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  1. S

    Proof of Jesus?

    Re: the correspendence between Seneca and Paul Hi, textualcriticism and TC-Alternate are two forums dedicated to textual matters on yahoogroups. You can find them simply by googling the names. TC-Alternate is more open-ended, however on this topic I put one post in each forum. So far, I do not...
  2. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Hi, Most welcome. ByGrace, for simplicity you can just go to the Wikipedia page and go to the section on the Council of Carthage, 484 AD, although you have some of that info in Travis. And what claim do you think is contradicted ? My words, and your purported correction. The earliest solid...
  3. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Confession of faith as textual evidence Hi, When a Bible verse is quoted, it shows that the verse was in the Bibles of those who made (and likely those who received) the Confession of Faith. It is similar to the evidence when a single early church writer quotes a verse, only it is quite a bit...
  4. S

    Proof of Jesus?

    the correspendence between Seneca and Paul Hi, Right. The first link, leaderu, has generally reasonable dates, except two books are placed after 70 AD (John Arthur Thomas Robinson places John as the first Gospel, while I am not sure of that, I definitely would reject the post 70 AD dating.)...
  5. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Re: Moving the goalposts? Hi, As I said, if you do not consider quotes from ECW to be relevant in some textual matter, we have nothing to discuss. Our conversations would be trains in the night. (One simple example would be Irenaeus and Cyprian and Pontius the Deacon referencing Acts 8:37,in...
  6. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Re: Charles Forster - This false principle is, the rejection of a common Textus Recep Hi, Welcome. What Charles Forster wrote above was to John Wordsworth (and others) generally, not just specifically to 1 John 5:7. Shalom, Steven
  7. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Charles Forster - This false principle is, the rejection of a common Textus Receptus Hi, Anybody can do any textual assessments they please. However it will not improve our Bible which is the pure Received Text. This concept that God had providentially given us his pure word was understood...
  8. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Hi, As I indicated, Grace, I am not debating with you, since you do not even consider ECW evidences as consequent. In fact, there is no longer really a discussion. I am just trying to help you understand how to find the Carthage info. Different Council. There were about five in all, the one I...
  9. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Hi, People do what they want to do. If they want to collate 5000 Latin manuscripts or 1000 Greek manuscripts, that is their right. However, it will not improve the Bible text, it is simply geek-tech .. or Greek-text geek-tech if you want to make it a tongue-twister. Steven
  10. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Hi, Nothing wrong with collation. However, they already knew the Greek lines, the Latin lines and the early church writers and the internal considerations. The whole enterprise was providentially guided. After that collation work is simply geek-tech. Nothing really changed with the...
  11. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Hi, Why don't you simply search out Council of Carthage, with or without 484 AD, and with either "1 John v:7" or "1 John 5:7" (you can leave off the "1" in the search). or "Johannine Comma" or "Comma Johanneum". At least then you can find out what actually happened around the heavenly...
  12. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Hi Folks, They were hundreds of men, respresenting hundreds of churches, whose Bibles included the heavenly witnesses. This tells us a lot about the historic transmission of the verse (and is information hidden by many of the verse opponents). I've never seen an ecclesiastical aura, so we...
  13. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Hi, Is an ecclesiastical aura something you want to have, or avoid ? Yours in Jesus, Steven
  14. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Hi, Note that all that is 419 AD. And the date I mentioned is 484 AD. Shalom, Steven
  15. S

    Proof of Jesus?

    Hi, Leaving aside the Revelation debate for now, what book was close to 100 AD ? Let's say that Mark is said to have written his Gospel at 95 AD. Then the prophecies of the Temple destruction were written decades after the event, and nobody can say that post-facto prophecy, about what was...
  16. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Hi, There has been a certain circular element to your approach, continually going back to a notion of yours about ecclesiastical text, expressed in a variety of phrases. There are ecclesiastical texts, examples are the Syriac of the various Syriac churches, which was modified a bit to receive...
  17. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Hi Folks, This contradicts your own words, in the context of the hundreds of bishops at the Council of Carthage, and their opposition : > independent textual witnesses that you see the value of the citations, rather than as a matter of an 'ecclesiastical text', Maybe you switched the topic...
  18. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Hi, Amen. Shalom, Steven
  19. S

    Comma Johanneum/Changing of the Bible.

    Hi, Did I use the phrase church authority ? You would have to be specific as to your question. To help you out, the importance of the Council of Carthage is what it showed about the text of the Bibles used by hundreds of bishops in the 400s. From a wide geographical area. And by logical...
  20. S

    Proof of Jesus?

    Hi, The majority of scholars who give you the late dating scenario also claim the forgery scenario. Even purported Christians, like Bruce Metzger (1914-2007). If you accept late dating because of the majority of scholars blah blah..then consistently you will accept their false forgery theory...
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