Is Saving Faith A Gift?

[SolaScriptura]

Is Saving Faith A Gift?

There are some, especially from the “Reformed/Calvinist”, who say that Saving Faith is a Gift from God, which is given only to the “Elect”, so that they can believe, and be saved.

They use Ephesians 2:8-9, which says:

“for by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, that no one would boast”

Contextually, Paul is speaking of Salvation as the Gift here. He repeats what he has just said in verse 5, “by grace you have been saved”. Clearly Salvation is the main theme here.

However, supposing that we agree and say that Saving Faith, is a Gift from God, and this is only given to the “Elect”. If this were true, then God must be unjust!

Faith is “to Believe”. A sinner is saved by both REPENTING and BELIEVING, as Jesus clearly Teaches in Mark 1:15, and elsewhere.

In Mark 16:16, Jesus says:

“He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who disbelieves will be condemned”

John 3:18 and 36 says:

“He who believes in him is not judged. He who doesn’t believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the one and only Son of God…One who believes in the Son has eternal life, but one who disobeys the Son won’t see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.”

Clearly says, that those who BELIEVE, will be saved; and those who do NOT BELIEVE, will be damned.

Now, if Saving Faith is a Gift from God, and only given to the “Elect”, how can God Justly condemn those who do NOT BELIEVE, as they were not given this Saving Faith, so that they could be saved? This makes God unjust! God with-holds Saving Faith from the “non-elect”, so that they cannot BELIEVE and be saved; and then damns them for something that they CANNOT do???

This teaching CANNOT be from the Holy Bible, and is an INVENTION from those who clearly OPPOSE the Bible’s Teaching, that, “EVERYONE, WHOEVER, SHALL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD, WILL BE SAVED”.

The Bible says of Saving Faith

"So faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God" (Romans 10:17)

 

[Fastfredy0]

Is Saving Faith A Gift?

There are some, especially from the “Reformed/Calvinist”, who say that Saving Faith is a Gift from God, which is given only to the “Elect”, so that they can believe, and be saved.

They use Ephesians 2:8-9, which says:

“for by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, that no one would boast”

Contextually, Paul is speaking of Salvation as the Gift here. He repeats what he has just said in verse 5, “by grace you have been saved”. Clearly Salvation is the main theme here.

However, supposing that we agree and say that Saving Faith, is a Gift from God, and this is only given to the “Elect”. If this were true, then God must be unjust!

Faith is “to Believe”. A sinner is saved by both REPENTING and BELIEVING, as Jesus clearly Teaches in Mark 1:15, and elsewhere.

In Mark 16:16, Jesus says:

“He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who disbelieves will be condemned”

John 3:18 and 36 says:

“He who believes in him is not judged. He who doesn’t believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the one and only Son of God…One who believes in the Son has eternal life, but one who disobeys the Son won’t see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.”

Clearly says, that those who BELIEVE, will be saved; and those who do NOT BELIEVE, will be damned.

Now, if Saving Faith is a Gift from God, and only given to the “Elect”, how can God Justly condemn those who do NOT BELIEVE, as they were not given this Saving Faith, so that they could be saved? This makes God unjust! God with-holds Saving Faith from the “non-elect”, so that they cannot BELIEVE and be saved; and then damns them for something that they CANNOT do???

This teaching CANNOT be from the Holy Bible, and is an INVENTION from those who clearly OPPOSE the Bible’s Teaching, that, “EVERYONE, WHOEVER, SHALL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD, WILL BE SAVED”.

The Bible says of Saving Faith

"So faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God" (Romans 10:17)

Given your logic ...
Premise 1: billions of people never heard of Christ. https://reachbeyond.org/Advocate/RBActionGuide.pdf
Premise 2: You must have faith in Christ to be saved (John 14:6, John 3:18; Acts 4:12, Romans 3:21-24;John 12:48 etc)
Premise 3: God must give everyone opportunity to be saved or He is unjust
Your Conclusion: God is unjust
My Conclusion: You're not being rational

Aside: I am glad you spend so much time studying reformed theology ... 1 Corinthians 2:12 Now we have not received the spirit [that belongs to] the world, but the [Holy] Spirit Who is from God, [given to us] that we might realize and comprehend and appreciate the gifts [of divine favor and blessing so freely and lavishly] bestowed on us by God.

