SALVATION

[Cornelius]

...........continued here from Current Events (Preacher looses Salvation thread)

Before you guys gets into a panic about what I said, let me rather try to clarify it better. (We can then move to a new topic if you wish)

I keep on forgetting that most people believe salvation is like stepping over a line. I believe salvation is like joining a gym Joining a gym does not make you fit. You have to "walk in the ways of the gym" to become fit.

Salvation is an ongoing process.

We are saved in many ways, not just in a "I am going to heaven" salvation !
1Cr 15:1 ¶ Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;


1Cr 15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

Believing in vain ? Yes, that is what it says! Christians can believe in vain, IF we do not keep the whole gospel "in memory" !!

Your spirit is saved by faith in Jesus.But our minds (souls) are still so wrong about many things ! We do immediately think the correct thoughts when we get saved. We have 0% knowledge of the ways of God that very first day of salvation. We now have to be rebooted and formatted LOL. God now uses the Word and He starts washing our minds with it.

God wants to change us. God is not interested in the "old you". No, He wants to manifest His Son in and through you. That is the race Paul is talking about .Do not let anybody take your crown from you.
Rom 12:2 And be not fashioned according to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, and ye may prove what is the good and acceptable and perfect will of God.

Transformed ! From the old you into the image of Christ. Your inner self, the way you are, your soul or mind (depending on your view) must still be saved. Saved from itself. Saved from wrong thoughts. Saved from the old way of thinking.

God must brainwash us before this can happen Eph 5:26 that he might sanctify it,(the church) having cleansed it by the washing of water with the word,

Eph 5:27 that he might present the church to himself a glorious [church], not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.


We do not start off like this, we END like this in Eph 5:27 when we have been washed by the water of the Word.

You see , God GIVES us salvation by and through our faith. But in the end, those who manifest this salvation is truly saved. God calls all Christians to manifest Christ.Many are called. But in the end, not all will do this. Many will not run this race to the end. Many will not allow the Word to change them. Many will cling to doctrines instead of the Word. They will loose their crowns, and some will have believed in vain.Not many are chosen. This is a narrow road.

Just think for a minute about the millions upon millions of Christians on this planet and then read this verse and see the truth of many are called , but few are chosen:


Mat 7:14 For narrow is the gate, and straitened the way, that leadeth unto life, and few are they that find it.

 

[Panin]

...........continued here from Current Events (Preacher looses Salvation thread)

Before you guys gets into a panic about what I said, let me rather try to clarify it better. (We can then move to a new topic if you wish)

I keep on forgetting that most people believe salvation is like stepping over a line. I believe salvation is like joining a gym Joining a gym does not make you fit. You have to "walk in the ways of the gym" to become fit.

Salvation is an ongoing process.

We are saved in many ways, not just in a "I am going to heaven" salvation !
1Cr 15:1 ¶ Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;


1Cr 15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

Believing in vain ? Yes, that is what it says! Christians can believe in vain, IF we do not keep the whole gospel "in memory" !!

Your spirit is saved by faith in Jesus.But our minds (souls) are still so wrong about many things ! We do immediately think the correct thoughts when we get saved. We have 0% knowledge of the ways of God that very first day of salvation. We now have to be rebooted and formatted LOL. God now uses the Word and He starts washing our minds with it.

God wants to change us. God is not interested in the "old you". No, He wants to manifest His Son in and through you. That is the race Paul is talking about .Do not let anybody take your crown from you.
Rom 12:2 And be not fashioned according to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, and ye may prove what is the good and acceptable and perfect will of God.

Transformed ! From the old you into the image of Christ. Your inner self, the way you are, your soul or mind (depending on your view) must still be saved. Saved from itself. Saved from wrong thoughts. Saved from the old way of thinking.

God must brainwash us before this can happen Eph 5:26 that he might sanctify it,(the church) having cleansed it by the washing of water with the word,

Eph 5:27 that he might present the church to himself a glorious [church], not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.


We do not start off like this, we END like this in Eph 5:27 when we have been washed by the water of the Word.

You see , God GIVES us salvation by and through our faith. But in the end, those who manifest this salvation is truly saved. God calls all Christians to manifest Christ.Many are called. But in the end, not all will do this. Many will not run this race to the end. Many will not allow the Word to change them. Many will cling to doctrines instead of the Word. They will loose their crowns, and some will have believed in vain.Not many are chosen. This is a narrow road.

