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Guest, Join Papa Zoom today for some uplifting biblical encouragement! --> Daily Verses
Trinity
- Thread starter gr8grace3
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teddy trueblood
Member
John 17:3 “And this is eternal life, that they know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent.” - RSV.
2 Thess. 1:7-9 “…when the Lord Jesus will be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in flaming fire, 8 dealing out retribution to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. 9 These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power” - NASB.
2 Thess. 1:7-9 “…when the Lord Jesus will be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in flaming fire, 8 dealing out retribution to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. 9 These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power” - NASB.
You will not find the word trinity in any Bible, but according to the American Heritage Dictionary it means a group consisting of three closely related members. Trinity, the union of three divine figures, the Father, Son (Jesus) and the Holy Ghost in one Godhead.
All three are that of Gods Spirit manifested in different ways.
God is a Spirit and wants us to worship or another word for worship is to humble ourselves before him in spirit and truth. God is not flesh and blood that we can see and touch with our physical senses for he has no form but the Spirit that is God can take on many forms for us to hear him speak to us.
John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
The Spirit of God was made flesh (Jesus) to walk among us teaching us and showing signs and wonders for the people to repent of their evil ways and come back to God.
John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
John 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
John 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
John 14:18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
All three are that of Gods Spirit manifested in different ways.
God is a Spirit and wants us to worship or another word for worship is to humble ourselves before him in spirit and truth. God is not flesh and blood that we can see and touch with our physical senses for he has no form but the Spirit that is God can take on many forms for us to hear him speak to us.
John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
The Spirit of God was made flesh (Jesus) to walk among us teaching us and showing signs and wonders for the people to repent of their evil ways and come back to God.
John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
John 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
John 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
John 14:18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
One must believe in the genuine Jesus to be saved.
Can one believe in the genuine Jesus and not know much about him?
Yes.
But there are so many counterfeit Jesus' being preached in the world it behooves the "convert" to be certain the Jesus they believe in is the genuine Jesus and that the Trinity is one proof of biblical evidence among many.
farouk
Member
for_his_glory:
The end of Matthew 28 is another great passage involving the Three Persons of the Trinity.
You're right the word Trinity doesn't actually occur in Scripture, but of course what it refers to does indeed, and gloriously so!
Blessings.
Doulos Iesou
Member
I don't think the Trinity is a necessary doctrine, I suppose I believe God has a lot more mercy upon those who get the issue wrong, be it Trinitarians, or those who are against.
It seems as Christians we are always in the business of drawing the boundaries. My business is to love my neighbor, he him a Trinitarian, Sabellian, Arian, etc. And God will sort out the rest. I will of course teach my children a certain interpretation, but I don't pretend that the debate is a simple one.
Jesse Stone
Member
Brothers, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is that they may be saved. For I can testify about them that they are zealous for God, but their zeal is not based on knowledge. Since they did not know the righteousness that comes from God and sought to establish their own, they did not submit to God’s righteousness. Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes.
Moses describes in this way the righteousness that is by the law: "The man who does these things will live by them." But the righteousness that is by faith says: "Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’" (that is, to bring Christ down) "or ‘Who will descend into the deep?’" (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead).
But what does it say? "The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart," that is, the word of faith we are proclaiming: That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. As the Scripture says, "Anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame." (Romans 10:1-11)
The day I see the word "Trinity" in that passage, on that day I will say that belief in the Trinity saves.
Moses describes in this way the righteousness that is by the law: "The man who does these things will live by them." But the righteousness that is by faith says: "Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’" (that is, to bring Christ down) "or ‘Who will descend into the deep?’" (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead).
But what does it say? "The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart," that is, the word of faith we are proclaiming: That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. As the Scripture says, "Anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame." (Romans 10:1-11)
The day I see the word "Trinity" in that passage, on that day I will say that belief in the Trinity saves.
chessman
Member
You didn’t mention that verse 13 provides the reset of the “Scripture” that Paul is using in these verses for his logical argument and that he actually quotes another Scripture in verse 13. Verse 13 is a quote from Joel 2:32:
11 For the scripture says,…
Rom 10:12 (LEB) For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord is Lord of all, who is rich to all who call upon him. 13 For “everyone who calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved.”
