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Guest, Join Papa Zoom today for some uplifting biblical encouragement! --> Daily Verses
Roman Centurion and the Canaanite Women
- Thread starter Lee2000
- Start date
Isn't it entirely possible Jesus knew something about the two situations that we don't ? Was the Roman Centurion's servant that needed healing a gentile ?
Kind of hard to read Jesus's mind through the actions we see him take as in " he did not want to help" . Was Jesus milking the situation for end result we have in these verses below ?
Matt 15
| 25 Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me. |
| 26 But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs. |
| 27 And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table. |
| 28 Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour |
Christ_empowered
Member
Look up commentary. I vaguely remember reading that this was clever word play but it has to be put into context…
I think
the commentary I read was by max lucado.
I think
the commentary I read was by max lucado.
journeyman
Member
Hello Lee2000.
It's possible he was speaking to her in a questioning tone, like "Are you one of my lost sheep?" Her response could be understood as meaning, "Yes Lord, because Gods' children are humblest of all, living by faith."
That's really how Abraham is our father.
Christ_empowered
Member
The Canaanite Woman: When Great Faith Meets Great Action
As a bridegroom rejoices over his bride, so will your God rejoice over you. — Isaiah 62:5I have a sketch of Jesus laughing. It hangs on the wall right across from my desk.
It’s quite a drawing. His head is back. His mouth is open. His eyes are sparkling. He isn’t just grinning. He isn’t just...
faithgateway.com
Hey All,
I meant to post this yesterday. But it was a very busy day. Let's take a look at both situations.
Matthew 8:5-13: Jesus and the Centurion
The centurion obviously had faith. He also was aware of the uncleanliness of his house. He was a Gentile. It was against Jewish custom to cross the threshold of a gentile's house. But no such actual law existed. (Remember all the places Jesus said, "Ye have heard it said . . . But I say unto you . . ." This is where Jewish tradition has risen to legal status.)
Knowing the Jewish viewpoint, the centurion assumed Jesus would feel the same. The centurion still asked commiting a selfless act. He didn't have to do this. Here is an interesting fact about the Roman Law . If a slave got sick or injured so badly that they couldn't perform their duties, the master had the rights to kill the slave. So the centurion was doing the opposite of the law. He was showing mercy for his servent. He was also showing faith in Jesus' abilities as a healer.
Jesus commends the centurion's faith, and heals his servent per his request.
Matthew 15:21-28 : Jesus and the Canaanite Woman
The lady comes to Jesus with her request--spiritual healing for her daughter, actually an exocism. The disciples tell Jesus to "send her away." Jesus tells her no at first. The lady worshipped the Man who just told her no, and asked again "Lord, help me." Then, in one of the most peculiar sayings Jesus ever makes, He compares her to a dog.(oh no He ditint!)
Matthew 15:26 But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs.
Oh Yes He did! Why? This seems so out of character.
Without proper understanding, this sounds like an insult. But when you delve further into the whole story, you find the meaning. The Greek word for "dogs" is kuon, and it means "wild cur" or "wild dogs." (Mat 7:6; Luke 16:21; Phil 3:2). The word Jesus used is kunarion meaning a small or pet dog. Jesus, using the word kunarion sets up a metaphor to define His ministry priorities to his disciples.
So He turned the Cananite woman down a second time. But you have to give it to her. She had moxy. She was advocating for her daughter, and she was determined. She hung in there saying that even dogs get scraps from the table. Or, If I am a pet, then treat me as such. She gets the metaphor Jesus is using, and uses it to argue for her daughter as she continues to plead for help. This is unwavering faith. Jesus was her last hope. She refused to take no for an answer. She believed that even a "crumb" from Jesus was enough to exorcize her daughter. Jesus praises her faith and grants her plea.
Her faith gave her more than a crumb. It gave her a seat at the table. She understood what the children of Israel, and even His disciples did not. Jesus used the opportunity to show that anyone, Jew or gentile, who places their hope--faith (Heb 11:1) in Jesus will be made free.
So it wasn't an insult, or an ethnic slur. It was a teaching opportunity to his disciples. He also used it to teat the faith of the woman, and in so doing, show us how to come before the Lord. I hope this helps. Keep walking everybody. May G
od bless,
Taz
I meant to post this yesterday. But it was a very busy day. Let's take a look at both situations.
Matthew 8:5-13: Jesus and the Centurion
The centurion obviously had faith. He also was aware of the uncleanliness of his house. He was a Gentile. It was against Jewish custom to cross the threshold of a gentile's house. But no such actual law existed. (Remember all the places Jesus said, "Ye have heard it said . . . But I say unto you . . ." This is where Jewish tradition has risen to legal status.)
Knowing the Jewish viewpoint, the centurion assumed Jesus would feel the same. The centurion still asked commiting a selfless act. He didn't have to do this. Here is an interesting fact about the Roman Law . If a slave got sick or injured so badly that they couldn't perform their duties, the master had the rights to kill the slave. So the centurion was doing the opposite of the law. He was showing mercy for his servent. He was also showing faith in Jesus' abilities as a healer.
Jesus commends the centurion's faith, and heals his servent per his request.
Matthew 15:21-28 : Jesus and the Canaanite Woman
The lady comes to Jesus with her request--spiritual healing for her daughter, actually an exocism. The disciples tell Jesus to "send her away." Jesus tells her no at first. The lady worshipped the Man who just told her no, and asked again "Lord, help me." Then, in one of the most peculiar sayings Jesus ever makes, He compares her to a dog.(oh no He ditint!)
Matthew 15:26 But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs.
Oh Yes He did! Why? This seems so out of character.