Just think for a minute about the millions upon millions of Christians on this planet and then read this verse and see the truth of many are called , but few are chosen:


Mat 7:14 For narrow is the gate, and straitened the way, that leadeth unto life, and few are they that find it.

Before I get into a panic can you please explain the following.

You see , God GIVES us salvation by and through our faith. But in the end, those who manifest this salvation is truly saved. God calls all Christians to manifest Christ.Many are called. But in the end, not all will do this. Many will not run this race to the end. Many will not allow the Word to change them. Many will cling to doctrines instead of the Word. They will loose their crowns, and some will have believed in vain.Not many are chosen. This is a narrow road.

Followed by a detailed explaination as to how one enters through the narrow gate AKA gets saved IE SALVATION. Inquiring minds want to know.

Mat 7:14 For narrow is the gate, and straitened the way, that leadeth unto life, and few are they that find it

For start only a saved person can manifest salvation. What you appear to be saying is; only the one who goes to the spirtual gym five times week will get there. I hope you arent because that's bunkum, my friend, bunkum.

 

[Panin]

DOCTRINE OF ETERNAL SECURITY

DOCTRINE OF ETERNAL SECURITY (IE ETERNAL SALVATION THAT CAN NOT BE LOSET OR EARNED)

1Pet.1:5 "who are protected by the power of God through faith (saving) for a deliverance (Rapture) ready to be revealed in the last time."
The logical approach.
If salvation is by grace through faith, then works are ruled out either as a means of salvation or as a means for its security, Eph.2:8,9.
If the new birth constitutes us as "sons", then our failings cannot change who our "parents" are, Jn.1:12,13.
The a fortiori argument: since God did the most for us when we were His enemies, how will He do less (keep us saved) as sons, Rom.5: 9,10,15,17,20.
The positional truth approach.
Direct statement, Rom.8:1.
The love of God for the believer is equal to God's love for His natural Son, Rom.8:38,39; cp. Eph.1:58, especially vs.6.
We already share Christ's resurrection, Eph.2:6.
The head cannot repudiate members of the body and continue to have a complete body, 1Cor.12: 13,21.
The family approach, Gal.3:26 "For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus"; cp. Jn.3.
The Greek tense approach, Act.16:31 "Believe (aor.act.imper.) in the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved (fut.pass.ind.)."
The typological approach.
Noah's ark, 1Pet.3:20,21.
The Red Sea crossing, 1Cor.10:1,2.
The breastplate attached to the ephod, Ex.28:22-28 (emphasizes security via the elaborate procedure for tying the uniform together: gold rings, chains, and a blue cord).
The approach from Christ's current ministry, seated at the right hand of God, to believers.
Mediatorship implies a go-between and is based on the Cross, Gal.3:20; 1Tim.2:5 (He represents both parties and, being perfect, He secures a settlement equally suitable to both parties); Heb.8:6; 9:15; 12:24.
He is our advocate with the Father, 1Jn.2:2; cp. Rev.2:10 (Satan is unsuccessful).
His intercessory work covers us for Phase 2 sins, Rom.8:31-34; Heb.7:2325; Lk.22:31-34 (for Peter).
The experiential approach, 2Tim.2:12,13.
We can deny Him in reversionism, but He cannot deny us salvation, since He cannot go back on a promise, vs.13.
He can deny us surpassing grace blessings in Phase 3 (SG3), vs.12.
The ministry of the Holy Spirit approach.
Regeneration, 1Pet.1:22-25. We are born of incorruptible seed (the gospel), not corruptible, therefore we cannot die, Jn.11:26b.
Indwelling, Rom.8:9; 1Jn.2:27. This is down payment or earnest on our resurrection body, 2Cor.1:22.
Baptism, see point II.
Sealing, 2Cor.1:21,22; Eph.1:13,14; 4:30. We are sealed with respect to the day of redemption.
The essence of God approach.
Sovereignty, 2Pet.3:9 "not willing..."; Eph1:58; cp. Rom.8:2830.
Love, Rom.8:38,39; Jn.3:16.
Immutability, 2Tim.2:13; cp. Jn.3:16; 5:24; 6:37; 10:28.
Veracity cannot lie, Ti.1:2.
Omnipotence, Jn.10:28; 6:39; 1Pet.1:5; Jd.1 "To those who are the called, beloved in God the Father, and kept for Jesus Christ."
Omniscience, Act.15:8. God is called o` kardiognw,sthj, ho kardiognostes; He "knows the heart" with respect to Cornelius and his household's conversion, cp.Jn.10:14.
Omnipresence, Ps.139, the example of Philip and the Ethiopian eunuch.
Righteousness, the doctrine of imputation, which is forensic and irreversible, Rom.4:38; cp. Ps.32:2.
Eternal Life, Jn.3:15,16; 4:13,14 "Jesus answered and said to her, 'Everyone who drinks of this water shall thirst again; but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall become in him a well of living water springing up to eternal life'"; Jn.5:24,39; 6:39,40,47,54; 10:28; 17:2,3.
Justice. Christ died for all sins for all people, 1Jn.2:2.
Problem passages can be explained due to a confusion of Phase 2 and Phase 3 grace with Phase 1, Jn15:6; Gal.5:4; Rev.22:19.
Christ's prayer for eternal security of the royal family presents an area of His intercessory work, Jn.17:2,6,9,11,12,24. He prays for us and this is one of the things He prays for. Jd.24,25 "Now to Him who is able to keep you from stumbling (reversionism), and to make you stand in the presence of His glory blameless with great joy, to the only God our Savior, through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion and authority, before all time and now and forever. Amen."
Soteriological (salvation) approach.
Since all sins were judged at the Cross, sins cannot undo our salvation, Ps.103:12; Isa.1:18; cp. Isa.53.
Since Old Testament saints had righteousness (+R) by faith (Gen.15:6; cp. Rom.4:3), their unbelief was not imputed to Him (Ps.32:2; cp. Rom.4:68).
Belief in Christ was the basis for salvation, Gen.15:6; Isa.28:16; Jn.3:5; 1Pet.2:6.
"And all who take refuge in Him will not be ashamed", Ps.34:22.
The believer himself can do nothing to negate the salvation adjustment to the justice of God, Rom.8:39 "nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord."

