Using predetermined questions, and predetermined answers....

[ikester7579]

I have debated at several Christian forums. And one trend I see more and more, are questions being asked from anti-christian sites by non-believers posing as believing. Anyone who does not know this, will be greatly helped by what I'm going to show here. Because those who do this only copy and paste such questions and answers, while the rest of us research it.

Example question threads:
1) Why do men have n@pples? This one has been flagged by most forums as someone who wants to start trouble so it's not used very often anymore. But it was popular at one time.

2) Who created God?

3) Where did the first light come from (creation)?

4) How did the first light sustain life?

5) Where the evidence for creation? Even though they will never accept what you say, they will ask anyway. It's a game of sorts.

Etc....

Some example sites:

http://www.evolutionhappens.net/nodebate.htm

http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/2437/

http://chem.tufts.edu/science/FrankStei ... stions.htm

http://www.discord.org/~lippard/hnta.html

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/hovind/

http://www.geocities.com/questioningpage/Links.html This site tries to come off as a Christian site of sorts. But as you scroll down to other links, you start to see what the site is actually promoting.

http://www.talkorigins.org/origins/faqs ... nists.html

http://talkorigins.org/faqs/hovind/howgood.html

http://exchristian.net/
Etc.....

Then there are several forums where they meet and ponder over questions to get answers. Try new tactics and strategies etc.... I can list them, but it's probably against the rules to link to other forums here.

If you've ever wondered why evolutionists seem to have all the answers, this is why. They are well organized to combat any creation question, and have all sorts of questions to cause most of us to question our faith. They may not know that much about creation, but just to copy and paste a few question and answers, they look like experts. Which often makes them claim to be what they are not, because of the fall back of the websites, and people on forums that will help them.

And this is just a small list of 1,000's of websites and forums dedicated to the cause of destroying the word of God. And all who follow God and His Son.

 

[MrVersatile48]

Thanks, Ike!

I just very quickly scanned 'find all posts by..' on your profile & you are making a very valuable contribution here

Can I just encourage readers to see the comprehensive menus of learned articles & features @ http://www.creationism.org & http://www.discovery.org/csc & http://www.AnswersInGenesis.org

http://www.creationism.org/articles/index.htm

http://www.discovery.org/csc/topQuestions.php

http://www.discovery.org/csc/essentialReadings.php

http://www.answersingenesis.org/Home/Area/postings.asp

God bless!

Ian

 

[Poke]

Re: Using predetermined questions, and predetermined answers

I have debated at several Christian forums. And one trend I see more and more, are questions being asked from anti-christian sites by non-believers posing as believing.

Indeed. And, this is very common origins forums.

 

[Lewis]

Re: Using predetermined questions, and predetermined answers

I have debated at several Christian forums. And one trend I see more and more, are questions being asked from anti-christian sites by non-believers posing as believing. Anyone who does not know this, will be greatly helped by what I'm going to show here. Because those who do this only copy and paste such questions and answers, while the rest of us research it.

Example question threads:
1) Why do men have n@pples? This one has been flagged by most forums as someone who wants to start trouble so it's not used very often anymore. But it was popular at one time.

2) Who created God?

3) Where did the first light come from (creation)?

4) How did the first light sustain life?

5) Where the evidence for creation? Even though they will never accept what you say, they will ask anyway. It's a game of sorts.

Etc....

Some example sites:

http://www.evolutionhappens.net/nodebate.htm

http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/2437/

http://chem.tufts.edu/science/FrankStei ... stions.htm

http://www.discord.org/~lippard/hnta.html

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/hovind/

http://www.geocities.com/questioningpage/Links.html This site tries to come off as a Christian site of sorts. But as you scroll down to other links, you start to see what the site is actually promoting.

http://www.talkorigins.org/origins/faqs ... nists.html

http://talkorigins.org/faqs/hovind/howgood.html

http://exchristian.net/
Etc.....