Without proper understanding, this sounds like an insult. But when you delve further into the whole story, you find the meaning. The Greek word for "dogs" is kuon, and it means "wild cur" or "wild dogs." (Mat 7:6; Luke 16:21; Phil 3:2). The word Jesus used is kunarion meaning a small or pet dog. Jesus, using the word kunarion sets up a metaphor to define His ministry priorities to his disciples.
So He turned the Cananite woman down a second time. But you have to give it to her. She had moxy. She was advocating for her daughter, and she was determined. She hung in there saying that even dogs get scraps from the table. Or, If I am a pet, then treat me as such. She gets the metaphor Jesus is using, and uses it to argue for her daughter as she continues to plead for help. This is unwavering faith. Jesus was her last hope. She refused to take no for an answer. She believed that even a "crumb" from Jesus was enough to exorcize her daughter. Jesus praises her faith and grants her plea.
Her faith gave her more than a crumb. It gave her a seat at the table. She understood what the children of Israel, and even His disciples did not. Jesus used the opportunity to show that anyone, Jew or gentile, who places their hope--faith (Heb 11:1) in Jesus will be made free.
So it wasn't an insult, or an ethnic slur. It was a teaching opportunity to his disciples. He also used it to teat the faith of the woman, and in so doing, show us how to come before the Lord. I hope this helps. Keep walking everybody. May G
od bless,
Taz
Lee2000
Member
Greetings,Hello Lee2000.
It's possible he was speaking to her in a questioning tone, like "Are you one of my lost sheep?" Her response could be understood as meaning, "Yes Lord, because Gods' children are humblest of all, living by faith."
That's really how Abraham is our father.
Yes that is so possible.
Blessings.
Lee2000
Member
Lee2000
Member
Greetings,Look up commentary. I vaguely remember reading that this was clever word play but it has to be put into context…
I think
I will need to check that one out thanks.
Blessings.
Lee2000
Member
Lee2000
Member
Greetings,The Canaanite Woman: When Great Faith Meets Great Action
As a bridegroom rejoices over his bride, so will your God rejoice over you. — Isaiah 62:5I have a sketch of Jesus laughing. It hangs on the wall right across from my desk. It’s quite a drawing. His head is back. His mouth is open. His eyes are sparkling. He isn’t just grinning. He isn’t just...
it was a good read thank you.
Blessings.
Lee2000
Member
I would offer when searching the mysteries of faith (the unseen things of God we must be careful how we hear his understanding of His faith called a labor of love Christ in us. How . . coming before what .
Parables reveal the unseen gospel the power of God's word that works in us. as revealed in Philippians 2;13 the power of God to both reveal his eternal will will and strengthen mankind to do it to the good pleasure of our unseen Holy Father. The gospel in a nutshell
Philippians 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you "both" to will and to do of his good pleasure. Do all things without murmurings and disputings:
Some like Jonas murmured and kicked against the pricks (the law of of God)
teaching God is not served by human hands as a will. Jesus empowered by the father did the will with delight
I consider the better thing that acompanies of salvation .Eternal God working in dying creatures .God working displaying his power.
He informs us he will not forget the good works that we miraculously "can" offer according to his power again both will and do.
Jesus said marvel not but believe the Holy father and we are empowered yoked with him if we do not harden our hearts . . . . . we have received his rest . Just in in both parables you offered the unseen Holy third party a strand of three is not easily broken.
Both parables
Mathew 8:5-13 And when Jesus was entered into Capernaum, there came unto him a centurion, beseeching him, And saying, Lord, (calling out to God) my servant lieth at home sick of the palsy, grievously tormented. And Jesus saith unto him, I will come and heal him. The centurion answered and said, Lord, I am not worthy that thou shouldest come under my roof: but speak the word only, and my servant shall be healed. For I am a man under authority, having soldiers under me: and I say to this man, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant, Do this, and he doeth it. When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven. But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.And Jesus said unto the centurion, Go thy way; and as thou hast believed, so be it done unto thee. And his servant was healed in the selfsame hour.
The father gave jesus the prophet faith to believe just as he did the servant at home sick of the palsy, grievously tormented Mutually comforting both . The Son of man Jesus never came under her roof
God's gift are alway two fold. It's not something we posses as a credential he gives any gift to whoever at any moment sometime more than one. .
The apostle Paul sent with prophecy and the prophet giving the hearing of the prophets the mutual work of one faith or called a labor of love
Romans 1:10 Making request, if by any means now at length I might have a prosperous journey by the will of God to come unto you. For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift, to the end ye may be established; That is, that I may be comforted together with you by the mutual faith both of you and me.
Mathew 15:21-28 Then Jesus The prophet prophesying the word of the father went thence, and departed into the coasts of Tyre and Sidon.And, behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, saying, Have mercy on me, O Lord, thou son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil.But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us.But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.Then came she and worshipped him,(not seen) saying, Lord, help me.
But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs.And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table.Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: (the power of God) be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour. And Jesus departed from thence, and came nigh unto the sea of Galilee; and went up into a mountain, and sat down there.
I would offer.
I have a different understanding of what makes a parable as tool for finding the mysteries of God hid from natural unconverted mankind
Without mixing the historical temporal with the unseen eternal spiritual things of God. Christ the Holy Spirit spoke not . . .he freely gives us the 20/20 recipe needed to rightly divide the parables .
2 Corinthians 4: 17-18 For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory; While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.
Having mixed the temporal historical with the unseen eternal we can rest with Christ who works in us
Some did hear the gospel preached but did not mix with faith the unseen things of God
Hebrews 4:1-2King James Version Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
Parables come along side helping to teach us how to walk by faith the unseen eternal things of God .
I would suggest committing to memory the mixing recipe. ( 2 Corinthians 4: 17-18)