Be Aware

[WIP]

I think I narrowly escaped a possible scam twice this past weekend and I thought I’d share my experience so hopefully others may not be trapped.

On Saturday morning I posted a 1997 Pontiac Bonneville for sale for $1,000.00 on Craigslist in my local area. Within 10 minutes I received a text message from an interested party. I thought that was fast. He asked if I had a PayPal account and if I could assure him he wouldn’t be disappointed. I responded with more details about the car including whatever negative information I could think of. I also told him that I did have a PayPal account so he asked if I could provide the appropriate information so he could send the money and then he would send a truck to pick up the car. I thought it was a bit unusual that someone would buy the car without at least seeing it in person.

One of the reasons I prefer using PayPal for online transactions is due to the buyer/seller protection they offer. Now, I’ve used PayPal to make purchases before but I have never received payment via PayPal so I wasn’t sure what information I needed to provide the buyer. I think this was a good thing because I believe this is what saved me from a possible scam and in the end possibly two scams.

I called PayPal to ask about this and was informed that they do not recommend using PayPal for automobile purchases because they do not offer buyer/seller protection for this type of transaction. I decided to do a little more digging and I learned that the scam is that the buyer transfers the money into my PayPal account and then sends a person to pick up the vehicle. Immediately after getting the vehicle in possession they withdraw the money from my PayPal account before it is transferred into my personal bank account. I’m then left with nothing.

I checked the buyer’s area code and learned he was from Los Angeles, CA. My first reaction to that news was amazement that he would have responded so quickly to a posting I placed on the local Craigslist website. I also thought it a bit unusual that someone would buy a car solely on my word from 2000 miles away so this brought up my skepticism another notch. I responded to the buyer that considering the distance involved, I would prefer cash on pickup. Up to that moment he was very responsive but after sending that message to him, I haven’t heard a word.

Within about a half hour I received a second text message from another potential buyer, this time from someplace in Maine. He offered to send me a cashier’s check and once it cleared my bank he would send a truck to pick up the car. Again, I thought it a bit odd considering the distance and how quickly the response came for my ad which was only online for about 45 minutes. At first I thought a cashier’s check should be relatively safe but I decided to do some digging and from First Bank’s website I found some details that convinced me to the contrary. A typical scam of this type is one using fraudulent cashier’s checks. Even the banks don’t have any real method of verifying their authenticity. In the end, I’d be left with nothing. I responded to this buyer the same as I did the first and haven’t heard a word since.

Word to the wise. When selling something where the item will be picked up, especially by a third party, it is best to insist on cash at pick up.

 

[Deborah13]

I think I narrowly escaped a possible scam twice this past weekend and I thought I’d share my experience so hopefully others may not be trapped.

On Saturday morning I posted a 1997 Pontiac Bonneville for sale for $1,000.00 on Craigslist in my local area. Within 10 minutes I received a text message from an interested party. I thought that was fast. He asked if I had a PayPal account and if I could assure him he wouldn’t be disappointed. I responded with more details about the car including whatever negative information I could think of. I also told him that I did have a PayPal account so he asked if I could provide the appropriate information so he could send the money and then he would send a truck to pick up the car. I thought it was a bit unusual that someone would buy the car without at least seeing it in person.

One of the reasons I prefer using PayPal for online transactions is due to the buyer/seller protection they offer. Now, I’ve used PayPal to make purchases before but I have never received payment via PayPal so I wasn’t sure what information I needed to provide the buyer. I think this was a good thing because I believe this is what saved me from a possible scam and in the end possibly two scams.

I called PayPal to ask about this and was informed that they do not recommend using PayPal for automobile purchases because they do not offer buyer/seller protection for this type of transaction. I decided to do a little more digging and I learned that the scam is that the buyer transfers the money into my PayPal account and then sends a person to pick up the vehicle. Immediately after getting the vehicle in possession they withdraw the money from my PayPal account before it is transferred into my personal bank account. I’m then left with nothing.

I checked the buyer’s area code and learned he was from Los Angeles, CA. My first reaction to that news was amazement that he would have responded so quickly to a posting I placed on the local Craigslist website. I also thought it a bit unusual that someone would buy a car solely on my word from 2000 miles away so this brought up my skepticism another notch. I responded to the buyer that considering the distance involved, I would prefer cash on pickup. Up to that moment he was very responsive but after sending that message to him, I haven’t heard a word.

Within about a half hour I received a second text message from another potential buyer, this time from someplace in Maine. He offered to send me a cashier’s check and once it cleared my bank he would send a truck to pick up the car. Again, I thought it a bit odd considering the distance and how quickly the response came for my ad which was only online for about 45 minutes. At first I thought a cashier’s check should be relatively safe but I decided to do some digging and from First Bank’s website I found some details that convinced me to the contrary. A typical scam of this type is one using fraudulent cashier’s checks. Even the banks don’t have any real method of verifying their authenticity. In the end, I’d be left with nothing. I responded to this buyer the same as I did the first and haven’t heard a word since.

