WIP said:

I think a more accurate question would be if it was believed that a willful practicing homosexual could inherit the Kingdom of God. My answer to that question would be to ask how they could continue willfully living a life of active homosexuality and still accept Jesus Christ as their Lord? That seems to be a contradiction.

Didn't Jesus say, "If you love me, keep my commandments?" See John 14:15.

Are we getting off topic?

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How does this sound?

I think a more accurate question would be if it was believed that a willful practicing drinker could inherit the Kingdom of God. My answer to that question would be to ask how they could continue willfully living a life of active drinking and still accept Jesus Christ as their Lord? That seems to be a contradiction.

Didn't Jesus say, "If you love me, keep my commandments?" See John 14:15.

Homosexuality is a sin, as are many, many other practices. It baffles me why people focus so much on homosexuality and don't consider the other Biblical sins, many of which are considered to be highly sinful. Have no gods before God, don't worship idols, don't steal, don't murder, don't take God's name in vain, don't give false testimony, etc. “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house. You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that belongs to your neighbor.” Of course you recognize these are part of the Ten Commandments. Isn't it interesting that homosexuality isn't mentioned in the ten commandments!

Why are people so obsessed with homosexuality, yet don't mention sins like idolatry, theft, murder, etc?

jaybo said:

How does this sound?

I think a more accurate question would be if it was believed that a willful practicing drinker could inherit the Kingdom of God. My answer to that question would be to ask how they could continue willfully living a life of active drinking and still accept Jesus Christ as their Lord? That seems to be a contradiction.

Didn't Jesus say, "If you love me, keep my commandments?" See John 14:15.

Homosexuality is a sin, as are many, many other practices. It baffles me why people focus so much on homosexuality and don't consider the other Biblical sins, many of which are considered to be highly sinful. Have no gods before God, don't worship idols, don't steal, don't murder, don't take God's name in vain, don't give false testimony, etc. “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house. You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that belongs to your neighbor.” Of course you recognize these are part of the Ten Commandments. Isn't it interesting that homosexuality isn't mentioned in the ten commandments!

Why are people so obsessed with homosexuality, yet don't mention sins like idolatry, theft, murder, etc?

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It sounds to me like you are trying desperately to justify homosexual behavior. I am not aware of anywhere in Scripture where it says that sin x is justified because sins y, z, n,.... are being committed. God's expectation is that we are perfect as He is perfect (Matthew 5:48).

JLB and I already told you why the focus of this discussion has been on homosexual behavior. I'll repeat it again if you didn't notice. It is in the topic of the this discussion thread.

If you'd prefer to discuss all sins or other particular sins, then it would be better to start a new discussion. As it is, I think we are beginning to take this discussion too far off topic because the actual topic is how homosexual activity relates to child molestation.

WIP said:

It sounds to me like you are trying desperately to justify homosexual behavior. I am not aware of anywhere in Scripture where it says that sin x is justified because sins y, z, n,.... are being committed. God's expectation is that we are perfect as He is perfect (Matthew 5:48).

JLB and I already told you why the focus of this discussion has been on homosexual behavior. I'll repeat it again if you didn't notice. It is in the topic of the this discussion thread.

If you'd prefer to discuss all sins or other particular sins, then it would be better to start a new discussion. As it is, I think we are beginning to take this discussion too far off topic because the actual topic is how homosexual activity relates to child molestation.

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I am not trying to justify homosexual behavior, only questioning why that sin is so much worse than other sins according to some people.

Regarding the actual topic, homosexuality does not relate in any way to child molestation. I have seen no evidence of this charge in this discussion or any other.

"Male homosexuality and child molestation tend to be associated with each other in the minds of a large percentage of the general public. Designing a research study to test this hypothesis presents a number of methodological problems which are not easily resolved. Existing studies which contain data on this general question provide no reason to believe that anything other than a random connection exists between homosexual behavior and child molestation." National Library of Medicine (https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/665354/)

Why are people fixated on this issue when no evidence exists?

jaybo said:

I am not trying to justify homosexual behavior, only questioning why that sin is so much worse than other sins according to some people.

Regarding the actual topic, homosexuality does not relate in any way to child molestation. I have seen no evidence of this charge in this discussion or any other.

"Male homosexuality and child molestation tend to be associated with each other in the minds of a large percentage of the general public. Designing a research study to test this hypothesis presents a number of methodological problems which are not easily resolved. Existing studies which contain data on this general question provide no reason to believe that anything other than a random connection exists between homosexual behavior and child molestation." National Library of Medicine (https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/665354/)

Why are people fixated on this issue when no evidence exists?