 

[SolaScriptura]

Given your logic ...
Premise 1: billions of people never heard of Christ. https://reachbeyond.org/Advocate/RBActionGuide.pdf
Premise 2: You must have faith in Christ to be saved (John 14:6, John 3:18; Acts 4:12, Romans 3:21-24;John 12:48 etc)
Premise 3: God must give everyone opportunity to be saved or He is unjust
Your Conclusion: God is unjust
My Conclusion: You're not being rational

Aside: I am glad you spend so much time studying reformed theology ... 1 Corinthians 2:12 Now we have not received the spirit [that belongs to] the world, but the [Holy] Spirit Who is from God, [given to us] that we might realize and comprehend and appreciate the gifts [of divine favor and blessing so freely and lavishly] bestowed on us by God.

How about dealing with the OP?

 

[Fastfredy0]

How about dealing with the OP?

I did. I showed plainly using a syllogism so you could understand that the your logic was not rational. If you have a reason to dispute any premise(s) and thereby put the conclusion in doubt, let's here it. (aside: Yeah, I know, you don't answer questions)
So, I still assert that per the premises I displayed that I believe reflex your logic that either:
1) You feel God is unjust (because God doesn't afford everyone the opportunity to be saved) ... or ....
2) You are not being rational

Here's another for you to solve (not that you answer questions, but for my amusement):
Premise 1: billions of people died before the age of accountability
Premise 2: Those of premise 1 all go to hell or to heaven
Premise 3: God must give everyone opportunity to be saved or He is unjust
Your Conclusion: God is unjust
My Conclusion: You're not being rational

 

[SolaScriptura]

I did. I showed plainly using a syllogism so you could understand that the your logic was not rational. If you have a reason to dispute any premise(s) and thereby put the conclusion in doubt, let's here it. (aside: Yeah, I know, you don't answer questions)
So, I still assert that per the premises I displayed that I believe reflex your logic that either:
1) You feel God is unjust (because God doesn't afford everyone the opportunity to be saved) ... or ....
2) You are not being rational

Here's another for you to solve (not that you answer questions, but for my amusement):
Premise 1: billions of people died before the age of accountability
Premise 2: Those of premise 1 all go to hell or to heaven
Premise 3: God must give everyone opportunity to be saved or He is unjust
Your Conclusion: God is unjust
My Conclusion: You're not being rational

How do you know the Mind of God? How do you know that the salvation of the billions who may never have heard of Jesus Christ, will not be judged on HOW they would have reacted to the Gospel Message, HAD they herad it? God is God, and everything is not in the Bible, on HOW He will do things. Always keep Genesis 18:25 in mind!

You have failed to answer, how Saving Faith can be a "Gift" only for the "Elect", and then God damns those who don't have this faith, because He in the first place never gave it to them? Is this JUST???

 

[Fastfredy0]

How do you know the Mind of God?

Ah ... the Bible?

How do you know that the salvation of the billions who may never have heard of Jesus Christ, will not be judged on HOW they would have reacted to the Gospel Message, HAD they herad it?

Ah, the Bible. I did give you corroborating verses. You are free to read them ... or you can give a scriptural reference to how people can be saved without knowledge of Christ today (oh yeah, you don't answer questions)
(Aside: 50% of evangelicals believe one can be saved without knowing Christ ... Roman Catholic tradition believes on can be saved without knowing of Christ)

will not be judged on HOW they would have reacted to the Gospel Message, HAD they herad it?

*giggles* you should be the Pope. You could make these completely unsubstantiated assertions into an infallible tradition on a par with the Bible. You would have to change you handle though from SolaScriptura
.... similar unsubstantiated assertions for you to consider:

• how do you know God doesn't give us second, third, fourth, ... chance to believe after we die
• how do you know God does have a place called purgatory where we can earn our way to heaven
• how do you know that God won't change His mind

etc., etc. ... just speculations based on nothingness.

You have failed to answer

Oh the irony from the one who does not answers questions.

You have failed to answer, how Saving Faith can be a "Gift" only for the "Elect", and then God damns those who don't have this faith, because He in the first place never gave it to them? Is this JUST???

