Where does the line end?

[7teenyearsold]

I'm 17 years old and a senior in high school and a straight A student. I'm going to turn eighteen in the winter of 2012.

My dad does not want me to drive so I don't have my permit or any driving experience outside of the manuals I've been reading. So far I have the basics down and the road signs and rules from the reading I've been doing. My dad is somewhat insecure and doesn't allow anyone in the family to drive besides himself, even my mom and my sister who is 19 and already has her high school diploma. I think he's afraid that we may leave him if he allows us to drive because he grew up an orphan, not knowing his mother or father.

I do plan on leaving eventually and going to college to begin my own life, but I won't just pick up and run away once I get my license. He does all the driving from taking us to the grocery store or and other places, but when he doesn't feel like going to places such as my friend's house or after school clubs, then I simply can't go.

I asked him to let me take the driver's ed class my high school offers for free, but he said something along the lines of "I don't have your mother driving, so why would I let you drive?" When I say I want to learn how to drive, he doesn't take me seriously and makes jokes about learning how to ride a bike first.

I am trying to be God-fearing and I know that I'm required to obey my father, but it is becoming really hard to do because I feel like he is trying to control my life and keep me at home forever. I am considering moving out when I'm 18, getting into a college and learning how to drive while I'm there. But I don't know if this rebellion in the eyes of God, because my dad would forbid these actions.

I try to be respectful of God, both of my parents and be hardworking. I love my dad and don't want to upset him. Any advice?

Sorry, I posted this twice because it was not showing up.

 

[felix]

My dad never allowed me to drive too. Today, I have my own car and drive my family around.

Your dad knows when you want to learn. Knowing to drive is good, but sometimes, do you really need to know how to drive now? If you know to drive, where would you go, and what will you do by knowing to drive?

There are some interesting statistics you must be aware of:
Teen Driving Statistics

Your dad can never stop you from learning to drive or even owning your own car when you have grown up and have your family. When you drive in your age, you don't care about anything and all you enjoy is driving. But imagine you have your 2 year old child at the back seat, how much careful will you drive? I would say, just listen to your dad. Don't say anything about your dad being orphan as it will hurt him. Just because you said he is an orphan, all that he longed from his parents which he did not get, he will pour out those love upon you and I bet he truly loves you and his advise will always be for your good. Just listen to him.

• (Prov 13:1a) A wise son [heeds] his father's instruction, ..
• (Prov 23:22a) Listen to your father who begot you ..

 

[7teenyearsold]

If you're 27 and your father insists on controlling everything still, because he has control issues and everyone including himself is aware of it, do I still follow him? He makes it very clear that even if I'm fifty I'm to unconditionally obey him. Not even my mother is allowed to drive. He's not letting me get a license period even just to have the experience. He tells my mom that when he dies she is still not to drive. This is not about some teenage freedom rampage. It's about being allowed to live your life. Becoming an adult means nothing to him.

 

[jasoncran]

pm me 7teen this will be better discussed in private.

 

[felix]

If you're 27 and your father insists on controlling everything still, because he has control issues and everyone including himself is aware of it, do I still follow him? He makes it very clear that even if I'm fifty I'm to unconditionally obey him. Not even my mother is allowed to drive. He's not letting me get a license period even just to have the experience. He tells my mom that when he dies she is still not to drive. This is not about some teenage freedom rampage. It's about being allowed to live your life. Becoming an adult means nothing to him.

First of all, irrespective of age you are a 'gift' of God to Him. Even in your 77, you still need to obey your dad because you are still your his son.

According to scripture you are an adult by the age of 12, knowing good and evil. Being an adult doesn't mean anything to your dad. Your father must not interfere in your family (after you are married) according to Gen 2:24. You will not understand why he controls you until you have a son of your age now.

I will advise you not to obey your dad only when he contradicts scripture.

 

[jasoncran]

First of all, irrespective of age you are a 'gift' of God to Him. Even in your 77, you still need to obey your dad because you are still your his son.

According to scripture you are an adult by the age of 12, knowing good and evil. Being an adult doesn't mean anything to your dad. Your father must not interfere in your family (after you are married) according to Gen 2:24. You will not understand why he controls you until you have a son of your age now.