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People can be found with fixations on any topic one can imagine. I personally only heard of this subject when this discussion thread was first begun. I do not know how reliable the information shared is. Such is the current situation with the internet. There is true information shared and there is false information shared.

jaybo said:

If homosexuals have accepted Christ as their savior then they will inherit the kingdom of God

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Homosexuals will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites...

jaybo said:

Why are people fixated on this issue when no evidence exists?

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It's not that people are fixated but we are discussing the topic of this thread.

How can we stay on topic if we discuss another topic.

JLB said:

Homosexuals will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites...

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I noticed that you didn't bold fornicators, idolaters, and adulterers. (Fornicators are those who commit adultery.)

Here is a better translation in 21st Century English: "The sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, passive homosexual partners, practicing homosexuals, thieves, the greedy, drunkards, the verbally abusive, and swindlers will not inherit the kingdom of God." 1 Corinthians 6:9-10, NET v2.1 Notice that two of these sins are mentioned in the Ten Commandments: idolatry and theft. The others, including homosexuality, are not.

1 Corinthians 5:9-10, "I wrote you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people. In no way did I mean the immoral people of this world, or the greedy and swindlers and idolaters, since you would then have to go out of the world. But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who calls himself a Christian who is sexually immoral, or greedy, or an idolater, or verbally abusive, or a drunkard, or a swindler. Do not even eat with such a person. For what do I have to do with judging those outside? Are you not to judge those inside?

I am not going to continue discussing this issue. It started with the false assumption that homosexuality and child molestation are connected. I won't participate in a discussion that is based on a false premise.

God said to love our neighbor as ourselves and Paul wrote about not judging non-Christians. Period.

jaybo said:

I noticed that you didn't bold fornicators, idolaters, and adulterers. (Fornicators are those who commit adultery.)

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From post 16.


Notice how liars are emphasized as well.



JLB

jaybo said:

I noticed that you didn't bold fornicators, idolaters, and adulterers. (Fornicators are those who commit adultery.)

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From post 15.


Fornicators are those who have sex but are nor married.

Adulterers are those who are married but have sex with other people.



JLB

jaybo said:

But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who calls himself a Christian who is sexually immoral, or greedy, or an idolater, or verbally abusive, or a drunkard, or a swindler. Do not even eat with such a person. For what do I have to do with judging those outside? Are you not to judge those inside?

I am not going to continue discussing this issue. It started with the false assumption that homosexuality and child molestation are connected. I won't participate in a discussion that is based on a false premise.

God said to love our neighbor as ourselves and Paul wrote about not judging non-Christians. Period.

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Paul plainly said… Are you not to judge those inside.


Plainly those who are Christian’s among a congregation, need to be evaluated as to whether they are living an immoral lifestyle or not.


Paul says to not associate with those who are sexually moral, or greedy, or an idolater, or verbally abusive, or a drunkard, or a swindler. Do not even eat with such a person.


Do you believe homosexuals are immoral?





JLB

jaybo said:

If homosexuals have accepted Christ as their savior then they will inherit the kingdom of God.

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What does “accepted Christ” mean?


If a homosexual repents, just like everyone else, then they can indeed be saved.




JLB

WIP said:

I think a more accurate question would be if it was believed that a willful practicing homosexual could inherit the Kingdom of God.

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The answer is no. A homosexual person, someone who practices homosexuality will certainly not inherit the kingdom of God.


Just like a willfully practicing liar or adulterer, or fornicator, or drunkard, and the like will not inherit the kingdom of God.




JLB

jaybo said:

I disagree that the LGBTQ society has sought to refine God in their own image and push an ungodly sexually immoral lifestyle on society.

a) How have they refined God in their own image? I have never heard anyone say that God is gay.
b) I disagree that they are trying to push an ungodly sexually immoral lifestyle on society. On the contrary, they are trying to live their lives without persecution.

We are supposed to love our neighbor and not judge them. That's what the Lord says to do.

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Who's judging them? She was stating cause and effect, essentially. I read nothing judgmental in her post.

And for someone with no interest in this subject...you sure got a lot to say!

jaybo said:

How does this sound?

I think a more accurate question would be if it was believed that a willful practicing drinker could inherit the Kingdom of God. My answer to that question would be to ask how they could continue willfully living a life of active drinking and still accept Jesus Christ as their Lord? That seems to be a contradiction.

