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Razeontherock said:
I'm not suggesting to ignore context, and am quick to point out there is NO Scripture that commands us (or Jews) to kill anyone.

I'm asking if you're aware of God commanding ancient Israel not to take a census.
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Deuteronomy 25:19.20:17 wipe out nations off the earth. that wars wasn't defensive. go and take what I have commanded that is yours and take none alive. they could accept peace and those that did had to live in subgation.

wipe out the seed of the amekelite. a command of a given season. I do study the torah and try not to ignore the context.

also ex 30:12
When you take the census of the people of Israel, then each shall give va ransom for his life to the Lord when you number them, that there be no plague among them when you number them.
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we are to offer a ransom for that? that implied they are mine and Im responsible for them. I would say that implies, to trust the lord when you offer that offering for them so that He will approve the numbering.
Wars

  1. That those engaged in warfare shall not fear their enemies nor be panic-stricken by them during battle (Deut. 3:22, 7:21, 20:3) (negative).
  2. To anoint a special kohein (to speak to the soldiers) in a war (Deut. 20:2) (affirmative). See Kohein.
  3. In a permissive war (as distinguished from obligatory ones), to observe the procedure prescribed in the Torah (Deut. 20:10) (affirmative).
  4. Not to keep alive any individual of the seven Canaanite nations (Deut. 20:16) (negative).
  5. To exterminate the seven Canaanite nations from the land of Israel (Deut. 20:17) (affirmative).
  6. Not to destroy fruit trees (wantonly or in warfare) (Deut. 20:19-20) (CCN191).
  7. To deal with a beautiful woman taken captive in war in the manner prescribed in the Torah (Deut. 21:10-14) (affirmative).
  8. Not to sell a beautiful woman, (taken captive in war) (Deut. 21:14) (negative).
  9. Not to degrade a beautiful woman (taken captive in war) to the condition of a bondwoman (Deut. 21:14) (negative).
  10. Not to offer peace to the Ammonites and the Moabites before waging war on them, as should be done to other nations (Deut. 23:7) (negative).
  11. That anyone who is unclean shall not enter the Camp of the Levites (Deut. 23:11) (according to the Talmud, in the present day this means the Temple mount) (CCN193).
  12. To have a place outside the camp for sanitary purposes (Deut. 23:13) (affirmative).
  13. To keep that place sanitary (Deut. 23:14-15) (affirmative).
  14. Always to remember what Amalek did (Deut. 25:17) (CCA76).
  15. That the evil done to us by Amalek shall not be forgotten (Deut. 25:19) (CCN194).
  16. To destroy the seed of Amalek (Deut. 25:19) (CCA77)
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modern warfare doctrine, doesn't allow me to wipe out even the japs or the germans on a scale like that. no seed left for a nation?
 
Ok, so God commanded Israel to take a census. David did, but did it the wrong way? Is that what you're saying?

[The ancient history of Israel's wars, offensive and defensive, is not directly related to the topic, and might confuse our OP. There is no question that God did, past tense, command Israel to kill, the way Scripture is written. There is also no way to make those commands pertain to anyone, today. A very in-depth analysis might give further insight into the topic of pride, but that's way ahead of where this thread is)
 
Razeontherock said:
Ok, so God commanded Israel to take a census. David did, but did it the wrong way? Is that what you're saying?

[The ancient history of Israel's wars, offensive and defensive, is not directly related to the topic, and might confuse our OP. There is no question that God did, past tense, command Israel to kill, the way Scripture is written. There is also no way to make those commands pertain to anyone, today. A very in-depth analysis might give further insight into the topic of pride, but that's way ahead of where this thread is)
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david offered no ransom. he would have to pay with whatever the ransom amount was for the entire nation. which would imply he had that amount. no Hebrew could be that wealthy. it implies that David birth, created Isreal. which He didnt
 
jasonc said:
david offered no ransom. he would have to pay with whatever the ransom amount was for the entire nation. which would imply he had that amount. no Hebrew could be that wealthy. it implies that David birth, created Isreal. which He didnt
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Ah! So THIS explains why God punished David over the census?
 
For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many. Mark 10:45 KJV

The ransom points to Christ. Without Christ's ransom, people are doomed.
 
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