This is my view on the security of my salvation. Thank Christ it doesnt have a lot to do with me as many "christians" would have me believe.

 

[Cornelius]

I certainly do not believe in unconditional eternal security. That is simply not true. Salvation has conditions. Faith is one condition. How on earth can we enter without faith? Holiness is another condition.

You can try and see the Lord without holiness,(I am not saying you are, but just for argument sake.....) but I am not going to consider that , because eternity is a long time Hbr 12:14 Follow peace with all [men], and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord: (How many Christians are concerned about living holy lives today? )

I certainly don't want to have believed in vain. Do you? Gal 2:2 And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain.

and we have to keep the real gospel in memory, unless we believe in vain.

1Cr 15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. So we can BELIEVE and it can all still be in vain.

For Christians who think they can live in unforgiveness and still make it to heaven: They will find out that we need our sins forgiven to get into heaven. No forgiveness = no heaven, no matter how much you praise and worship the Lord and how much you love Him.
Mar 11:26 [But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father who is in heaven forgive your trespasses.]

Willing sin, that is done through a rebellious heart, will cause you to become hardened and you can fall away.
Hbr 10:26 ¶ For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,


Hbr 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

Unbelief in what the Word says brings judgement upon the believers.Rom 11:20 Well; by their unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by thy faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
Rom 11:21 for if God spared not the natural branches, neither will he spare thee. Does not sound like unconditional security is preached by Paul here at all. No he is warning us to FEAR. Be careful how you walk and be careful that you are found IN faith regarding the Word and NOT to be entangled in the useless doctrines of the "church" (I use that word for lack of a better one)


I will not make this too long, but there are so many scriptures that tell us that we have a part to play as well. Its really not just up to God. We have WALK in this salvation , or this is no salvation at all. In the beginning we are washed, but we have to look at how we walk to maintain it:

Jhn 13:6 Then cometh he to Simon Peter: and Peter saith unto him, Lord, dost thou wash my feet?
Jhn 13:7 Jesus answered and said unto him, What I do thou knowest not now; but thou shalt know hereafter.
Jhn 13:8 Peter saith unto him, Thou shalt never wash my feet. Jesus answered him, If I wash thee not, thou hast no part with me.
Jhn 13:9 Simon Peter saith unto him, Lord, not my feet only, but also [my] hands and [my] head.
Jhn 13:10 Jesus saith to him, He that is washed needeth not save to wash [his] feet, but is clean every whit: and ye are clean, but not all.