I will advise you not to obey your dad only when he contradicts scripture.

or if they dont know your subject matter or or job. my dad has no authority over me in the army. he cant tell me how to lead nor does he know what jobs i do. why would i listen to him on that?

and its by TALMUDIC TRADITIONS that a jew is an adult.

 

[handy]

7teen,

I think that there is a difference in how a child honors one's parents when they are children and when they are adults.

For all who might not understand where I'm coming from let me explain it this way...the Scriptures tells children to honor both their mother and their father and the Scriptures also tells children to obey both their mother and their father. And yet, Scripture also states that women are not to hold authority over men. In the New Testament the word "obey" means "jump up and do". I doubt very seriously any here would suggest that at age 77 you are still expected to "jump up and do" whatever your mother tells you to do. Nor are you expected to "jump up and do" whatever your father tells you to do.

Once you are a man, your obligation to "jump up and do" whatever your parents say diminishes. Your obligation to honor (showing them deference and reverence) your parents (both of them) never does.

In our society, you will be recognized as an adult at age 18. More in keeping with the spirit of things, you are recognized as fully adult when you are living out on your own. I would suggest that you both honor and obey your parents as long as you are living under their roof and they are supporting you. However, given what you describe here, I would suggest you find a way to live on your own as soon as you can in this dreadful economy.

Then, you should certainly listen to your parents (remember the Bible tells children to honor both father and mother, not just Dad) and carefully consider what they have to say. But, you must also be a man and make your own decisions.

No, it would not be rebellion in God's eyes for an adult son to move out and live on his own. Nor would it be rebellion in God's eyes for your sister, who is now 19 to do so either. However, even if you and your sister decide to move out against your father's wishes, you need to be respectful and reverent in how you present your decision to your parents.

The Bible can certainly be used in an ungodly way by those who want to twist certain Scriptures to control others. I know first hand how this is done and also how harmful it is. If your father is doing this, he is the one in rebellion to God.

 

[felix]

And yet, Scripture also states that women are not to hold authority over men.

A son is not to hold authority over his own mother.

(Prov 30:17) The eye that mocks his father, And scorns obedience to his mother, The ravens of the valley will pick it out, And the young eagles will eat it.

In the New Testament the word "obey" means "jump up and do". I doubt very seriously any here would suggest that at age 77 you are still expected to "jump up and do" whatever your mother tells you to do. Nor are you expected to "jump up and do" whatever your father tells you to do.

Once you are a man, your obligation to "jump up and do" whatever your parents say diminishes.

I don't think this is biblical even a bit. Can you back your statement using scriptures? A person becomes a man at 12 according to scriptures (and Jewish traditions). Are you suggesting that the obligation to obey diminishes after he is 12?

In our society, you will be recognized as an adult at age 18. More in keeping with the spirit of things, you are recognized as fully adult when you are living out on your own.

We are to have scripture as the reference point and not culture or traditions. At the age of approx. 12 (or after s/he know good and evil), s/he becomes an adult.

(Deut 1:39) 'Moreover your little ones and your children, who you say will be victims, who today have no knowledge of good and evil, they shall go in there; to them I will give it, and they shall possess it.

All who knew good and evil are not children.

No, it would not be rebellion in God's eyes for an adult son to move out and live on his own. Nor would it be rebellion in God's eyes for your sister, who is now 19 to do so either. However, even if you and your sister decide to move out against your father's wishes, you need to be respectful and reverent in how you present your decision to your parents.

It would be rebellion in God's eyes to move out against his father's wishes. A man must move out after he is married to live with his wife. The same applies to his sister too.

The Bible can certainly be used in an ungodly way by those who want to twist certain Scriptures to control others. I know first hand how this is done and also how harmful it is. If your father is doing this, he is the one in rebellion to God.

I am interested to know how scripture can be twisted when it speaks plain and simple. The one place we are not to obey parents is that, when they ask or use their children to do anything contrary to scripture.

7teenyearsold, I suggest he should read the parable of prodigal son. The first son was angry when his father made a feast for the return of his prodigal second son because, when the first son asked his father for a single fatten calf to celebrate with his friends, his father had earlier denied his requests. Does that make the father bad? FYI, the father in the parable is compared to our Heavenly Father.

 

[jasoncran]

7teen,

I think that there is a difference in how a child honors one's parents when they are children and when they are adults.