Then there are several forums where they meet and ponder over questions to get answers. Try new tactics and strategies etc.... I can list them, but it's probably against the rules to link to other forums here.

If you've ever wondered why evolutionists seem to have all the answers, this is why. They are well organized to combat any creation question, and have all sorts of questions to cause most of us to question our faith. They may not know that much about creation, but just to copy and paste a few question and answers, they look like experts. Which often makes them claim to be what they are not, because of the fall back of the websites, and people on forums that will help them.

And this is just a small list of 1,000's of websites and forums dedicated to the cause of destroying the word of God. And all who follow God and His Son.

Thanks, now to my people on this board take note of this stuff.

 

[ikester7579]

Re: Using predetermined questions, and predetermined answers

I have debated at several Christian forums. And one trend I see more and more, are questions being asked from anti-christian sites by non-believers posing as believing.

Indeed. And, this is very common origins forums.

It takes a deception to decieve someone with a deception. Truth does not require this. And this is why they do this. By their own actions they admit to what they believe as not being true. Why else would a deception be used to try and make a point that is claimed to be true?

To hide they use different user names at every forum they go to, so their deeds in deception cannot be traced. Why is there a need for this if what they preach be true?

 

[ikester7579]

Re: Using predetermined questions, and predetermined answers

I have debated at several Christian forums. And one trend I see more and more, are questions being asked from anti-christian sites by non-believers posing as believing. Anyone who does not know this, will be greatly helped by what I'm going to show here. Because those who do this only copy and paste such questions and answers, while the rest of us research it.

Example question threads:
1) Why do men have n@pples? This one has been flagged by most forums as someone who wants to start trouble so it's not used very often anymore. But it was popular at one time.

2) Who created God?

3) Where did the first light come from (creation)?

4) How did the first light sustain life?

5) Where the evidence for creation? Even though they will never accept what you say, they will ask anyway. It's a game of sorts.

Etc....

Some example sites:

http://www.evolutionhappens.net/nodebate.htm

http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/2437/

http://chem.tufts.edu/science/FrankStei ... stions.htm

http://www.discord.org/~lippard/hnta.html

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/hovind/

http://www.geocities.com/questioningpage/Links.html This site tries to come off as a Christian site of sorts. But as you scroll down to other links, you start to see what the site is actually promoting.

http://www.talkorigins.org/origins/faqs ... nists.html

http://talkorigins.org/faqs/hovind/howgood.html

http://exchristian.net/
Etc.....

Then there are several forums where they meet and ponder over questions to get answers. Try new tactics and strategies etc.... I can list them, but it's probably against the rules to link to other forums here.

If you've ever wondered why evolutionists seem to have all the answers, this is why. They are well organized to combat any creation question, and have all sorts of questions to cause most of us to question our faith. They may not know that much about creation, but just to copy and paste a few question and answers, they look like experts. Which often makes them claim to be what they are not, because of the fall back of the websites, and people on forums that will help them.

And this is just a small list of 1,000's of websites and forums dedicated to the cause of destroying the word of God. And all who follow God and His Son.

Thanks, now to my people on this board take note of this stuff.

What's funny is when they are exposed, or the same is done to them, they whine and make all kinds of accusations, as if what they do is better even though it's the samething. It's like the saying goes: What's okay for me is not okay for you. And they dish it out but can't take it dished back.

Their favorite tactic is the guilt game. When you expose them, suddenly what you do is ten times worse. And if you ban them, they always have to have the last word.

How can you tell a non-believer posing as a believer?
1) They very seldom use scripture to back up what they claim (some will even refuse to).
2) They never give God the glory for anything. Because their faith is always temporal (things that can be seen only).
3) They only act like a believer when they realize they have over stepped their bounds, and maybe in trouble. Or to place a guilt trip by always pointing out they are a believer, as if they do not believe it themselves (omission by action).
4) Their support is always for the side that conflicts with the view of God.
5) Their friends (members) they support with their posts also have the same conflicting views.
6) When things get heated, they always act as the innocent party.
7) And when the evidence points to them, they will always try and make it point to another believer. They feel much better about being banned if they can take another believer with them
6) They always show up in groups. Very seldom alone.