(Those who have been washed by the blood, still have to have the Word wash their feet..........or they have no part in Him.

 

[beardedad]

Why is it so hard to grasp that our salvation is assured by accepting Christ as our lord and savior. If someone does sin on purpose you think that he will lose his salvation. We sin on purpose every day sometime we know it, other times we don’t. When we do things that we know are wrong but at the time thinking that since it is just a small thing for instance:
You are ridding down the road and see an old man trying to change a tire, but you are in a hurry you just can’t stop to help. By Gods account you committed a sin by not helping.
A sin as small as this to God is just the same as the sin killing someone. We all have free will and God lets us make mistakes and as with all children sometimes you have to stand back and watch them fall, but that does not mean they are not still your child. If a son had committed murder and his father tried distance himself from his son and tell everyone that this is not my son. He can no more do this as the sun not rise the next day. It is the same when you are a child of God. Jesus has already paid the price for our sins. You are his child forever, in good and bad. A gift you give someone you don’t take back because of what they do with it or you don’t take it back because they try to give it back to you. It was given freely just as our salvation is given to us freely with no strings attached.

 

[shad]

Why is it so hard to grasp that our salvation is assured by accepting Christ as our lord and savior. If someone does sin on purpose you think that he will lose his salvation. We sin on purpose every day sometime we know it, other times we don’t.

Oh my, this is what I mean by mainstream is watering down Jesus' messages and Salvation. Please read the Bible with open heart and mind thoroughly yourself without anyone's influence. Start from the New Testament.

.

 

[beardedad]

Why is it so hard to grasp that our salvation is assured by accepting Christ as our lord and savior. If someone does sin on purpose you think that he will lose his salvation. We sin on purpose every day sometime we know it, other times we don’t.

Oh my, this is what I mean by mainstream is watering down Jesus' messages and Salvation. Please read the Bible with open heart and mind thoroughly yourself without anyone's influence. Start from the New Testament.

.

How is this watered down?

 

[Cornelius]

Why is it so hard to grasp that our salvation is assured by accepting Christ as our lord and savior. If someone does sin on purpose you think that he will lose his salvation. We sin on purpose every day sometime we know it, other times we don’t. When we do things that we know are wrong but at the time thinking that since it is just a small thing for instance:
You are ridding down the road and see an old man trying to change a tire, but you are in a hurry you just can’t stop to help. By Gods account you committed a sin by not helping.
A sin as small as this to God is just the same as the sin killing someone. We all have free will and God lets us make mistakes and as with all children sometimes you have to stand back and watch them fall, but that does not mean they are not still your child. If a son had committed murder and his father tried distance himself from his son and tell everyone that this is not my son. He can no more do this as the sun not rise the next day. It is the same when you are a child of God. Jesus has already paid the price for our sins. You are his child forever, in good and bad. A gift you give someone you don’t take back because of what they do with it or you don’t take it back because they try to give it back to you. It was given freely just as our salvation is given to us freely with no strings attached.

Actually this is not the true gospel. You are just giving back here, what the church has taught you. Its a human interpretation of what we THINK the gospel should be, but in reality God is after something else.You are ignoring a lot of scriptures in favor of the opinions of man.

Sorry, I am not trying to antagonize you, but you must read your Bible for yourself WITH prayer.Just once ask the Lord if what you have written here, is in line with the WHOLE revelation of the Bible regarding salvation.

 

[vja4Him]

I do not believe that anyone loses their salvation. Many people will appear to be saved. They may even know the Bible, preach, pray, sound like a Christian, have the outward appearance of a born again Christian. Even those who are of the world do good works, are nice folks, kind, loving, patient, forgiving, etc. ....

But only those who know the Lord Jesus Christ as their Savior are saved. Jesus promised us eternal salvation. If you get saved, then lose your salvation, you never had eternal salvation, but rather only had temporary salvation.

I struggled with the whole issue of eternal security for the believer in Jesus Christ.

You cannot have true peace, when you are not really certain that you are saved. Always aware that you just might lose your salvation, that perhaps you blew it, or sinned one too many times ....

