Bible Study What fruit do you think the Tree of Life produced?

[4afaithfulone]

The Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil doesn't produce anything other than the knowledge of what is good and what is evil.

Do you consider knowledge to do good and evil as being wise?

 

[4afaithfulone]

Tree of Life produces Life
I do believe this is Christ.
John 3:16 comes to mind.
We all are described by being branches, trees so forth, judge them by their fruits.
Hosea 14:8
I am like a green fir tree.From me is thy fruit found.
Now as the tree of good and evil:
I believe it to be Satan.
Ezek.28:12-15
King of Tyrus ( one of the roles of Satan)
Perfect in beauty.
Thou has been in Eden the garden of God.
Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth, and set thee so.
Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou was created, till iniquity was found in thee.

Ezek 31:3-10
The Assyrian ( another role of Satan)
Was a cedar in Lebanon with fair branches.......,
His height was exalted above all the trees of the field...
The cedars in the garden of God could not hide him, the fir trees were not like his boughs...nor any tree in the garden of God was like unto him in his beauty.
I have made him fair by the multitude of his branches, so that all the trees of Eden that were in the garden of God, envied him.
Because thou hast lifted up thyself in height....and his heart is lifted up in height,..

You are exactly correct of who the two trees are! But I am still not at my point yet.
The tree of life is, the Bread of life, the Word of Life, the Spirit of Life, the Christ of God, The True Vine who was hidden from us in times past until now in this time. Now, you are very close to what kind of fruit does Christ the tree of life produces that births us into his image?

I need for it to come from someone other than me showing it, because it is going to reveal something that we have always believed, but is not true, that I have tried to show many times, but no one can receive it. God's Word is full of details that must be sifted through with a fine toothed comb.

The tree of the knowledge of good and evil is Satan who has joined himself to women (Eve)by his spirit which caused us to fall. .
Rulers are seen as trees:
Mark 8:24 And he looked up, and said, I see men as trees, walking. KJV

 

[Gary]

Do you consider knowledge to do good and evil as being wise?

No.

It's neither wise nor unwise. It's simply knowing right from wrong.

.

 

[4afaithfulone]

I'm not sure what you mean by 'produce' ?
I think the The tree of life was meant to preserve Adam's life.

Adam had to have known what death was, so when the Devil said "You will not die if you all eat the fruit", there is an implied threat that is not necessarily from the fruit itself; eg: It could also be interpreted as a veiled threat -- if you don't eat the fruit, I'll kill you or your wife. The text is written such that the position of the devil is assumed to be between Adam and the woman; for it does not say that he approached "them" but "her", and there has to be some minor separation between them for this to have been possible.

Note also; scripture says that the Devil was a murderer from the beginning -- and I think being accused of murder is something that goes beyond guile, but to direct threat and action he himself was prepared to instigate out of hatred. For this reason, some scholars will state that the tree of life was placed there so that if Adam were in danger of dying, he could reach out and receive life again; although, it is questionable whether or not Eve would have survived had the devil struck her. ( Note, That someone can be killed isn't the same as them being mortal in the sense of having a naturally limited lifespan. )

From the way the text is written, I infer that Eve was closer to the tree of knowledge than Adam was; and it's uncertain where, exactly Adam stood. Should there be more than one tree, separate trees of life and knowledge (not one tree bearing two fruits), then it is possible that Adam was closer to the other tree, the Tree of lIfe.

Thank you for your response About the Son of God, I can see that you understand that the Word is more complex in meaning than it seems. And that is because God does not reveal His hidden goods for the casual reader, but to those who hunger for truth.
I am not actually looking as to why all this happened for I already know why the Bible tells us why.
Rom 8:19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.
20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
KJV
I am really looking for one word that explains what kind of fruit did the tree of life produce that would be able to give us eternal life?

 

[Karl]

Don't you think the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil was placed in the Garden as a test? Gn 2:16, 17 To see if Adam would obey, also how would God know if Adam really loved Him 1 Jn 4:19, 20, 21, 5:2, there has to be a choice doesn't there, obey God or rebel against Him? We all had choices to make when choosing our mate, why not God? 1 Jn 3:1, 4:9, 19

Adam was an intruder in satan's world, Jn 12:31, 14:30, 16:11, Eph 2:2 satan thought if he could cause Adam to disobey then he would be in satan's ranks (all the demons have the will of satan), but instead of there being two wills in the cosmos, God's and satan's, man has his own will, which is now multiplied billions since Adam (which is why we pray Your will be down in my life as it is in Heaven Matt 6:10).