When they are online, there are two groups:
1) The actual debaters (some members).
2) The lurkers.

The lurkers are the part of the group that is here for the entertainment of the game that is played. The debaters from that group provide that entertainment for them. They also never join unless one of the believers is making a mockery out of one in their group. They also provide answers for tuff questions, and even deceptive ones

When they come on as a group, they will also use a tag team method of discouraging someone about what they believe. The average tag team, for one thread subject, ranges from 2-4 against one. They don't like it when the odds become even though. And will run if they become overwhelmed.

While tag teaming, one of the main objectives is to out post their opponent. Have contradicting views look right by having more people, on their side, posting to support it. The other main objective is support each other for what they believe. Majority view rules in their book, and they will browbeat other members to achieve this. And will constantly point out that you are in the minority view, and their view is the majority. And because of this you should change. As if the majority makes a new truth.

The phrase they hate most is the :God did it" phrase. Through making a believer be afraid to use it (through guilt), makes them join the non-believers in their game of denying the supernatural power of God. And therefore make the first step towards having a naturalistic view only. Which replaces faith with doubt. And allows the seeds of doubt to grow. And when seeds are not planted in good soil, they will wither just like the foundation of their faith will wither as well.

 

[Oscar3]

Wow
Thank you so much for the info.
The devil never sleeps and has his armies causing confusion.
Blessings to you, Oscar

 

[ikester7579]

The "God did it" phobia. Science has positioned itself as the dictator of origins. Funny thing is, none (theories can't be proven to an absolute) of their evidences can really be proven. But in their fight to prove what they "believe" to be right, they also have to prove what denies it, "wrong". Which is creation. Several tactics are being used to do this. One is creating a phobia about using phrases or evidences that science cannot argue with. One is the "God did it" phrase. They will say it's not scientific to use it because it's not testable. And they will make snide remarks about your comments on this trying to degrade you into never using it again (creating a phobia, of you being humiliated, if you do so). Others will agree to make their case even stronger against you. This has actually worked quite well. Because when you deny that "God did it", you start to lose faith that God did anything at all, unless science approves of it first. This is when the believer starts turning to science more than God's word for answers. This is what happens to a lot of creation scientist. And why a lot of God's word is now referred to as a myth.

If you use the God did it phrase, you will run into these resonses:

Note: These are also common mockeries of God, a real Christian would never mock God in this fashion. Only those that are not Christian, or pose as one will slip up and make comments like this.

1) God lied.... In order for something to be a lie, what ever is being lied about has to be proven truth or fact. And since I see no theories making that goal (becoming truth). What God has said is not lying. For can you lie about an unproven truth?

2) God is deceptive.... Deception is where someone is being deceived. In order to be deceived, what has been done has to be hidden. God did not hide anything. He wrote it all in His book. And the book is not hidden from anyone who wishes to seek it, or read it.

3) God used magic (God poofs something into existance) when ever this is implied, it is not good to allow the atheist-evolutionist to get away with this comment. Putting God and magic together is implying that God uses witchcraft. And is the very reason this is said. They know that this comment mocks God directly. But it also plants bad seeds in the minds of all those who read this comment on a Christian forum, when it goes un-challenged. So upon this comment being made, ask them if making God out to use witchcraft was their intent, and if they would be so kindly to list all verses where God actually used magic. And if they proceed to mock God even more, then it's time to report them to the mods. If the mods do nothing, then that forum ministry is not the type of ministry to be involved in.