Oh, I answered it. You just didn't see the answer. When you solve the syllogisms (determine which premise is wrong), then you will have your answer.

 

[brightfame52]

sola scripture

Contextually, Paul is speaking of Salvation as the Gift here.

Correct, and Faith to believe accompanies Salvation, so its a Gift of Gods Grace. The Christian believes because of Grace Acts 18:27
27 And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:

So Faith/Believing as well as Salvation is not of the sinner, its all the Gift of God !

 

[brightfame52]

sola scrip

Now, if Saving Faith is a Gift from God, and only given to the “Elect”, how can God Justly condemn those who do NOT BELIEVE

Because they law breaking sinners !

 

[jerry63935]

saved BY grace through faith faith is only part of it

 

[brightfame52]

saved BY grace through faith faith is only part of it

Faith is part of the Gift of Salvation

 

[jerry63935]

Faith is part of the Gift of Salvation

umm i think i covered that " faith is only part of it "

 

[brightfame52]

umm i think i covered that " faith is only part of it "

As long as you realize that Faith is a Gift of God and doesnt come natural in the natural man, not Salvation Faith that is.

 

[jerry63935]

As long as you realize that Faith is a Gift of God and doesnt come natural in the natural man, not Salvation Faith that is.

look i really would prefer not have the Calvinism lecture .i am well aware of a lot things in due time i will enter into discussion. but i will not hold to being told i am wrong your right

 

[Whatever]

However, supposing that we agree and say that Saving Faith, is a Gift from God, and this is only given to the “Elect”. If this were true, then God must be unjust!

That is the whole complaint against Calvinism. People judge God by their standard of what God can or can't do. If a passage clearly has God doing what they say He cannot do, they have to use all kinds of exegetical gymnastics to twist it to say "the passage isn't saying that."

I like the Living Bible translation of Romans 9:18-19. It sounds just like all anti-Calvinists.
18 So you see, God is kind to some just because he wants to be, and he makes some refuse to listen.
19 Well then, why does God blame them for not listening? Haven’t they done what he made them do?

Or in other words, "doesn't this make God unjust?"

The Voice Translation or paraphrase
18 So when and where God decides to show mercy is completely up to Him. Likewise, when He chooses to harden one’s heart, how can we argue?
19 I can hear one of you asking, “Then how can He blame us if He is the one in complete control? How can we do anything He has not chosen for us?”

Go ahead and twist on - you know "Paul isn't really saying that."

 

[brightfame52]

solascriptura said

However, supposing that we agree and say that Saving Faith, is a Gift from God, and this is only given to the “Elect”. If this were true, then God must be unjust!

You just called God unjust friend !

 

[brightfame52]

That is the whole complaint against Calvinism. People judge God by their standard of what God can or can't do. If a passage clearly has God doing what they say He cannot do, they have to use all kinds of exegetical gymnastics to twist it to say "the passage isn't saying that."

I like the Living Bible translation of Romans 9:18-19. It sounds just like all anti-Calvinists.
18 So you see, God is kind to some just because he wants to be, and he makes some refuse to listen.
19 Well then, why does God blame them for not listening? Haven’t they done what he made them do?

Or in other words, "doesn't this make God unjust?"

The Voice Translation or paraphrase
18 So when and where God decides to show mercy is completely up to Him. Likewise, when He chooses to harden one’s heart, how can we argue?
19 I can hear one of you asking, “Then how can He blame us if He is the one in complete control? How can we do anything He has not chosen for us?”

Go ahead and twist on - you know "Paul isn't really saying that."

Now I am not too into those paraphrases because they can go way off at times, but theses capture the Truth of those verses very well I believe.

 

[GodsGrace]

solascriptura said



You just called God unjust friend !

Ummmm.
I think You call Him unjust.

 

[SolaScriptura]

solascriptura said



You just called God unjust friend !

It is "Reformed" theology that makes God unjust

 

[Whatever]

Now I am not too into those paraphrases because they can go way off at times, but theses capture the Truth of those verses very well I believe.

Sometimes I just use them to show that I'm not the only person who understands these verses that way.

 

[brightfame52]

Envision a cleaner system·

We start in heaven·
And just never leave·

Get a soulmate·
Get to brew wine·

Quintessential to the Nth power·

This doesnt make sense !