Doesn't James tell us the wisdom of this world is demonic? Jas 3:15

So then, when we chose to make our decisions based on our own earthly knowledge and wisdom we are (typically) eating of the fruit of the Tree of the knowledge of Good and Evil, we are the ones deciding what is good and what is evil for us, .........and that plays out to us usurping the position and authority of the Holy Spirit in our lives and we fall into the snare of the devil, 2 Ti 2:25, 26 ...and become like god(s) (each exercising their own carnal will). Gn 3:5

If that be true, then isn't the test still present, individually, for us today?

Will we eat of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, or will we eat of the Bread (Tree) of Life, ...Jesus Christ (your Will be done in my life)?

 

[4afaithfulone]

No.

It's neither wise nor unwise. It's simply knowing right from wrong.

.

Thank you for pointing out my typo error in leaving out the NOT in the sentence below.
Thank you for that answer. It was to learn HOW to do good and evil, not just to know right from wrong. But, we agree that the knowledge of good and evil is NOT considered to make one wise right?

 

[Karl]

Thank you for your response About the Son of God, I can see that you understand that the Word is more complex in meaning than it seems. And that is because God does not reveal His hidden goods for the casual reader, but to those who hunger for truth.
I am not actually looking as to why all this happened for I already know why the Bible tells us why.
Rom 8:19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.
20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
KJV
I am really looking for one word that explains what kind of fruit did the tree of life produce that would be able to give us eternal life?

It's symbolic of Jesus. Jn 6:50, 51

 

[dianegcook]

You are exactly correct of who the two trees are! But I am still not at my point yet.
The tree of life is, the Bread of life, the Word of Life, the Spirit of Life, the Christ of God, The True Vine who was hidden from us in times past until now in this time. Now, you are very close to what kind of fruit does Christ the tree of life produces that births us into his image?

I need for it to come from someone other than me showing it, because it is going to reveal something that we have always believed, but is not true, that I have tried to show many times, but no one can receive it. God's Word is full of details that must be sifted through with a fine toothed comb.

The tree of the knowledge of good and evil is Satan who has joined himself to women (Eve)by his spirit which caused us to fall. .
Rulers are seen as trees:
Mark 8:24 And he looked up, and said, I see men as trees, walking. KJV

I really don't know what you are looking for.
All I can come up with is ( Living water or meat?)
Rev.22:
It bare 12 manner of fruits every month.(12 tribes?)
Ezek:47:12
Neither shall the fruit be consumed, it shall bring forth new fruit according to his months, because the waters that issued out of the sanctuary, and the fruit thereof shall be for meat, and the leaf for medicine.
Zech.14:8
Living waters shall go out from Jerusalem.
John 4:13,14
But whosoever drinketh of this water shall thirst again,
But whosoever drinketh of the water that I give him shall never thirst, but the water I give , shall be in him a well springing up into everlasting life.

 

[Gary]

Thank you for that answer. It was to learn HOW to do good and evil, not just to know right from wrong.

Where does it state that the tree was for learning "HOW" to do evil?

But, we agree that the knowledge of good and evil is considered to make one wise right?

No.

Where do you get that just having the knowledge makes one wise?
.

 

[About the Son of God]

Where does it state that the tree was for learning "HOW" to do evil?

No.

Where do you get that just having the knowledge makes one wise?
.

Hmmm... maybe it's a female thing Gary, as in some translations, it is said that Eve (but not Adam) saw it was for gaining wisdom: Genesis 3:6

But, I'm more inclined to think that knowledge is not identical with wisdom as you point out, and this is especially true when Hebrew and Greek manuscripts do not agree on the word in the passage -- for the Greek manuscripts do not have the word "sophia" for wisdom there.

http://studybible.info/interlinear/Genesis 3:6

The more modern Herbrew is often translated as wisdom, though: http://biblehub.com/interlinear/genesis/3-6.htm
So -- I'm uncertain if wisdom is a valid translation of the Hebrew as used in Jesus day ; or if the word for 'wisdom' is just translated loosely.
הַשְׂכִּ֔יל

 

[dianegcook]

Satan is a liar.
What kind of wisdom could you get from him?
The ways of the world?

Satan is death, and that is what he bought them.

 

[mswright6488]

removed

 

[Gary]

Hmmm... maybe it's a female thing Gary, as in some translations, it is said that Eve (but not Adam) saw it was for gaining wisdom: Genesis 3:6

I agree.

I see the same assumption being made here that was made in the Garden. Satan told Eve she would be equal to the gods and she took that to mean she would be given the wisdom of the gods if she ate the fruit.

Satan is the one that equated knowing good and evil to being godlike.

Genesis 3
5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.


I know of no scriptures that state there is wisdom in knowing how to do evil.

.

