When will those that receive the Beast's Mark be judged?

[lecoop]

We read in Rev. 14 about the terrible punishment of these that accept the mark of the beast - but I cannot find where they are actually judged.



Will they be the goats at the sheep and goat judgement?



Coop

 

[golfjack]

reply

I believe there is two types of judgments mentioned in the Bible pertaining to your question. Matt. 25:31-46 talks about the judgment of the Nations. The judgmment of the nations will take place when the Son of Man comes in His glory... And then He will sit on the throne of His glory. The second judgment ( Great White Throne) is never called the throne of His glory.

At the judgment of the nations, He will judge the living nations ( Joel 3:11-16). At the Great White Throne judgment, He will judge the wicked dead.

Therefore, at the Judgment of the nations, there are three classes judged:

1. Sheep, saved ( v. 33; Rev. 7:9-17).
2. Goats, the unsaved ( v. 33; 2 Thess. 1:7-10
3 Brethern, The elect of Israel ( v.40; Rom. 11:25-28).

At the Great White Throne, there is only one class, the dead ( Rev. 20:12).



May God bless, Golfjack

 

[lecoop]

Re: reply

I believe there is two types of judgments mentioned in the Bible pertaining to your question. Matt. 25:31-46 talks about the judgment of the Nations. The judgmment of the nations will take place when the Son of Man comes in His glory... And then He will sit on the throne of His glory. The second judgment ( Great White Throne) is never called the throne of His glory.

At the judgment of the nations, He will judge the living nations ( Joel 3:11-16). At the Great White Throne judgment, He will judge the wicked dead.

Therefore, at the Judgment of the nations, there are three classes judged:

1. Sheep, saved ( v. 33; Rev. 7:9-17).
2. Goats, the unsaved ( v. 33; 2 Thess. 1:7-10
3 Brethern, The elect of Israel ( v.40; Rom. 11:25-28).

At the Great White Throne, there is only one class, the dead ( Rev. 20:12).



May God bless, Golfjack

Thanks for answering. Are you then saying that you belive those that have taken the mark will be among the goats at this judgement?

It seems to me that the parable of the tares must be a separate event from this sheep and goat judgement, if the words, "one taken and one left" does refer to the parable of the tares, as I believe it does. When the disciples ask where they were taken, Jesus mentioned birds, as in eating the flesh of those taken. The point it, one was taken, and one was left. In the sheep and goat judgement, it seems that all will be taken and none left! Every human still in his or her natural body will be at that judgement.

It is possible then, that those with the mark of the beast will be taken as tares. I believe this event must take place at the moment of Jesus return to earth.

Comments anyone?

Coop

 

[golfjack]

reply

Coop, This is an interesting parable. I will give it my best shot. To me the wheat represent true believers and mixed with them are false believers, like JW'S, mormans, and the like. Finally, the tares will be processed by the angels and thrown into hell. Appreciate your comments.



May God bless, Golfjack

 

[lecoop]

Re: reply

Coop, This is an interesting parable. I will give it my best shot. To me the wheat represent true believers and mixed with them are false believers, like JW'S, mormans, and the like. Finally, the tares will be processed by the angels and thrown into hell. Appreciate your comments.



May God bless, Golfjack

Exactly! It will surely come to pass. Who is "taken?" Jesus said, "all things that offend, and them which do iniquity..." This "harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels."

What else do we have to compare this with? We have the parable of the dragnet, where Jesus says something very similar: "So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just, And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

So we have the wicked, those that do iniquity, and those that offend. So far, it seems that this could be the same as the sheep and goat judgement.

The timing here is the "end of the world," which would line up with the judgement of the nations. Now read these carefully:

mat. 24:
40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

When is the "then? Jesus had just mentioned that His coming would be as the days of Noah. In verse 42 we see "your Lord doth come." Again then, this "one taken and one left" is when Jesus comes.

Lightning and thunder - I will have to finish later.

Coop

 

[golfjack]

reply

Coop, How do you interpret the parable of the ten virgins?



May God bless, Golfjack

 

[lecoop]

Re: reply

Coop, How do you interpret the parable of the ten virgins?

May God bless, Golfjack

For a proper understanding, we MUST take these scriptures in the context that Jesus gave them. Let's start with the parable of the 10 virgins. What is the context?

Matt 24
50 The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,
51 And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

This is the context just before the parable of the 10 virgins. Notice that it is talking about the day that Jesus returns. For further proof:

42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

We see clearly that Jesus is talking about the time AFTER the 70th week. For those of us that believe in a pretrib' rapture, we CANNOT relate these scriptures to the rapture, for it will have happened about 7 years previous to this time. In other words, the parable of the 10 virgins has nothing to do with Christians. It is about the Jews (that have survived) that are awaiting the coming of Christ.