Joel 2:32 (LEB) And it will happen—everyone who calls on the name of Yahweh will be rescued, because on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem there will be those who escape, as Yahweh said, and among the survivors whom Yahweh is calling.
Which meshes perfectly with the Trinitarian Doctrine and Paul’s statement here:
if you confess with your mouth “Jesus is Lord” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
Confessing with your mouth “Jesus is Lord” , to Paul is the same thing as what Joel spoke of: “everyone who calls on the name of Yahweh”!
Which is what got him and the other Apostles (and Jesus) killed.
Jesse Stone
Member
Chessman
The below is a copy of something I already said to Free on this verse:
In Old Testament times people were saved by calling on Jehovah or God. The Messiah had not yet come. Since the Ascension of Jesus the Messiah people are to call on Jesus. Not just unbelievers to be saved (Romans 10:9), but also believers, to whom Jesus is the head of each church (local) and of the Body (universal), as Paul said and for the reason he gave in Philippians 2:8-11 (see 1 Corinthians 1:2).
The correct translation of Romans 10:9 is not "if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Jehovah".
The below is a copy of something I already said to Free on this verse:
In Old Testament times people were saved by calling on Jehovah or God. The Messiah had not yet come. Since the Ascension of Jesus the Messiah people are to call on Jesus. Not just unbelievers to be saved (Romans 10:9), but also believers, to whom Jesus is the head of each church (local) and of the Body (universal), as Paul said and for the reason he gave in Philippians 2:8-11 (see 1 Corinthians 1:2).
The correct translation of Romans 10:9 is not "if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Jehovah".
Deborah13
Member
I do believe the Trinity even though I really don't understand, by reading the scriptures. When I decided that my faith was there I decided first that it was one of the few things that every main Christian denomination believes. And it just sets right with me, too.
However, per the OP questions, I don't see scripture that says one must believe in the Trinity as defined in order to be saved. I think one must believe that Jesus was God come in the flesh.
Jesus took His finger and wrote on the stone......
However, per the OP questions, I don't see scripture that says one must believe in the Trinity as defined in order to be saved. I think one must believe that Jesus was God come in the flesh.
Jesus took His finger and wrote on the stone......
Deborah13
Member
What chunks are you referring to?
farouk
Member
Just hypothetically. When it comes to the Person and work of the Lord Jesus, particularly, the margin for error becomes rather small, also. Blessings.
E
elijah23
Guest
First, you must understand what salvation is. Salvation is the process of the Lord saving us from the consequences of the sins we commit. It happens over and over in our lives. And as time goes on, the Lord expects us to learn from our mistakes. In the end, we are pretty much expected to save ourselves:
[12] Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
[13] for God is at work in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure. Phil 2:12-13 RSV
In other words, we need to repent of our sin.
Okay, that is what salvation is. I'm not sure how the Trinity things works into that. Here is my view of the Trinity: The Lord is simultaneously a Father, Son, and Holy Spirit as a man can simultaneously be a father, son, husband, truck driver, boy scout leader, and whatever else.
Well said. Without the doctrine of the trinity, what a person "knows" is not the one true God.
Jesus is YHWH.
Jehovah is a false name.
It is a compound word.
Strongs. # 3050. Together with -
Strongs # 1043.
Look it up for yourself.
teddy trueblood
Member
The Father is YHWH - Is. 64:8
If Jehovah is a "false name," then the KJV (and others) is a false translation!: Psalm 83:18, KJV.
Furthermore, the personal name of our Messiah (who trinitarians claim is equally God!) is just as much a “false translation” as is the personal name of God, “Jehovah.” As best we can determine Christ's personal name was something like “Yehoshua”!
Although not the original Hebrew pronunciation, “Jehovah” has been the traditional English transliteration for YHWH for many hundreds of years. Are we to erase it from our translations because of this? If so, we must erase the traditional name of “Jesus” from our translations for the same reason!
Jesus is not YHWH - Ps. 110:1 “YHWH said to my Lord (Jesus) sit at my right hand” (compare Acts 2:34-36). And Ps. 2:2 “The kings of the earth take their stand … against YHWH and against his Anointed (Messiah).” (Compare Acts 4:26, 27.)
YHWH It is not a compound word.
It has nothing to do with Strong’s #1043 (Beth-anath).
Look it up for yourself.
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