Uncircumcision a sin?

[Classik]

Have been wondering what folks think of this issue of circumcision. An uncircimcised person is still a person. Seems the bible strictly forbids it...no clear reasons (except what some claims today is for self-control).

Your views.

 

[TOG]

There is a clear reason given.

And God said to Abraham, “As for you, you shall keep my covenant, you and your offspring after you throughout their generations. This is my covenant, which you shall keep, between me and you and your offspring after you: Every male among you shall be circumcised. You shall be circumcised in the flesh of your foreskins, and it shall be a sign of the covenant between me and you. (Gen. 17:9-11 ESV)
​

Circumcision is the sign of the Abrahmic covenant. The commandment to circumcise all males is reiterated in the covenant at Sinai, because everyone there was also part of the Abrahmic covenant. If a man today is part of the covenant with Abraham, he should be circumcised, otherwise it's not commanded.

The TOG​

 

[jasonc]

There is a clear reason given.

And God said to Abraham, “As for you, you shall keep my covenant, you and your offspring after you throughout their generations. This is my covenant, which you shall keep, between me and you and your offspring after you: Every male among you shall be circumcised. You shall be circumcised in the flesh of your foreskins, and it shall be a sign of the covenant between me and you. (Gen. 17:9-11 ESV)
​

Circumcision is the sign of the Abrahmic covenant. The commandment to circumcise all males is reiterated in the covenant at Sinai, because everyone there was also part of the Abrahmic covenant. If a man today is part of the covenant with Abraham, he should be circumcised, otherwise it's not commanded.

The TOG​

okaaaaaaaaaaaaaay. so if a goy wants to be saved and is a messianic jew what then?

im circumcised but. well how many messianic jews are there that are from isreal these days? not many. besides its by faith not by birth even in the ot way. a Hebrew still had to believe on his or her own. the circumcision was also the act of declaration by the parents to rear that boy in the torah. the bar mitzvah was confirmation of that and public declaration of that by that child to the nation that he would be faithful to the Lord.

 

[TOG]

okaaaaaaaaaaaaaay. so if a goy wants to be saved and is a messianic jew what then?

It has nothing to do with salvation. It's a sign that a man is a member of the covenant God made with Abraham, similar to the way a wedding ring is a sign of the marriage covenant. If you're married, but don't have a ring for some reason (for example if you lost it or could never afford one), then that doesn't have anything to do with your salvation. In fact, it doesn't invalidate your marriage. It just means the sign is missing.

The TOG​

 

[agua.]

An uncircumcised heart maybe.

 

[Classik]

Then why would families circumcise their males today?

 

[TOG]

Then why would families circumcise their males today?

Why not, if they're part of that covenant?

The TOG​

 

[Edward]

1 Corinthians 7:19
19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God./(KJV)

I do not believe it matters nowadays. What does matter is the condition of the heart and our obedience.

 

[jasonc]

Then why would families circumcise their males today?

health, lower risks of stds.

 

[jasonc]

It has nothing to do with salvation. It's a sign that a man is a member of the covenant God made with Abraham, similar to the way a wedding ring is a sign of the marriage covenant. If you're married, but don't have a ring for some reason (for example if you lost it or could never afford one), then that doesn't have anything to do with your salvation. In fact, it doesn't invalidate your marriage. It just means the sign is missing.

The TOG​

originally it was for what I said. now because of the blood is an option. that is all I was saying.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Then why would families circumcise their males today?

Today? I don't know. But in my day it was the Christian tradition.....and so you don't stand out in the locker room after gym class. I'm thinking that maybe the circumcised fellow is the odd looking chap these days(?) You know, with everything religious and traditional being so despised these days.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

It has nothing to do with salvation. It's a sign that a man is a member of the covenant God made with Abraham, similar to the way a wedding ring is a sign of the marriage covenant. If you're married, but don't have a ring for some reason (for example if you lost it or could never afford one), then that doesn't have anything to do with your salvation. In fact, it doesn't invalidate your marriage. It just means the sign is missing.

The TOG​

Good answer except that circumcision is an illustration of how the absence of the deeds of the flesh is the sign of being in covenant with God. Circumcision is symbolic of having the covering and influence of the flesh removed from the secret organ of the heart, where life issues forth. The person who has laid aside the power of the sin nature (the flesh) from the hidden organ of the heart is the circumcised person who shows that they are in covenant with God.

The literal Sabbath is also an illustration of this laying aside of the deeds of the flesh. It is the other 'sign' command of the old covenant. (Actually, all of them are, but circumcision and the Sabbath are the biggies).

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Seems the bible strictly forbids it...no clear reasons (except what some claims today is for self-control).

Actually, Paul forbids it for two reasons: 1) for the purpose of being justified by that work, and 2) to become identified with the sect that circumcised you, much like some denominations do today with water baptism. Other than that, there is no Biblical prohibition against literal circumcision.