We can see that the theme here is the time of the end, the day of Christ's return, not the rapture. Does "weeping and wailing" sound "rapture-ish?" Jesus will come back suddenly, evil people will be cast into hell, and there will be weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth. The next parable, the parable of the talents, ends up with, “And cast the unprofitable servant into the outer darkness. There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.†We can see that the theme is the same. The parable of the virgins is sandwiched in-between these two parables that clearly speak of the reaping of evil people at the time of the end, and their removal from the planet, as well as the harvest of the righteous. To stay in context, the parable of the virgins should be about the same theme: the harvest. In a parable, it is wise to pick out one main teaching point, and not try to make the parable say too much. With these thoughts in mind, what is this parable to teach us? Notice the last verse of this parable:

Matt 25
13"Watch therefore, for you know neither the day nor the hour in which the Son of Man is coming.

It is clear that this parable is about the 24 hour day that Christ will come again, riding on the white horse. We can see then, that the context is all wrong for the rapture. The main point of this parable is to "be ready!"

The bridegroom here is Jesus. His return will signify His Second Coming, at the end of the age. The wedding feast will represent the millennial reign of Christ, His earthly kingdom. The virgins represent all of humanity. They do not represent the bride of Christ. The bride is already in heaven. This is not talking about the wedding feast of the church that has probably already taken place in heaven. This story is undoubtedly of a typical Jewish wedding of that time, where some girls are picked to provide light for the wedding procession. Today we would call them bridesmaids. The groom would come to get the bride, and the girls with the lamps would provide the light for the procession, and possibly even for the ceremony.

It seems that the bridegroom was delayed in his coming. Notice that all ten virgins were sleeping. Therefore, sleeping was not the problem. The problem was not being ready. These five foolish virgins could be likened to the one that received one talent and went and buried it. Jesus called him lazy. Apparently these five foolish virgins were lazy and had not prepared. There assigned task was to provide light, and because they were unprepared, they were unable to do what they had been asked to do. The oil probably does represent the indwelling holy Spirit. Jesus is expecting that those that have survived the tribulation will put their faith in Him. the reason Jesus said that he didn't know them is because they did not have a blood relationship to Jesus and did not have the indwelling Holy Spirit. Those found without this oil of the Holy Spirit will be told by Jesus, “I do not know you.†The main point of this parable is that it will be impossible to prepare (become born again and get the oil of the Holy Spirit) at the last moment, when they see the lightning of His coming split the dark sky! Then it will be too late.
Coop

 

[golfjack]

reply

For sure, this parable reveals an end time event. Let's examine Matt. 25:8-10, I believe this is an event for which some had failed to make preparations. This is where I disagree with you. To me this story clearly parallels the cattching away of the Church for the marriage Supper of the Lamb which will take place in heaven during the same time as the Great Tribulation on the earth. The Church ( Body of Christ) being caught up to heaven, will escape the wrath of God that will be poured out on the earth during that seven-year period. ( Rev' 4:1; 5:9-11; 1 Thess. 4:16-17).

It is evident from verse 10 that half of those waiting for the bridegroom were not prepared at the time of His Appearance. Therefore, they were not recognized as guests for the marriage supper.

It is significant that the bridegroom said, I know you not, rather than, I never knew you, as stated on another occasion in Matt. 7:23. Matt. 25:12 seems to indicate that He had known them at one time. However, He did not recognize them as guests for the marriage, because they were unprepared. The problem being they had no oil, which in this parable, represents the source of their light.

Some key verses that we must consider: Proverbs 20:27: The spirit of man is the candle of the Lord, searching all the inward parts of the belly. This seems to be indicative of the reborn human spirit. Proverbs 13:9, The light of the righteous rejoiceth: But the lamp of the wicked shall be put out.

There is no doubt that these prophetic Scriptures are referrin to Israel as the virgin, stating that the virgin has fallen. ( Amos 5:1, 2, 4). Then it seems obvious that the five foolish virgins could represent the Jewish people as well as Gentiles who have noit received Christ as the true light

One more verse: Proverbs 6:23, For the commandment is a lamp; and the law is light; and reproofs of instruction are the way of life. I believe this is a revealing statement. To the Jews, the law was their light. When Jesus fulfilled the Law, it passed away and their light went out.

Enough for now.


May God bless, Golfjack

 

[n2thelight]

leecoop

It is my understanding that all souls will be judged at the same at the Great White Throne Judgement,which will take place after the millennium.

As for Rev 14 here is a good study on it,as well as the rest of the Bool also,hope it helps and let me know what you think


http://www.theseason.org/revelation/revelation14.htm

 

[lecoop]

leecoop

It is my understanding that all souls will be judged at the same at the Great White Throne Judgement,which will take place after the millennium.

As for Rev 14 here is a good study on it,as well as the rest of the Bool also,hope it helps and let me know what you think


http://www.theseason.org/revelation/revelation14.htm

The pure chronology of Revelation is mixed up! Sorry, but John is very clear on when Jesus gets on the white horse: it is after the 70th week has finished (it ends with the 7th vial). Chapter 14 is a part of John's "midpoint intermission" where he covers all the events that will occur at the midpoint of the week. For example, why would God send an angel to warn about taking the mark of the beast, if that part of the week had already finished? Of course, God would not do that. No, this angel goes out a warns of taking the mark, before that mark is set up.

Therefore, I don't give the auther much credit.

Coop

 

[n2thelight]

lecoop

Therefore, I don't give the auther much credit.

I will agree to disagree,thanks for responding