And I have seen and known people who struggle daily with this issue ... I could see clearly that they had no peace in Christ, and were laying their guilt trip on me and others ... Leading many to question their own salvation, which only causes confusion and strife.

After searching the scriptures many times, I am thoroughly convinced that my salvation IS SECURE in Jesus Christ, and nobody can take that from me, not myself, and not anyone else!

I have true peace in Jesus Christ, knowing that He will forgive me of my sins past, present and future. This is a true peace that passes all understanding, that can only come from Almighty God.

John 14:27

Peace I leave with you, My peace I give to you; not as the world gives do I give to you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

Isaiah 26:3

You will keep him in perfect peace,
Whose mind is stayed on You,
Because he trusts in You.

 

[beardedad]

Actually this is not the true gospel. You are just giving back here, what the church has taught you. Its a human interpretation of what we THINK the gospel should be, but in reality God is after something else.You are ignoring a lot of scriptures in favor of the opinions of man.

Sorry, I am not trying to antagonize you, but you must read your Bible for yourself WITH prayer.Just once ask the Lord if what you have written here, is in line with the WHOLE revelation of the Bible regarding salvation.

I know that you are not trying to antagonize me, but do you not believe that, Jesus death on the cross, has not set us, as belivers, free? Do you feel that you have to be perfect to have God's love. In John 8:31-32 (KJV) 31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; 32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

Jesus freed us, when he died on the cross for those who are his, the punishment of Hell. His love is bigger then mine, yours or anybody else. It is Unconditional love, it is a love that no matter what you do you are still his. When we as belivers try to limit or put limits on what you can do or not do to lose god's love or our salvation then we are wrong. Once we are his we are his forever. This is what Jesus taught. There is no watering down, no agonizing over if I did this or if I did that, will I go to heaven? Sure God wants us to be as good as we can, but we are of a sinfull people and such we are going to sin. But that does't stop God's love.The whole revelation of the Bible is simple. Believe on Jesus with all your heart and soul and he will save you. To try to add stipulations is like the Pharisees adding you must do this or that, when all the time it is as simple as it gets. You said God is after something else, he is. Our love for him. That is all he requires from us, our love. Everything else will follow in good time.

 

[vja4Him]

I will not make this too long, but there are so many scriptures that tell us that we have a part to play as well. Its really not just up to God. We have WALK in this salvation , or this is no salvation at all. In the beginning we are washed, but we have to look at how we walk to maintain it:

This is where many people make the mistake ... which leads people astray, and gets many cults started ...

If salvation depends even just a little bit on you, then Jesus didn't pay it all ...

Think about that for a moment ... Jesus said that it is finished. The Bible clearly teaches that our salvation is from Jesus, not from anyone else, not from you, me, our leaders, family, friends, neighbors, or anyone, except Jesus Christ.

If you play a part in your salvation, then you are doomed, and will be damned to spend eternity in hell .... Because YOU cannot pay the price for your salvation! No matter hard you try, you will NEVER be able to be good enough, or do enough good works.

Ephesians 2:8-9

8For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9not by works, so that no one can boast.

Clearly, salvation is NOT by works. If your salvation depends upon works, then your salvation cannot be by grace. Perhaps those who hold to the teaching that you can lose your salvation need to reevaluate their standing with God ....

When we all stand before God, none of us will be able to claim any merit whatsoever. The only thing that will save us is our faith in Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior, accepting and believing that the blood of Jesus Christ is the atonement for our sin.

 

[vja4Him]

Hebrews chapter seven:

25Therefore he is able to save completely[a] those who come to God through him, because he always lives to intercede for them.

26Such a high priest meets our need—one who is holy, blameless, pure, set apart from sinners, exalted above the heavens. 27Unlike the other high priests, he does not need to offer sacrifices day after day, first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people. He sacrificed for their sins once for all when he offered himself. 28For the law appoints as high priests men who are weak; but the oath, which came after the law, appointed the Son, who has been made perfect forever.

You see, Jesus is ABLE to SAVE COMPLETELY those who come to God through Him (Jesus). You don't have to keep coming to God over and over (saved, then lost, saved, then lost, saved, then lost) ....

You are saved once, and saved for all eternity. You are not partially saved when you believe in Jesus Christ, then have to continue to complete your salvation as time goes on ....

Your salvation is complete in Christ Jesus! You can have peace, and assurance that you are saved, and that nobody can take that away from you!