Didn't Jesus say, "If you love me, keep my commandments?" See John 14:15.

Homosexuality is a sin, as are many, many other practices. It baffles me why people focus so much on homosexuality and don't consider the other Biblical sins, many of which are considered to be highly sinful. Have no gods before God, don't worship idols, don't steal, don't murder, don't take God's name in vain, don't give false testimony, etc. “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house. You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that belongs to your neighbor.” Of course you recognize these are part of the Ten Commandments. Isn't it interesting that homosexuality isn't mentioned in the ten commandments!

Why are people so obsessed with homosexuality, yet don't mention sins like idolatry, theft, murder, etc?

Click to expand...

Oh, come on. This is a thread about one subject, and while it is not the only sin in scripture, it is the one under discussion, geez.

Are you homo-sympathetic?

I'm leaving. This subject has been discussed ad nauseum. IMHO some people, including (unfortunately) some Christians, have a need to vilify homosexuals while other sinful behaviors mentioned in the Bible are ignored. This says more to me about the person who judges than it does about the sin committed. Even the thread subject -- child molestation and the homosexual movement -- is biased, since there is no correlation between the two when compared to the general population.

We are told by Christ to love our neighbor as ourselves. Period. It doesn't say to love some neighbors. If God so loved the world and Jesus didn't even mention homosexuality, I am following them not the opinions of some men with an obvious agenda.

jaybo said:

This subject has been discussed ad nauseum. IMHO some people, including (unfortunately) some Christians, have a need to vilify homosexuals while other sinful behaviors mentioned in the Bible

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This is a blatant and deceitful misrepresentation of what is being presented here by myself and others who are participating in this thread.



JLB

jaybo said:

We are told by Christ to love our neighbor as ourselves.

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Loving our neighbors who are homosexual would include lovingly warning them of being sent to hell for their behavior, which the Bible calls immoral.


JLB

JLB said:

This is a blatant and deceitful misrepresentation of what is being presented in this thread by me and others who are participating in this thread.



JLB

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This is why I'm leaving!

jaybo said:

This is why I'm leaving!

Click to expand...

ok



Loving our neighbors who are homosexual would include lovingly warning them of being sent to hell for their behavior, which the Bible calls immoral.



JLB

WIP said:

8 No, you yourselves do wrong and cheat, and you do these things to your brethren!
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.
1 Corinthians 6:8-10 NKJV


With regard to your reference to judging, there's a difference between judging and rebuking. Not every incident where sin is brought to the forefront is a sin of judgment. Sometimes it is a loving thing to do.

1 Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted.
2 Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ.
Galatians 6:1-2 NKJV

20 As for those who persist in sin, rebuke them in the presence of all, so that the rest may stand in fear.
21 In the presence of God and of Christ Jesus and of the elect angels I charge you to keep these rules without prejudging, doing nothing from partiality.
1 Timothy 5:20-21 NKJV

19 My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back,
20 let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.
James 5:19-20 NKJV

1 And he said to his disciples, “Temptations to sin are sure to come, but woe to the one through whom they come!
2 It would be better for him if a millstone were hung around his neck and he were cast into the sea than that he should cause one of these little ones to sin.
3 Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him."
Luke 17:1-3 NKJV

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Hi WIP,
I don't really intend to be on this thread...
I just want to make one observation about what you and jaybo are discussing....

We must give some credit to Jaybo...
he does make a good point.
The NT speaks of many sins but the sin of homosexuality does seem to bother us more.

Maybe there's a reason (and I haven't read every post, someone might have said this).

I've seen the change in the LGBT community over the past 50 years.
They were maligned and made fun of.
Today they're allowed to get married and we see these couples openly expressing themselves in the open for all to see. (I don't care for this in heterosexual couples either BTW).
Somehow, though it took many decades, we have somehow come to have to accept this lifestyle, at least in a legal and societal manner - even if we know it's not a moral way to live.

But the other sins are not moral either !

The difference , IMHO, is that we've been conditioned to believe that homosexuality is OK...that it's just another lifestyle,,,they've done a good job of convincing everyone that it's perfectly fine with the world to be immoral in the name of love.

They do something no other sinner does:
Have thieves tried to convince us in the past 50 years that stealing is OK and we should just accept it?
Do we believe lying is OK today when 50 years ago we did not?
Are we still upset at adultery or do we accept it these days?

The homosexual has changed our society and its morals.
The other sinners sins have not.
They have not tried to convince us that their sins are OK and acceptable today.
And this is what makes us upset...at least that's what makes me upset.