OSAS discussion without using scripture

[DRS81]

You broke the rules.

Good-bye.

.

If we break the rules then we delete it and move on, ooops.

 

[JLB]

You broke the rules.

Good-bye.

.

I kinda like like this better since we can say what we want and then tag a scripture reference to what we say.


JLB

 

[DRS81]

You have to continue to believe until the end, for those who believe for awhile then fall away, have become unbelievers, since they no longer believe.

Remember, no scripture. What does the blood of Jesus symbolize for you?

 

[JLB]

Remember, no scripture. What does the blood of Jesus symbolize for you?

It doesn't symbolize anything to me.

Jesus literally shed His blood, so that my literal sins would literally be removed.

Jesus Blood continues to do this as I confess my literal sins to Him.

If I decide one day to stop believing that His blood was really shed for me, and Jesus was just some story that people made up, then I literally have no more sacrifice and forgiveness for my sins that I still literally commit.

If I literally become an unbeliever, then can I expect to still be counted with those who were faithful to the end?


JLB

 

[DRS81]

Jesus Blood continues to do this as I confess my literal sins to Him.

But we are no longer convicted of sins but of righteousness. Why would you ask for forgiveness of things you've already been forgiven for?

If I decide one day to stop believing that His blood was really shed for me, and Jesus was just some story that people made up, then I literally have no more sacrifice and forgiveness for my sins that I still literally commit.

But blood in general is on the inside of us.
How can that blood be removed from the inside out.
Did Jesus die a horrible and gruesome death so that we would lose our salvation.
If our self works keep our salvation, can you please name some of these works that keep us out of hell.

 

[JLB]

DRS81 said -

But we are no longer convicted of sins but of righteousness. Why would you ask for forgiveness of things you've already been forgiven for?

Because I haven't already been forgiven. That is what makes OSAS a false doctrine.

Repentance for the remission of sins is what is preached in His name.

We must come to God, and ask for forgiveness and He is faithful and just to forgive.

Now if we choose the practice a sinful habit, and we don't want to stop, then we don't repent and don't ask for forgives from God, we still have those sins because they have not been removed.


JLB

 

[DRS81]

Because I haven't already been forgiven. That is what makes OSAS a false doctrine.

Repentance for the remission of sins is what is preached in His name.

We must come to God, and ask for forgiveness and He is faithful and just to forgive.

Now if we choose the practice a sinful habit, and we don't want to stop, then we don't repent and don't ask for forgives from God, we still have those sins because they have not been removed.


JLB

But you (have) been forgiven.

Once you accepted Jesus in your heart and confessed that he was your savior, you then have been forgiven of all sins.

The Holy Spirit no longer convicts us of sin, do you understand what that means JLB.

 

[Gary]

The disciples asked Jesus to teach them to pray. One of the lines in that prayer is "Forgive us our trespasses".

It's true, we don't have to ask forgiveness for every sin, but if you catch yourself sinning, it would be in your best interest to approach the Father regarding that issue. If you don't, there is no forgiveness for those sins. Also, if you catch yourself sinning and just take it for granted that you're forgiven, you are tempting the Lord. That's also sinning.

Just some things to keep in mind.
.

 

[DRS81]

If you don't, there is no forgiveness for those sins.

But why ask for forgiveness of things you were already forgiven for at the cross. The holy spirit no longer convicts us of sin.

 

[Gary]

But why ask for forgiveness of things you were already forgiven for at the cross. The holy spirit no longer convicts us of sin.

That conviction is called discerning the spirits. If you're not being convicted of your sinning, that means you are no longer able to discern right from wrong. You've just went back to square one. That's not good.

Orrrrrrr, you know what you're doing, but are just taking it for granted that you're secure in your salvation and that the Blood of the Lamb automatically shields you. You believe that all you need to do is believe. The bible doesn't support that doctrine.


Here's my question to you: How does one know when they are saved?
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[Free]

But you (have) been forgiven.

Once you accepted Jesus in your heart and confessed that he was your savior, you then have been forgiven of all sins.

The Holy Spirit no longer convicts us of sin, do you understand what that means JLB.

That is not what Scripture teaches.