For all who might not understand where I'm coming from let me explain it this way...the Scriptures tells children to honor both their mother and their father and the Scriptures also tells children to obey both their mother and their father. And yet, Scripture also states that women are not to hold authority over men. In the New Testament the word "obey" means "jump up and do". I doubt very seriously any here would suggest that at age 77 you are still expected to "jump up and do" whatever your mother tells you to do. Nor are you expected to "jump up and do" whatever your father tells you to do.

Once you are a man, your obligation to "jump up and do" whatever your parents say diminishes. Your obligation to honor (showing them deference and reverence) your parents (both of them) never does.

In our society, you will be recognized as an adult at age 18. More in keeping with the spirit of things, you are recognized as fully adult when you are living out on your own. I would suggest that you both honor and obey your parents as long as you are living under their roof and they are supporting you. However, given what you describe here, I would suggest you find a way to live on your own as soon as you can in this dreadful economy.

Then, you should certainly listen to your parents (remember the Bible tells children to honor both father and mother, not just Dad) and carefully consider what they have to say. But, you must also be a man and make your own decisions.

No, it would not be rebellion in God's eyes for an adult son to move out and live on his own. Nor would it be rebellion in God's eyes for your sister, who is now 19 to do so either. However, even if you and your sister decide to move out against your father's wishes, you need to be respectful and reverent in how you present your decision to your parents.

The Bible can certainly be used in an ungodly way by those who want to twist certain Scriptures to control others. I know first hand how this is done and also how harmful it is. If your father is doing this, he is the one in rebellion to God.

thanks dora, i wanted to say it this way.for the record my dad and mom arent strong christians and seldom would i go to them for advice on spiritual matters.

even in secular matters or life i know some things that they didnt know or dont care to learn.

they would pay a plumber rather then fix things if they could,i dont hold them at fault for what they didnt teach but i once did as my dad belittled me as he gets(yes he does still do this at times and when he does i remind him that i am not of any obligation to take his crap).

i take what i have learned to help my parents and in doing so i honor them.

 

[jasoncran]

A son is not to hold authority over his own mother.

(Prov 30:17) The eye that mocks his father, And scorns obedience to his mother, The ravens of the valley will pick it out, And the young eagles will eat it.



I don't think this is biblical even a bit. Can you back your statement using scriptures? A person becomes a man at 12 according to scriptures (and Jewish traditions). Are you suggesting that the obligation to obey diminishes after he is 12?



We are to have scripture as the reference point and not culture or traditions. At the age of approx. 12 (or after s/he know good and evil), s/he becomes an adult.

(Deut 1:39) 'Moreover your little ones and your children, who you say will be victims, who today have no knowledge of good and evil, they shall go in there; to them I will give it, and they shall possess it.

All who knew good and evil are not children.



It would be rebellion in God's eyes to move out against his father's wishes. A man must move out after he is married to live with his wife. The same applies to his sister too.



I am interested to know how scripture can be twisted when it speaks plain and simple. The one place we are not to obey parents is that, when they ask or use their children to do anything contrary to scripture.

7teenyearsold, I suggest he should read the parable of prodigal son. The first son was angry when his father made a feast for the return of his prodigal second son because, when the first son asked his father for a single fatten calf to celebrate with his friends, his father had earlier denied his requests. Does that make the father bad? FYI, the father in the parable is compared to our Heavenly Father.

fyi in america its considered pretty sorry of one to be a mommas boy and live at home till 30. its a sign of laziness and you wont find a woman being that way. my wife told me that even though i lived with my parents at a late age, i did have a car and worked and was in college. all things that made her want to be with me


that said i paid rent to my parents and i worked on their cars.

 

[handy]

Toto, I have a feeling we're not in b.c. Judea anymore....


Felix, are you saying that you will demand that your children live with you, will not drive, or have any independence from you until they are married? (If they ever get married that is...if Australia is anything like America, other singles aren't going to touch them with a 10 foot pole, living under conditions like that.)

If you are not going to demand that all your children (and I know you to be a very loving father) live with you until they get married, demand that they never learn to drive a car until they are married, and demand that your wife not drive a car, even after you are dead...then to tell this young man that he must do these things seems hypocritical...forcing something on him that you wouldn't do or expect from your loved ones.