 

[vja4Him]

Why is it so hard to grasp that our salvation is assured by accepting Christ as our lord and savior. If someone does sin on purpose you think that he will lose his salvation. We sin on purpose every day sometime we know it, other times we don’t. When we do things that we know are wrong but at the time thinking that since it is just a small thing for instance:
You are ridding down the road and see an old man trying to change a tire, but you are in a hurry you just can’t stop to help. By Gods account you committed a sin by not helping.
A sin as small as this to God is just the same as the sin killing someone. We all have free will and God lets us make mistakes and as with all children sometimes you have to stand back and watch them fall, but that does not mean they are not still your child. If a son had committed murder and his father tried distance himself from his son and tell everyone that this is not my son. He can no more do this as the sun not rise the next day. It is the same when you are a child of God. Jesus has already paid the price for our sins. You are his child forever, in good and bad. A gift you give someone you don’t take back because of what they do with it or you don’t take it back because they try to give it back to you. It was given freely just as our salvation is given to us freely with no strings attached.

Actually this is not the true gospel. You are just giving back here, what the church has taught you. Its a human interpretation of what we THINK the gospel should be, but in reality God is after something else.You are ignoring a lot of scriptures in favor of the opinions of man.

Sorry, I am not trying to antagonize you, but you must read your Bible for yourself WITH prayer.Just once ask the Lord if what you have written here, is in line with the WHOLE revelation of the Bible regarding salvation.

I am not simply regurgitating what the church has taught me! I read the Bible for myself daily. I have read the entire Bible many times, and parts of the Bible dozens or even hundreds of times. I'm not bragging, just want to clarify matters here ....

I have already posted some scriptures which are very clear. Post all you want, but you will never convince me that I might lose my salvation! I believe that is lie from the pits of hell.

You see, Satan wants us to doubt our salvation. He does not want us to trust God, or the Bible. He (Satan) is the father of lies, and he wants us to be confused. The enemy (the devil, Satan) does not want us to have any peace, and assurance of our salvation.

My salvation is secure in Jesus ....

 

[beardedad]

Hebrews chapter seven:

25Therefore he is able to save completely[a] those who come to God through him, because he always lives to intercede for them.

26Such a high priest meets our need—one who is holy, blameless, pure, set apart from sinners, exalted above the heavens. 27Unlike the other high priests, he does not need to offer sacrifices day after day, first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people. He sacrificed for their sins once for all when he offered himself. 28For the law appoints as high priests men who are weak; but the oath, which came after the law, appointed the Son, who has been made perfect forever.

You see, Jesus is ABLE to SAVE COMPLETELY those who come to God through Him (Jesus). You don't have to keep coming to God over and over (saved, then lost, saved, then lost, saved, then lost) ....

You are saved once, and saved for all eternity. You are not partially saved when you believe in Jesus Christ, then have to continue to complete your salvation as time goes on ....

Your salvation is complete in Christ Jesus! You can have peace, and assurance that you are saved, and that nobody can take that away from you!

Amen!!

 

[vja4Him]

Eternal Life ...

John 10:28

I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand.

Jesus has given me eternal life. I shall never perish. Nobody can take away my eternal salvation!

I pray that you will see this truth someday, and find true peace in Jesus Christ. You cannot have true peace, thinking that you might lose your salvation. You will be miserable everyday, confused, wondering if you did something, anything, that caused you to lose your salvation.

Lord Jesus, show us your truth, and give us your peace, and assurance that you have promised us, so that we will know that we are Yours, and that we can rest in your peace, knowing that we belong to You, forever ... !!! Amen.

 

[Cornelius]

I know that you are not trying to antagonize me, but do you not believe that, Jesus death on the cross, has not set us, as belivers, free? Do you feel that you have to be perfect to have God's love. In John 8:31-32 (KJV) 31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; 32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

I can see the loving spirit in which you write this brother. I have absolute assurance in the total work of the cross. Maybe more than you realize. But because of that, I also know that the work of the cross bought us so much, that we actually now must walk in this freedom. It came at a HIGH price. Jesus bought something that is available to us to actually walk in.A LACK OF WALK shows a lack of understanding of what it is exactly what He did for us.

Jesus freed us, when he died on the cross for those who are his, the punishment of Hell.