Trying to have a theological discussion without referencing Scripture is pointless--it all becomes opinion and therefore a fruitless exercise in trying to come to the truth of a matter.

 

[DRS81]

That conviction is called discerning the spirits. If you're not being convicted of your sinning, that means you are no longer able to discern right from wrong. You've just went back to square one. That's not good.

Nonbelievers who haven't come to faith yet are being convicted of sin. The world is being convicted of sin. When you come to faith, God is bringing you OUT of the world. Jesus says we are not of the world anymore. Believers are convicted of righteousness not sin, nonbelievers like (atheist/buddhists/muslims) are being convicted of sin. Why do you think believers are no longer convicted of sin?

Here's my question to you: How does one know when they are saved?

Through your faith and God's grace. Because God's grace is physical, the indwelling of the holy spirit is physical or it wouldn't be indwelling you.

That is not what Scripture teaches.

Trying to have a theological discussion without referencing Scripture is pointless--it all becomes opinion and therefore a fruitless exercise in trying to come to the truth of a matter.

It's not pointless, we're having a good discussion here. Nonbelievers who haven't come to faith yet are being convicted of sin. The world is being convicted of sin. When you come to faith, God is bringing you OUT of the world. Jesus says we are not of the world anymore. Believers are convicted of righteousness not sin, nonbelievers like (atheist/buddhists/muslims) are being convicted of sin.

 

[Gary]

Nonbelievers who haven't come to faith yet are being convicted of sin. The world is being convicted of sin. When you come to faith, God is bringing you OUT of the world. Jesus says we are not of the world anymore. Believers are convicted of righteousness not sin, nonbelievers like (atheist/buddhists/muslims) are being convicted of sin. Why do you think believers are no longer convicted of sin?

If that's you believe............

How does one know when they are saved?
Through your faith and God's grace. Because God's grace is physical, the indwelling of the holy spirit is physical or it wouldn't be indwelling you.

You mean all one has to do is believe and they're saved?
.

 

[follower]

But why ask for forgiveness of things you were already forgiven for at the cross. The holy spirit no longer convicts us of sin.

if anyone or everyone was forgiven at the cross then they wouldn't, supposedly, have to repent later. but the Master Yeshua says clearly that without repentance there is no remission(no forgiveness) of sin. and believers may , like Peter, find themselves repenting for sin much later (all their lives?) after they are first saved. (if they fall into sin)

 

[DRS81]

You mean all one has to do is believe and they're saved?

Yes.

if anyone or everyone was forgiven at the cross then they wouldn't, supposedly, have to repent later. but the Master Yeshua says clearly that without repentance there is no remission(no forgiveness) of sin. and believers may , like Peter, find themselves repenting for sin much later (all their lives?) after they are first saved. (if they fall into sin)

Well, I would say repentance for a nonbeliever and a believer are different.

 

[Gary]

You mean all one has to do is believe and they're saved?
.

Yes.

That's Universalism.
.

 

[follower]

Well, I would say repentance for a nonbeliever and a believer are different.

Look up the meaning of the word, in any language. It simply means turning to Yhvh, 'turning around', forsaking sin, not facing the same direction in order to sin again, but facing /looking toward Yhvh to go towards Him, His Way.

gentiles, goyim, foreigners, who have Torah in their hearts and do what Yhvh wants from their hearts Yhvh makes note of;
just like Jews or Law Keepers who have the Written Torah but do not do what Yhvh wants, Yhvh notes that also.

 

[DRS81]

That's Universalism.

How?

Look up the meaning of the word, in any language. It simply means turning to Yhvh, 'turning around', forsaking sin, not facing the same direction in order to sin again, but facing /looking toward Yhvh to go towards Him, His Way.

gentiles, goyim, foreigners, who have Torah in their hearts and do what Yhvh wants from their hearts Yhvh makes note of;
just like Jews or Law Keepers who have the Written Torah but do not do what Yhvh wants, Yhvh notes that also.

Nonbelievers who repent are obtaining salvation. Believers who repent are walking closer to God then they were yesterday.

 

[Gary]

How?

Look it up.

 

[DRS81]

Look it up.

Can you sum of universalism for me in your own words.