This is more of an advice thread, so it will not be nice of us to derail the advice 7teen is asking for in hammering out when and how adult children should "honor" their parents. If you like to create a thread, I'll be happy to discuss the issue (but might not have a lot of time until next week for discussion. I'd be interested in the Chapter and verse that tells us that we are adults in God's eyes at age 12.)


7teen, it sounds as if your father has control issues and perhaps even mental illness. You will not be in rebellion against God to live an ordinary life, even if folks show you verses that seem to speak to the contrary.

I was not raised in a Christian home and knew next to nothing of the Scriptures when I became a Christian. When I went to college, I wanted to join in fellowship with other Christian students...and found myself right in the middle of a cult.

The leader of that cult had the same kind of control issues that it sounds as if your father has. He demanded that we "obey" him as our spiritual leader because of Hebrews 13:17 which states:

Obey your leaders and submit to them, for they keep watch over your souls as those who will give an account. Let them do this with joy and not with grief, for this would be unprofitable for you.

Man, he and his wife got a LOT of mileage out of that verse. Once when I told his wife that I wanted to reschedule and early morning bible study we had planned (because I had a full schedule at college, worked a part time job, and had a major paper due and had stayed up until 3:00am, the bible study being scheduled for 6:30am), she went back to her husband crying that she felt Satan was instilling a spirit of lazyiness in me. Because I "caused her grief" he came over, made me get out of bed, drive back to his house with him and kneel on the floor before her and ask her forgiveness.

Everything they did, and I mean EVERYTHING, was backed up with bible verses. We couldn't have friends over to our place without permission from them, we couldn't go to church with our parents (I got into big trouble for going to church with my mom on Mother's Day), we couldn't go on day trips or do anything without "clearing" it with them first. Again, all these demands...they backed up with the Bible. When I wanted to spend some time with my own mom and dad who had by then turned their lives over to the Lord, they had me memorize Matthew 14:26 and repeat it to them 10 times.

7teen, I'm sharing this with you to help you understand that just because someone can point to texts in the Bible and say "You have to obey your father even if you're 77 years old" based on what they say...that doesn't mean that God is behind it. Even Satan used Scriptures to tempt Christ.

I'm not trying to be rude to Felix and am certainly not comparing him to Satan...I know him to be a man who holds God and his own family very dear to his heart and I'm sure he is giving advice from what he truly believes is the "godly" perspective.

But, I doubt that Felix has ever dealt with the type of controlling and even paranoid personality like that of that cult leader I once was under or a man like your father.

Do honor your father by being respectful while you live with him and always try to keep the lines of communication open (as hard as that might become) when you do move out. Do obey him as long as you are living in his house. Also, since you think his issues stem from fears of losing his family, reiterate your love for him and the fact that, even after you move away, you will always love him and desire to be with him. Start saying that now, because if your father is anything like the leaders I was with...as soon as I left, they had nothing to do with me, nor would they allow any of the group to have anything to do with me.

What most concerns me about your situation is the fact that without a driver's license, it might become very hard to get another living situation. Do you live in an area that has adequate public transportation or are you able to ride a bike to potential jobs? Or, do you possibly have other family members that might be able to help you as you first start out? These are questions that you'll need to consider.

Also, it concerns me the impact of moving out might have on your relationship with your mother and your sister. What do you think will happen with them if you do move out?

 

[handy]

I think I'll go ahead and start a thread in Apologetics and Theology regarding what children who are legally of age owe to their parents. This weekend will be a busy one, but this is an important topic and we don't want to hijack 7teen's thread haggling over it.

Here is the thread:

http://www.christianforums.net/f17/how-do-adult-children-honor-their-parents-38764/#post576168

 

[felix]

I think I'll go ahead and start a thread in Apologetics and Theology regarding what children who are legally of age owe to their parents. This weekend will be a busy one, but this is an important topic and we don't want to hijack 7teen's thread haggling over it.

Here is the thread:

http://www.christianforums.net/f17/how-do-adult-children-honor-their-parents-38764/#post576168

I too don't want to hijack this thread but i will just reply some specific questions to me before replying on the other thread - or else, I feel there would be a disconnect.

Felix, are you saying that you will demand that your children live with you, will not drive, or have any independence from you until they are married? (If they ever get married that is...if Australia is anything like America, other singles aren't going to touch them with a 10 foot pole, living under conditions like that.)