4) God's word is a parable, or an allegory.... Atheist, evolutionist, OEC, and theistic evolutionist, try to find several way to imply the word of God is a lie without actually using the word "lie". Allegory is the latest word being used to explain away 6 day creation. There is not much difference between the meaning of allegory, and parable. And they both imply untruth somewhere. So if you let them use the word, then they make their point. And will use these words from that point forward. allegory allows the non-believer to imply God's word is a lie, but then when asked, it also allows them to back peddle on commiting to such a comment. Their delusion of what truth is, makes them look for such words that allow them to twist truth as much as possible, so that the unproven truth will look like the new truth.

Never is creation used as a parable in the word of God. But it will always be inplied as such

Taking God's side only phobia. This is where the believer is made to think that you can mix anything with any part of God's word and it will be ok. They are afraid to take God's side only, and will make fun of all who try and do it. Along with the other phobias, this will destroy your faith. How? By making what God says into a lie, such as saying: God used evolution to create. Who promotes this? God or man? It is not mentioned anywhere in God's word that we came from animals upon creation. But the fear of being singled out, and not being able to fit into the mainstream. Has made people resort to this as a means of trying to have God, on their own terms, while being accepted by everyone else who does not believe in God.

Don't bring up our past, but we'll bring up your past. Evolutionist, and old earthers, love to bring up any past wrong doings by Christians from past history. But when theirs is brought up (Hitler, evolution, Haeckel, Dawson, etc...), they like to use the excuse that it was one of their own that exposed it. As if wrong doing is justified by someone in their group pointing it out. Besides, who else can prove them wrong? There is not one person, out side of science circles, that science would listen to about being wrong. If there is, can anyone name even one instance of this? For it's like pulling teeth to get one to admit they are wrong even on little things. Does two wrongs make a right? It would seem as if it does the way they refuse to even discuss it, but try and require a christian to do what they won't, or refuse to.

A known deception....

Allowing yourself to be deceived, is different from actually being deceived. A known deception is a known lie. And those who do this, and convince others of the same decption, they are in danger of a curse that God has for those who would do this. It's called being given up to a reprobate mind. What is a reprobate? Someone who has lost the ability to tell between a lie and actual truth, and between right and wrong (no morals). This is why, so many seem to not understand creation (they chose to be decieved). When the truth is presented to them, they are blinded from ever seeing it. To debate a reprobate, is like banging your head against a wall because someone told you it felt good, only to find out it don't.

Here are some examples: http://www.yecheadquarters.org/catalog2.0.html9.4.html

If you like what you read and would like to know more, just click the next link at the bottom of each page.

 

[Solo]

Excellant Information, Ikester! This info holds true on all of the deceptive moves of the enemy and his children from creation to all false doctrines of devils. Keep up the good work.
God bless you and yours.

 

[Lewis]

Just absolutely great stuff man, and I have, and many on this board have ran into those examples. And the babes in Christ need to be protected until they learn better. So God bless you for bringing this stuff to the forefront. There is aways room for the truth.

 

[Rob]

I just look at it as an opportunity to spread the word I don't care how stubborn they are I don't give up until they realize how foolish they are making themselves look. Only way I give up is when they lock the thread like Vic did that last one about murdering innocent children I would still be debating him if Vic hadn't locked that :

 

[jgredline]

great post

 

[ikester7579]

I just look at it as an opportunity to spread the word I don't care how stubborn they are I don't give up until they realize how foolish they are making themselves look. Only way I give up is when they lock the thread like Vic did that last one about murdering innocent children I would still be debating him if Vic hadn't locked that :

Just from experience. Not trying to tell you how to approach this. But I used to do the same thing you are doing, and thought I could make a huge difference. But I found that I was wrong. Why? The ones who rely on support groups, and go from forum to forum to debate. They are not looking for the truth we present. They are actually looking to have a war of words, and a way to mock God. And a way to make us waste our time debating them instead of showing those who want to know truth, what truth is. Did Jesus chase after those who would not listen? Nope.