 

[4afaithfulone]

I will cut through the chase since it is causing an up rising,
I have been trying to show that Eve mistakenly ate from the forbidden tree, in error of the Word God told Adam, because she received it second hand not personally from God.
She did not purposefully eat of it to be like a god and to learn how to do good and evil and I will show this. ..
She didn’t know which tree was the forbidden tree by name. She said the tree in the Midst of the garden, meaning as there is only one in the middle.
So, she thought it was the Tree of life was the forbidden and she was deceived because the devil did not correct her in here error and in fact lied about what kind of fruit she could expect from it.
Gen 3:2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
THIS is the opposition I have when I show this scripture below Gen. 2:9:

Gen 2:9 And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil. KJV

They say, but it shows that the tree of the knowledge of good and evil was in the midst of the garden too according to this! But isn’t it really saying just that the Tree of Kof G& E was also in the garden?
They say no!
So I give you this to show my point.
Col 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timotheus our brother,
KJV
2 Cor 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timothy our brother, unto the church of God which is at Corinth, with all the saints which are in all Achaia:
KJV
Does this read that Paul was an apostle by the will of God and Timotheous?? Of course not, it just means that Timotheous was with Paul. Just as it means that the tree of the K of G& E was in the garden with the other trees as well, but not in the middle of the garden. If it had been, then the serpent would have had to ask, which tree in the middle are you referring to?
We should understand that it is the Wisdom of God through His Word and given understanding by the Holy Spirit that gives us life eternal correct?
God never changes so if He sent us His Word to save us and give us eternal life, then His Word must be the tree of life and the fruit of the Tree produces wisdom=Fruit of the Spirit is Wisdom
So the Tree of life, when we feed upon the fruit thereof gives us godly wisdom.
Wisdom is the word that I have been looking for to further prove my point of Eve eating out of ignorance and not rebellion as we have always been taught.
Now, lets look at the attribute from the fruit that she expected to receive from the tree she (Thought in error) was allowed to eat of:
Gen. 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
KJV
It does not say she ate expecting to learn good and evil and to be like gods, it says she expected wisdom as in the Tree of life!

Prov 3:11 My son, despise not the chastening of the LORD; neither be weary of his correction:
12 For whom the LORD loveth he correcteth; even as a father the son in whom he delighteth.
13 Happy is the man that findeth wisdom, and the man that getteth understanding.
14 For the merchandise of it is better than the merchandise of silver, and the gain thereof than fine gold.
15 She is more precious than rubies: and all the things thou canst desire are not to be compared unto her.
16 Length of days is in her right hand; and in her left hand riches and honour.
17 Her ways are ways of pleasantness, and all her paths are peace.
18 She is a tree of life to them that lay hold upon her: and happy is every one that retaineth her.
19 The LORD by wisdom hath founded the earth; by understanding hath he established the heavens.
KJV
We must never put our trust in what man says alone, even me. The Word alone revealed by the Spirit of God is our guide and we need to compare the scripture with what we hear, for man can be deceived, especially when we get our Word second hand from man instead of seeking it from God.

 

[Gary]

It does not say she ate expecting to learn good and evil and to be like gods, it says she expected wisdom as in the Tree of life!

You're adding a value to the scriptures that isn't there. There is no mention in the scriptures that Eve assumed she was eating from the Tree of Life.

So the Tree of life, when we feed upon the fruit thereof gives us godly wisdom.

We were discussing the Tree of Knowledge, not the Tree of Life. You stated that the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil shows one "HOW" to do evil and that having this knowledge makes one wise.

That's not true.

.

 

[About the Son of God]

Thank you for your response About the Son of God, I can see that you understand that the Word is more complex in meaning than it seems. And that is because God does not reveal His hidden goods for the casual reader, but to those who hunger for truth.
I am not actually looking as to why all this happened for I already know why the Bible tells us why.

I wasn't trying to explain why it all happened, but only why the tree was placed there, and I did so to indicate what the tree's purpose was, and hence -- what the tree was expected to produce.

I am really looking for one word that explains what kind of fruit did the tree of life produce that would be able to give us eternal life?

Hmm....

In terms of biblical history, I think it likely that the tree was supposed to produce dates -- as in palm dates.

The cherubim whom are placed around the garden to prevent enterance, are the same creatures who carry God's mobile (but often invisible) throne in Ezekiel, and again mentioned in Revelation; so that the Chrubim are understood not only to be guards of the garden of eden, but also as creatures carrying the mystical garden around for God to gaze down into. Cherubim are also are the "horses" (so to speak) of God's eternal chariot ; although the cherubim, and the seraphim who stand on top of them -- have human hands with which to actually carry the throne of God and are not mere animals.

