should be as christians by the word of God.
Also I personally do not have a problem with other christians disagreeing with me, HOWEVER as christians our disagreeing should always, as much as is possible be based on what we at this time understand the word of God to say and teach on the matter, not just on culture or history or tradition. The reason for this being that we are told over and over that it is the will of God, that as His united body that we be of ONE MIND. If we each decide that our perameters of reasonings are going to be outside of the word of God, then we are doing our own thinking, instead of letting the word of God renew our minds bringing them into unity together.
As for your original topic, you did not originally specify that you did not want bible answers, so i adressed your topic with a bible answer. I will expand on that here to get back on topic somewhat.
Marriage between a man and a woman, causes both people to become ONE flesh.- This goes beyond this simple fact as well, because the word is clear if you are joined to a harlot you become a harlot, on the other hand if a husband or wife becomes a believer, their faith sanctifies their spouse, so the crossing over of effects of people becomming ONE flesh are numerous.- Now in the word of God we see that sin brings curses, and if something is naturally bad for you and brings a curse on you it is not good for you.-
Now the union sexually of a man and woman makes them one and out of that comes LIFE into another whole person.- but the union of two men or two women brings no life, it brings vanity. Nothing good comes forth from that naturally speaking. Beyond that it is clear that the sexual workings of two men together brings the curse upon them. The human male body was not made to accept that system of sexuality and because of that, many activities they engage in together are harmful physically to their bodies and can cause life long damage. So now not only is their union VAIN< producing no life or possiblity of it, but it causes harm to one or both people.
God knew it was not good for man to be alone, and so he made man a wife. Not a friend, not a pal, not a man but a wife. He not only made him a wife but he could have formed the wife likewise out of the dust but He did not, He took FROM adam to make her. And he made us the weaker vessel by nature. Our job is to be a HELP meet unto our husbands. When you have two men, there is no help meet and when you have two women you have no stronger vessel, no headship.
Also I personally do not have a problem with other christians disagreeing with me, HOWEVER as christians our disagreeing should always, as much as is possible be based on what we at this time understand the word of God to say and teach on the matter, not just on culture or history or tradition. The reason for this being that we are told over and over that it is the will of God, that as His united body that we be of ONE MIND. If we each decide that our perameters of reasonings are going to be outside of the word of God, then we are doing our own thinking, instead of letting the word of God renew our minds bringing them into unity together.
As for your original topic, you did not originally specify that you did not want bible answers, so i adressed your topic with a bible answer. I will expand on that here to get back on topic somewhat.
Marriage between a man and a woman, causes both people to become ONE flesh.- This goes beyond this simple fact as well, because the word is clear if you are joined to a harlot you become a harlot, on the other hand if a husband or wife becomes a believer, their faith sanctifies their spouse, so the crossing over of effects of people becomming ONE flesh are numerous.- Now in the word of God we see that sin brings curses, and if something is naturally bad for you and brings a curse on you it is not good for you.-
Now the union sexually of a man and woman makes them one and out of that comes LIFE into another whole person.- but the union of two men or two women brings no life, it brings vanity. Nothing good comes forth from that naturally speaking. Beyond that it is clear that the sexual workings of two men together brings the curse upon them. The human male body was not made to accept that system of sexuality and because of that, many activities they engage in together are harmful physically to their bodies and can cause life long damage. So now not only is their union VAIN< producing no life or possiblity of it, but it causes harm to one or both people.
God knew it was not good for man to be alone, and so he made man a wife. Not a friend, not a pal, not a man but a wife. He not only made him a wife but he could have formed the wife likewise out of the dust but He did not, He took FROM adam to make her. And he made us the weaker vessel by nature. Our job is to be a HELP meet unto our husbands. When you have two men, there is no help meet and when you have two women you have no stronger vessel, no headship.
Tissue said:
Christians ought to choose their spouse as God fearing one. The Bible says do not yoke with non-believer. When you marry you will have children most likely; parents have responsibility to raise their children as they should go. When you marry non-believer you will have a problem how you raise kids.
Caroline H
Member
Tissue, if you did not want Scripture only-based answers about the nature of marriage, then why start this topic in "Apologetics and Theology"? 
Also, the Statement of Faith of this site holds that "The bible is the inspired, infallible and authoritative Word of God." To expect people not to approach a topic like this with anything other than Scripture is silly. This thread will be closely watched, if it veers into homosexual promotion, or negating the Scriptures, it will be closed.
Also, the Statement of Faith of this site holds that "The bible is the inspired, infallible and authoritative Word of God." To expect people not to approach a topic like this with anything other than Scripture is silly. This thread will be closely watched, if it veers into homosexual promotion, or negating the Scriptures, it will be closed. Tissue said:
God is the foundation of marriage, if it is He who first designed it as well as commanded us how we were to have a truly blessed or happy marriage. Marriage, in its true form is not to be had between any other but a man and a woman. I understand not all will believe this way or believe scripture in its fullest. So I cannot push my own beliefs on another. Here though are some scriptures that truly define what marriage is in my heart.
Genesis 1: 26-28 Then God said, “Let us make man in our image, after our likeness. And let them have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the heavens and over the livestock and over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.â€
So God created man in his own image,
in the image of God he created him;
male and female he created them.
And God blessed them. And God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth and subdue it and have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the heavens and over every living thing that moves on the earth.â€
Genesis 2:24 Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one flesh.
Ecclesiastes 9:9 Enjoy life with the wife whom you love, all the days of your vain life that he has given you under the sun, because that is your portion in life and in your toil at which you toil under the sun.
Ephesians 5:22-33 Wives, submit to your own husbands, as to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife even as Christ is the head of the church, his body, and is himself its Savior. Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit in everything to their husbands. Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish. In the same way husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ does the church, because we are members of his body. “Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.†This mystery is profound, and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the church. However, let each one of you love his wife as himself, and let the wife see that she respects her husband.
Hebrews 13:4 Let marriage be held in honor among all, and let the marriage bed be undefiled, for God will judge the sexually immoral and adulterous.
Leviticus 20:13 If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination.
Leviticus 18:22-24 You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination. Nor shall you mate with any animal, to defile yourself with it. Nor shall any woman stand before an animal to mate with it. It is perversion. ‘Do not defile yourselves with any of these things; for by all these the nations are defiled, which I am casting out before you.
caromurp said:Tissue, if you did not want Scripture only-based answers about the nature of marriage, then why start this topic in "Apologetics and Theology"?
Because both Apologetics and Theology (the second more so than the first) are respected realms of study and inquiry, which do not base their studies on rote memorization of the best possible Bible translation as a knee-jerk response to intellectual situations.
It is, properly speaking, IMPOSSIBLE to understand the Bible without drawing upon reason and experience. No person can understand the world except through a pair of lens. No person can understand the Bible except through a pair of lens. It is thoroughly irresponsible to attempt to interpret the Bible without drawing upon tradition.
I am being thoroughly orthodox in calling for a discussion of this matter based upon reason, experience, Scripture, and tradition. How else would one approach this topic? Anyone who thinks the Bible is the end all be all is oversimplifying; reason and experience and tradition play a role as well, though it may not be immediately recognizable.
I've never, EVER in this thread said 'Don't quote the Bible.' In fact, I encouraged it, calling it 'certainly relevant.' My own stance on marriage stems from my understanding of the Bible. But I cannot let it stay there. That is only the beginning; we must work out this Biblical understanding for the world in which we live.
Wasn't intending on it, but ok. You may also close it if we speak about manatee mating rituals.