Truth is not even in their mind. They only want to justify what they believe by argueing it over and over again. There are people so caught up in this, I have actually run into them at ten different Christian forums debating the samething against creation. There is only two things they want when debating on this level.

1) To justify what they believe.
2) To always "look" right.

And they will go to great lengths to make number 2 happen, which includes flat out lying.

How evolution is a competing religion:

The three "D's" on how to tell if someone is pushing something beyond the word of God. And are doing the work of Satan (whether they know it or not).

Satan illustrated the three "D" main tactics he would use to destroy a person's faith in God by his first actions in the garden.

1) Doubt.
Genesis 3:
1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

2) Deny.
4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

3) Deify.
5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

These same three principles are used to plant bad seeds at every forum on the net.

1) Doubt: Get someone to doubt God's word, or his eternal power to create. It is one thing to question how the word is written. It is another to imply that it is a lie (hath God said?).

2) Deny: To allow not only to question the word of God. But to also allow something to override it. Naturalistic means cannot explain God's eternal power to create. So when it is preached as truth, this plants more seeds of doubt, which can grow until the believer starts to question the word as a whole.

Example: The flood was local because there is not enough water to flood the earth to the point spoke of (Ye shall not surely die). But yet they cannot prove it through God's word, and refuse to do so.

3) Deify: When a person uses their knowledge, or even remarks, to make ones self look above another. It is one thing to use knowledge to teach. It is another to use it to mock, or call someone a deceiver, when what they claim cannot be proven. Using knowledge as self deification.

Example: YEC is a cult. YEC believes in flat earth. Your stupidity and uneducated arrogance does not allow you to see truth. If you actually study evolution, you would understand it etc....(Through knowledge, ye shall be as gods, knowing both good and evil).

Always claiming what they cannot deliver. A theory requires no delivery of truth. Only degrees of truth. Degrees are used in every Satanic based religion, cult, or thought. Satan gave us the illustration of this in these verses. Notice each one places him further up the scale of power. But he cannot really deliver what he wants to become.

Isaiah 14:
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

Religions like Mormons, Masons, etc... Also have these levels of knowledge. The longer you stay, the more money you invest. The more knowledge you receive. And the higher you go in levels of authority. And each level makes others have to look up to you because you know more than they do. And at the top level, everyone has to listen to you (Deify).

This is why Christians and creationists are always referred to as uneducated for what we believe. On the level scale of Satan, we are the lowest of the low. And those who are doing his work, will always point this out to try and keep us there. They will even lie about how educated they are just to make their point.

This is also why the evolution chart is also about levels. Levels of evolving: "Evolution chart". Death: "Survival of the fittest". And creation without a Creator: "Natural selection". Having level that man can deify himself has temptations to raise one's self above others. Total denial of God opens the door for self deification.

How to tell when the three "D's" of Satan are being preached: When a person reaches the goal of connecting all three "D's", and will not waiver from that view. Once done, he has graduated from the three "D's" of Satan, to the five "I wills" of Satan.

1) I will ascend into heaven.
2) I will exalt my throne above the stars of God.
3) I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north.
4) I will ascend above the heights of the clouds.
5) I will be like the most High.

And what ever is believed (which is through man), will be exalted with him (evolution is a good example).

The person who reaches the five "I wills", is also turned over to a reprobate mind.
tit 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

And because they are reprobates, they also refuse truth.

2tim 3:8 Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.

Allowing those who have reached the five "I wills" of Satan to debate in any christian forum, is planting the seeds of the three "D's" of all who would listen to them. Which is the first step to losing faith in the word of God. Once done, the door is open for Satan to do his work. And because the net is flooded with info that denies God. Satan's work from this point is fairly easy if the one who falls has an open mind to it.

The transformation to not believing is easy, if a person can grab the first two "D's" of Satan. Once the absolute truth of God is doubted, and then denied. They are well on their way to the third "D". And then to the five "I wills".