Exactly. But tell me now. What exactly did He free us from. (Would you start with this in your answer please )





His love is bigger then mine, yours or anybody else. It is Unconditional love, it is a love that no matter what you do you are still his.

Brother, this did not work for Judas. And here we are warned again by Paul:


Rom 11:20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:


Rom 11:21 For if God spared not the natural branches, [take heed] lest he also spare not thee.
What is it that the Bible tells us we must not do, if we indeed do not want to be cut off too?


When we as belivers try to limit or put limits on what you can do or not do to lose god's love or our salvation then we are wrong. Once we are his we are his forever. This is what Jesus taught.

Brother, Jesus did not teach that. He actually gave us many instances where He points out the conditions of salvation. Here is just one of them: Mat 16:24 ¶ Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any [man] will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.


Mat 16:25 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.

(because and here is the condition )!:Luk 14:27 And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple. I know many Christians who do not take up their cross and yet, they believe that they can get to heaven even without being a disciple (follower) of Christ.

There is no watering down, no agonizing over if I did this or if I did that, will I go to heaven? Sure God wants us to be as good as we can, but we are of a sinfull people and such we are going to sin.

Then why are we called saints and not sinners. And why are we told to be holy (or does holiness include sin? For many it does ! Our teaching about sin is very bad in the modern church. Because of this, people do not know how to get our of it and they have designed a doctrine to allow them to stay in it. We have lost all hope that Jesus are able to take sin out of us. We are still slaves to sin, even though we are told that we are indeed free of sin. )




But that does't stop God's love.The whole revelation of the Bible is simple. Believe on Jesus with all your heart and soul and he will save you.

Do you think that , that means that you only have to believe in the physical person of a historical Jesus and you will be saved? Even my unsaved Jewish friend believes Jesus came and that He is really the Messiah. But she prefers New Age witchcraft to Him. She believes in all that He has done, but that does not save her ! Do you think that just maybe this has another level of truth to it? What about agreeing with the Word that .......Jesus =Word (John 1;1) Well, if we do that, then that verse could also mean, that we have to believe the WHOLE Word for us to be saved. Jesus said Jhn 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, [they] are spirit, and [they] are life. So is it the belief in the physical Son only, or is it also the believing of the "words that I speak to you, (they) are spirit , and (they) are life.

That would complicate things a bit, because now we have to know these words too. But that is true, because the reason HIS PEOPLE persih is because of a lack of knowledge of the Word.



To try to add stipulations is like the Pharisees adding you must do this or that, when all the time it is as simple as it gets. You said God is after something else, he is. Our love for him.

That is correct. Here is love defined by Jesus. Please, please take note that Jesus is calling for something that we must DO , if we say we love Him!
Jhn 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself unto him.



That is all he requires from us, our love. Everything else will follow in good time.

 

[Cornelius]

Re: Eternal Life ...

John 10:28

I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand.

That certainly is true. But the rest of Scripture teaches that WE can leave that hand and that God Himself can cut us off. The Bible is a full revelation, we cannot just take one verse and create a doctrine around it. God tells us in the Psalms that "The SUM of Thy Word is truth"

 

[beardedad]

My faith is that I am saved, fully with no thought of having to worry about going to hell because I know Christ has already paid the price for me. John in Romans stated

For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
24Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
25Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
26To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. 27Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. 28Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

In the book of John he quotes Jesus words
And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand.
It shows that when we are saved there is nothing that can take it away. If our sin could take our salvation away then nobody would ever be saved, because I know of no one that is sinless except Christ. It would have been a fruitless act for him to die if it was not to pay for everything that has or will ever be done.

In the book of John he quotes Jesus words
And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand.

It shows that when we are saved there is nothing that can take it away. If our sin could take our salvation away then nobody would ever be saved, because I know of no one that is sinless except Christ. It would have been a fruitless act for him to die if it was not to pay for everything that has or will ever be done.

 

[Cornelius]

Then I suggest you pray and ask the Lord if your understanding is indeed correct. Surely that is something that you are willing to do? Do not trust what I say to you, but only for your own sake, tell the Lord that you are prepared to be wrong if He can prove it to you Himself.If He does not, then you can rest in what you know now.

blessings
Cornelius

 

[vja4Him]

Was Judas Saved ... ???

Brother, this did not work for Judas. And here we are warned again by Paul:

I'm curious, do you believe that Judas was saved ... ??? Then lost his salvation ... ???