The issue is not about driving. There are several other things a father would think. I would certainly not allow my children to go to some friend unknown to me or my wife. I would certainly not allow my children to stay late elsewhere as long as I can reach them in a few minutes and they are with people well known to me and safe for my children.

If you are not going to demand that all your children (and I know you to be a very loving father) live with you until they get married, demand that they never learn to drive a car until they are married, and demand that your wife not drive a car, even after you are dead...then to tell this young man that he must do these things seems hypocritical...forcing something on him that you wouldn't do or expect from your loved ones.

I would certainly allow my daughters to learn driving (if possible even flight ;)). But this is very different from controlling. I myself (and every father) would have passed this stage of 17 years. Let me be honest with you, how a father would think. Is 7teen going to his friend's house driving alone to do Bible study? Certainly not. Every guy in his later teen stage would actively involve in porn. Porn is a sin and scripture calls it 'sins of the youth'. Every good father knows this and wants his children not to expose too much into this sinful world by giving them no private space. Can you list the things people do in private? (except rest room activities). Giving private space means it encourages to hide things from parents.

As I previously stated, did the Father satisfy the request of his first son with his friends? Bible is our best friend and best example.

7teen, it sounds as if your father has control issues and perhaps even mental illness. You will not be in rebellion against God to live an ordinary life, even if folks show you verses that seem to speak to the contrary.

Does the Father in the prodigal son has control issues and mental illness?

I was not raised in a Christian home and knew next to nothing of the Scriptures when I became a Christian. When I went to college, I wanted to join in fellowship with other Christian students...and found myself right in the middle of a cult.

The leader of that cult had the same kind of control issues that it sounds as if your father has. He demanded that we "obey" him as our spiritual leader because of Hebrews 13:17 which states:

Obey your leaders and submit to them, for they keep watch over your souls as those who will give an account. Let them do this with joy and not with grief, for this would be unprofitable for you.

Man, he and his wife got a LOT of mileage out of that verse. Once when I told his wife that I wanted to reschedule and early morning bible study we had planned (because I had a full schedule at college, worked a part time job, and had a major paper due and had stayed up until 3:00am, the bible study being scheduled for 6:30am), she went back to her husband crying that she felt Satan was instilling a spirit of lazyiness in me. Because I "caused her grief" he came over, made me get out of bed, drive back to his house with him and kneel on the floor before her and ask her forgiveness.

Everything they did, and I mean EVERYTHING, was backed up with bible verses. We couldn't have friends over to our place without permission from them, we couldn't go to church with our parents (I got into big trouble for going to church with my mom on Mother's Day), we couldn't go on day trips or do anything without "clearing" it with them first. Again, all these demands...they backed up with the Bible. When I wanted to spend some time with my own mom and dad who had by then turned their lives over to the Lord, they had me memorize Matthew 14:26 and repeat it to them 10 times.

I understand your situation and it is very unfortunate that you came across a cult leader. I can only imagine many true Christians were prosecuted in the name of God, only to twist the Word of God which scripture itself warns. I also agree, that you coming from a non christian background, it would be very difficult at the early states to use the sword of God to fight back, which is using the scripture itself.

But a spiritual cult leader controlling his victims is very different from a loving father controlling his son.

7teen, I'm sharing this with you to help you understand that just because someone can point to texts in the Bible and say "You have to obey your father even if you're 77 years old" based on what they say...that doesn't mean that God is behind it. Even Satan used Scriptures to tempt Christ.

I'm not trying to be rude to Felix and am certainly not comparing him to Satan...I know him to be a man who holds God and his own family very dear to his heart and I'm sure he is giving advice from what he truly believes is the "godly" perspective.

But, I doubt that Felix has ever dealt with the type of controlling and even paranoid personality like that of that cult leader I once was under or a man like your father.

Are you suggesting that Satan is saying through me for I said: "You have to obey your father even if you're 77 years old" ?

(Prov 23:22) Listen to your father who begot you, And do not despise your mother when she is old.

So, how old should father and mother be in Prov 23:22. ?

 

[7teenyearsold]

For some reason, a lot of people in this forum are under the impression that I'm a guy. I don't what I said to indicate this, but I am a girl.....

 

[handy]

For some reason, a lot of people in this forum are under the impression that I'm a guy. I don't what I said to indicate this, but I am a girl.....

Got me! Yep, I did indeed think you were a guy...not sure why, but I did have that impression.