Word to the wise. When selling something where the item will be picked up, especially by a third party, it is best to insist on cash at pick up.

Then make sure, if you receive a large sum of money, that when you take it to the bank you bring along a copy of the receipt for selling the vehicle or some type of proof as to where that money came from.
If you were to make contact with the police while you had that cash on you, they can use that as just cause to hold you, your cash, and your vehicle until you provide proof that it wasn't from illegal activities.
Welcome to the new America!

 

[Obadiah]

Yes indeed, this is a scam. I got EXACTLY the same messages when I was selling an old car about a year and half ago. Craigslist has this scam and some of it's variations documented somewhere, but I remember I had to search for it. Can't remember exactly where it was now. Anther thing Craigslist warned commonly happens is that when the guy with the tow truck shows up (probably the same guy that's pulling the scam in the first place), he pulls another scam on you and gets more money out of you! Something about the buyer paid him for the towing job with a cashier's check but he has no bank and nowhere to cash it since he's on the road all the time, so he signs it over to you in return for cash from you. Of course, the amount of the check is larger than the amount of cash he asks you to give him and he enthusiastically tells you to keep the rest as a thank you gift for helping him out!

I was getting these from 3 different people (supposedly different people) and having too much time on my hands I played along with them. I played dumb and asked all sorts of questions and made comments designed to keep the conversation going (and therefore waste a lot of their time knowing full well I would never agree to their scams or give them any information they could use). Of course, all the emails were from one scammer using different accounts. It was especially funny when he got confused and started answering questions I'd asked through one account on a different account than the one I had asked the question on! Hehe, I ask the guy in California a question and the "unrelated" guy in Florida answers it! I got to string him along for about 3 weeks, long after I'd sold the car to a legitimate buyer. It was really fun playing dumb and watching all the angles he would come up with to try to scam me, never knowing I was just wasting his time all along. In the end I think he figured it out, or just figured it wasn't worth all the work I was putting him through, so he just quit responding.

 

[Deborah13]

Yes indeed, this is a scam. I got EXACTLY the same messages when I was selling an old car about a year and half ago. Craigslist has this scam and some of it's variations documented somewhere, but I remember I had to search for it. Can't remember exactly where it was now. Anther thing Craigslist warned commonly happens is that when the guy with the tow truck shows up (probably the same guy that's pulling the scam in the first place), he pulls another scam on you and gets more money out of you! Something about the buyer paid him for the towing job with a cashier's check but he has no bank and nowhere to cash it since he's on the road all the time, so he signs it over to you in return for cash from you. Of course, the amount of the check is larger than the amount of cash he asks you to give him and he enthusiastically tells you to keep the rest as a thank you gift for helping him out!

I was getting these from 3 different people (supposedly different people) and having too much time on my hands I played along with them. I played dumb and asked all sorts of questions and made comments designed to keep the conversation going (and therefore waste a lot of their time knowing full well I would never agree to their scams or give them any information they could use). Of course, all the emails were from one scammer using different accounts. It was especially funny when he got confused and started answering questions I'd asked through one account on a different account than the one I had asked the question on! Hehe, I ask the guy in California a question and the "unrelated" guy in Florida answers it! I got to string him along for about 3 weeks, long after I'd sold the car to a legitimate buyer. It was really fun playing dumb and watching all the angles he would come up with to try to scam me, never knowing I was just wasting his time all along. In the end I think he figured it out, or just figured it wasn't worth all the work I was putting him through, so he just quit responding.

You old cop you. Being a detective and finding the truth is the play. Then trying to get the criminal to incriminate themselves and succeeding is the finale. Serves the scammer right.
I know I would not want to pit my intelligence against a good detective/cop/interrogator. Especially if I am innocent of any wrong doing. My motto is make no statements period, claim my 5th amendment right to silence. Get a good attorney and let him/her do the talking. :yes

 

[jeff77]

Thanks for the info WIP

 

[Kenny_ms]

I love playing with scammers like that.

As for Paypal protection for both buyer and seller, yes, there is a certain amount of protection for the seller but they are much more vulnerable than the buyer on a Paypal transaction. Been awhile and a lot of changes since but, I hung on the Ebay seller boards for nearly 15 yrs and there are buyers out there lined up to use the Paypal/Ebay system to scam unaware sellers.

If it hasn't been mentioned already, another reason to only take cash on a local pick up is the buyer can pay you with Paypal, come get the item, then file an Item Not Received to get their money back and almost always get it because the seller has no online viewable delivery confirmation. Doesn't matter what kind of proof you might have, all Paypal cares about is the online confirmation as that's what their automated system is set up to take.

"i still dont understand why scammers gotta scam."

I often think, at least for the petty scammers, (How in the world can "scammer" still not be a word??) if they put half the effort into doing something legit, they could make as much, if not more money.