Moses himself made a copy of this heavenly throne and a walled in area (paradiso/paradise/garden), as a "model" of the cosmos (order), of the world -- the model is called the ark of the covenant and tent of meeting (trysting place), AKA the mercy seat ; and it too was carried by human hands and placed in a walled in area. Hence, the place to look for images when deciding what the tree is -- I would infer as being best found in the artwork Moses commanded the Israelites to make of God's paradise and throne which the Cherubim carried , eg: the model is known as the temple of Jerusalem from Solomon's time onward.

The only tree woven into the tapestries of the temple according to the books of Moses -- around the holy of holies -- is the palm tree. There is quite a bit of biblical and historical Jewish extra-biblical evidence, that the straight and tall date-palm tree is associated with god-liness and goodness. Eg; for one example, the prophetess Deborah, is known to have issued judgments (as a judge/ruler) under one. Judges 4:4-5. And the symbolism is important -- date palms are both straight and very tall, reaching up toward heaven.

Also, Note, the final (or near final) textual form of Genesis was compiled in Babylon, during the captivity; wherein the stories that Moses told orally were arranged in the particular order needed to help the Jews prepare for the coming of the messiah; So the oral traditions of the Jews of that time were arranged in ways which served as an apologetic against the heresies of the Babylonians in order to help the Jews keep their religious identity while in captivity. Biblical texts often bring up points in a specific order, and with subtle differences from the Babylonian own versions of religious texts in order to give reasons that the Babylonans ought to let the Jews live (Babylon was Abraham's homeland, for one thing, they were 'brothers' like Cain and Abel) and that they ought not fight for their common ancestor Abraham, and his cosmologies (which also meant their laws, for Genesis is a book of laws) had ambiguities which made certain practices illegal to both peoples. I won't attempt to explain the symbolism of the tree of life as the Babylonians understood it, as history has mostly forgotten it -- but I will point out, that even the Babylonians depicted the tree of Life as having Palm fronds.

As an aside:
I do not disagree that 'trees' often symbolize rulers within scripture, as you pointed out -- although I don't think the scripture you quoted shows anything about rulers. (Mark 8:24, though in the Greek I think if I remember right that it says, dendrites -- rather than xylum, so it's really more like 'branches' walking than trees....) So -- I would just like to mention that I think you would be better off citing examples in the old testament about the 'cedars' of Lebanon where the prophecies and images would help people in a bible study forum grasp the point more clearly.

In ancient cultures, including Babylon, the tree of life was often alternated with an image of their king or ruler in the same place as the tree. So -- yes, there is good evidence -- both inside and outside of the bible -- that rulers are seen as analogous to trees.

 

[mswright6488]

removed

 

[About the Son of God]

She didn’t know which tree was the forbidden tree by name. She said the tree in the Midst of the garden, meaning as there is only one in the middle.
So, she thought it was the Tree of life was the forbidden and she was deceived because the devil did not correct her in here error and in fact lied about what kind of fruit she could expect from it.

I don't disagree with you about this part although I am unsure of whether there is one tree or two in the midst of the Garden ; but if it were one tree, I am unsure if it bore one or many kinds of fruit. These are details worth looking into...
In the Babylonian depictions, there is a single tree -- but many fruits. In the Jewish temple, I only know of the palm tree -- and am unsure if many fruits were drawn or not. I do know that many people understand the menorah candle to be an image of the tree of life, for it has the dendritic structure of a tree -- but it burned pure olive oil ; so is more like the Garden of Gethsemane....

There is more you have written, but I am not sure what to make of it yet. I'll write more when I have a clearer understanding. I am not, of course, interested in entering into debate -- but only examining the bible and what can be found within it, and how -- historically -- it fit contextually into the world of it's peers and what relationship they bore to each other.
Issues of Prophecy, and the like, are probably better served in other forum sections. Hopefully, I have not been part of any "uprising" but only supplying additional information which people can discus or researched later in harmony with this forum's intention.

 

[mswright6488]

removed

 

[About the Son of God]

WHAT?????? She didn't know??? Is this a joke?

Ummm... well, probably not a joke.
Read Paul, here: 1Timothy 2:14. There is another thread where I entered part way into this discussion before, ----EDIT---- with Adriel. Paul basically identifies certain details of the Genesis narrative, and indicates that Adam was not fooled because he was created first and received the law -- but Eve who was created later, came into existence after the Law was given; so she did not hear it directly from God.

http://christianforums.net/Fellowship/index.php?threads/god-man.58008/#post-1055601

It's an incomplete discussion, but the issue that's sort of getting tripped over here in this thread is that wisdom comes from God -- as in, the Law God gave to Adam is wisdom. I'm not sure how to say it better than that without making the confusion worse. So, read Paul and think carefully about what he says. Sorry I know it's confusing when you first see the idea.... although it's quite biblical. It's the very reason Paul refused to allow women to teach in HIS churches.