Doesn't really matter. (Well, at least as far as any advice I've shared...it certainly matters to you if you are a guy or a girl!;)) If you haven't done so, you might like to check out the thread in Apologetics and Theology. We (meaning Felix and myself) are delving deeper into this subject.

The fact that you are a girl doesn't mean that you have to remain with your father until you're married. It really doesn't. I know that several people tried to tell me that as well during my single years. I didn't marry until I was 38 years old. I had a good relationship with my parents and they were Christian my adult life. They always welcomed me back home when I would hit times of hardship...but in no way did they expect me to live under their authority. Nor does the Bible teach this. We really do need to separate out what was culture and tradition from what is actually taught in Scripture.

 

[felix]

For some reason, a lot of people in this forum are under the impression that I'm a guy. I don't what I said to indicate this, but I am a girl.....

When you said 'I'm 17 years old...' that made me think you are a guy because I believe girls don't like to reveal their age .

Anyway, just a last question ... Is your father not allowing you only to drive (is it all about driving?) or treating you bad? If so how? (controlling is different from mistreating). You also said your dad is somewhat insecure. I don't know what that really means, but as a wise father, he might be avoiding any risks on the car and on you.

 

[7teenyearsold]

Hi.
Sorry, I took so long to answer. I got out of school about two hours ago.

I don't think you fully understand what's going on. He's not allowing me, my sister (age 19), my brother (age 16), and my mother to drive at all. I mention the ages to bring light to the fact that we're all of the legal driving age in the state I live in.

He doesn't want us to leave or have a means of living independent of him. Again, I am not on a teenage rampage...

I don't understand how my dad thinks all the time, but I do know that his growing up without parents has led to this tendency to make decisions that keep us within his grasp for as long as possible.

I'm not only concerned with the "no-driving" rule. That was the main issue biting at me when I posted this. As far as treating me bad goes- well, I'm going to have to say that he treats me decently, I guess. Food, clothing, shelter- we have all those thanks my mom and him. Also, they have instilled strong Christian values in my siblings and me so I want to make sure I am not going against God if I leave. I know that my father will go berserk. My mom- she would be concerned with how I would fare but she would encourage my decision to move out.She does not do it openly around my Dad because he would punish her for contradicting him and punish me also, and just try to control us even more.

I can't tell you everything that goes on, but really, I don't see how it is important in respect to what the Scripture allows a teenager to do in respect to leaving her parents.

The way I see it, it's either it is acceptable or not acceptable in God's eyes. That was the real question I should have made clearer: Is it okay for me to move out when I turn 18 against my Dad's wishes?

Please Help.....

 

[handy]

7teenyearsold,

I would say yes, it is acceptable in God's eyes to move out when you are 18. The hard thing will be to do it in a way that is not disrespectful, even though he is going to throw at you that the very act of doing this is disrespectful.

This is what you need to do...consider all the rational reasons why your father does not want you to move out. If the concerns that he voices are along the lines of:

You will become financially unstable.
You will be lonely and therefore more susceptible to temptations.
You are not ready to take on the full range of adult responsibilities.

...things like that. These are valid concerns that adults voice to their adult children as their children are moving onward in life. If you listen to his concerns, think them through and figure out how you are going to negotiate through these very real issues and talk through your plans with him...then you are respecting him...even if you decide that this is something you are ready to take on.

Of course, this is what you can do if your father is a rational person. Something I'm no so convinced of.

I do have a concern that you say that your Dad would "go berserk" and "punish your mother". "Punishment" has absolutely no place in a Christian marriage. It is out of line for him to punish his wife.

In a normal, healthy Christian marriage, your mother could certainly facilitate useful conversation with your father, but it would also be her place to stand in agreement with him. It wouldn't be godly of her to contradict him, anymore than it would be right of him to contradict her if she were telling you something.

It's just that just as I have doubts as to the rationality of your father...I also have doubts to the health of your parent's marriage.

What is your church like? Is is super, super fundamental...or would your pastor be a person that you could discuss this with?

 

[7teenyearsold]

We don't have a church. Everyone kind of studies on their own. Our parents advise us to read the Scriptures, but there's no set schedule or anything.

 

[handy]

We don't have a church. Everyone kind of studies on their own. Our parents advise us to read the Scriptures, but there's no set schedule or anything.

:gah Somehow this doesn't surprise me.